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Major seated coinage dealer refuses to sell me his coins
KingOfCoins
Posts: 153
I won't mention his name, but he is the author of one of the major reference books for seated coins.
I emailed him wanting to buy some semi-key seated quarters. I gave him a list of criteria that I was looking for in the coin (rim bumps, scratches etc...)
He responds telling me that I would be better off buying at shows, because it is easier to just to hand the coin back rather than having to ship it back.
I then respond saying that I will relax my standards because the date is so hard to find in any grade, and I made a promise not to return the coin. I told him I would send a money order when he confirmed availability of the coin. (It was an 1868-s quarter)
He then responds that none of his 68-s quarters meet my requirements, and that I shouldn't relax my standards. He added that when he was a collector, he was as picky as me, and never bought via mail order.
So now I am out of luck, and it appears he won't sell me any of his coins because I am too picky, even thought I gave him a guarantee I would not return any of the coins.
Did I do something wrong here?
I emailed him wanting to buy some semi-key seated quarters. I gave him a list of criteria that I was looking for in the coin (rim bumps, scratches etc...)
He responds telling me that I would be better off buying at shows, because it is easier to just to hand the coin back rather than having to ship it back.
I then respond saying that I will relax my standards because the date is so hard to find in any grade, and I made a promise not to return the coin. I told him I would send a money order when he confirmed availability of the coin. (It was an 1868-s quarter)
He then responds that none of his 68-s quarters meet my requirements, and that I shouldn't relax my standards. He added that when he was a collector, he was as picky as me, and never bought via mail order.
So now I am out of luck, and it appears he won't sell me any of his coins because I am too picky, even thought I gave him a guarantee I would not return any of the coins.
Did I do something wrong here?
0
Comments
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>If none of his coins meet your standards, I don't see the issue. >>
would not pass , what appears to be,your reasonable standards.
I have had really good dealers, call me up to discuss a coin in great detail
before they send it to me. You may be well served not dealing with this
person as the relationship does not sound like it would be a pleasant one.
Big reputations do not aways translate ,into good and honorable dealers.
Some big shots can talk the talk, but they can not walk the walk.
Camelot
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Russ, NCNE
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
only marginal, second rate cr*p. You folks appear much too
accepting, of sheer rudeness for candor.
Camelot
means the difference, in the long run, between
making money and losing money. Much as in real estate,
with coins it is always, quality, quality and quality!!!!!
Camelot
you probably wear velvet robes and a crown, right?
everyone knows it's tough to please a King in his own Court
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
only marginal, second rate cr*p.
Bear - It sounds like you have no idea how difficult it is to find perfect circ 1868-S quarters. I'll bet that in the last 30 years I haven't seen half a dozen I'd want in my own collection, if I collected the series.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
San Diego, CA
I was discussing this with a gentleman at the same coin show and he said that his father had been a furniture store owner/carpenter, and made, sold, and repaired furniture. A guy came into his dads shop one day and spent an inordinate amount of time inspecting pieces of furniture, finally turning to the guys dad and saying, "Ill take it". His dad said Im sorry, I cant sell to you. If I did I would have to live in your house, as you would constantly be demanding my attention on every detail.
Im not a picky person, I understand some people are, and sometimes I get taken advantage of by people who are picky. Id rather have my PCGS Pr70 and MS70 Gold Buffalo First Strikes back , than have someone unhappy with them, they will go to someone who wants them without feeling like they have to spend all night doing research they should have done prior to buying them.
I know the dealer you are referring to and he is giving you good advice. Just as a side note, if it is the person I am thinking of, he is conservative in his grading and very fair, so you can expect to get what he says and maybe even better.
Suggestion: buy a few less expensive coins from him and see if you are pleased with the coins. Then, if you are happy, pull the trigger on the semi-keys that you are looking for.
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
That is possible. Or, the seller might just be trying to save the
buyer from feeling unhappy after the sale.
When buyers email questions that indicate they are going to
be difficult to satisfy, I steer them to shows/shops... and away
from EBAY/online sales. That does not mean I am being rude,
and it does not mean the buyer is unreasonable; only that I
do not want to deal with the circumstance.
Doing de facto "approval" sales on EBAY is especially troublesome
for sellers.
Buyers should be "picky;" and they should be prepared to pay
top-dollar for their perfect finds.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Just keep looking. And bookmark the dealer's page as one of your regular sites to check.
-David
And if that dealer does find something of that quality you can bet it will be 20-50% over regular price.
roadrunner
<< <i>If none of his coins meet your standards, I don't see the issue. >>
you would not like his coins and would return them as unsatisfactory.
edited to add: even with the no return clause you wished to add,
you were already becoming a "potential problem".
<< <i>You appear to have tagged yourself as being more potential trouble than your business would be worth. >>
That's how I interpreted it. And now I'm very curious to see the "list of criteria" you gave him . . .
Me too. I would love to see the email you sent.
It may seem to be more expensive to travel to a large show (such as Baltimore) to see the major Seated dealers in person, but you avoid the time and expense of sending a coin back and you get the added bonus of being able to develop a relationship with a dealer. You can discuss your likes and dislikes in person and you and the dealer can point to examples of what you like or dislike in his inventory.
Plus, while you're at the show, you can go to a meeting of the Liberty Seated Collectors' Club and meet some other Seated collectors.
Check out the Southern Gold Society
<< <i>if a dealer tells you that the coin wont work for you... and it's in his inventory. He's going to be right >>
Well stated.
You go to a major show, you can examine the coins and buy or decline on the spot. You can also dicker with the seller to try to get the price down.
I've been collecting the Seated Quarters for nearly 20 years now.
If you won't take anything but perfect coins, it's best you switch from the Seated Quarters to the State Quarters.
Your coins won't be worth diddly, but they'll be perfect and you'll be happier.
Ray
Completely original
No noticeable rim bumps
No noticeable scratches (a few minor dings/small scratches are acceptable)
100% full rims on both sides
Medium dark color (must be even color and attractive)
Devices should be a lighter color than the fields
Maybe that is too much to ask, but I thought that because this dealer is known very well for seated coinage, he might have something I would like.
I didn't expect him to not want to sell me anything.
I should have worded it better. "No noticeable rim bumps" should probably read "no significant or deep rim bumps."
I am not looking for perfection, just a better than average circulated coin.
The gemmy circulated seated quarters are most elusive.
The advice is good - go to shows, find what you like, and buy it.
<< <i>Completely original
No noticeable rim bumps
No noticeable scratches (a few minor dings/small scratches are acceptable)
100% full rims on both sides
Medium dark color (must be even color and attractive)
Devices should be a lighter color than the fields >>
Your criteria, while certainly not out of the realm of possible, disqualifies the vast majority of coins in this series that most collectors would classify as relatively problem-free, original and attractive. Given that, I could imagine that the dealer might have several coins that many folks would kill for, but that might fall somewhat short of one or more of your qualifications. Therefore, I can imagine how someone might have quite high quality, desireable coinage yet may think you would not want it.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Maybe a collector that has high standards and wants everything for nothing would fit. But I do not see anywhere in this thread where the buyer is a cheapo buyer.
Ken
<< <i>Here is the exact criteria I gave:
Completely original
No noticeable rim bumps
No noticeable scratches (a few minor dings/small scratches are acceptable)
100% full rims on both sides
Medium dark color (must be even color and attractive)
Devices should be a lighter color than the fields
Maybe that is too much to ask, but I thought that because this dealer is known very well for seated coinage, he might have something I would like.
I didn't expect him to not want to sell me anything.
I should have worded it better. "No noticeable rim bumps" should probably read "no significant or deep rim bumps."
I am not looking for perfection, just a better than average circulated coin. >>
My view is that your original criteria as listed (prior to the qualifiers you added after the fact) might have convinced the dealer that you were going to be unrealistic in your expectations and very hard to please.
But as you have recognized, slight changes in wording to indicate that your were realistic would have helped a lot.
Find someone that can!
there is an old saying about not keeping a toilet in the kitchen
J/K.....Sounds like the dealer has his ethics in order....you wouldn't want to buy a car over the internet just because of the advertised mileage would you? You would want to know the history, whether or not it matched your lifestyle (in this case an existing collection). He is protecting his interests as well as yours. If it was a common coin, I can see where it could be a "sight unseen" type of a deal but when you are dealing in quality coins of x dollars for a collection....it comes down to seeing the coin INHAND prior to purchasing.
Hell, I don't need to exercise.....I get enough just pushing my luck.
What does this imply about the Quality/ Authenticity of his coins.
I don't know who HE is and furthermore I don't want to know.
<< <i>This Dealer is scared of you Ron. >>
<< <i>What does this imply about the Quality/ Authenticity of his coins. >>
This "one side of the story" does NOT imply anything about the Quality/Authenticity of the dealers coins!! It shows that the dealer did not feel that the particular coin he had in inventory at this time would meet the buyers expectations. I applaud the dealer.
<< <i>No harm, no foul. Just as collectors may choose to deal with whomever they wish, so may dealers. >>
I agree with RYK !!
My #1 Low Ball Peace Dollar Set
Probably not.
<< <i>I didn't expect him to not want to sell me anything. >>
Anything or just this one coin?
You could always contact him again and clarify your standards. If this is the dealer I think it is, it will be good to have a working relationship with him and to have him looking for stuff, because if anyone can find something, he can.
I'd stick to your standards, you will be able to complete the perfect set with time.
I can't think of a situation in which I would give up my right to return a coin.
And if that dealer does find something of that quality you can bet it will be 20-50% over regular price.
roadrunner
I agree.
I feel your pain. All of us collectors other than Modern wantabe flippers would love to fill some key spots, many times willing to settle with less quality than we'd prefer. Personally, I think the Dealer came off as a jerk. Selling coins via mail / approval is part of the business. It's not his place to determine what's in the best interest of the Buyer. I'd have respect for the Dealer if he told you it was crap, but he'd send it to you for your inspection in case you were tired of looking at that empty spot in your collection and were wiling to settle for it until he found you an upgrade.
Any person like this Dealer treated you is the same 'crap' as his coins IMHO. I don't care how high fulutin he thinks he is, his S,H,I,T still stinks. Stay away from the Jerk.
I have trouble putting a dealer down who actually tries to deliver what his customers want. As if we'd actually want more dealers looking out for themselves at the expense of others. I'd actually be curious of who this dealer is, since I also happen to like seated quarters.