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@keets said:
all I know is that when our economy is based on Investment and Finance instead of Labor and some sort of Manufacturing we are in trouble.
"Investment" has gone out the window along with the fundamentals. What you have today is pure speculation. There is trouble in River City, terrible trouble.
The markets have been rigged for years by insider trading and various other manipulations. Brokerages even skim a tiny percent right off the top of trades by having faster communications than others. The silver markets has long been the most heavily manipulated of all the markets in all probability, All manipulation distorts markets but that occurring in silver is one of the worst because it leads to wasting a very important commodity.
Capital means nothing any longer because excessive debt means interest rates will remain low forever or until inflation tames the debt, whichever comes first. We take in each others laundry and send out for Chinese at the end of the day. It works great since they have cheap labor and can make lots of CO2 and all sorts of counterfeit.
@keets said:
all I know is that when our economy is based on Investment and Finance instead of Labor and some sort of Manufacturing we are in trouble.
"Investment" has gone out the window along with the fundamentals. What you have today is pure speculation. There is trouble in River City, terrible trouble.
The markets have been rigged for years by insider trading and various other manipulations. Brokerages even skim a tiny percent right off the top of trades by having faster communications than others. The silver markets has long been the most heavily manipulated of all the markets in all probability, All manipulation distorts markets but that occurring in silver is one of the worst because it leads to wasting a very important commodity.
>
This is a gross exaggeration of the truth. The markets are not rigged nor are they rampant with insider trading. Unfortunately there is some insider trading and occasional manipulation as we have seen very noticeably this past week. Brokerages don’t compete on speed. They route orders to market makers (who compete on speed). However, this results in a better price for customers. It’s called “price improvement”. Also look up “payment for order flow” if you are curious about the mechanics of this.
@Gazes said:
Wait....wasnt this a movie? Some old bad guys got caught trying to make a fortune shorting a commodity and went broke when it was bid up the other way---Trading Places
This is a gross exaggeration of the truth. The markets are not rigged nor are they rampant with insider trading. Unfortunately there is a some insider trading and occasional manipulation as we have seen very noticeably this past week. Brokerages don’t compete on speed. They route orders to market makers (who compete on speed). However, this results in a better price for customers. It’s called “price improvement”. Also look up “payment for order flow” if you are curious about the mechanics of this.
Perhaps there is some exaggeration here but there is apparently manipulation occurring and the hand of government. Ted Butler claims that those shorting silver have won every time. If prices go a little higher they just sell more paper until they win. JP Morgan was fined, I believe.
The shorts are were already in a bind before the reddit crowd found them. This time they can sell all the paper they want but you can't make electronics, solar panels, and a host of other products out of paper. The world is awash in SLV but not in silver.
Too many stocks have prices based on things that have no relationship to fundamentals in my opinion. Great stocks are cheap and stay cheap and fly by night stocks soar and crash. It looks like a lottery. I suppose there are more explanations for this than there are stocks and maybe using the word "manipulation" isn't entirely fair.
@Panda4456 said:
I think I’ll even hold SLV for the long term. We all know silver will rise with inflation over time!
You mean like it did from 1981 to 2000?
If you want to hold silver for a long time, buy physical. The ETF will cost you a few percent every year.
Does anybody go short on SLV and long on physical (or COMEX) silver ?
If I understand correctly how SLV works (I haven't studied it much) the yearly fees draw down the amount of actual physical silver backing. If that is true, it seems like it would be "can't lose" proposition to short SLV and go long a corresponding amount of silver elsewhere.
You'd be better off buying AG and selling both covered calls and puts against it. My guess is that in a few minutes when the market opens the options premiums will be massive, just like they are for the other goofy stocks. You could probably pocket 30+% in out of the money premiums. Very nice gain for the week, and mitigates the potential downside.
assuming there is no transaction cost to shorting SLV and owning silver, the mgmt fee on SLV is ... what ... .5% ? you'd make only a little bit doing it
Shorting the 140% can be achievable. Assuming the GME insiders held their stock in margin accounts to borrow its equity up to the hilt to buy other 'profitable' stocks, brokerage firms can then loan 140% of each customer's margin balance. They loan those stocks shorters (hedge funds) pay the most to borrow. GME was on that list.
Brokerage firms allow customers to short as long as they can 'locate' another firm willing to loan the shares. Doesn't mean they can actually borrow, just means a brokerage firm posted shares willing to loan. RobinHood was a big loaner of shares.
@2ndCharter said: Gasoline prices are on the move too, $2.60 a gallon for 87, down the street from me, they usually are the best prices around.
You need to move to a different state. $1.96 this morning where I am in South Carolina.
3.09 Bethesda Md
My 2c is people have already started going nuts. I was bidding on some worn VG war nickel rolls for a YN last night and the prices realized were a bit more than I suspect the seller thought they would get when they listed them a week ago.
@WQuarterFreddie said:
What the Reddit team could do is create a short squeeze on some of the Silver miners.....take a look at First Majestic (AG) and Hecla (HL).
These 2 are very heavily shorted....
You are correct that First Majestic is heavily shorted. Hecla is not heavily shorted. Hecla's short interest is less than 3%
Well, the roller coaster ride has been exciting! Right now AG is up 22% and HL is up 32%! 🤑🤑🤑🥳
1) it is perfectly legal to have more than 100% short interest. Multiple people can borrow the stock and then lend it again. It has nothing to do with margin. It is very rare, but there’s no mechanical reason why it can’t be so.
2) you have to pay a “borrow” cost to short a stock. Again, this is separate from the margin required to enter/maintain the position (which is not a fee just a required amount of capital). That’s why the SLV short is not guaranteed to work (nor will shorting any levered ETF which has volatility drag pushing its price lower in the long term) .
3) it is not obviously illegal what is happening to GME. The SEC might decide that it’s illegal and punish people for doing it. Financial regulators have an interest in smooth markets and this is definitely not that.
The present reminds me too much of 2011 and anyone just starting to accumulate silver may get a similar surprise. I hit my lifetime goal for physical silver in 2016 and I certainly won't add more at current prices. I won't sell any of my physical either. My SLV shares are another matter. At $40 I will start selling. At $45 I will be out of SLV entirely.
It was around 30.30 and has been coming down pretty good ever since...29.15 right now. I think it is strange that Kitco shows a bid/ask spread of 1.00 instead of the usual 0.10. I am using this to value since the Kitco prices make no sense right now: https://www.investing.com/commodities/silver-commentary
@chesterb said:
Whatever happens, I don’t think it will end well. It’s fun to watch and speculate what will happen but my guess is it will come crashing down in the end and will not recover for awhile. That’s my 2 ozs. worth...
My crystal ball is broken but I do agree that it won't end well. Not for GME and not for SLV. These things never do. Some people will make some real money, maybe even some of the stackers around here if they dump some of their hoard. But someone is buying silver at $30+ and is going to ride it down. Someone bought GME at $400 and is going to ride it down to $5 again.anythin
Do you want to make all forms of gambling illegal or just when it involves buying and selling securities?
I didn't want to make anything illegal. Pointing out that you've got a 90% chance of losing at craps isn't the same as suggesting craps is illegal.
The fact that I think the pumping and dumping should be illegal has nothing to do with the fact that the people doing it are losing money. It's what they are doing to other people.
And, in this case, the stated goal of the Reddit Insurrectionists is to bankrupt the hedgies and the shorts. Some of them even said they don't care if they lose everything as long as they bring down the hedgies. Well, if they bring down the banks, that does have broader repercussions in the market. And you better hope it isn't your bank they bring down and you get less than 100% of your money back.
A lot of pension funds have money in hedge funds. This is not just a poker game among the frat boys.
@Gazes said:
Wait....wasnt this a movie? Some old bad guys got caught trying to make a fortune shorting a commodity and went broke when it was bid up the other way---Trading Places
@Gazes said:
Wait....wasnt this a movie? Some old bad guys got caught trying to make a fortune shorting a commodity and went broke when it was bid up the other way---Trading Places
I think it was orange juice, wasn't it?
Yup! The Duke brothers Mortimer and Randolph lost their seat when they were given the wrong crop report on Oranges ...🤣😂
Always amusing to watch how some of the precious metals people stain their Underoos when their favorite metals start dancing upwards quickly, almost like the rapture. Then when it starts back down (like it is now), the sound of squealing balloons releasing their air can be heard.
I love silver coins just as much is the next person and have sold some when the prices got high before, but now people are getting played like a crusty booger. Be careful out there.
At some point, they are going to throw a few of these reddit bozos in jail. Conspiring to manipulate the price of securities isn't legal. And the pump and dump has been illegal forever.
I think you are confusing two things. Pump and Dump is you tell all your friends a stock is WAY undervalued and get them to buy in and then you, individually, sell your shares and leave them all hanging.
The folks on reddit are just buying stock and making it all go higher. They aren't being secretive about any of it...
You're drawing an awfully fine, possibly invisible line.
Read the Reddit. They are conspiring to buy the stock to create a short squeeze. A short squeeze, by its nature, pushes up the price of the stock. That is blatant price manipulation.
No it is not blatant price manipulation. jessewvu is correct. The reddit gang is merely buying up the supply of GME stock in the face of very high demand from the short sellers, causing the price of GME to skyrocket. Our ruling courts have stated that the mere intent to affect prices is not enough; rather, it must be shown that the intent was to cause artificial prices—i.e., prices that were understood to be unreflective of the forces of supply and demand.
The shorters want the GME stock (demand), the reddits own them (supply). Supply and demand. Seems that the shorters got caught with their shorts down. Nothing illegal about that.
Except there is no way that company is worth $350 much less the $10,000 per share that they are targeting. You say that intent must be shown to cause artificial prices. How is a nearly bankrupt company worth 5,000x what it was selling for? This is not simply supply and demand.
And go read the reddit. They declared war on the hedgies. Some of them have vowed to lose money themselves as long as it helps bankrupt "the enemy".
While I don't think prosecution is a given, if that isn't technically illegal it certainly should be.
One could argue that there is no way that company is worth $1.98 per share, which is the price on some of the shorts. But that is not the point.
Why not point the finger at the other side. The stock was shorted 140%, while about 50% of the stock is controlled by one entity. Taking contrary positions from, shall we call the shorts ill-advised and short-sighted positions, is not illegal. Why pick sides and accuse those of leveraging long over those leveraging short with misfeasance? Yes, it is supply and demand, within the system we have. If you don't like the answer, change the system.
Some refer to overgraded slabs as Coffins. I like to think of them as Happy Coins.
At some point, they are going to throw a few of these reddit bozos in jail. Conspiring to manipulate the price of securities isn't legal. And the pump and dump has been illegal forever.
I think you are confusing two things. Pump and Dump is you tell all your friends a stock is WAY undervalued and get them to buy in and then you, individually, sell your shares and leave them all hanging.
The folks on reddit are just buying stock and making it all go higher. They aren't being secretive about any of it...
You're drawing an awfully fine, possibly invisible line.
Read the Reddit. They are conspiring to buy the stock to create a short squeeze. A short squeeze, by its nature, pushes up the price of the stock. That is blatant price manipulation.
No it is not blatant price manipulation. jessewvu is correct. The reddit gang is merely buying up the supply of GME stock in the face of very high demand from the short sellers, causing the price of GME to skyrocket. Our ruling courts have stated that the mere intent to affect prices is not enough; rather, it must be shown that the intent was to cause artificial prices—i.e., prices that were understood to be unreflective of the forces of supply and demand.
The shorters want the GME stock (demand), the reddits own them (supply). Supply and demand. Seems that the shorters got caught with their shorts down. Nothing illegal about that.
Except there is no way that company is worth $350 much less the $10,000 per share that they are targeting. You say that intent must be shown to cause artificial prices. How is a nearly bankrupt company worth 5,000x what it was selling for? This is not simply supply and demand.
And go read the reddit. They declared war on the hedgies. Some of them have vowed to lose money themselves as long as it helps bankrupt "the enemy".
While I don't think prosecution is a given, if that isn't technically illegal it certainly should be.
One could argue that there is no way that company is worth $1.98 per share, which is the price on some of the shorts. But that is not the point.
Why not point the finger at the other side. The stock was shorted 140%, while about 50% of the stock is controlled by one entity. Taking contrary positions from, shall we call the shorts ill-advised and short-sighted positions, is not illegal. Why pick sides and accuse those of leveraging long over those leveraging short with misfeasance? Yes, it is supply and demand, within the system we have. If you don't like the answer, change the system.
I haven't exonerated "the other side". But so far only one side has declared that the destruction of the enemy is the goal. And it is only clear to me that the one side has openly colluded.
As for price, I think it is arguable that the company is worth $0 per share which is what the shorts feel. They are the Blockbuster of video games. As video games, like films, increasingly move to streaming, is there a place for a Brick & Mortar that sells largely cartridges which will go the way of Betamax and video game paraphenalia that you can buy online from Amazon or directly from the game manufacturers.
Folks are confusing 'shorting' a stock, which requires selling the stock in the marketplace and noting in the trade to your B/D, and the regulators, you are shorting it. Lending is not shorting. The stock borrow conduit business where 5 of us move the shares around to the 1 ultimate shorter does not increase the short interest.
Shorting a stock is not illegal. Now do the regulators need to cap the short interest at some %, probably so. But shorting requires 2 main components, 1 - availability to borrow and 2 - an uptick in price. The SEC suspended shorting during the 2009 market crisis, thank God, but there are benefits in the marketplace to shorting.
I don’t think any dealers in their right mind would buy silver bullion at $100/ounce let alone $1k!
Dealers hedge so that they can buy & sell at whatever price the market decides to maintain. Dealers love this type of market.
This is no different than betting that a team you play on will lose. Short Selling should be removed, period. Thinking and hoping that someone loses is wrong, and gives people an incentive to not do or give their best.
Short selling is no different than going long on margin. Both involve leverage, and if you believe that short selling is ill-conceived, you might also consider that so is buying stocks or commodities on margin.
And frankly, derivative contracts that require only 5-10% to control a sizable chunk of a commodity are the same ilk as the newly-poofed fractional reserve fiat money that the Fed and the banking system profit from on a daily basis - they ALL contribute to a synthetic, manipulated, corrupt and unsustainable system that sells out the future for a quick consumption fix in the present.
As in the past, physical rules.
Yup!
The shorters want the GME stock (demand), the reddits own them (supply). Supply and demand. Seems that the shorters got caught with their shorts down. Nothing illegal about that.
It will be critical to see if the rules are changed in favor of the institutional shorts in GME - it may be the same regulatory pattern that develops if/when silver spikes. Be wary.
_But someone is buying silver at $30+ and is going to ride it down.
They might ride it down a few dollars, but there will always (usually) be a buyer who expects to ride it back up. When silver spikes, it creates expectations to the upside and it takes months to dispel the notion that it's going back down (unless constraints are placed on buying while allowing only selling to take place). Eventually it does, but I wouldn't expect a rapid decline in silver like I would expect with a manipulated small-cap stock like CME.
The markets are not rigged nor are they rampant with insider trading.
JP Morgan has been busted and paid fines for rigging the silver market. Goldman Sachs has been busted for front-running their OWN clients. Nobody has gone to jail in either case. Nobody involved in MF Global or the 2008 financial crisis has gone to prison either, but it's well-established that all sorts of financial malfeasance have been running rampant then, and now - led by both the Federal Reserve and Congress.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
At some point, they are going to throw a few of these reddit bozos in jail. Conspiring to manipulate the price of securities isn't legal. And the pump and dump has been illegal forever.
I think you are confusing two things. Pump and Dump is you tell all your friends a stock is WAY undervalued and get them to buy in and then you, individually, sell your shares and leave them all hanging.
The folks on reddit are just buying stock and making it all go higher. They aren't being secretive about any of it...
You're drawing an awfully fine, possibly invisible line.
Read the Reddit. They are conspiring to buy the stock to create a short squeeze. A short squeeze, by its nature, pushes up the price of the stock. That is blatant price manipulation.
No it is not blatant price manipulation. jessewvu is correct. The reddit gang is merely buying up the supply of GME stock in the face of very high demand from the short sellers, causing the price of GME to skyrocket. Our ruling courts have stated that the mere intent to affect prices is not enough; rather, it must be shown that the intent was to cause artificial prices—i.e., prices that were understood to be unreflective of the forces of supply and demand.
The shorters want the GME stock (demand), the reddits own them (supply). Supply and demand. Seems that the shorters got caught with their shorts down. Nothing illegal about that.
Except there is no way that company is worth $350 much less the $10,000 per share that they are targeting. You say that intent must be shown to cause artificial prices. How is a nearly bankrupt company worth 5,000x what it was selling for? This is not simply supply and demand.
And go read the reddit. They declared war on the hedgies. Some of them have vowed to lose money themselves as long as it helps bankrupt "the enemy".
While I don't think prosecution is a given, if that isn't technically illegal it certainly should be.
One could argue that there is no way that company is worth $1.98 per share, which is the price on some of the shorts. But that is not the point.
Why not point the finger at the other side. The stock was shorted 140%, while about 50% of the stock is controlled by one entity. Taking contrary positions from, shall we call the shorts ill-advised and short-sighted positions, is not illegal. Why pick sides and accuse those of leveraging long over those leveraging short with misfeasance? Yes, it is supply and demand, within the system we have. If you don't like the answer, change the system.
I haven't exonerated "the other side". But so far only one side has declared that the destruction of the enemy is the goal. And it is only clear to me that the one side has openly colluded.
As for price, I think it is arguable that the company is worth $0 per share which is what the shorts feel. They are the Blockbuster of video games. As video games, like films, increasingly move to streaming, is there a place for a Brick & Mortar that sells largely cartridges which will go the way of Betamax and video game paraphenalia that you can buy online from Amazon or directly from the game manufacturers.
I hope that is hyperbole. I'd guess .0001% of the other side have the goal of destroying the enemy, even if it means losing money. The other 99.9999% are in it to make money.
Some refer to overgraded slabs as Coffins. I like to think of them as Happy Coins.
Silver would have to get to $150 per ounce in order to match its value in early 1980. Even at $30 per ounce today that only equals $7.50 per ounce in 1980 dollars. Thank you inflation.
At some point, they are going to throw a few of these reddit bozos in jail. Conspiring to manipulate the price of securities isn't legal. And the pump and dump has been illegal forever.
I think you are confusing two things. Pump and Dump is you tell all your friends a stock is WAY undervalued and get them to buy in and then you, individually, sell your shares and leave them all hanging.
The folks on reddit are just buying stock and making it all go higher. They aren't being secretive about any of it...
You're drawing an awfully fine, possibly invisible line.
Read the Reddit. They are conspiring to buy the stock to create a short squeeze. A short squeeze, by its nature, pushes up the price of the stock. That is blatant price manipulation.
No it is not blatant price manipulation. jessewvu is correct. The reddit gang is merely buying up the supply of GME stock in the face of very high demand from the short sellers, causing the price of GME to skyrocket. Our ruling courts have stated that the mere intent to affect prices is not enough; rather, it must be shown that the intent was to cause artificial prices—i.e., prices that were understood to be unreflective of the forces of supply and demand.
The shorters want the GME stock (demand), the reddits own them (supply). Supply and demand. Seems that the shorters got caught with their shorts down. Nothing illegal about that.
Except there is no way that company is worth $350 much less the $10,000 per share that they are targeting. You say that intent must be shown to cause artificial prices. How is a nearly bankrupt company worth 5,000x what it was selling for? This is not simply supply and demand.
And go read the reddit. They declared war on the hedgies. Some of them have vowed to lose money themselves as long as it helps bankrupt "the enemy".
While I don't think prosecution is a given, if that isn't technically illegal it certainly should be.
One could argue that there is no way that company is worth $1.98 per share, which is the price on some of the shorts. But that is not the point.
Why not point the finger at the other side. The stock was shorted 140%, while about 50% of the stock is controlled by one entity. Taking contrary positions from, shall we call the shorts ill-advised and short-sighted positions, is not illegal. Why pick sides and accuse those of leveraging long over those leveraging short with misfeasance? Yes, it is supply and demand, within the system we have. If you don't like the answer, change the system.
I haven't exonerated "the other side". But so far only one side has declared that the destruction of the enemy is the goal. And it is only clear to me that the one side has openly colluded.
As for price, I think it is arguable that the company is worth $0 per share which is what the shorts feel. They are the Blockbuster of video games. As video games, like films, increasingly move to streaming, is there a place for a Brick & Mortar that sells largely cartridges which will go the way of Betamax and video game paraphenalia that you can buy online from Amazon or directly from the game manufacturers.
I hope that is hyperbole. I'd guess .0001% of the other side have the goal of destroying the enemy, even if it means losing money. The other 99.9999% are in it to make money.
Read WallStreetBets for a while. Yes, many of them want to make money. But a LOT of the louder voices in the room are doing it to wage war on the establishment.
Comments
https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/31/investing/silver-price-squeeze-reddit-wallstreetbets/index.html
100% positive transactions with SurfinxHI, bigole, 1madman, collectorcoins, proofmorgan, Luke Marshall, silver pop, golden egg, point five zero,coin22lover, alohagary, blaircountycoin,joebb21
The markets have been rigged for years by insider trading and various other manipulations. Brokerages even skim a tiny percent right off the top of trades by having faster communications than others. The silver markets has long been the most heavily manipulated of all the markets in all probability, All manipulation distorts markets but that occurring in silver is one of the worst because it leads to wasting a very important commodity.
Capital means nothing any longer because excessive debt means interest rates will remain low forever or until inflation tames the debt, whichever comes first. We take in each others laundry and send out for Chinese at the end of the day. It works great since they have cheap labor and can make lots of CO2 and all sorts of counterfeit.
Silver is a very different target than a stock.
The swarms may get bored and walk away. Or not.
>
This is a gross exaggeration of the truth. The markets are not rigged nor are they rampant with insider trading. Unfortunately there is some insider trading and occasional manipulation as we have seen very noticeably this past week. Brokerages don’t compete on speed. They route orders to market makers (who compete on speed). However, this results in a better price for customers. It’s called “price improvement”. Also look up “payment for order flow” if you are curious about the mechanics of this.
I should have kept my slider Morgans!
Remember the Hunt brothers...
Mortimer and Randolph and their $1 bet😂🤣
Perhaps there is some exaggeration here but there is apparently manipulation occurring and the hand of government. Ted Butler claims that those shorting silver have won every time. If prices go a little higher they just sell more paper until they win. JP Morgan was fined, I believe.
The shorts are were already in a bind before the reddit crowd found them. This time they can sell all the paper they want but you can't make electronics, solar panels, and a host of other products out of paper. The world is awash in SLV but not in silver.
Too many stocks have prices based on things that have no relationship to fundamentals in my opinion. Great stocks are cheap and stay cheap and fly by night stocks soar and crash. It looks like a lottery. I suppose there are more explanations for this than there are stocks and maybe using the word "manipulation" isn't entirely fair.
spot just breached $30
You'd be better off buying AG and selling both covered calls and puts against it. My guess is that in a few minutes when the market opens the options premiums will be massive, just like they are for the other goofy stocks. You could probably pocket 30+% in out of the money premiums. Very nice gain for the week, and mitigates the potential downside.
assuming there is no transaction cost to shorting SLV and owning silver, the mgmt fee on SLV is ... what ... .5% ? you'd make only a little bit doing it
GME 140% naked shorted. How did they do that?
Oh, I forgot...the system is rigged.
Shorting the 140% can be achievable. Assuming the GME insiders held their stock in margin accounts to borrow its equity up to the hilt to buy other 'profitable' stocks, brokerage firms can then loan 140% of each customer's margin balance. They loan those stocks shorters (hedge funds) pay the most to borrow. GME was on that list.
Brokerage firms allow customers to short as long as they can 'locate' another firm willing to loan the shares. Doesn't mean they can actually borrow, just means a brokerage firm posted shares willing to loan. RobinHood was a big loaner of shares.
Here's something fascinating;
https://silverseek.com/article/silversqueeze-manifesto
I'm a silver bug but I'm not sure I agree with this. Presenting this as the Boston Tea Party 2.0 might not be entirely accurate.
ASE available on apmex
We know its achievable.
Its illegal.
3.09 Bethesda Md
My 2c is people have already started going nuts. I was bidding on some worn VG war nickel rolls for a YN last night and the prices realized were a bit more than I suspect the seller thought they would get when they listed them a week ago.
No research project for the nephew this month
11.5$ Southern Dollars, The little “Big Easy” set
Well, the roller coaster ride has been exciting! Right now AG is up 22% and HL is up 32%! 🤑🤑🤑🥳
Alright, let’s correct some misinformation here.
1) it is perfectly legal to have more than 100% short interest. Multiple people can borrow the stock and then lend it again. It has nothing to do with margin. It is very rare, but there’s no mechanical reason why it can’t be so.
2) you have to pay a “borrow” cost to short a stock. Again, this is separate from the margin required to enter/maintain the position (which is not a fee just a required amount of capital). That’s why the SLV short is not guaranteed to work (nor will shorting any levered ETF which has volatility drag pushing its price lower in the long term) .
3) it is not obviously illegal what is happening to GME. The SEC might decide that it’s illegal and punish people for doing it. Financial regulators have an interest in smooth markets and this is definitely not that.
The present reminds me too much of 2011 and anyone just starting to accumulate silver may get a similar surprise. I hit my lifetime goal for physical silver in 2016 and I certainly won't add more at current prices. I won't sell any of my physical either. My SLV shares are another matter. At $40 I will start selling. At $45 I will be out of SLV entirely.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
Platinum is doing way better than silver currently/ recent history
11.5$ Southern Dollars, The little “Big Easy” set
There are a few ancillary boats afloat!
It was around 30.30 and has been coming down pretty good ever since...29.15 right now. I think it is strange that Kitco shows a bid/ask spread of 1.00 instead of the usual 0.10. I am using this to value since the Kitco prices make no sense right now: https://www.investing.com/commodities/silver-commentary
By New York close today I expect to see silver unchanged for the day.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
Quick rise followed by a free fall, all in the same morning! Maybe a little bit of a bounce back now before the end of the day?
I didn't want to make anything illegal. Pointing out that you've got a 90% chance of losing at craps isn't the same as suggesting craps is illegal.
The fact that I think the pumping and dumping should be illegal has nothing to do with the fact that the people doing it are losing money. It's what they are doing to other people.
And, in this case, the stated goal of the Reddit Insurrectionists is to bankrupt the hedgies and the shorts. Some of them even said they don't care if they lose everything as long as they bring down the hedgies. Well, if they bring down the banks, that does have broader repercussions in the market. And you better hope it isn't your bank they bring down and you get less than 100% of your money back.
A lot of pension funds have money in hedge funds. This is not just a poker game among the frat boys.
I think it was orange juice, wasn't it?
Bad day for the insurrectionists. Silver is dropping steadily and GME is down 25%.
Yup! The Duke brothers Mortimer and Randolph lost their seat when they were given the wrong crop report on Oranges ...🤣😂
spot steadily settling, thank god - I've got some silver I'd like to buy and would appreciate it at a lower price 😂
The only people to make money on this were the PM dealers who massively jacked up premiums
Yeah....well some of us would like to sell and would appreciate it to skyrocket 💰🚀🚀🚀😂🤣
Not true! I made some quick cash on my AG stock buy on Friday and on my AG stock sell earlier this morning for a nice 30% return 😎
The lead redditers are telling the “retards” to stop buying SLV. “Citadel owns SLV” and “Papa Elon supporting GME”, so there!
You cannot naked short stock shares that do not exist. 140% shorting exists because of loopholes.
But it is blatantly illegal. Period.
Ending a sentence with “period” doesn’t make it true. Please point out which law prevents this.
A owns 100 shares and lends it to B. B then lends these 100 shares to C. There are now 200 shares short. This is all fine.
Always amusing to watch how some of the precious metals people stain their Underoos when their favorite metals start dancing upwards quickly, almost like the rapture. Then when it starts back down (like it is now), the sound of squealing balloons releasing their air can be heard.
I love silver coins just as much is the next person and have sold some when the prices got high before, but now people are getting played like a crusty booger. Be careful out there.
10-4,
My Instagram picturesErik
My registry sets
Sorry @ElmerFusterpuck Not laughing at your comment altogether; however, getting played like a crusty booger did it!
One could argue that there is no way that company is worth $1.98 per share, which is the price on some of the shorts. But that is not the point.
Why not point the finger at the other side. The stock was shorted 140%, while about 50% of the stock is controlled by one entity. Taking contrary positions from, shall we call the shorts ill-advised and short-sighted positions, is not illegal. Why pick sides and accuse those of leveraging long over those leveraging short with misfeasance? Yes, it is supply and demand, within the system we have. If you don't like the answer, change the system.
I haven't exonerated "the other side". But so far only one side has declared that the destruction of the enemy is the goal. And it is only clear to me that the one side has openly colluded.
As for price, I think it is arguable that the company is worth $0 per share which is what the shorts feel. They are the Blockbuster of video games. As video games, like films, increasingly move to streaming, is there a place for a Brick & Mortar that sells largely cartridges which will go the way of Betamax and video game paraphenalia that you can buy online from Amazon or directly from the game manufacturers.
Just got off the phone with my local dealer, with spot at ~$29.25 his BUY prices are:
$34 on ASE
22x on 90%
Very tempting to sell eagles at $34 each cash money. Most of my stack is at less than half that price......
Successful transactions with: Lakesammman, jimineez1, Flackthat, PerryHall, bidask, bccox, TwistedArrow1962, free_spirit, alexerca, scooter25, FHC, tnspro, mcarney1173, moursund, and SurfinxHI (6 times)
Folks are confusing 'shorting' a stock, which requires selling the stock in the marketplace and noting in the trade to your B/D, and the regulators, you are shorting it. Lending is not shorting. The stock borrow conduit business where 5 of us move the shares around to the 1 ultimate shorter does not increase the short interest.
Shorting a stock is not illegal. Now do the regulators need to cap the short interest at some %, probably so. But shorting requires 2 main components, 1 - availability to borrow and 2 - an uptick in price. The SEC suspended shorting during the 2009 market crisis, thank God, but there are benefits in the marketplace to shorting.
anything can happen in a heartbeat in this day and age silver prices well we will have to see what will happen cause right now it's just a guess
2003-present
1997-present
I don’t think any dealers in their right mind would buy silver bullion at $100/ounce let alone $1k!
Dealers hedge so that they can buy & sell at whatever price the market decides to maintain. Dealers love this type of market.
This is no different than betting that a team you play on will lose. Short Selling should be removed, period. Thinking and hoping that someone loses is wrong, and gives people an incentive to not do or give their best.
Short selling is no different than going long on margin. Both involve leverage, and if you believe that short selling is ill-conceived, you might also consider that so is buying stocks or commodities on margin.
And frankly, derivative contracts that require only 5-10% to control a sizable chunk of a commodity are the same ilk as the newly-poofed fractional reserve fiat money that the Fed and the banking system profit from on a daily basis - they ALL contribute to a synthetic, manipulated, corrupt and unsustainable system that sells out the future for a quick consumption fix in the present.
As in the past, physical rules.
Yup!
The shorters want the GME stock (demand), the reddits own them (supply). Supply and demand. Seems that the shorters got caught with their shorts down. Nothing illegal about that.
It will be critical to see if the rules are changed in favor of the institutional shorts in GME - it may be the same regulatory pattern that develops if/when silver spikes. Be wary.
_But someone is buying silver at $30+ and is going to ride it down.
They might ride it down a few dollars, but there will always (usually) be a buyer who expects to ride it back up. When silver spikes, it creates expectations to the upside and it takes months to dispel the notion that it's going back down (unless constraints are placed on buying while allowing only selling to take place). Eventually it does, but I wouldn't expect a rapid decline in silver like I would expect with a manipulated small-cap stock like CME.
The markets are not rigged nor are they rampant with insider trading.
JP Morgan has been busted and paid fines for rigging the silver market. Goldman Sachs has been busted for front-running their OWN clients. Nobody has gone to jail in either case. Nobody involved in MF Global or the 2008 financial crisis has gone to prison either, but it's well-established that all sorts of financial malfeasance have been running rampant then, and now - led by both the Federal Reserve and Congress.
I knew it would happen.
I hope that is hyperbole. I'd guess .0001% of the other side have the goal of destroying the enemy, even if it means losing money. The other 99.9999% are in it to make money.
Silver would have to get to $150 per ounce in order to match its value in early 1980. Even at $30 per ounce today that only equals $7.50 per ounce in 1980 dollars. Thank you inflation.
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
Sold my silver today at $40 an oz to capture the premium due to the shortage in the physical market.
Latin American Collection
Read WallStreetBets for a while. Yes, many of them want to make money. But a LOT of the louder voices in the room are doing it to wage war on the establishment.
people will use any excuse to make money nowadays and this is just one of many excuses to do such in this day and age
2003-present
1997-present
nice moves 😎🏎💨
Prices are Going to the moon 🌚