Should PCGS require Gold Shield for every classic US coin?

Zoins · April 19, 2019 7:33PM

I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

Update: a big general request for this has been to make the hobby safer by reducing both doctoring and counterfeiting.

sparky64 · April 19, 2019 7:44PM

Required?
No, not at all.

I love Trueviews because I'm not good with the camera yet, BUT
if I could take pics like messydesk, et al I'd consider it a waste of time and money.

RogerB · April 19, 2019 7:46PM

No. Services requested are at the owner's discretion.

Zoins · April 19, 2019 7:47PM

@sparky64 said:
Required?
No, not at all.

I love Trueviews because I'm not good with the camera yet, BUT
if I could take pics like messydesk, et al I'd consider it a waste of time and money.

Beyond just being nice photos, TrueViews are official reference photos that people can rely on to represent the coin as PCGS saw it, to help prevent doctoring and counterfeiting.

Zoins · April 19, 2019 7:47PM

@RogerB said:
No. Services requested are at the owner's discretion.

Well, it's required for classic World coins

And it would help deal with both doctoring and counterfeiting.

Smudge · April 19, 2019 7:58PM

On a high dollar coin, yes. Many coins are slabbed that aren't worth top drawer service and customers should be able to pick the option they want. A smart customer will normally choose the best option for the coin being submitted.

BryceM · April 19, 2019 8:19PM

Catering to the needs and wants of the clients is usually a winning formula. Mandates are rarely a good idea. JMHO.

Bochiman · April 19, 2019 8:33PM

As a shareholder of CLCT, I like the idea.
As a practical and logical submitter (collector....or even, I would imagine, a dealer), the answer would be no.

Not everyone that buys a coin cares about a trueview, even for classic coins. Many untoned classic coins, particularly if circulated, don't require/need a trueview. Many classic coins aren't that expensive.

While I can understand how it makes it "easier" for some people, to impose your idea of what's right on others, just because it is easier for you, is the wrong way to go.

Zoins · April 19, 2019 8:34PM

@Bochiman said:
While I can understand how it makes it "easier" for some people, to impose your idea of what's right on others, just because it is easier for you, is the wrong way to go.

One thing is that PCGS already does this for classic World coins so it would be making the services consistent.

Should PCGS stop requiring Gold Shield for classic World coins?

PQueue · April 19, 2019 8:55PM

Just what's needed, TrueViews for the hundreds of thousands of PCGS graded Morgans.

illini420 · April 19, 2019 9:06PM

You mean "The Big One" that was advertised nearly a decade ago? Of course it should be required. There should not be an option to bypass that extra scanning and security. But we know that a few vocal crack out dealers have kept that from happening so far.

Raybo · April 19, 2019 9:06PM

@Zoins said:
I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

Morgan? Really?

Zoins · April 19, 2019 9:12PM

@Raybo said:

@Zoins said:
I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

Morgan? Really?

Yes, it's a toner, but I have other pieces too like colonials that I need to send in.

Zoins · April 19, 2019 9:12PM

@illini420 said:
You mean "The Big One" that was advertised nearly a decade ago? Of course it should be required. There should not be an option to bypass that extra scanning and security. But we know that a few vocal crack out dealers have kept that from happening so far.

I was thinking crack out dealers would be the most against this as well. Perhaps they will be more okay now that CoinFacts doesn't show as many coins.

lkeigwin · April 19, 2019 9:38PM

All coins should be imaged as part of the grading process. It will happen eventually.
Lance.

messydesk · April 19, 2019 9:48PM

I think more important is for every coin to be photographed fresh off the sonic welder. It won't be a glamour shot, but it can be done with sufficient automation that it wouldn't cost much time on the assembly line.

winesteven · April 19, 2019 9:56PM

@Zoins said:
Beyond just being nice photos, TrueViews are official reference photos that people can rely on to represent the coin as PCGS saw it, to help prevent doctoring and counterfeiting.

I’m a big fan of PCGS, TV, and GS, but I have to say despite today’s technology of hi res photos, IMO so many TV’s don’t come close to the true representation of luster on a coin, and even color is often not as close as one would expect of the actual color of the coin in hand.

Zoins · April 19, 2019 10:20PM

@messydesk said:
I think more important is for every coin to be photographed fresh off the sonic welder. It won't be a glamour shot, but it can be done with sufficient automation that it wouldn't cost much time on the assembly line.

The old Secure Plus automated scans were super dark and hard to use many times. If something like this is done again, hopefully it can be better.

The ATS slab scans seem to be getting better. Some are almost ok.

ilikemonsters · April 19, 2019 10:28PM

No. An 1834 Capped Bust Dime in Good doesn't need to be TV'd.

MFeld · April 20, 2019 5:06AM

@Zoins said:

@Raybo said:

@Zoins said:
I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

Morgan? Really?

Yes, it's a toner, but I have other pieces too like colonials that I need to send in.

You just think you need to send them in. In reality, you want to send them in.😉

ricko · April 20, 2019 5:23AM

I do not like 'mandatory' things....and services cost money, so it should be an electable service. I like TruViews, and I have coins with TV's...I also have a lot without them... just not worth it. Cheers, RickO

keets · April 20, 2019 7:01AM

NGC already photographs every encapsulated coin, right?? I take advantage of that feature and find it helpful. also, how many times do you find yourself at the PCGS cert-check page wishing a picture was available?? for me it is often enough to realize it would be a good idea. like the pictures available via TV or not, they at least tend to be consistent and remove an ability of sellers to deceive.

realistically, if PCGS did a picture of everything they slabbed the small fee would be outweighed by the benefit of having the picture.

Cougar1978 · April 20, 2019 7:26AM

No - isn’t this more expensive?

Services at owners choice.

I would resent some outsider (poster here) butting in on something which is my choice with my Pcgs submissions.

jabba · April 20, 2019 7:46AM

I honestly don’t know if the gold shield is superior to the normal holders but when I got my 3-leg crossed I chose the gold shield and true view Incase I ever sell the coin it would be neat that coins valued over a certain amount get it automatically.

Hemispherical · April 20, 2019 7:52AM

Makes it a bit easier to analyze a coin when buying if there is a GSTV or TV available.

Edit to add: With the latest quarterly special I have been sending slabs in for a reholder to get the GS/TV. Once I started
it’s now become an OCD thing.

coinbuf · April 20, 2019 8:09AM

So because you want something everyone else should have to pay extra, who appointed you emperor? You should learn the definition of "want" and "need"; these words have separate meanings and are not interchangeable. Freedoms lost are very hard to win back, I and many others who have also posted in your thread want the freedom to choose not some silly mandate because you feel it's better for all.

keets · April 20, 2019 8:33AM

I would resent some outsider (poster here) butting in on something which is my choice with my Pcgs submissions.
until about six months ago I wasn't aware that NGC photographed every coin encapsulated by them, but they do and did. it seems to be helpful and I believe it is probably a counterfeit deterrent.

So because you want something everyone else should have to pay extra, who appointed you emperor?
costs for submissions are steadily increasing and I suppose that since the TV cost is already low that this feature could be incorporated into the next increase. the price will be going up sooner than later anyway. in the long rune this will be a good thing for everyone.

I suppose a reasonable approach would be a very nominal fee for the current service, high quality/high resolution pictures meant for "viewing" and to help with auctions, and a more production-line feature for every coin to help with the counterfeit issues. PCGS could recoup some of that with the next fee increase and no one would even know.that should satisfy everyone.

ReadyFireAim · April 20, 2019 10:38AM

@Zoins said:
I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield...

I know some dealers prefer the flattering, "soft focus" pictures that they take.
I've been burned a couple times by their sneaky photography.

PCGS won't bite the hand that feeds them by making TV mandatory.
We saw that when they gutted coin facts.

Personally though, I won't buy a coin anymore without TV.
I don't need to anymore.

Dave99B · April 20, 2019 1:04PM

No, it should not be required.

On the other hand, a basic pic of EVERY coin they grade would clearly help reduce the crazy doctoring/counterfeiting that's rampant right now. I'd advocate for that, and I expect we will see it soon. Fingers crossed.

Dave

ms70 · April 20, 2019 1:07PM

No.

Desert Moon · April 20, 2019 6:42PM

@ilikemonsters said:
No. An 1834 Capped Bust Dime in Good doesn't need to be TV'd.

No, depends on the collector doesn't it?

dbldie55 · April 20, 2019 7:58PM

NGC has images of the coins in the holders (at least all that I have submitted). They do not charge for this.

They are offering a new service for nice images when they are not in the holder. They do charge for this. (I think another grading service does something like this)

Should Gold Shield be mandatory....not just no but ...

Bochiman · April 20, 2019 8:08PM

@Zoins said:

@Bochiman said:
While I can understand how it makes it "easier" for some people, to impose your idea of what's right on others, just because it is easier for you, is the wrong way to go.

One thing is that PCGS already does this for classic World coins so it would be making the services consistent.

Should PCGS stop requiring Gold Shield for classic World coins?

That's up to PCGS and what world coin submitters will want/accept.

Just because they do it for those, doesn't mean it should be forced on it for others. Would be nice for every submitted coin to have a picture, but to be REQUIRED to pay more to have that, when many of them are generic looking, is not something I would support (from a collector/submitter viewpoint).

Should PCGS require Gold Shield for every classic US coin?

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