Is the Mercury dime the only coin with a male Liberty?
Zoins
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Lady Liberty is on many coins. Is Mercury the only male figure we have other than real people, including Indians?
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Wow, that's a twist. Never heard this one. Winged Liberty dime, a guy?!?!
I'd vote the Barber coinage a guy before the Merc's.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
It was a female model for the Mercury dime. I think the Barber coinage looks more like a male honestly.
Isn't Mercury a guy?
See this thread:
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1038399/post-a-favorite-mercury-dime#latest
Info on Mercury:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_(mythology)
LOLOLOL!
I think it's Ms. Liberty throughout all US coinage. You can tell on Mercs because she doesn't have an Adam's apple.
The Mercury dime features a female on the obverse - Ms. Liberty
https://mercurydime.net/history-of-the-mercury-dime/
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Elsie Stevens was believed to be the model.
Same model as walkers.
My Saint Set
Also, regardless of whether it is a God or a Goddess ... it is in Ms. Liberty, as stated. Also it is widely reported that the model for the Weinman's design was one Elsie K. Stevens, who was married to contemporary poet Wallace Stevens, and who rented rooms in a building Weinman owned in New York.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
Interesting since so many people call this Mercury. Is the idea that Mercury can be a woman?
Yes, Mercury was a guy, but he didn't pose for the dime.
From Mark's article it seems we don't know definitively who posed for the dime.
Winged Liberty ... expressing Freedom of Thought
The common use of Mercury caught on, and that was that
But yes, Mercury was a God
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
Be that as it may, I can (again) say with 100% certainty that it wasn't the god Mercury himself. I can also say with 99.9% certainty that the figure depicted on the Winged Liberty dime appears (to me) to be a female. YMMV.
It does not depict Mercury. It does depict Liberty with a winged head covering that, I believe, symbolizes freedom of thought.
Mercury's wings were at his ankles.
The Mercury dime was a name that was applied to the issue at an early date and has stuck ever since, though some have tried to correct it.
Mercury had wings on both his ankles and his head piece. Many depictions show this such as the one above and this one below.
Agree it seems "Mercury dime" is the common way to call this coin.
Thor is going to be a woman in the new movies, so perhaps Mercury can be a woman too?
I agree with the female designation.
I believe they are technically Winged Liberty dimes and Mercury was the nickname due to the portrait's similarity to him.
I thought that "Mercury Dime" was sort of like the generic name the coin was given while "Winged Liberty Dime" is the more accurate name. the generic name probably came about because of the resemblance to the Roman god Mercury. my take on it is this: Liberty is symbolically represented as being feminine, spiritual or related to the soul. if you consider the wings on Liberty's head they are actually part of the headband she's wearing which is emblazoned with the word Liberty.
Funny thread. She’s most definitely a woman and was always intended to be. The Mercury nickname is incorrect, but it stuck.
The god of mercury(Hermes) is male.
The god of mercury is NOT on the "Mercury Dime." That is a common misconception.
As others have said, it is Winged Liberty (a female model was used) that is depicted on the dime and the wings represent liberty of thought. The general public nicknamed it the Mercury Dime and it stuck.
Historically, other coins have also shown wings on head:
1. Bronze coin of Bithynia, depicting King Prusias II with a winged diadem, 183-149 B.C.
2. Winged head of Roma on a silver denarius issued by C. Terentius Lucanus, circa 147 B.C.
(Sourced this info from The Complete Guide of Mercury Dimes Second Edition by David W. Lange)
Both of those are "Winged" but NOT Hermes.
Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners.
Of course winged Liberty dimes, and "Indian" head cents, depict a female representation of the concept.
How about Indian head nickels, quarter and half eagles? The word Liberty isn't always on the headband..
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
I do think it's funny how commonly people use "Mercury" but then say the coin has a female depiction. The two don't necessarily go together but somehow it works.
Oh, I did not know this. I am not a big U.S. coin collector, but I always thought the public called it the Mercury Dime because of the god Mercury, who was the god of merchants and commerce. So, the image is meant to be Liberty? That is new for me. It resembled Mercury, so people called it that and it stuck.
There are a lot of examples in many cultures of how something inaccurate stuck and took a life of its own.
So, is Liberty the personification of the USA? How about Uncle Sam? France, Great Britain, and Germany have Marianne, Britannia, and Germania, respectively.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
Interesting discussion. Never gave this much thought. Here is the bust Weinmen sculpted of Elsie.
They bring out Uncle Sam when they want to convince people to join the military or pay taxes.
It was called the "Mercury" Dime when I started collecting.
I will continue to call it that.
And yes...........Elsie Katchel Stevens..........is the SAME person on the Walking Liberty Half.
Those are not Liberty but are actual (generic) Native Americans. Hence, no "Liberty" on the headband.
The $10 gold was Liberty, though.
And, of course, the Indian Head cent was Miss Liberty's first appearance in a Native American headdress.
@DeutscherGeist
Allegorical Liberty got us started, then the politicians started showing up on coins. The newest $1 coins have returned to a depiction of the Statue of Liberty, so perhaps there’s some hope.
The very idea of Liberty is something we might not appreciate as much as we should. Ancient civilizations sometimes flirted with it. Monarchy was the name of the game for centuries. The concept Of Liberty was pretty radical in the late 1700s. What took root here in the US spread back to Europe and across most of the Western world. Sometimes we act like it’s continuation is inevitable. God help us if we loose it.
I wonder if Liberty only goes back as far as when the French first gave us the Statue of Liberty on Ellis Island. Does the concept go back further than that? I mean, how did France know to make it in the first place?
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The Barber coinage was definitely the early transition phase!
Why does this look like a Chucky Cheese token?
The first coins the US issued in the 1790s portrayed Liberty. The statue came almost 100 years later. I assume France knew that was our symbol, or perhaps they envisioned the statue design as a good representation of the concept.
Let's be neutral and say transgender.
Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc
dude looks like a lady
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Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Is that more due to the metal than the design?
Lady Liberty for the US certainly goes back further than the Statue of Liberty!
Lady Liberty on coins in general goes back to the Roman era with Libertas Publica from 251 until 253. Libertas Pvblica means "Liberty for the Public."
https://nomosag.com/default.aspx?page=ucAuctionDetails&auctionid=14&id=553&p=6&s=&ca=0&type=webauction
For the US may have Benjamin Franklin to thank for this going back to 1782 when he penned the ideas for the Libertas Americana medal:
https://artgallery.yale.edu/collections/objects/99166
On US coins, she was Lady Liberty, Parent of Science & Industry in 1792:
She finally became our traditional Lady Liberty in 1793 on the large cent and half cent:
The French knew to make the Statue of Liberty because it was the US Centennial in 1876:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statue_of_Liberty
On US coins, she was Lady Industry and Liberty in 1792
we each interpret things differently. on that Disme my interpretation is: Liberty, Parent of Science and Industry.
in that sense it seems fitting that we have the "Innovation" Dollar series.
Ah, you're totally right! Too late right now!
Fixed it above.
Very interesting history here. I didn't realize that the idea for the Statute of Liberty took off in France during the American Civil War.
https://www.ancientpages.com/2018/09/28/is-there-an-ancient-secret-connection-between-the-statue-of-liberty-and-the-anunnaki-goddess-inanna/
Me thinks there was an androgynous Pat back then too. Peace Roy
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Interesting discussion. I had no idea there was so much confusion over the dime... or of the personification of Liberty.....I must get out more
Some things are just 'known'... and come with learning history (something that has long been diminished in our education system of today). Cheers, RickO
It’s funny this subject came up. I hate to admit it but until just last week I thought the Indian head Cent was a guy. I guess the headdress thew me off ALL OF MY DAMN LIFE😂
Mercury dime is a female. At least this is what I thought all of my life.
Oh, I thought the mercury dime was made with mercury.
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Wait, you mean the Indian Head Cent isn’t an Indian??
I thought it was common knowledge that it was a woman... Lol. Just nicknamed mercury because of the wings. She was playing dress up I guess.
If a bison copper can be called a buffalo nickel (75% Cu, 25% Ni), Winged liberty dimes can probably be called Mercury
My US Mint Commemorative Medal Set
I think this one is modeled after Superman:
Hey, 10 karat gold is still called gold, so why not?
Well, I'll still go ahead and think, as I believe the authorizers and designers of the coins almost certainly did, of those Native American images as at least as emblematic of Liberty as some allegorical woman. While I'm at it, same for Ben Franklin, the Presidents, and even all the eagle birds for that matter.
But don't mind me, I also think of God as the behavior of the laws of physics and nature, rather than an old bearded white guy in robes lounging on a cloud.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
The designs are actually very tightly controlled by the authorizing legislation.
For example, that little eagle on the reverse of the Franklin half is there to comply with an existing law that an eagle appear on the reverse of the half.
Also, "Liberty" must appear on our coins, either as an allegorical representation or as a word.