@PerryHall said:
Am I the only one who thinks that a coin collector limiting his collection to only 20 coins is ridiculous?
I'm not sure I'd call it ridiculous. I do think it is essentially impossible.
Can you imagine coming back from a coin show with this beautiful coin that is the centerpiece of anyone's collection and immediately going to your box and trying to decide which coin has to go?
Depends on the coins. Parmelee immediately worked on letting go of his Brasher Doubloon when he bought another one.
I think the concept of the Box of 20 is to buy coins where you wouldn't necessarily be able to hold them all.
Upgrading is one thing. But imagine if he bought his one and only Doubloon and had nothing but Proof 19th century gold in his box of 20. He'd have to sell one of the Proof gold just to fit the Doubloon into the box of 20.
I think a Box of 20 is more of a metaphor to prevent giant accumulations.
I think it's more a concept that doesn't really work for most collectors.
I think the general concept is to buy things that are expensive enough that you can only hold a few so that you get nicer, more expensive things, but most collectors don't want so few things.
I could not restrict myself to 20 pieces. I probably have a couple thousand or more items now if you count everything that is not in a tube or coin wrapper. I am doing projects on most all of it from time to time, and the collection is growing with addition of Roman emperors for Julius Caesar to Constantine the Great.
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
to my way of thinking and understanding the term Box of 20, it should be at the heart of every collection, no matter how big, important or valued. every collector should be able to hold out from the rest of their collection the best of the best and that would be their Box of 20.
BTW, with PCGS issuing the white, cardboard, PCGS embossed boxes that hold only 10 coins, the parameter has been altered.
@keets said:
to my way of thinking and understanding the term Box of 20, it should be at the heart of every collection, no matter how big, important or valued. every collector should be able to hold out from the rest of their collection the best of the best and that would be their Box of 20.
I think a number of collectors take it to mean this, basically a Top 20, but I think it goes beyond that. To me, it means buying at a level where you can’t hold much more, thus elevating the quality of your fewer pieces.
BTW, with PCGS issuing the white, cardboard, PCGS embossed boxes that hold only 10 coins, the parameter has been altered.
I went to eBay to get a PCGS Orange box to hold my top 20 but they are all sold!
I'm sure this has been posted but I see the box of 20 as a subset of your collection with your favorite or most unique coins. I know some people have done actual keep only 20 but I doubt they were strict either by technical definition. Maybe something like the 20 above $XXXX amount or something like? Given that definition I dont see why the premise wont endure as well always have a subset of our favorites.
So a box of 20 is in addition to other boxes of coins. Got it.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I recall when the concept was first advanced here on the forum. A lot of discussions back then. The idea never appealed to me. I have lots of coins. @keets has an excellent point, 20 special coins that - to the collector - represents his/her core/special coins. That could work for all collectors - though the number may vary. Cheers, RickO
@ricko said:
I recall when the concept was first advanced here on the forum. A lot of discussions back then. The idea never appealed to me. I have lots of coins. @keets has an excellent point, 20 special coins that - to the collector - represents his/her core/special coins. That could work for all collectors - though the number may vary. Cheers, RickO
I think all collectors should have a top subset of coins, but I also don’t think that is what the concept is about.
I just filled the last slot in a second box (40 coins). I used to own more, but decided I would rather have a smaller number of nice pieces than a lot of amusing coins that are mostly common/melt. Let's be honest, most end up with a large collection of mostly common/melt (as evidenced by the 'I just inherited a large collection' threads). Your money/interest so of course collect what you enjoy but when/if I pass before my wife, she will not have to deal with a lot of junk. Plus, I just really hate the experience of selling coins. If/when I decide to convert my coin resources into something else I will have much less work on my hands. I was happy to sell off a bunch of coins a few years ago and use the proceeds to buy fewer/nicer pieces.
@ricko said:
I recall when the concept was first advanced here on the forum. A lot of discussions back then. The idea never appealed to me. I have lots of coins. @keets has an excellent point, 20 special coins that - to the collector - represents his/her core/special coins. That could work for all collectors - though the number may vary. Cheers, RickO
I think all collectors should have a top subset of coins, but I also don’t think that is what the concept is about.
Strictly speaking, it's not. It's about building the value, but not the size, of your collection through careful upgrading over time. Since this was first proposed by a dealer, you could be cynical and say it's a way of churning someone's collection. It's a sound concept that isn't compatible with most collectors' instincts, personality traits, or goals. That we're talking about this widely understood concept a good 20+ years after it was first floated would seem to indicate the concept will stand the test of time, even if there are few collections made by strictly implementing it.
20 Coins From 20 Centuries - 1st Through 20th Century
This collection provides an impressive journey through two millennia of numismatic history. We are proud to be able to present the ambitious collector with this historically significant and unique collection spanning two thousand years. The collection itself consists of 20 coins, which impressively reflect the history of the 1st to 20th century A.D. Each century is represented by a particular coin through which a profound insight into its period and culture may be obtained. All of the coins in this compilation, which are selected by expert hands, are original historical artifacts that trace the ascent of dynasties, empires, rulers and world religions. Highlights of the set include ancient India, Persia, the Roman Empire, Pakistan, Imperial China, the Byzantine Empire, the Sultanate of Delhi, Europe and the New World of America
I can tell you when it works for some people. It really works for someone who wants to “dabble” but wants good stuff. For example I am more a collector of coins, comic books and even video games than a collector of currency. However I still wanted some quality currency. So I decided to dabble in it by tackling a box of 10 notes. Below is a link to my ongoing thread. It’s a great way for someone to try collecting currency without going hogwild. It’s working for me.
@TomB said:
It works well for those whose interests intersect neatly with the parameters. In this way, the Bo20 is no different than any other collecting strategy.
I agree. Which is why I decided long ago that if I ever do a Box of 20, it will be 1793 Cents by die variety.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Include as many (or as few) coins of whatever value and type you like in your collection. Coins YOU like, not ones you think other people think you should like. "Box of 20" sounds like marketing hype, don't let other people define the constraints for you. It's your collection, isn't it?
I dont know if I commented yet on this thread, but this is how I use a Box of 20 approach:
I have two basic collecting interests that I'm constantly working on in this hobby, and one of them is so esoteric that new additions come along rather infrequently. To keep my interest, I add and subtract from a Box of 20 of my favorite designs of tokens and medals usually from the Civil War era. When opportunity presents itself, I try to add something unique to that box with one or all of these attributes: rarity, history, and eye appeal.
They are in the "core collection" so to speak, yet nothing in there is totally off limits to sell because the set is always evolving. It is the the concept and the number of special pieces that remains constant.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
@DCW Your Box of 20 Civil War pieces is amazing and is a great example of moving pieces in and out of the collection.
One thing I've thought about is that many of the large collections were sold all at once with large catalogs but some collections, like TDNs, were built at different times but the pieces can be thought of collectively as part of the same collection.
For your Box of 20, it would be great to keep track of all the pieces that were ever in it, at any time, so the actual number of pieces may be larger than 20!
I believe in a slab roster of say 100- 120 slabs (like a college fb team) for easy mgt. The 20 coin storage boxes easy to store / manage. I have about 200 pieces graded currency which is much lighter and takes up less space. I know of one guy who uses the box of 20 concept. His are all slabbed MS69-70 AGB / AGE. A very impressive specialty. He is an investor.
I think any collection size should be planned on the capacity of secure storage used.
@Mr_Spud said:
I have a box of 20 plus another box of 20,000
Nobody says you can't do both. Twenty favorites is allowed.
The "Box of 20" concept is that you keep the number limited to 20 and sell the others.
"Box of 20 Favorites" is a good concept too, but it's not really in the spirit of the Box of 20 collecting concept.
Overall, it seems like the vast majority of collectors do not limit themselves to 20 pieces and a "Box of 20 Favorites" is much more popular than a "Box of 20". When a "Box of 20" is implemented (as envisioned where the excess is sold), it may be an additional collection to other collections, rather than the only collection.
With the discussion in this thread, my impression is that, in practice, a "Box of 20" collection may not "stand the test of time" as a well-known, well-regarded collection if it is only known by the 20 coins in at the end. It's certainly possible to collect only 20 amazing coins (imagine only rarities like 1913 Liberty Head nickel, 1804 dollar, 1884/185 Trade Dollars, 1916-D Mercury Dime, etc.), but it seems most collectors collect that way.
Indeed, it seems collectors don't strictly follow the "Box of 20" concept at all.
I think it's much more likely if the "Box of 20" was known for all the coins that were ever in it, so more than 20 coins in which case calling it a "Box of 20" is interesting.
Comments
I think it's more a concept that doesn't really work for most collectors.
I think the general concept is to buy things that are expensive enough that you can only hold a few so that you get nicer, more expensive things, but most collectors don't want so few things.
Just like that I'm at 18 now .
We can go on like this for a few minutes and then I think one of us is at 1 and its over.
I just quickly counted it out on my fingers and I guess you win
I could not restrict myself to 20 pieces. I probably have a couple thousand or more items now if you count everything that is not in a tube or coin wrapper. I am doing projects on most all of it from time to time, and the collection is growing with addition of Roman emperors for Julius Caesar to Constantine the Great.
to my way of thinking and understanding the term Box of 20, it should be at the heart of every collection, no matter how big, important or valued. every collector should be able to hold out from the rest of their collection the best of the best and that would be their Box of 20.
BTW, with PCGS issuing the white, cardboard, PCGS embossed boxes that hold only 10 coins, the parameter has been altered.
I think a number of collectors take it to mean this, basically a Top 20, but I think it goes beyond that. To me, it means buying at a level where you can’t hold much more, thus elevating the quality of your fewer pieces.
I went to eBay to get a PCGS Orange box to hold my top 20 but they are all sold!
I think there are absolutists who hold the concept to mean a collector only owns 20 coins. that is unworkable.
I'm sure this has been posted but I see the box of 20 as a subset of your collection with your favorite or most unique coins. I know some people have done actual keep only 20 but I doubt they were strict either by technical definition. Maybe something like the 20 above $XXXX amount or something like? Given that definition I dont see why the premise wont endure as well always have a subset of our favorites.
So a box of 20 is in addition to other boxes of coins. Got it.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I don’t think it needs to be just 20 but I also don’t think it’s simply your Top 20. I think it loses its meaning beyond say 40-50.
Beyond that, I’d just call it your Top 20.
It’s like the lunch table where the cool kids hang out
I recall when the concept was first advanced here on the forum. A lot of discussions back then. The idea never appealed to me. I have lots of coins. @keets has an excellent point, 20 special coins that - to the collector - represents his/her core/special coins. That could work for all collectors - though the number may vary. Cheers, RickO
I think all collectors should have a top subset of coins, but I also don’t think that is what the concept is about.
I just filled the last slot in a second box (40 coins). I used to own more, but decided I would rather have a smaller number of nice pieces than a lot of amusing coins that are mostly common/melt. Let's be honest, most end up with a large collection of mostly common/melt (as evidenced by the 'I just inherited a large collection' threads). Your money/interest so of course collect what you enjoy but when/if I pass before my wife, she will not have to deal with a lot of junk. Plus, I just really hate the experience of selling coins. If/when I decide to convert my coin resources into something else I will have much less work on my hands. I was happy to sell off a bunch of coins a few years ago and use the proceeds to buy fewer/nicer pieces.
Strictly speaking, it's not. It's about building the value, but not the size, of your collection through careful upgrading over time. Since this was first proposed by a dealer, you could be cynical and say it's a way of churning someone's collection. It's a sound concept that isn't compatible with most collectors' instincts, personality traits, or goals. That we're talking about this widely understood concept a good 20+ years after it was first floated would seem to indicate the concept will stand the test of time, even if there are few collections made by strictly implementing it.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Now this IS a box of twenty
20 Coins From 20 Centuries - 1st Through 20th Century
This collection provides an impressive journey through two millennia of numismatic history. We are proud to be able to present the ambitious collector with this historically significant and unique collection spanning two thousand years. The collection itself consists of 20 coins, which impressively reflect the history of the 1st to 20th century A.D. Each century is represented by a particular coin through which a profound insight into its period and culture may be obtained. All of the coins in this compilation, which are selected by expert hands, are original historical artifacts that trace the ascent of dynasties, empires, rulers and world religions. Highlights of the set include ancient India, Persia, the Roman Empire, Pakistan, Imperial China, the Byzantine Empire, the Sultanate of Delhi, Europe and the New World of America
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
I can tell you when it works for some people. It really works for someone who wants to “dabble” but wants good stuff. For example I am more a collector of coins, comic books and even video games than a collector of currency. However I still wanted some quality currency. So I decided to dabble in it by tackling a box of 10 notes. Below is a link to my ongoing thread. It’s a great way for someone to try collecting currency without going hogwild. It’s working for me.
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
I agree. Which is why I decided long ago that if I ever do a Box of 20, it will be 1793 Cents by die variety.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Include as many (or as few) coins of whatever value and type you like in your collection. Coins YOU like, not ones you think other people think you should like. "Box of 20" sounds like marketing hype, don't let other people define the constraints for you. It's your collection, isn't it?
I dont know if I commented yet on this thread, but this is how I use a Box of 20 approach:
I have two basic collecting interests that I'm constantly working on in this hobby, and one of them is so esoteric that new additions come along rather infrequently. To keep my interest, I add and subtract from a Box of 20 of my favorite designs of tokens and medals usually from the Civil War era. When opportunity presents itself, I try to add something unique to that box with one or all of these attributes: rarity, history, and eye appeal.
They are in the "core collection" so to speak, yet nothing in there is totally off limits to sell because the set is always evolving. It is the the concept and the number of special pieces that remains constant.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
@DCW Your Box of 20 Civil War pieces is amazing and is a great example of moving pieces in and out of the collection.
One thing I've thought about is that many of the large collections were sold all at once with large catalogs but some collections, like TDNs, were built at different times but the pieces can be thought of collectively as part of the same collection.
For your Box of 20, it would be great to keep track of all the pieces that were ever in it, at any time, so the actual number of pieces may be larger than 20!
I believe in a slab roster of say 100- 120 slabs (like a college fb team) for easy mgt. The 20 coin storage boxes easy to store / manage. I have about 200 pieces graded currency which is much lighter and takes up less space. I know of one guy who uses the box of 20 concept. His are all slabbed MS69-70 AGB / AGE. A very impressive specialty. He is an investor.
I think any collection size should be planned on the capacity of secure storage used.
Nobody says you can't do both. Twenty favorites is allowed.
The "Box of 20" concept is that you keep the number limited to 20 and sell the others.
"Box of 20 Favorites" is a good concept too, but it's not really in the spirit of the Box of 20 collecting concept.
Overall, it seems like the vast majority of collectors do not limit themselves to 20 pieces and a "Box of 20 Favorites" is much more popular than a "Box of 20". When a "Box of 20" is implemented (as envisioned where the excess is sold), it may be an additional collection to other collections, rather than the only collection.
With the discussion in this thread, my impression is that, in practice, a "Box of 20" collection may not "stand the test of time" as a well-known, well-regarded collection if it is only known by the 20 coins in at the end. It's certainly possible to collect only 20 amazing coins (imagine only rarities like 1913 Liberty Head nickel, 1804 dollar, 1884/185 Trade Dollars, 1916-D Mercury Dime, etc.), but it seems most collectors collect that way.
Indeed, it seems collectors don't strictly follow the "Box of 20" concept at all.
I think it's much more likely if the "Box of 20" was known for all the coins that were ever in it, so more than 20 coins in which case calling it a "Box of 20" is interesting.
I do both. I working on Box of 20 but also working on Jeffs 38-45 and have Lincoln date wheat set
Box of twenty ? O.K. My problem is I have about 75 boxes of twenty. AND I'M KEEPING THEM.
I am not in it for the test of time. That’s a foregone conclusion (see the 3000 chart since 89 crash).
I am in it to move it Now for positive retail sales / gain.
I think one has to take charts with a grain of salt. Some coins and exonumia have been doing exceedingly well.
Are you mostly a dealer then? If a dealer keeps his or her top 20 coins, the Box of 20 concept can work well!