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Coins that circulated in early America - Does this chopmarked 8 reale qualify??
Lakesammman
Posts: 17,682 ✭✭✭✭✭
Or do the chopmarks automatically exclude it?? Were there China towns in America in 1808??
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Sue me
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Just saying.
John
See 3rd post.
I preface this with saying that while this series is fascinating I know very little about it except how to identify mint and assay marks. So the question I guess becomes could a coin from Lima Peru minted in 1808 make it to general circulation in the US?
Was it a significant proportion of 8 reales in early America? Probably not. In fact, the folks who would have brought them back from China then probably put the bulk of them, still bagged and counted, right back into the international trade network. I've learned to never say never on what circulated here though: I have a Russian coin from 1810 that was dug in Rhode Island and a cash coin from the 1790s that was dug in Connecticut. So who knows.
I would not equate chopmarks with regulation, though. A chop was, at root, a way to tell if a silver coin had a core of a different metal. But it didn't confirm that a coin was of proper weight, or even that the coin was genuine -- I've seen several contemporary counterfeit 8 reales that bore chopmarks. Regulation was a confirmation that a known merchant brought the coin up to a given weight standard.
If I was collecting coins that circulated in early America, I probably wouldn't necessary buy a piece with chopmarks. But if I wanted to show the role of the New World in international trade of that era, I definitely would.
<< <i>The US-China trade was alive and well after 1790, when the Lady Washington and Columbia went to Canton after a stop in the Pacific Northwest and became the first American vessels to circumnavigate the world. I don't know if China was a net importer of 8 reales or a net exporter, but I'm sure some of ours went there and some of theirs came here.
Was it a significant proportion of 8 reales in early America? Probably not. In fact, the folks who would have brought them back from China then probably put the bulk of them, still bagged and counted, right back into the international trade network. I've learned to never say never on what circulated here though: I have a Russian coin from 1810 that was dug in Rhode Island and a cash coin from the 1790s that was dug in Connecticut. So who knows.
I would not equate chopmarks with regulation, though. A chop was, at root, a way to tell if a silver coin had a core of a different metal. But it didn't confirm that a coin was of proper weight, or even that the coin was genuine -- I've seen several contemporary counterfeit 8 reales that bore chopmarks. Regulation was a confirmation that a known merchant brought the coin up to a given weight standard.
If I was collecting coins that circulated in early America, I probably wouldn't necessary buy a piece with chopmarks. But if I wanted to show the role of the New World in international trade of that era, I definitely would. >>
There are lots of Spanish Colonial coins with chops. At that time, the Philipines was a Spanish colony, and Manila was an important point of embarcation for very lucrative trade with East Asia (New World silver exchanged for silks, porcelains, etc.). For centuries, Spanish fleets traveled back and forth across the Pacific, between Manila and Acapulco.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
Not even 3rd cousins, thrice removed??
John - how can I get any controversy going here when you jump right in?? Aren't you supposed to be at an auction today??
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]