Swartz is right That whole thing was BS from the start, and still is I've got no problem with Allen, as a long time poster he deserved the benefit of the doubt and a certain amount of respect But no details, no proof, no auction #, no ebay ID (BTW hiding the ID of a thief is absurd), no action beyond a he-said she-said letter to ebay he might be a good guy, but on this thing he's FOS Lightning doesn't strike twice to the same person My opinion only Maybe I'm wrong
Just wanted to add that I believe the story to be true - Allen's been posting here for more yrs than most and doesn't need to draw attention by playing the 'drama queen.'
As was said - if someone wants to keep their ebay ID private - one can't divulge any info about the sale/buyer.
Since I haven't sold anything, I don't have a good hold on how to prevent this kind of thing - but I can sure see someone being a bit cautious with certain buyers when good money is involved.
Let's give Allen the same respect that we would want for ourselves.
There's been situations here where a person's ebay account has been terrorized by disgruntled forum members - and he's well aware of that.
I agree with Steve and Mike. I wouldn't share a darn bit of auction info with this forum anymore. Too many trouble makers who want to let the "other party" give their side of the story.
You'd think this forum was comprised of women there are so many hens in the hen house.
<< <i>Allen's been posting here for more yrs than most and doesn't need to draw attention by playing the 'drama queen.' >>
Then why did he?.. Why the drama I wonder???
If he just wanted storm's advice he could have easily refered to his last paypal ripoff thread.
Whatever, I like Allen also. My whole problem with this thread is that all the sellers get left out of the loop with regard to this hypothetical scammer. And buyers also.
I've personally been involved in a negative way with a seller that was also a buyer with a different ID. The buyer ID was outed by a member here in a thread, and when I told the member about the seller I was having problems with, also posting his real name and ebay ID. All the problems were solved. And ebay had more to go on of course. He got owned bad when his two different scams met two different members of CU.
what amazes me if this story is true, that according to ebay someone with hardly any feedback is superior to a seller that has been a paying member for many years. incredible
Unless I missed where Allen gave them a credit card to repay the $2000 he's not really out the money. He sold the card, the buyer got the card, and he got the $ out of his paypal acct.
Paypal might come after him with a collections action, I would think that would be a halfway easy one to challenge. Storm will know better than me about that.
I would lose the ebay acct and either start a new one or move on.
I don't think Allen did anything wrong here. $2000 is a lot to potentially lose. He made us aware of an uncommon scam technique that apparently works. He didn't out the buyer so any enemies he may have here don't try to hurt his position.
If he leaves here I hope at least that he goes across the street.
<< <i>And thus concludes my time on eBay and on these forums. Good Bye. >>
While I tend to believe Allen's story about being scammed, if he is also telling the truth about being finished with eBay, then there is no longer any reason to hide/protect his or the scammer's eBay ID--is there?
Also, if he is telling the truth about being finished with the forums, I guess we may never know any more details.
It seems like Allen "took his ball and went home"--and another eBay scammer remains cloaked and protected--free to strike again at least once more.
Allen, while I respect your right to not talk about the scammer--I agree with other posters that we would like to know who the POS scammer is--while he may have changed his eBay ID--you still know what his name and address is, since you had to mail him the cards. Could you at least send a PM or email to one of your friends on this board, so they can post the information about the scammer? Helping protect others against fraudulent eBay buyers or sellers is one of the cool aspects about this board--it would be great if you help others avoid this crook.
I collect Vintage Cards, Commemorative Sets, and way too many vintage and modern player collections in Baseball (180 players), Football (175 players), and Basketball (87 players). Also have a Dallas Cowboy team collection.
A few things to note, if/when such a scam is played on you:
Since the instant example of fraud was conducted thru the EBAY dispute console - not the PayPal scheme - the risk is VERY high that EBAY will piggyback the $2K with any fees designated to be funded via "automatic payment."
The lingo in the auto-pay agreement makes it easy for EBAY to suck the money from any source that PayPal is authorized to feed from. A sweep account - or ANY other source listed in your PayPal que - can easily be hit.
As the RICO-gang has sucked MILLIONS from checking accounts, it is reasonable to speculate that the ENTIRE purpose of adding the "EBAY resolution" scheme to the "PayPal Buyer Protection" scheme was to make it easy for EBAY to recover disputed funds. (Direct recovery thru the PP scheme is more difficult for the gang.)
Folks using a sweep account to fund EBAY fees, need to stop doing so. Sweep accounts should themselves ALWAYS be swept into an account that has ZERO connection to EBAY/PayPal. When a dispute arises, it is best to close the sweep account and remove it from the PP que; merely sweeping the account will result in repeated overdraft fees as the gangsters will repeatedly attempt to feed at the trough. Closing the sweep account is the ONLY way to short-circuit the scam.
................
The San Jose BBB is a viable complaint venue. EBAY has a team that deals with such complaints and routinely resolves filed cases to the seller's satisfaction.
Litigation brought in a Small Claims venue should name the criminal who masquerades as a buyer, EBAY who abets the scam, and PayPal who facilitates the transfer of the stolen money.
............................
EBAY and PP will usually wait up to 90-days before turning the disputed "debt" over to a collection agency.
Upon notice from such an agency, the seller should dispute the "debt" in writing within 30-days. Certified mail required.
A 100-word statement should be sent to the three credit bureaus. That statement should detail the seller's position in the dispute. Swear words are bad, but it is acceptable to use words like "RICO Enterprise," "fraud," "criminal," "extortion," "unfair business practices," etc.
If a seller is sued in such matters, he should counterclaim against the Plaintiff(s) AND file a separate action against the fake "buyer."
eBay said it would remove the Stores tab in the navigation bar that appears at the top of every page. In its announcement, eBay said very few buyers use the Stores tab, which sent shoppers to a portal page where they could browse by category or search by Store name or item.
In late March, eBay eliminated the Store inventory format but encouraged sellers to open Stores in order to save money on fees with the introduction of a new fee structure that rolled out in April. eBay said Monday that, since all items in eBay Stores are now included in regular search results, it would remove the Stores tab from the navigation header this week.
eBay had previously encouraged visitors to shop eBay Stores. "eBay Stores lets you connect with sellers who share your enthusiasm and offer the service, quality and unique shopping experience you deserve. Once you find an eBay Store you like, click the "Add to My Favorite Stores" link to bookmark it and stop in anytime.
30
................
May 14, 2010 Listing Counts:
eBay 104,494,384 +342685
eCrater 3,452,911 +4240
Bonanzle 3,161,996 +4102
Folks Who Bite Get Bitten. Folks Who Don't Bite Get Eaten.
<< <i>Too many trouble makers who want to let the "other party" give their side of the story. >>
AGREED!!!! I will never forget the time the guy who sent me empty "cracked" PSA slabs back in an attempt to get his money back AND keep the cards came on and gave "his side" of the story.............I felt like I was in the People's Court and this guy was lying through his teeth after he swore on a stack of bibles to tell the truth. I can laugh about it now, but at the time, that was a serious scam going on and I was worried about losing some good money!
1) I would disagree that this type of scam is rare - it happened to me in 2008 and that's the last nickel ebay ever got from me, directly or indirectly.
2) I like to think that I have a pretty good BS detector and even though I never spoke with Allen and I am not a member of any CU cliques, I'd notice his name around the boards and he always seemed like a truthful, forthright, good guy
3) As one of the few people who employ reason and logic on a daily basis, storm's opinions mean a lot to me. That he essentially (correct me if I'm wrong) sides with Allen in this case influences me more than a little
Having said that, this (Allen's description of his ebay woes) still smells like an urban legend to me. It plays on our worst fears (they got my card AND my money) and whether the thread meant to or not, it pulls the bait and switch: lots of emotion, punch and drama up front followed by evasion and non-answers coasting into an abrupt exit. That there may be good reasons for the evasions and non-answers is not a negative reflection of the OP but to me, it does follow the urban legend formula.
You guys are probably sick of me sanctimoniously mentioning in every post that I took the hard line and quit ebay years ago, so I won't beat that drum here. But I'll go on record, right or wrong, as saying that the OP's story as reported in this thread does not ring true to me.
<< <i>3) As one of the few people who employ reason and logic on a daily basis, storm's opinions mean a lot to me. That he essentially (correct me if I'm wrong) sides with Allen in this case influences me more than a little >>
Allen, I'm sorry this happened and I'm not doubting your story. Just seems like you were reactive instead of proactive.
<< <i>I waited for eBay Customer Support to contact me within 48 hours as my case said they would. Four days later I received a standard email telling me that I had lost the dispute. >>
<< <i>I made several more attempts in getting help from customer service and was told that due to the dollar amount of the transaction my case had been assigned a specialist who would have to handle it. Twice I left my cell phone number and was assured they emailed him and he would be calling me that same day. I was never called >>
And according to eBay, you didn't make an appeal until after 45-days:
<< <i>At this time, we are unable to grant your appeal as it has been over 45 days since our decision was made. >>
If I was potentially out of $2k, I would call more than several times. You should have been calling them every waking hour of every day, immediately appealed any decision, and raised holy heck.
Maybe you did do that but based upon your posts, doesn't sound like it.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
Comments
<< <i>it wasnt $2 it was $2000.00
if it walks like a duck...
and if other threads were similar...
someone having some fun...
naivety comes to mind...
where is Waldo?
nuff said... >>
4 is more than 5
Does a bear sh1t in the woods?
Have you a sunday on yesterday
stupidity isn't dumb
Monopoly
Yes sir Captain!
_____
Are you trying not to make sense or does it just come naturally?
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." Dr. Seuss
That whole thing was BS from the start, and still is
I've got no problem with Allen, as a long time poster he deserved the benefit of the doubt and a certain amount of respect
But no details, no proof, no auction #, no ebay ID (BTW hiding the ID of a thief is absurd), no action beyond a he-said she-said letter to ebay
he might be a good guy, but on this thing he's FOS
Lightning doesn't strike twice to the same person
My opinion only
Maybe I'm wrong
As was said - if someone wants to keep their ebay ID private - one can't divulge any info about the sale/buyer.
Since I haven't sold anything, I don't have a good hold on how to prevent this kind of thing - but I can sure see someone being a bit cautious with certain buyers when good money is involved.
Let's give Allen the same respect that we would want for ourselves.
There's been situations here where a person's ebay account has been terrorized by disgruntled forum members - and he's well aware of that.
You'd think this forum was comprised of women there are so many hens in the hen house.
<< <i>Allen's been posting here for more yrs than most and doesn't need to draw attention by playing the 'drama queen.' >>
Then why did he?.. Why the drama I wonder???
If he just wanted storm's advice he could have easily refered to his last paypal ripoff thread.
Whatever, I like Allen also. My whole problem with this thread is that all the sellers get left out of the loop with regard to this hypothetical scammer. And buyers also.
I've personally been involved in a negative way with a seller that was also a buyer with a different ID. The buyer ID was outed by a member here in a thread, and when I told the member about the seller I was having problems with, also posting his real name and ebay ID. All the problems were solved. And ebay had more to go on of course. He got owned bad when his two different scams met two different members of CU.
<< <i>and if other threads were similar... >>
Swartzie one other thread was similar. One.
Steve
Paypal might come after him with a collections action, I would think that would be a halfway easy one to challenge. Storm will know better than me about that.
I would lose the ebay acct and either start a new one or move on.
I don't think Allen did anything wrong here. $2000 is a lot to potentially lose. He made us aware of an uncommon scam technique that apparently works. He didn't out the buyer so any enemies he may have here don't try to hurt his position.
If he leaves here I hope at least that he goes across the street.
JMHO
<< <i>
<< <i>and if other threads were similar... >>
Swartzie one other thread was similar. One.
Steve >>
like I said - naive...
extend your search...
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
Positive Transactions - tennesseebanker, Ahmanfan, Donruss, Colebear, CDsNuts, rbdjr1, Downtown1974, yankeeno7, drewsef, mnolan, mrbud60, msassin, RipublicaninMass, AkbarClone, rustywilly, lsutigers1973, julen23 and nam812, plus many others...
<< <i>And thus concludes my time on eBay and on these forums. Good Bye. >>
While I tend to believe Allen's story about being scammed, if he is also telling the truth about being finished with eBay, then there is no longer any reason to hide/protect his or the scammer's eBay ID--is there?
Also, if he is telling the truth about being finished with the forums, I guess we may never know any more details.
It seems like Allen "took his ball and went home"--and another eBay scammer remains cloaked and protected--free to strike again at least once more.
Allen, while I respect your right to not talk about the scammer--I agree with other posters that we would like to know who the POS scammer is--while he may have changed his eBay ID--you still know what his name and address is, since you had to mail him the cards. Could you at least send a PM or email to one of your friends on this board, so they can post the information about the scammer?
Helping protect others against fraudulent eBay buyers or sellers is one of the cool aspects about this board--it would be great if you help others avoid this crook.
Since the instant example of fraud was conducted thru the
EBAY dispute console - not the PayPal scheme - the risk is
VERY high that EBAY will piggyback the $2K with any fees
designated to be funded via "automatic payment."
The lingo in the auto-pay agreement makes it easy for EBAY
to suck the money from any source that PayPal is authorized
to feed from. A sweep account - or ANY other source listed
in your PayPal que - can easily be hit.
As the RICO-gang has sucked MILLIONS from checking accounts,
it is reasonable to speculate that the ENTIRE purpose of adding
the "EBAY resolution" scheme to the "PayPal Buyer Protection"
scheme was to make it easy for EBAY to recover disputed funds.
(Direct recovery thru the PP scheme is more difficult for the gang.)
Folks using a sweep account to fund EBAY fees, need to stop doing
so. Sweep accounts should themselves ALWAYS be swept into an
account that has ZERO connection to EBAY/PayPal. When a dispute
arises, it is best to close the sweep account and remove it from the
PP que; merely sweeping the account will result in repeated overdraft
fees as the gangsters will repeatedly attempt to feed at the trough.
Closing the sweep account is the ONLY way to short-circuit the scam.
................
The San Jose BBB is a viable complaint venue. EBAY has a team that
deals with such complaints and routinely resolves filed cases to the
seller's satisfaction.
Litigation brought in a Small Claims venue should name the criminal
who masquerades as a buyer, EBAY who abets the scam, and PayPal
who facilitates the transfer of the stolen money.
............................
EBAY and PP will usually wait up to 90-days before turning the disputed
"debt" over to a collection agency.
Upon notice from such an agency, the seller should dispute the "debt"
in writing within 30-days. Certified mail required.
A 100-word statement should be sent to the three credit bureaus. That
statement should detail the seller's position in the dispute. Swear words
are bad, but it is acceptable to use words like "RICO Enterprise," "fraud,"
"criminal," "extortion," "unfair business practices," etc.
If a seller is sued in such matters, he should counterclaim against the
Plaintiff(s) AND file a separate action against the fake "buyer."
........................
....................................
And, the beat goes on:
eBay Quits Sending Traffic to Stores Portal Page
By Ina Steiner
AuctionBytes.com
May 11, 2010
eBay said it would remove the Stores tab in the navigation bar that appears at the top of every page. In its announcement, eBay said very few buyers use the Stores tab, which sent shoppers to a portal page where they could browse by category or search by Store name or item.
In late March, eBay eliminated the Store inventory format but encouraged sellers to open Stores in order to save money on fees with the introduction of a new fee structure that rolled out in April. eBay said Monday that, since all items in eBay Stores are now included in regular search results, it would remove the Stores tab from the navigation header this week.
eBay had previously encouraged visitors to shop eBay Stores. "eBay Stores lets you connect with sellers who share your enthusiasm and offer the service, quality and unique shopping experience you deserve. Once you find an eBay Store you like, click the "Add to My Favorite Stores" link to bookmark it and stop in anytime.
30
................
May 14, 2010 Listing Counts:
eBay 104,494,384 +342685
eCrater 3,452,911 +4240
Bonanzle 3,161,996 +4102
<< <i>ke I said - naive... extend your search... >>
Link us.
Steve
<< <i>Too many trouble makers who want to let the "other party" give their side of the story. >>
AGREED!!!! I will never forget the time the guy who sent me empty "cracked" PSA slabs back in an attempt to get his money back AND keep the cards came on and gave "his side" of the story.............I felt like I was in the People's Court and this guy was lying through his teeth after he swore on a stack of bibles to tell the truth. I can laugh about it now, but at the time, that was a serious scam going on and I was worried about losing some good money!
1) I would disagree that this type of scam is rare - it happened to me in 2008 and that's the last nickel ebay ever got from me, directly or indirectly.
2) I like to think that I have a pretty good BS detector and even though I never spoke with Allen and I am not a member of any CU cliques, I'd notice his name around the boards and he always seemed like a truthful, forthright, good guy
3) As one of the few people who employ reason and logic on a daily basis, storm's opinions mean a lot to me. That he essentially (correct me if I'm wrong) sides with Allen in this case influences me more than a little
Having said that, this (Allen's description of his ebay woes) still smells like an urban legend to me. It plays on our worst fears (they got my card AND my money) and whether the thread meant to or not, it pulls the bait and switch: lots of emotion, punch and drama up front followed by evasion and non-answers coasting into an abrupt exit. That there may be good reasons for the evasions and non-answers is not a negative reflection of the OP but to me, it does follow the urban legend formula.
You guys are probably sick of me sanctimoniously mentioning in every post that I took the hard line and quit ebay years ago, so I won't beat that drum here. But I'll go on record, right or wrong, as saying that the OP's story as reported in this thread does not ring true to me.
I wonder why you said 'if' Swartzie?
In this thread one other situation was brought to light.
I know of no other thread created by the OP that was similar.
And, I'd bet if there were more some of the sleuths here would have linked them long ago.
Steve
<< <i>3) As one of the few people who employ reason and logic on a daily basis, storm's opinions mean a lot to me. That he essentially (correct me if I'm wrong) sides with Allen in this case influences me more than a little >>
According to at least one poster Storm is naive.
As is Stone and myself.
Steve
<< <i>I waited for eBay Customer Support to contact me within 48 hours as my
case said they would. Four days later I received a standard email
telling me that I had lost the dispute. >>
<< <i>I made several more attempts in getting help
from customer service and was told that due to the dollar amount of the
transaction my case had been assigned a specialist who would have to
handle it. Twice I left my cell phone number and was assured they
emailed him and he would be calling me that same day. I was never
called >>
And according to eBay, you didn't make an appeal until after 45-days:
<< <i>At this time, we are unable to grant your appeal as it has been over 45
days since our decision was made. >>
If I was potentially out of $2k, I would call more than several times. You should have been calling them every waking hour of every day, immediately appealed any decision, and raised holy heck.
Maybe you did do that but based upon your posts, doesn't sound like it.
<< <i>
And according to eBay, you didn't make an appeal until after 45-days:
<< <i>At this time, we are unable to grant your appeal as it has been over 45
days since our decision was made. >>
>>
Actually, I think he started contacting them well before that...but now that its well past day 45, eBay says they can't help.
<< <i>Actually, I think he started contacting them well before that...but now that its well past day 45, eBay says they can't help. >>
Well with regard to no type of anything... how the hell can any of us help?
Pretending to be offended and skipping court is not excusable or defendable.