My likely slow to develop "Box of Ten"
stevereecy
Posts: 205 ✭✭✭
Hey guys,
I used to be heavily into notes here. I'd love to expound on why I dropped out, and why I'm back, but if I do that, this thread will go into information overload. But in simple terms, I do love the aesthetics of notes, but it couldn't keep me in the hobby in the face of competing interests.
In a way, I have the same feelings about coins. And my coin interest was rekindled due to the "box of twenty" concept. The concept of box of twenty collecting came from the idea that a person could collect twenty (usually slabbed) coins in a 20-slot box like those provided by the NGC and PCGS grading services. You build a collection of quality coins limited to 20 coins, and once you acquire 20 coins, you can only improve your collection but you must maintain a total of 20 coins. This makes you focus on quality instead of quantity. In simple terms, whenever you add a new coin, you must sell an old one.
I find that this style of collecting really suits me. I have some coins out being graded, but I've pretty much hit the threshold of 20 coins, and I'm really happy with the results. It's important to use care when filling the box because your number of slots is limited. I've been selling off some of my less-interesting coins to fund that project and I'm confident the end product is something my heirs will appreciate, instead of the hodge-podge of loose coins I did have.
So you can guess where this is going. I do have a special place in my heart for currency...especially large size with a few exceptions. And I have quite a bit of somewhat so-so currency left over from my last effort that I can sell off to fund this venture. But balancing that with the expense of the notes that I'd like to work toward, this has to be a smaller venture. So, I'm going to tackle a "box of ten" of currency. Ok, there isn't really a box, but I might eventually get one. So here is my first purchase. (seller's photo).
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Comments
Interesting way of collecting. That ship has already sailed for me.
The box of ten or twenty concept isn't a widely used one in currency collecting but it does have it's appeal. There's no reason why such a box couldn't be in addition to other currency items or collections that one pursues. But ONLY a box of ten or twenty makes one focus, think, evaluate and choose one over another instead of both. Certainly something that all collectors should consider and decide and a different approach.
Now with that lovely black eagle $1 note as a first, your box can still take many directions. Nice high grade circulated large size type seems like a good collection but a broader approach may be high grade type notes from all eras of US currency-colonial through modern. And, of course, there are many other possibilities.
Are you going with large size type for now? Any thoughts about your next purchase?
That’s a good question. Bear in mind that most every note I buy will get upgraded at some point if I stick with this so I need to focus on bargains. But I also want to take pride in the note, which is a tall order. Thankfully there will always be sellers who don’t appreciate what they have or are in a hurry to sell.
In the short run I definitely want to go after large size, but there are a few small size notes that I want like the red seal funny back and I really like the small size $20 gold note (in particular) for some reason.
My next one will probably be a high-grade PPQ horse blanket to give my wallet a chance to cool off. I used to have one that was embossed so heavily I swear are you could cut your hand on it and the beauty of the reverse of these is under appreciated. But if some of my More expensive eBay “junk” sells suddenly I might hunt down something a little more expensive and save the horse blanket for later when money is tight. I’m intrigued by nice circulated examples of the less expensive large size gold notes. To me, they just seem spectacular relative to their price. So they are on my radar.
But yes, in general I’m looking at circulated large size notes with good paper quality. It never ceases to amaze me how inexpensive a nicer problem-free circulated large size note is relative to their rarity. I mean...sure...you guys have them...but most people don’t have one stashed in a cigar box like they do with coins. And if they do, it’s probably a ratty horseblanket with tape on it. I plan to seek out cleaner looking notes with minimal staining. There is a lot of latitude in the eye appeal of the VF to XF grades without much change in price. I like notes that technically have that extra fold but you need to look hard to see it.
I like the idea. I know little of currency, being pretty strictly a coin guy, but I think the "less is more" idea of a small, higher-quality collection is a good strategy, and I would imagine it could be applied just as well to currency as to coins.
Or any collectible, for that matter.
Hey Lord M. IMHO, you’re missing out. Currency is just as great as coins. However, like coins, it’s easy to get side tracked and buy a lot of “cigar box fodder” like I did. If you do decide to try it, limiting yourself in some fashion or otherwise putting great thought into each purchase is just as important as it is on the coin side. (again, IMHO)
Oops. If I confused anyone, WestySteve and me (Stevereecy) are one and the same. I don't want two usernames, but somehow I wound up with them when I recovered my "new" username on my phone and it found an old one. Sorry for the confusion.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Why are you going back-and-forth with the two member names on the same thread ?
Always loved the Black Eagle notes!
When I got back into coins a long time I couldn’t remember my old membership so I made a new one. Turns out my old address was created on my work email. Somehow logging in on my work phone triggered it.
I need to get rid of one of these accounts. I’ll probably use the oldest one. It’s a shame you can’t change your name here when you realize posting in your real name might not be a good idea.
OK this is weird. I was watching YouTube videos tonight. There is a video called “collecting and investing in paper money pt1” created by CGC. Yeah, that CGC. It’s obviously an older video.
Anyway, during the discussion, they covered the topic of how to collect. And the guy on the video recommended a “dirty dozen” approach which is exactly like the box of 20 concept except with 12 notes.
Struck me as interesting and coincidental.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Note #2 (seller's photo). I'm going to try to be somewhat picky on the purchase of my notes. This one seemed really clean and had good eye appeal for the grade. I'm also going to try to stick to notes that are somewhat harder to find in my price range. So I'll try to avoid notes that are prolific. So far, this is fun....I'm enjoying the hunt.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Handsome note Steve, congratulations bud.
I just snagged my third note. (Seller's photo) Had to buy this one raw because it was at the bleeding edge of my budget. Next notes will be cheaper. This was on the short list of my already short list. I wanted one with color (not faded)...the sharper border was a bonus. It's also an ornate back, which is pretty neat. At some point, I'll have it graded. I've opened the door for raw notes, so I won't have it graded until I gather some more. What do you think it will grade?
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Steve,
Looks to be in the mid VF range to me, and nicely ORIGINAL. I like it a lot.
Both are excellent additions and your strategy of avoiding the most common stuff is quite sound and wise.
This box is going to be a great way to introduce others to our interests. It's a good, valuable tool. It's visually attractive and the facts associated with them can be quite interesting. And other collecting possibilities can be explained using these.
Thanks. It did strike me as original and I’m hoping that it will get a Q designation when I have it graded. I also think it’s in the middle of the VF range.
Funny you should talk about the history of the note. I watched a video about Martha Washington and learned a lot of interesting stuff. I didn’t know that her marriage to George was her second marriage and she had four kids when she married him. And George was thought to be sterile, which they believe was from a childhood disease so they never had kids of their own. She was also a wealthy southern plantation owner before marrying George with all the negative connotations associated with that.
I do think this method would be a good side venture for the coin guys. Ten notes (or a dozen) isn’t a big, distracting, endeavor. It’s fun!
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Well said Steve. Congratulations on your newest addition.
Great note,I love Marthas! Still,don't get your hopes up for the "Q" when getting it graded...there are a few things I can see from the pics that will prevent that.Overall,the grade will VF20 pretty easily with a great shot at VF25,but no Q.
Ok. I can accept that. What are you seeing? Like to know what to look for in the next raw.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
On the front...a small "X" (ink or pencil?) towards the bottom under the "D.C.". Also a small light brown stain at the top of the P in "Payable" that can also be seen on the back. On the back, dead center, is some paper disturbance (pinhole or tear?).Also, the right 1/4 of the back appears stained/toned and so is the center fold (on the bottom half of the note).
Ok. Thanks. Does each issue disqualify it, or a group of them tip the scales? I saw these issues but figured if I didn’t try to fix them, they would be OK for a lower grade Q.
Appreciate the info.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Hmmmm, had a thought that if it didn’t get a Q, I might send it to be stickered. It impressed me as still being nice for the technical grade.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Hmmm...Comparing back and forth, I can only find one good picture of a slabbed "non-details" 25 Martha note. Here's the backside. Pretty sure mine falls between a VF25 and a VF30. Check it out.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
It finally showed up. Not gonna lie...it was cool seeing it raw.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Well that clearly didn't work. I vowed to decrease the amount I'm spending on each note. Instead, I just put 60% down to layaway my most expensive note to date. And ironically, the lowest grade. Ah well. The pain I'm feeling in my pocketbook will all be worth it when I get it. Pictures will pop up when it's paid off in a week or two.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Note #4: Well, nothing like an unexpected inflow of cash to help out your collection, right? That was the shortest layaway ever. I got this one from Northeast Coin for what I thought was a fantastic price, so I'm happy to promote their business. I was specifically looking for a VF20 because it was the lowest grade that would make me happy but was still beyond what I want to spend on my initial 10 notes. Next one will be cheaper.
I knew I had to buy it when I saw the PPQ designation. I didn't see any other VF20's in ppq in the marketplace during my search. The back is awful dusty, but from an optimistic point of view, the front is clean...maybe it laid face down somewhere for several decades. I'm happy nobody pressed or cleaned it though...I love the originality.
Thanks for following along this thread. After my next note, I'll do a half-way point group photo.
Seller’s photos
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Note #5 (Seller's Photo)
Another raw note. Finally something that doesn't break my bank account. Found this on Vcoin from Harford Coin. Looks like a no nonsense XF40...maybe an XF45. I've always liked this note...it's jarring to see Jackson on a $10. A pet peeve of mine is when the white area in the middle of the reverse has staining. This one seems pretty fresh. I'll have this one graded eventually.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
"My likely slow to develop "Box of Ten" is already 50 percent complete in under 2 months.
What will you do when you achieve your ten notes? At the rate you are going that could be by the end of December. Would it be better to save funds and buy a higher grade type note rather than multiple lower grade notes? Just my opinion. Collect what makes you happy.
Funny you added that Montgomery note, bc i was gonna mention adding a hometown national to your"box" of 10/12
Nice stuff, have fun!
Thanks. I looked up my Hometown national and we only had one bank and it would be thousands of dollars. It’s one of the really rare ones unfortunately.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Now I had guessed that your next choice might be an educational or rainbow or maybe a gold certificate of some sort. A tougher national type didn't even occur to me but it's an excellent choice and a great example for the grade. The centering is great (unusual on hand-cut nationals) and I like the unusual red signatures. The soiling on back is slight.
The 1918 FRNs are a beautiful series and also an excellent choice.
When you reach ten, are you going to upgrade and/or replace with more desired types or expand to 12, 15 or 20? Any thoughts yet? I guess that you need to see if ten is enough once you get there. It might be tough to "kick anyone off the island" with these excellent choices.
Well I was concerned that my box of 10 would be like my box of 20 coins where I would lose interest and drop the collection for a while and then come back to it a couple years later. I said “slow to develop” because I was hedging on my constantly changing level of interest. But I’m really enjoying these notes and finding it to be a lot of fun. Every time I get a new one in the mail it just makes me more excited about the next one so I’m adding them quicker than I expected. The visual impact of having the note in your hand is so cool. I really don’t know why I stopped collecting notes.
Your other question about why not just save up to get more spectacular notes is a fair question. With the box of 10 method, When I hit ten notes I will begin to upgrade. Though I am certainly not forced to. I could put some of my notes up for sale before the box is full or trade two for one etc. So I might upgrade some earlier. I’m considering doing that with my black eagle. So more spectacular notes are planned but just not right away. I certainly am enjoying what I have though. Compared to the fodder that I used to have they’re pretty cool to me. FWIW, I’ve been judicious in my buying so I don’t expect big losses during upgrading.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
I'm glad you are enjoying your purchases and you were judicious in your buying. Losing money when you resell can easily sour the experience. I've started and stopped over the years because of this. By the way the color on your $20 gold note is outstanding.
Thanks but that’s the sellers photo. Unfortunately when it showed up it didn’t look that good. Somebody might’ve got a little carried away with contrast and image lightening. Still a good looking note at a good price though so I kept it.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Sorry I missed your response. I haven’t decided about 10 or 12. But I do plan to stick to that ceiling. After doing quite a lot of shopping for large size notes I’ve noticed that the prices seem to run in “bands”. $300-$500 gets you into better notes (which has been a painful revelation) but the quality really jumps when you get into the $800 range. I’m scared to look to see what’s beyond that band.
Interesting that you are trying to predict my next acquisitions. You almost nailed it with one of your guesses but the older nationals make great type notes besides their obvious draw. I might be predictable because, due to budget constraints, my choices are limited. I can say that I amazed myself with my national purchase, it was a great deal so I don’t see upgrading it anytime soon.
I learned when you’re limiting yourself to 10 notes some of them have to do double duty. For example, I do like the 1923 one dollar horse blanket, but I also need to have stars and color varieties so I likely won’t get a common version of that note...I’d like the horse blanket to tick at least a couple boxes. Likewise, one note might have to represent a series, so if I do get an educational note it probably won’t be the one dollar note because I know I’ll likely own only one at a time. There’s no reason why I won’t end up with the five dollar note, which I love, because the upgrade process will make that feasible.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
"Thanks but that’s the sellers photo. Unfortunately when it showed up it didn’t look that good. Somebody might’ve got a little carried away with contrast and image lightening. Still a good looking note at a good price though so I kept it."
I was thinking the color was too good to be true. That's always a problem buying online versus making an inperson purchase. Unfortunately most of us are making online purchases due to Covid.
Note #6 (Unexpected and Controversial)
OK, here's one you didn't expect: (Seller's Photo)
This is definitely a note that Sellitstore didn't see coming
...a small size note
I love Lime Green Seals. I used to have some, including a great note that I bought from Numbersman years ago (a Dallas $5), and like a dope I sold them. Wish I had kept it, and I'll bet Numbersman feels the same way. , Since I know I'm going to be sending notes off to be graded anyway, I'm taking a chance on this one. The price on this, coupled with the strong embossing, makes this worth the gamble. FWIW, I've confirmed by more than one method that this would definitely be assigned the LGS designation.
On the way to purchasing this, I asked a few of you guys (privately) for opinions on grade (thanks!) and the opinions were all over the map. I heard every grade from VF+ to mid-AU. Most felt this is a likely PPQ/EPQ, but you never can tell. Along the way, while dickering with the seller about the grade, I think I made a new friend in the process, which was a nice dividend.
It needs to be stated: I will not monkey with this note. It will reside in a holder until I send it in...no pressing or anything like that.
So this note is much like that internet dress that everyone argued about the color on....how do YOU grade it? I'll eventually find out. And even if I could predict the grade (which I can't), it's hard to figure out the value, since there is a serious shortage of these Atlanta notes. This one adds some color and fun to the collection.
Update: The note came in the mail. Looks good under normal lighting:
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Great embossing. I’d give it an XF.
OK, you are right. I didn't see that coming. But now you are bending the rules a bit.
This seal color is a favorite among many collectors of 1934 FRNs.
For many years there was confusion over the terms used to describe the various shades. Eventually, it was concluded that at least some of this confusion was due to a slight color blindness among some who coined and used the color descriptions. I was among those who saw "light green seal" used for this color as well as another, which was light but not as yellow.
I think that there is now better standardization of these shades. I hope that small size experts will comment further.
Heh, if you read over my rambling with a fine-tooth comb you’ll see I left the door open for small size coolness. This LGS was always in the back of my mind because I just love them. While it might appear that I’m also being kind of thrifty compared to my other notes, if I invest time and $$$ into grading this note I’m gambling that it will fit in well with it’s large-size brothers.
You’re right about the color blindness issues. I have problems with seeing greens. So maybe this looks far more fabulous through my eyes.
. Once it’s squished inside a grading holder it will look new, though I am happy I’ll get to handle such an original note raw.
Interestingly, when I showed this one to the wife, she chided me for buying another raw. This one could be my last...we’ll see.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
As promised, here’s the group photo for the halfway point. The $10 Andrew Jackson note came in today. Let me tell you that thing was so wrapped in tape and so hard to open that I came a cats whisker from accidentally cutting it with a knife. I actually put a dent in the note holder and cut through the outer envelope that was inside the package. It was close!
Sorry about the shadow.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
Note #7: Picked this “raw” up last night (edit: updated with my photos after receipt). Out of all of the Fractionals, this design is one of my favorites. It was advertised as AU/CU as a FR 1271 with Violet Fibers, but my book says that would make it FR 1269. I don't think these are the best photos and I'll be curious to see how it looks in hand. What I like about it is Columbia...I always loved women on notes and coins. I also like how it fades to blue on the right side like a rainbow note and the violet fibers should add to its appearance. I bought it raw since I'm committed to slabbing some of my other notes so this can ride along.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
I read the OP & encourage other collectors to focus on quality over quantity. A box of 10? Not sure how I could contain myself to so few but there's nothing wrong with narrowing one's scope (in terms of a top 10 or top 20). I really like the 1922 Gold $20 & the Jackson $10 FRN (nice scene on the reverse). Great notes (congrats)!
**https://sites.google.com/view/notaphilycculture/collecting-banknotes **
@stevereecy ……… I’m thinking it is in fact an Fr 1271 with the smaller 38 mm seal. The Fr 1269 has the larger 40 mm seal. Both have the Blue Right Side , difference is seal size.
_Awesome progress on your “Box of Ten 👍 Beautiful Notes _
You need a battleship note in that box!
Thanks. What you’re saying makes sense. My 20 year old copy of United States Paper Money specifically calls out violet fibers for FR 1269. But I see now that could be taken in a different context since 1269 is potentially the only violet fiber variety of the large seal (it’s most salient feature), whereas 1271 is the only one with a smaller seal. Perhaps the author was being economical with his descriptions.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
You’re not wrong. The end of the line is looming and that one is up for consideration. I also really like the Bison note because it has a lot of cool features to it but I’m not relishing saving my pennies for it. I also like the Indian $5, but I find the Bison a little bit more ornate and I fully acknowledge that’s a matter of personal taste.
Being close to the end of this journey is making for interesting decisions. I’m trying to avoid the temptation of rushing to the end so that the upgrading can begin. I now have four raw notes so logically I should add at least one more raw to take advantage of a future membership with one of the grading companies...memberships always seems to involve buying 5 grading credits.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest
I believe that the paper used for these was the same paper as the 1869 "Rainbow" Legal Tender issue.
I like the fact that you chosen another type of US currency. Will all remaining notes be large or small size or would you consider a colonial, Confederate, obsolete or U.S. Military Payment Certificate? There are worthy candidates in each of these areas, too.
I’ll never say never. But I’ve owned MPCs and Confederate before and they don’t really “grab me”. Perhaps because I can’t buy lotto tickets and beer with them today. Same with broken banks. I’m on the fence about the colonials. I love the history of them but I also enjoy art on notes. My collecting interests might be colored by the types of notes my Dad had in his 3 or 4 note collection growing up.
My currency "Box of Ten" Thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1045579/my-likely-slow-to-develop-box-of-ten#latest