King Farouk's Wonderful Coins!

Zoins · October 24, 2021 6:43PM

When I think of the most awesome of patterns, the 1877 Half Union is at the top of the list because of it's denomination and size.

While the gold ones are now owned by all of us in the National Numismatic Collection, some gilt ones are available to the collecting public with a census here:

https://uspatterns.stores.yahoo.net/j1549p1722.html

Here's the 1877 Half Union in gilt copper owned by King Farouk.

What a gorgeous piece!

This used to be a PCGS PR63.

It was upgraded to NGC PF63+.

coinsarefun · October 24, 2021 6:50PM

I'd take it in a heart beat........who do I need to know?

Lakesammman · October 24, 2021 6:53PM

Pretty cool, but not sure it's the King of Patterns.

I'd like to see "Deo Est Gloria" instead of IGWT on the reverse. Seems more appropriate for a 1877 pattern.

Zoins · October 24, 2021 7:02PM

@Lakesammman said:
Pretty cool, but not sure it's the King of Patterns.

I'd like to see "Deo Est Gloria" instead of IGWT on the reverse. Seems more appropriate for a 1877 pattern.

Deo Est Gloria seems appropriate for 1879 given the Stellas. Is it used on prominent 1877 patterns?

yosclimber · October 24, 2021 7:04PM

The PCGS "100 Greatest U.S. Coins" Registry Set has the half union as the 3rd highest pattern:

#7 1907 Double Eagle Pattern Judd 1776 Proof

#11 1872 Amazonian Set Proof

(photo of J-1549 Gilt)
#13 1877 "Half Union" Fifty Dollar (Type One or Two) Proof
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/famous-u-s-coins/famous-u-s-coins/100-greatest-u-s-coins/composition/1576

Given that the design is very similar to the regular $20, I agree the J-1776 and Amazonians are more interesting.

Zoins · October 24, 2021 7:08PM

@yosclimber said:
The PCGS "100 Greatest U.S. Coins" Registry Set has the half union as the 3rd highest pattern:
#7 1907 Double Eagle Pattern Judd 1776 Proof
#11 1872 Amazonian Set Proof
#13 1877 "Half Union" Fifty Dollar (Type One or Two) Proof
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/famous-u-s-coins/famous-u-s-coins/100-greatest-u-s-coins/composition/1576

Given that the design is very similar to the regular $20, I agree the J-1776 and Amazonians are more interesting.

Great point! Of course, everyone can have their own ranking methods. I can see how you focus on the design but to me patterns include denomination, for which this one is hard to beat.

Here are my thoughts:

I like the half union because it's a larger, unused denomination, something others, like the J-1776, don't have. The J-1776 is nice but is using an existing denomination and used designs. As a pattern, the design is less interesting to me because it's used on the Eagle and Double Eagle coins.
Regarding the Amazonian set, I don't generally consider an entire set when ranking individual specimens. And while the Amazonian double eagle design is interesting... I'll leave it at that....
It would be great to have relative sized photos

Nothing wrong with your ranking or thinking. The above is just mine.

yosclimber · October 24, 2021 7:11PM

The $50 denomination is available in the Pan-Pac and the California Assay Office octagonals.

Zoins · October 24, 2021 7:13PM

@yosclimber said:
The $50 denomination is available in the Pan-Pac and the California Assay Office octagonals.

Useful to note, but neither are standard issue coins, for which this is a pattern for.

Pan Pac is a commem and came much later.

Assay octagonals are basically bullion bars.

Crypto · October 24, 2021 7:42PM

@Zoins said:

@yosclimber said:
The $50 denomination is available in the Pan-Pac and the California Assay Office octagonals.

Useful to note, but neither are standard issue coins, for which this is a pattern for.

Pan Pac is a commem and came much later.

Assay octagonals are basically bullion bars.

Thin line between commemoratives and standard issues. Currency is currency when issued. Even the modem bullion with their fictitious face values aren’t the same as the 50$ Pan Pacs as they were issued to currency standards for content

Zoins · October 24, 2021 7:46PM

@Crypto said:

@Zoins said:

@yosclimber said:
The $50 denomination is available in the Pan-Pac and the California Assay Office octagonals.

Useful to note, but neither are standard issue coins, for which this is a pattern for.

Pan Pac is a commem and came much later.

Assay octagonals are basically bullion bars.

Thin line between commemoratives and standard issues. Currency is currency when issued. Even the modem bullion with their fictitious face values aren’t the same as the 50$ Pan Pacs as they were issued to currency standards for content

The Pan Pac slugs are somewhat similar to modern clad half dollar commemoratives as their metal content is similar to those issued for circulation purposes, but were issued with a commemorative price premium. The 1915 slugs were sold for twice their face value and gold content, at $100 a piece.

MsMorrisine · October 24, 2021 7:49PM

Aside: I wouldn’t call a panpac a slug

Zoins · October 24, 2021 7:50PM

@MsMorrisine said:
Aside: I wouldn’t call a panpac a slug

Why not? Is half union better?

Broadstruck · October 24, 2021 7:51PM

Looks more like a Morgan design than Barber.

MsMorrisine · October 24, 2021 7:58PM

It’s just the association of the bullion octagonal as slugs.

I’d call them the panpac round or panpac octagonal

Zoins · October 24, 2021 10:35PM

@MsMorrisine said:
It’s just the association of the bullion octagonal as slugs.

Was the term slug used for any denomination other than $50?

I’d call them the panpac round or panpac octagonal

It would be nice to use a term that denoted denomination like eagle or double eagle. If slug doesn't fit the bill, half union could work.

Zoins · October 25, 2021 3:11AM

Wow! I just noticed that Mike @Byers sold the top pop NGC PF64+ CAC Simpson-Byers specimen a while back!

More on MikeByers.com: https://mikebyers.com/1964000-001.html

BillJones · October 25, 2021 3:45AM

Believe or not, when I went to my first large coin shows in New York City in the early 1970s, there was a coin dealer who had one of these pieces in his case for sale. The piece was far beyond my pay grade at the time, but there is was sitting in his case as a featured coin.

ricko · October 25, 2021 3:47AM

Collectors may well debate terms and beauty of these gold specimens. For me, they are just works of coin art. I like them all. Cheers, RickO

BillJones · October 25, 2021 3:48AM

@Zoins said:

@MsMorrisine said:
It’s just the association of the bullion octagonal as slugs.

Was the term slug used for any denomination other than $50?

I’d call them the panpac round or panpac octagonal

It would be nice to use a term that denoted denomination like eagle or double eagle. If slug doesn't fit the bill, half union could work.

These coins were called “half unions.” The “union”, or $100 gold piece, never got beyond the concept phase, but there were plans for it.

Zoins · October 25, 2021 4:25AM

@BillJones said:
Believe or not, when I went to my first large coin shows in New York City in the early 1970s, there was a coin dealer who had one of these pieces in his case for sale. The piece was far beyond my pay grade at the time, but there is was sitting in his case as a featured coin.

That's really amazing to see. Definitely a treat and something to remember

Byers · October 25, 2021 7:29AM

Zions- that $50 Half Union pattern was one of my favorite patterns that I owned.

Zoins · December 29, 2023 3:42PM

Here's another coin from King Farouk's collection, the single 1866 No Motto Dollar available:

1866 No Motto Dollar, PCGS PR63+ CAC, Ex - Snowdon-Woodin-Boyd-Green-Newman-Farouk-duPont-Simpson

King Farouk's Wonderful Coins!

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