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Mint Monkey Business
BuffaloIronTail
Posts: 7,744 ✭✭✭✭✭
Mint Monkey Business - We all are aware of the clandestine operations and tomfoolery that went on at the Mints throughout the years. Not only by Mint Officials.........but also by employees.
Let's see how many we can list. I'll start by listing one of the most obvious:
The 1913 Liberty Nickels
Pete
"I tell them there's no problems.....only solutions" - John Lennon
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Clashed FE cents - all of them. LOL, that eliminated a lot of choices.
That is the first thing I thought of, as well!
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
How about the overstruck, circulated Barber quarter that was included in a 1970(?) proof set package.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
It's too bad there has not been a Barber Quarter found struck on a nail yet!
Sac/quarter mule.
The ‘extra leaf’ Wisconsin quarters come to mind.
Would a 1964-D peace dollar qualify?
If any of them exist.........a big YES
Pete
1894-S dimes, lawfully done, but for private distribution.
Class 2 and 3 1804 dollars.
AFAIK, the 1964-D dollars were not made on the sly.
The 2009 Lincoln varieties (errors) are what comes to mind for me. How could over 100 varieties possibly be made without someone seeing them.
The "BS" 1999-W $5 & $10 AGE's.
There was a large number of error coins that dishonest mint employees were smuggling out of the Philadelphia Mint. The mint found out about it and finally cracked down it.
I remember back in the 1970s some foolish stuff like Proof Ike Dollars struck on cent planchets. A collector shows some slides of these pieces at a club meeting I attended one night. Most everyone at the club, which was the New Jersey Numismatic Society, thought these were “manufactured errors.” There were a fair number of expert collectors in that club.
Sure enough I read a few months later that the government had confiscated those pieces.
The mint employee caught selling bags of "missing" edge lettering Presidential dollars.
Sugar magnolia blossoms blooming, heads all empty and I don't care ...
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Wisconsin Quarter
David Rittenhouse and Albion Coxe's little scheme regarding 1794 silver coins.
Sugar magnolia blossoms blooming, heads all empty and I don't care ...
Are you referring to the problem they created when they unilaterally changed the alloy from .8924 fine silver to .9000 without Congressional approval?
Yes, they should not have done that, but the original law was stupid. Forcing the assayer to hit .8924, especially given the technology of the times, was ridiculous. Whatever change that needed to be made, should have a minor weight adjustment.
Yes, they took a big chance. I agree with your statement regarding the fineness.
Sugar magnolia blossoms blooming, heads all empty and I don't care ...
The comment is valid if any of them got out of the Mint, and were not destroyed. They were legally coined.
Pete
2 Tails Quarter ?
R.I.P Son 1986>2020
1959 Lincoln with wheat ear reverse
I don't see how this comment rates a Disagree. Yes, they were legally coined, but were NEVER meant to leave the Denver Mint. All were supposedly destroyed.
IF THEY EXIST..............with a big IF..........someone spirited them out. Shenanigans for sure!
Pete again
1958 DDO - Lincoln Cent.
R.I.P Son 1986>2020
Far worse, I feel, are the multiple instances of employee defalcation. See From Mine to Mint for a short list.
I thought that was thought to be made OUTSIDE of the mint?
[Transcriptions are by volunteers. Thank you!]
@Buffalorltail Sorry about that, it was my mistake. I corrected the error.
1972 aluminum cents.
bob
None of the ones I have seen came out of the Mint that way.
would the 1959 wheat cent fall into this subject line as well?
Interesting list.... I wonder how many were true errors and how many were manufactured errors. Better yet... which is which.... Cheers, RickO
Never mind errors. How much " scrap " silver and gold is making it's way out of the mint. I spent almost my whole life working for the Federal Government. In 36 years I worked at all sorts and types of buildings and facilities. These ranged from open to the public to the most secret and secure. The one thing they had in common is that the employees always had a way to steal if they wanted too. The persons who had it the easiest were the maintenance people. Just like that movie where the women and her friends steal the old used money from the Fed. Reserve. Janitors and service people move about these buildings almost like they are invisible, no one pays any mind to them.
also if any of you decide you want to enter a " secure " building either government or private just go around back to the entrance where the janitors and groundskeepers come and go and I'll bet you a dollar you will find the door ajar and the alarm " broken " cause that where everybody goes to sneak a smoke.
Happy New Year
Bob
Lordmarcovan, WTCG, YogiBerraFan, Phoenin21, LindeDad, Coll3ctor, blue594, robkoll, Mike Dixon, BloodMan, Flakthat and others.
How about the mint employee that was selling the 1933 $20 to Izzy Switt?
Also the mint employee in San Francisco that embezzled some $30K ca. 1900.
Can't forget this one...to catch a thief.
R.I.P Son 1986>2020
Here is another perspective about the Izzy Switt controversy.
If you open up your “Red Book” and look at the mintages for 1927-S and 1929 through 1932 $20 gold pieces, you will see some healthy mintages, often exceeding 1 million pieces. Yet, the prices are very high because few pieces were issued by the government. Why?
The government had large numbers of double eagles struck and held them in inventory for use during financial panics and other economic calamities. The Federal Reserve does the same thing today with paper money. In the event of a bank run or some other spike in the demand for paper money, the Fed is prepared to supply ample paper money to an otherwise solvent bank to cover a rough patch.
Few people realize it, but collectors could have send $20 plus postage and have obtained all of those rare dates. Few collectors did it because they did not want to tie up that much money in a coin, and after the Great Depression set in at the end of 1929, very few of them could afford it. Therefore, those coins sat in government vaults. When the great melt started in the 1930s, those coins were all turned into gold bars.
Franklin Roosevelt took the Oath of Office on March 4, 1933. The inauguration date was not moved to January 20 until 1937. Since the Philadelphia Mint had struck 445,500, 1933 double eagles, who could have known that they could not be issued to collectors prior to the time that FDR was inaugurated? Was there a government proclamation that said those coins could not be sold to collectors? I doubt it. If they were issued before early March, who is to say that they were issued illegally? Only government bureaucrats who were out to make a name for themselves.
Thanks for all the replies...........on and on we go. When this stuff stops..........nobody knows.
Pete
The two 1877 gold Half Union patterns were ordered destroyed to recover the $100 worth of gold. Fortunately, some dishonest Mint employee sold them for (presumably) $100 worth of gold plus (presumably) a small bonus for themselves. Otherwise, these magnificent relics would be no more!
Well in this case, the "shenanigans" ended up being a good thing.
Reminds me of the San Francisco employees who were spiriting out error coins by hiding them in the oil pan of autos, then selling them.
Pete
The fork lifts with the proof coin errors hidden in oil pans were sent out for service. I've never heard of "autos" being used to spirit out the custom made error goodies.
When I toured the Denver Mint floor in 1993 led by long time employee Tito Real, he was well aware of this happening prior at San Fran Mint and Denver Mint had installed screens on the fork lift oil filler tubes years earlier. Tito was on Denver production floor when 1964D Peace $ were struck and then recalled before release.
These SF Mint custom made proof errors openly trade, legally, just like 1913 Liberty Five Cents trade in spite of their dubious past. A few years ago there was a bunch of custom made errors that the Secret Service examined and they then let them legally sell:
The famous "safety deposit box" hoard.
From what I understand the Mint only goes after current error coin leaks, you know coin struck onto 2016, 2017, 2018 nail strikes, washers, screws, etc ...
Not quite. A. Loudoun Snowden exchanged gold-for-gold for the half union patterns in an entirely legal and normal process with the Curator of the Mint Cabinet, For decades the Curator had authority to make exchanges and buy coins for the Cabinet. Congress provided a small annual appropriation for such purposes, and outside donations were accepted.
All items in the Mint Cabinet that originated internally were valued at bullion/face value. Exchanges were made on that basis, and purchases were carried at cost. Available inventories confirm this and other details.
RE: "If they were issued before early March, who is to say that they were issued illegally? Only government bureaucrats who were out to make a name for themselves"
1. The first delivery did not take place until mid-March 1933. There was never a transfer to any FRB. But - 43 1933 DE were made and moved to the 1932 ("prior") year category to cover defective pieces date 1932. Thus, 1933 might have been mixed with 1932-dated DE and distributed over-the-counter that way.
2. How were these "government bureaucrats who were out to make a name for themselves"? If they wanted to "make a name for themselves" why do we not have any names except the Coiner, William Bartholomew?
Thanks for the reply , gentlemen.
Pete
I stand corrected on the "oil pan" thing. Didn't really know the specifics other than "oil pan".
Pete
I am unfamiliar with this trade. If it was done legally, why the big stink in 1910?
The 1910 stink was because of the $10,000 that William Woodin paid. It's unclear to whom he paid the money, but it does not appear to have been Snowden. Publicity about Woodin flaunting the purchase was the main problem.
Sacagawea Dollar / Washington Quarter mule.
2000 W 22kt gold Sacagawea 1$.
The 12 surviving examples were sent into outer space on Columbia.
BillyKingsley...........Why would you hit the Disagree on this? At least explain why you did so I know the reason.
Pete