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NGC Early Release label adds $26,000 to value of 2009 $20 UHR?

greghansengreghansen Posts: 4,301 ✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum
I was scrolling through the EBAY completed auctions on these coins and ran across this auction:

EBAY auction for 2009 $20 UHR NGC MS70PL Early Release

I had been aware that the MS70 PL NGC coins had been selling for around $4K, but at least 2 bidders were willing to pay $30,000 for a MS70 PL UHR in an Early Release slab. Is anyone aware of a higher premium being paid for any coin in a 'early release' or 'first strike' slab? I don't pretend to understand the rationale of buyers who will pay this sort of premium...but I admit to being fascinated by it.

Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum

Comments

  • RedHerringRedHerring Posts: 2,077 ✭
    I had heard these were bringing up to $8-$9K.

    $30K? I'm checking my postmarks.......
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I consider it ridiculous... however, it is not my money - therefore, not my concern. Cheers, RickO
  • ebaytraderebaytrader Posts: 3,312 ✭✭✭
    Nice score for Bob!
  • RWBRWB Posts: 8,082 ✭
    Just an opinion- the label adds nothing.
  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 34,850 ✭✭✭✭✭
    A fool and their money ... image
    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • packers88packers88 Posts: 558
    ALot of ebay stuff also gets bidded up by friends and family so that a barometer can be set for a legit sale a few weeks later. SOmeone else might pop up a few weeks from now and say that one just sold for $31,000, so mine should be worth $31,000.
  • soty27soty27 Posts: 1,956


    << <i>ALot of ebay stuff also gets bidded up by friends and family so that a barometer can be set for a legit sale a few weeks later. SOmeone else might pop up a few weeks from now and say that one just sold for $31,000, so mine should be worth $31,000. >>



    This is correct, simply check the feedback and notice there is none for the item.
  • OPAOPA Posts: 17,143 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Just an opinion- the label adds nothing. >>



    Not so....F/S labels or Early Release labels do add to the value .... face reality ... you may not agree with it, but that's just the way it is.
    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
  • AnkurJAnkurJ Posts: 11,370 ✭✭✭✭
    image
    All coins kept in bank vaults.
    PCGS Registries
    Box of 20
    SeaEagleCoins: 11/14/54-4/5/12. Miss you Larry!
  • RedHerringRedHerring Posts: 2,077 ✭

    Just noticed the winning bidder has feedback of (0)!
  • SonorandesertratSonorandesertrat Posts: 5,695 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Just an opinion- the label adds nothing. >>



    Not so....F/S labels or Early Release labels do add to the value .... face reality ... you may not agree with it, but that's just the way it is. >>




    The U. S. Mint has made it clear that it cannot ascertain which coins are true 'first strikes'. Those labels are marketing gimmicks, nothing more. Anyone who pays a huge premium for a modern coin with such a label will need to find a buyer who is a greater fool in order to have a hope of recovering his 'investment'.
    Member: EAC, NBS, C4, CWTS, ANA

    RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'

    CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
  • MilesWaitsMilesWaits Posts: 5,438 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I remember MCM selling those when the UHR first hit the streets; I had no idea it would draw this great of interest or there would be so few available!???

    As far as the bidding, someone with a feedback number of 15764 bid $17765, then three bidders with varying feedback numbers of 49, 36 and eventually the winner at 0 feedback,

    all drove the price much higher.

    As a seller, I would be happy to get paid but be much happier to be dealing with someone that has some history with ebay.

    He may be wishing the highest bidder had been any of the combatants other than the one with zero feedback.

    As a bidder, could you imagine getting a Second Chance Offer of $30,000 after the heat of bidding had subsided and soberness has arrived??

    Miles

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.
  • eggboneeggbone Posts: 615 ✭


    << <i>A fool and their money ... image >>



    image
  • RYKRYK Posts: 35,800 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>ALot of ebay stuff also gets bidded up by friends and family so that a barometer can be set for a legit sale a few weeks later. SOmeone else might pop up a few weeks from now and say that one just sold for $31,000, so mine should be worth $31,000. >>


    That's exactly what I was guessing when I saw this.
    My Box of 20: https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/box-20/ryks-gold-box-20/17132
  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 29,335 ✭✭✭✭✭
    everyone on ebay started there at 0. with something like that thou it would be better to have some sort of minimum number on that ( eg: 10,15 etc, etc
  • SonorandesertratSonorandesertrat Posts: 5,695 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>ALot of ebay stuff also gets bidded up by friends and family so that a barometer can be set for a legit sale a few weeks later. SOmeone else might pop up a few weeks from now and say that one just sold for $31,000, so mine should be worth $31,000. >>


    That's exactly what I was guessing when I saw this. >>



    image

    Just a form of shill bidding.
    Member: EAC, NBS, C4, CWTS, ANA

    RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'

    CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
  • crazyhounddogcrazyhounddog Posts: 14,071 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think the selling price for these coin is foolish....image
    The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
  • sbeverlysbeverly Posts: 962 ✭✭✭
    I like to say that I've gotten old enough that nothing surprises me.

    That price was surprises me...
    Positive transactions with Cladiator, Meltdown, ajbauman, LeeG, route66,DennisH,Hmann,FilamCoins,mgoodm3,terburn88,MrOrganic, weg,dcarr,guitarwes,Zubie,Barndog,wondercoin,braddick,etc...
  • CharlieCCharlieC Posts: 189 ✭
    Todays look at the stats show there were 7 graded Early Release that went 70-MSPL.

  • ebaytraderebaytrader Posts: 3,312 ✭✭✭
    The seller is one of the most reputable men around, and not just within the business, with integrity beyond reproach.

    There was no funny stuff going on with that auction. Period.
  • RYKRYK Posts: 35,800 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>The seller is one of the most reputable men around, and not just within the business, with integrity beyond reproach.

    There was no funny stuff going on with that auction. Period. >>


    I did not catch the winky. image
    My Box of 20: https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/box-20/ryks-gold-box-20/17132
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,903 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Makes about as much sense as paying $106,000,000 for a Picasso painting.image

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • PlacidPlacid Posts: 11,299 ✭✭✭
    I dont think the seller was doing anything. Same seller has a pcgs graded ms70 uhr with a bin for normal prices.

    I see one (not early release) sold at Heritage on Oct 13, 2009 for $2,530.00 (includes BP)

    image

    Link to Heritage sale.
  • nencoinnencoin Posts: 1,284 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>The seller is one of the most reputable men around, and not just within the business, with integrity beyond reproach.

    There was no funny stuff going on with that auction. Period. >>



    Ebaytrader is correct. It's frustrating some times to see how quickly people assume a dealer is doing something underhanded. Bob and Rich Lecce are experienced, honest dealers. This particular buyer so happened to wire the funds the very next day. A legit auction all around.
    Northeastcoin.com
  • MilesWaitsMilesWaits Posts: 5,438 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I dont think the seller was doing anything. Same seller has a pcgs graded ms70 uhr with a bin for normal prices.

    I see one (not early release) sold at Heritage on Oct 13, 2009 for $2,530.00 (includes BP)

    image

    Link to Heritage sale. >>



    Yes, and MCM was selling for around that price or lower when they were first released but now, the perceived "rarity" and "special PL" factor is causing a significant rise in prices

    whether you view the last ($30,000) or previous auctions. It is simply shocking but not unbeilevable in the context of the 2008-W Gold Buffs and other ecent rising issues.

    Miles
    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.
  • RYKRYK Posts: 35,800 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Being that my gut reaction was probably wrong, I apologize for jumping to conclusions and will have to simply agree with those who believe that it is ridiculous and leave it at that.
    My Box of 20: https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/box-20/ryks-gold-box-20/17132
  • 19Lyds19Lyds Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Nice score for Bob! >>



    Bob??

    Isn't he that Enzyte guy??

    Stuff must really work.
    I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.



    The name is LEE!
  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 36,073 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What are the NGC pops for MS70 ER, MS70PL, and MS70 ?

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,955 ✭✭✭✭✭
    That buyer must be totally nuts...one of the most absurd numismatic purchases that I've ever seen. The buyer must have so much $ that $30K just doesn't mean much and he just had to have the ER label with such a low pop. It really boggles the mind. A hearty congrats to the seller - what a score!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Note also the $25K + (which didn't sell) being asked for a PCGS MS70 FS UHR.

    Finally, the proof like thing seems foolish as well. Note the PCGS didn't do it. A couple of months ago one could buy an MS70PL for around $2300. I didn't even consider it as I've seen PLs and non-PLs side-by-side and, for the life of me, couldn't tell the difference.

    Just unreal - to pay so much for a (meaningless) ER label.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 36,073 ✭✭✭✭✭
    there were 3 bidders. The other two of them really drove it up.

    and a fourth in the high $17k's

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,955 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>Just an opinion- the label adds nothing. >>



    Not so....F/S labels or Early Release labels do add to the value .... face reality ... you may not agree with it, but that's just the way it is. >>




    The U. S. Mint has made it clear that it cannot ascertain which coins are true 'first strikes'. Those labels are marketing gimmicks, nothing more. Anyone who pays a huge premium for a modern coin with such a label will need to find a buyer who is a greater fool in order to have a hope of recovering his 'investment'. >>



    I think that there is no question that the label is techincally meaningless, but the most certainly add value. This can not be denied. A great marketing job.

    The seller is first rate. I think that the auction is legit.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!

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