Should PCGS require Gold Shield for every classic US coin?

ZoinsZoins Posts: 19,413 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited April 20, 2019 9:14AM in U.S. Coin Forum

I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

Update: a big general request for this has been to make the hobby safer by reducing both doctoring and counterfeiting.

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Comments

  • sparky64sparky64 Posts: 6,350 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Required?
    No, not at all.

    I love Trueviews because I'm not good with the camera yet, BUT
    if I could take pics like messydesk, et al I'd consider it a waste of time and money.

    "If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"

    My meager Washington Quarter Registry set

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 19,413 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 19, 2019 7:48PM

    @sparky64 said:
    Required?
    No, not at all.

    I love Trueviews because I'm not good with the camera yet, BUT
    if I could take pics like messydesk, et al I'd consider it a waste of time and money.

    Beyond just being nice photos, TrueViews are official reference photos that people can rely on to represent the coin as PCGS saw it, to help prevent doctoring and counterfeiting.

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 19,413 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 19, 2019 7:49PM

    @RogerB said:
    No. Services requested are at the owner's discretion.

    Well, it's required for classic World coins ;)

    And it would help deal with both doctoring and counterfeiting.

  • SmudgeSmudge Posts: 4,007 ✭✭✭✭✭

    On a high dollar coin, yes. Many coins are slabbed that aren't worth top drawer service and customers should be able to pick the option they want. A smart customer will normally choose the best option for the coin being submitted.

  • BryceMBryceM Posts: 7,982 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Catering to the needs and wants of the clients is usually a winning formula. Mandates are rarely a good idea. JMHO.

  • BochimanBochiman Posts: 24,686 ✭✭✭✭✭

    As a shareholder of CLCT, I like the idea.
    As a practical and logical submitter (collector....or even, I would imagine, a dealer), the answer would be no.

    Not everyone that buys a coin cares about a trueview, even for classic coins. Many untoned classic coins, particularly if circulated, don't require/need a trueview. Many classic coins aren't that expensive.

    While I can understand how it makes it "easier" for some people, to impose your idea of what's right on others, just because it is easier for you, is the wrong way to go.

    I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 19,413 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 19, 2019 8:35PM

    @Bochiman said:
    While I can understand how it makes it "easier" for some people, to impose your idea of what's right on others, just because it is easier for you, is the wrong way to go.

    One thing is that PCGS already does this for classic World coins so it would be making the services consistent.

    Should PCGS stop requiring Gold Shield for classic World coins?

  • PQueuePQueue Posts: 738 ✭✭✭

    Just what's needed, TrueViews for the hundreds of thousands of PCGS graded Morgans.

  • illini420illini420 Posts: 11,292 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You mean "The Big One" that was advertised nearly a decade ago? Of course it should be required. There should not be an option to bypass that extra scanning and security. But we know that a few vocal crack out dealers have kept that from happening so far.

  • RayboRaybo Posts: 4,431 ✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:
    I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

    Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

    Morgan? Really?

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 19,413 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Raybo said:

    @Zoins said:
    I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

    Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

    Morgan? Really?

    Yes, it's a toner, but I have other pieces too like colonials that I need to send in.

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 19,413 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 19, 2019 9:14PM

    @illini420 said:
    You mean "The Big One" that was advertised nearly a decade ago? Of course it should be required. There should not be an option to bypass that extra scanning and security. But we know that a few vocal crack out dealers have kept that from happening so far.

    I was thinking crack out dealers would be the most against this as well. Perhaps they will be more okay now that CoinFacts doesn't show as many coins.

  • lkeigwinlkeigwin Posts: 15,072 ✭✭✭✭✭

    All coins should be imaged as part of the grading process. It will happen eventually.
    Lance.

  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 15,966 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think more important is for every coin to be photographed fresh off the sonic welder. It won't be a glamour shot, but it can be done with sufficient automation that it wouldn't cost much time on the assembly line.

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 276 ✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:
    Beyond just being nice photos, TrueViews are official reference photos that people can rely on to represent the coin as PCGS saw it, to help prevent doctoring and counterfeiting.

    I’m a big fan of PCGS, TV, and GS, but I have to say despite today’s technology of hi res photos, IMO so many TV’s don’t come close to the true representation of luster on a coin, and even color is often not as close as one would expect of the actual color of the coin in hand.

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 19,413 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 19, 2019 10:21PM

    @messydesk said:
    I think more important is for every coin to be photographed fresh off the sonic welder. It won't be a glamour shot, but it can be done with sufficient automation that it wouldn't cost much time on the assembly line.

    The old Secure Plus automated scans were super dark and hard to use many times. If something like this is done again, hopefully it can be better.

    The ATS slab scans seem to be getting better. Some are almost ok.

  • ilikemonstersilikemonsters Posts: 700 ✭✭✭✭

    No. An 1834 Capped Bust Dime in Good doesn't need to be TV'd.

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 926 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:

    @Raybo said:

    @Zoins said:
    I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield, a Morgan this time, so it is yet another recently slabbed coin I'll have to send in to get TrueViewed. It would be great to not have to send in all these recently slabbed coins for TrueViews.

    Does it make sense for PCGS to require Gold Shield and thus TrueView for classic US coins like they do for classic World coins?

    Morgan? Really?

    Yes, it's a toner, but I have other pieces too like colonials that I need to send in.

    You just think you need to send them in. In reality, you want to send them in.😉

    Mark Feld of Heritage Auctions

  • rickoricko Posts: 67,868 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I do not like 'mandatory' things....and services cost money, so it should be an electable service. I like TruViews, and I have coins with TV's...I also have a lot without them... just not worth it. Cheers, RickO

  • keetskeets Posts: 21,471 ✭✭✭✭✭

    NGC already photographs every encapsulated coin, right?? I take advantage of that feature and find it helpful. also, how many times do you find yourself at the PCGS cert-check page wishing a picture was available?? for me it is often enough to realize it would be a good idea. like the pictures available via TV or not, they at least tend to be consistent and remove an ability of sellers to deceive.

    realistically, if PCGS did a picture of everything they slabbed the small fee would be outweighed by the benefit of having the picture.


    --- George Carlin RIP, he'd have a lot of fresh material if he was alive today!!
  • Cougar1978Cougar1978 Posts: 3,918 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 20, 2019 7:28AM

    No - isn’t this more expensive?

    Services at owners choice.

    I would resent some outsider (poster here) butting in on something which is my choice with my Pcgs submissions.

    Creekside Tangible Assets - Coins & Currency
  • jabbajabba Posts: 2,308 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I honestly don’t know if the gold shield is superior to the normal holders but when I got my 3-leg crossed I chose the gold shield and true view Incase I ever sell the coin it would be neat that coins valued over a certain amount get it automatically.

  • HemisphericalHemispherical Posts: 6,955 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 20, 2019 8:35AM

    Makes it a bit easier to analyze a coin when buying if there is a GSTV or TV available.

    Edit to add: With the latest quarterly special I have been sending slabs in for a reholder to get the GS/TV. Once I started
    it’s now become an OCD thing. ;)

  • coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 5,054 ✭✭✭✭✭

    So because you want something everyone else should have to pay extra, who appointed you emperor? You should learn the definition of "want" and "need"; these words have separate meanings and are not interchangeable. Freedoms lost are very hard to win back, I and many others who have also posted in your thread want the freedom to choose not some silly mandate because you feel it's better for all.

  • keetskeets Posts: 21,471 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would resent some outsider (poster here) butting in on something which is my choice with my Pcgs submissions.
    until about six months ago I wasn't aware that NGC photographed every coin encapsulated by them, but they do and did. it seems to be helpful and I believe it is probably a counterfeit deterrent.

    So because you want something everyone else should have to pay extra, who appointed you emperor?
    costs for submissions are steadily increasing and I suppose that since the TV cost is already low that this feature could be incorporated into the next increase. the price will be going up sooner than later anyway. in the long rune this will be a good thing for everyone.

    I suppose a reasonable approach would be a very nominal fee for the current service, high quality/high resolution pictures meant for "viewing" and to help with auctions, and a more production-line feature for every coin to help with the counterfeit issues. PCGS could recoup some of that with the next fee increase and no one would even know.that should satisfy everyone.


    --- George Carlin RIP, he'd have a lot of fresh material if he was alive today!!
  • ReadyFireAimReadyFireAim Posts: 668 ✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:
    I just picked up another PCGS 6.0 generation slabbed coin without TrueView or Gold Shield...

    I know some dealers prefer the flattering, "soft focus" pictures that they take.
    I've been burned a couple times by their sneaky photography.

    PCGS won't bite the hand that feeds them by making TV mandatory.
    We saw that when they gutted coin facts.

    Personally though, I won't buy a coin anymore without TV.
    I don't need to anymore.

  • Dave99BDave99B Posts: 6,212 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 20, 2019 1:05PM

    No, it should not be required.

    On the other hand, a basic pic of EVERY coin they grade would clearly help reduce the crazy doctoring/counterfeiting that's rampant right now. I'd advocate for that, and I expect we will see it soon. Fingers crossed.

    Dave

    Always looking for original, better date VF20-VF35 Barber quarters and halves, and a quality beer.
  • ms70ms70 Posts: 11,056 ✭✭✭✭✭

    No.

  • spacehaydukespacehayduke Posts: 2,424 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ilikemonsters said:
    No. An 1834 Capped Bust Dime in Good doesn't need to be TV'd.

    No, depends on the collector doesn't it?


    Successful transactions with - Boosibri, lkeigwin, TomB, CRO, EagleEye, ianrussell (@GC), ThePennyLady, Broadstruck, coinsarefun, Type2, jom, ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief, Driggs, Barndog, EXOJUNKIE, WDP, RYK, tdiaz1979, ldhair, Dawg144

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  • dbldie55dbldie55 Posts: 7,051 ✭✭✭✭

    NGC has images of the coins in the holders (at least all that I have submitted). They do not charge for this.

    They are offering a new service for nice images when they are not in the holder. They do charge for this. (I think another grading service does something like this)

    Should Gold Shield be mandatory....not just no but ...

    Collector and Researcher of Liberty Head Nickels. ANA LM-6053

    imageimage
  • BochimanBochiman Posts: 24,686 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:

    @Bochiman said:
    While I can understand how it makes it "easier" for some people, to impose your idea of what's right on others, just because it is easier for you, is the wrong way to go.

    One thing is that PCGS already does this for classic World coins so it would be making the services consistent.

    Should PCGS stop requiring Gold Shield for classic World coins?

    That's up to PCGS and what world coin submitters will want/accept.

    Just because they do it for those, doesn't mean it should be forced on it for others. Would be nice for every submitted coin to have a picture, but to be REQUIRED to pay more to have that, when many of them are generic looking, is not something I would support (from a collector/submitter viewpoint).

    I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment

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