In the future, you might try a different mode on your camera. I use a D40, and if it is on "auto", coins come out with a gold tint. I have found the "P" mode (whatever that is) to be more accurate, though the white balance is always difficult.
I've learnt to bite my tongue accept the return, if the person is a total PITA I block them and move on. Its not worth getting upset over. I see it as just a part of doing business on Ebay nowadays.
@tennbjj said: I am a serious collector who pays over 5 grand for the right CC Morgan I do not have a printer
As silly as that sounds - and it may be a lie in this case - there are a LOT of old timers out there, especially in the stamp community, that spend a lot of money but don't have a digital presence.
@No Headlights said:
To logger 7
Heritage handles it by charging a HUGE shipping fee on top of the 20% auction fee. They win every time
Actually, I think Heritage's shipping fees are pretty reasonable. Flat rate priority packages costs $5.75 (standard commercial discount, Heritage may have a deeper discount) with $99 insurance. If you want to insure even only a couple hundred bucks, it's over $7 in shipping. Heritage only charges $10-ish for a single coin and on multi-coin orders it's only about $5 or $6 per coin.
[People who complain about shipping costs have never had to ship and insure packages. It is not cheap.]
@sellitstore said:
The guy expected a return label because that's how many companies outside Ebay handle returns.
But this is Ebay and returns are handled by their procedures which does not include the seller providing a return label.
eBay does provide return labels. And just like pretty much every major retailer, they are sent DIGITALLY to be printed. Try an Amazon return, exactly the same procedure as eBay: return label provided to be printed at home.
SOME retailers may mail you a return label in some cases, but I'm not specifically aware of any at this point.
The guy is an ass. But if I were he, I would have returned the coin also. That coin looks evenly golden toned because of the picture and it is NOT. Pretty much all of you would return it. Hopefully, you would be less abrasive about it than this guy...then again, there are some pretty crusty people on these boards.
@TomB said:
If the WLH shared above is the image you used in the auction then it seems fairly obvious that the white balance settings are off and that the coin would appear more white (untoned) in-hand than in the image. This is especially obvious given that the PCGS plastic is an unnatural yellowish color in your images. The buyer should have likely had a much better idea of what was offered.
I fully agree with Tom regarding the photo. In addition, I would have left out a lot of the commentary (it serves no good other than making you feel better). If he's not going to ship without getting a label, that's good for you--in a few days eBay will just close the case in your favor.
That said, talk to eBay about the claim in general. I just had a buyer make a SNAD claim because he didn't think the color matched my photo (even with multiple photos showing the coin in various light). eBay advised me to not refund the shipping and to charge the restocking fee when I get the coin back because color is considered a "remorse" reason for a return, not a valid SNAD. If the photo is deceptive (cranked up saturation) that's one thing, but if eBay thinks things are on the up and up, it sounds like they may be working with sellers at least a bit.
I was just advised by ebay that buyer was issued a refund by eBay ... "without any impact to [me]." Not sure I believe that. I've certainly learned a few things in this encounter and thank you for comments and criticisms, but it does seem unfair. Buyer wins.
@TPRC said:
I was just advised by ebay that buyer was issued a refund by eBay ... "without any impact to [me]." Not sure I believe that. I've certainly learned a few things in this encounter and thank you for comments and criticisms, but it does seem unfair. Buyer wins.
Does he also get to keep the coin? In any case, if you got to keep the $$ and eBay covered him on his side, then you both won. Just block him to avoid running into him again.
You need better pics, he needs a serious attitude adjustment Your issues will be easier to fix than his. He will be saddled with being a jerk most likely for the rest of his life, and considering all the stress he creates unnecessarily, that may not be very long.
Does he also get to keep the coin? In any case, if you got to keep the $$ and eBay covered him on his side, then you both won. Just block him to avoid running into him again.
You need better pics, he needs a serious attitude adjustment Your issues will be easier to fix than his. He will be saddled with being a jerk most likely for the rest of his life, and considering all the stress he creates unnecessarily, that may not be very long.
I wonder how common it is for ebay to eat a transaction like this. Seems like an expensive practice on ebay's part.
And now he'll probably just make a new account and do the same thing to someone else who uses an off white-balance image. If ebay rewards this behavior it will keep happening.
He's probably building a nice collection at no cost to himself.
So he keeps the coin without paying for it or having to return it? Talk about encouraging bad behavior.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Ebay won't force the seller to issue a refund until the item is delivered to the seller (which should be verified by a tracking number).
AT this point I believe the buyer has the coin & the seller has the funds....just like a normal sale, except for excess aggravation.
I would just sit back and keep telling the buyer that they will get the refund upon return, until that point, nothing more can be done.
"Character is doing the right thing when no one is watching". - J.C. Watts sarasotanumismatics.com
But I think eBay refunded, outside of a normal return process. So-called "buyer protection" that eBay offers, I wonder if is their way of keeping both parties happy when they know the seller is not necessarily in the wrong (at lest about the return label thing). I just hope they don't also have the ability to still post neg feedback.
@travlntiques said:
Ebay won't force the seller to issue a refund until the item is delivered to the seller (which should be verified by a tracking number).
AT this point I believe the buyer has the coin & the seller has the funds....just like a normal sale, except for excess aggravation.
I would just sit back and keep telling the buyer that they will get the refund upon return, until that point, nothing more can be done.
Why would the buyer want to even return the coin at this point? He has both the coin and the refund already
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
@logger7 said:
I can't imagine ebay holding the bag on this transaction, I assume the seller got it back.
The seller doesn't have the coin back. EBay refunded the buyer by using eBay funds. Buyer wins again and gets rewarded for poor behavior.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
@logger7 said:
I can't imagine ebay holding the bag on this transaction, I assume the seller got it back.
@TPRC said:
I was just advised by ebay that buyer was issued a refund by eBay ... "without any impact to [me]." Not sure I believe that. I've certainly learned a few things in this encounter and thank you for comments and criticisms, but it does seem unfair. Buyer wins.
Looks to me like the buyer has the coin plus his refund. Seller doesn't have coin but has the money paid. eBay is out the amount of the refund. If I am incorrect, I hope TPRC corrects me.
Sounds really strange that eBay would resolve the situation this way.
Of course, if the buyer had done a credit card chargeback, the seller would have had to provide the refund but wouldn't have received the coin, so seller would be out the cost of the coin.
My guess is that eBay flags this guy so that eBay doesn't end up providing another refund.
But in this case, it was profitable for the buyer to be uncooperative and not comply with eBay's rules.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
I don't understand why eBay would just eat the cost. As already mentioned, rewarding the buyer only encourages him to do it again. Not the right way to solve this problem for sure.
If the buyer was physically incapable of sending their ebay item back, they could have just sent a shipping courier to pick it up as long as it was in an enclosed package.
@sellitstore said:
The guy expected a return label because that's how many companies outside Ebay handle returns.
But this is Ebay and returns are handled by their procedures which does not include the seller providing a return label.
Not so...eBay does supply a return label, if the sellers parameters allow returns handled by eBay.
But the buyer said he didn't have a printer or apparently access to one. So he was old school with that, but new school with online ordering, strange. And old school in being an obstreperous, crusty demanding customer, lacking understanding of human misunderstandings, at least when it comes to other people. "The customer is always right", an imbecilic motto.
Does he also get to keep the coin? In any case, if you got to keep the $$ and eBay covered him on his side, then you both won. Just block him to avoid running into him again.
You need better pics, he needs a serious attitude adjustment Your issues will be easier to fix than his. He will be saddled with being a jerk most likely for the rest of his life, and considering all the stress he creates unnecessarily, that may not be very long.
I wonder how common it is for ebay to eat a transaction like this. Seems like an expensive practice on ebay's part.
.. and increased fees to all sellers as eBay needs t keep their profit margin
@TPRC said:
I was just advised by ebay that buyer was issued a refund by eBay ... "without any impact to [me]." Not sure I believe that. I've certainly learned a few things in this encounter and thank you for comments and criticisms, but it does seem unfair. Buyer wins.
Does he also get to keep the coin? In any case, if you got to keep the $$ and eBay covered him on his side, then you both won. Just block him to avoid running into him again.
Not quite. You "win" in that you're not out money, which is good, but now the buyer is encouraged to keep acting in this way. I remember I once had a buyer damage an item before returning it (his reason for the item not being as described was also false--his claim was literally exactly how I described the item), and when I called eBay, they said they're refund it instead. I wasn't happy with that because this was a case where the buyer wasn't right, but he was made whole. I firmly believe in making people whole if I make a mistake, but I don't think they deserve to win every case just because they're the buyer. The last thing I want is for such buyers to feel like they can keep acting a certain way because they're going to be covered.
Comments
In the future, you might try a different mode on your camera. I use a D40, and if it is on "auto", coins come out with a gold tint. I have found the "P" mode (whatever that is) to be more accurate, though the white balance is always difficult.
I've learnt to bite my tongue accept the return, if the person is a total PITA I block them and move on. Its not worth getting upset over. I see it as just a part of doing business on Ebay nowadays.
Successful Trades: Swampboy,
As silly as that sounds - and it may be a lie in this case - there are a LOT of old timers out there, especially in the stamp community, that spend a lot of money but don't have a digital presence.
Actually, I think Heritage's shipping fees are pretty reasonable. Flat rate priority packages costs $5.75 (standard commercial discount, Heritage may have a deeper discount) with $99 insurance. If you want to insure even only a couple hundred bucks, it's over $7 in shipping. Heritage only charges $10-ish for a single coin and on multi-coin orders it's only about $5 or $6 per coin.
[People who complain about shipping costs have never had to ship and insure packages. It is not cheap.]
eBay does provide return labels. And just like pretty much every major retailer, they are sent DIGITALLY to be printed. Try an Amazon return, exactly the same procedure as eBay: return label provided to be printed at home.
SOME retailers may mail you a return label in some cases, but I'm not specifically aware of any at this point.
The guy is an ass. But if I were he, I would have returned the coin also. That coin looks evenly golden toned because of the picture and it is NOT. Pretty much all of you would return it. Hopefully, you would be less abrasive about it than this guy...then again, there are some pretty crusty people on these boards.
Wow, bummer
Blocked... Thank you
He is trying to keep the coin for free, that's his only MO
I fully agree with Tom regarding the photo. In addition, I would have left out a lot of the commentary (it serves no good other than making you feel better). If he's not going to ship without getting a label, that's good for you--in a few days eBay will just close the case in your favor.
That said, talk to eBay about the claim in general. I just had a buyer make a SNAD claim because he didn't think the color matched my photo (even with multiple photos showing the coin in various light). eBay advised me to not refund the shipping and to charge the restocking fee when I get the coin back because color is considered a "remorse" reason for a return, not a valid SNAD. If the photo is deceptive (cranked up saturation) that's one thing, but if eBay thinks things are on the up and up, it sounds like they may be working with sellers at least a bit.
You simply got hosed with bad low end buyer. Be sure block.
I was just advised by ebay that buyer was issued a refund by eBay ... "without any impact to [me]." Not sure I believe that. I've certainly learned a few things in this encounter and thank you for comments and criticisms, but it does seem unfair. Buyer wins.
Tom
Does he also get to keep the coin? In any case, if you got to keep the $$ and eBay covered him on his side, then you both won. Just block him to avoid running into him again.
You need better pics, he needs a serious attitude adjustment Your issues will be easier to fix than his. He will be saddled with being a jerk most likely for the rest of his life, and considering all the stress he creates unnecessarily, that may not be very long.
I wonder how common it is for ebay to eat a transaction like this. Seems like an expensive practice on ebay's part.
And now he'll probably just make a new account and do the same thing to someone else who uses an off white-balance image. If ebay rewards this behavior it will keep happening.
He's probably building a nice collection at no cost to himself.
Collector, occasional seller
So he keeps the coin without paying for it or having to return it? Talk about encouraging bad behavior.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Ebay won't force the seller to issue a refund until the item is delivered to the seller (which should be verified by a tracking number).
AT this point I believe the buyer has the coin & the seller has the funds....just like a normal sale, except for excess aggravation.
I would just sit back and keep telling the buyer that they will get the refund upon return, until that point, nothing more can be done.
sarasotanumismatics.com
But I think eBay refunded, outside of a normal return process. So-called "buyer protection" that eBay offers, I wonder if is their way of keeping both parties happy when they know the seller is not necessarily in the wrong (at lest about the return label thing). I just hope they don't also have the ability to still post neg feedback.
Once again, proof eBay is nuts. Buyer demands a return but refuses to mail the item and still gets reimbursed. Wow. Just wow.
Blocking every crazy ebayer is like throwing snowballs into a volcano
Latin American Collection
I can't imagine ebay holding the bag on this transaction, I assume the seller got it back.
Why would the buyer want to even return the coin at this point? He has both the coin and the refund already
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
The seller doesn't have the coin back. EBay refunded the buyer by using eBay funds. Buyer wins again and gets rewarded for poor behavior.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Looks to me like the buyer has the coin plus his refund. Seller doesn't have coin but has the money paid. eBay is out the amount of the refund. If I am incorrect, I hope TPRC corrects me.
Sounds really strange that eBay would resolve the situation this way.
Of course, if the buyer had done a credit card chargeback, the seller would have had to provide the refund but wouldn't have received the coin, so seller would be out the cost of the coin.
My guess is that eBay flags this guy so that eBay doesn't end up providing another refund.
But in this case, it was profitable for the buyer to be uncooperative and not comply with eBay's rules.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
I don't understand why eBay would just eat the cost. As already mentioned, rewarding the buyer only encourages him to do it again. Not the right way to solve this problem for sure.
Donato
Donato's Complete US Type Set ---- Donato's Dansco 7070 Modified Type Set ---- Donato's Basic U.S. Coin Design Set
Successful transactions: Shrub68 (Jim), MWallace (Mike)
If the buyer was physically incapable of sending their ebay item back, they could have just sent a shipping courier to pick it up as long as it was in an enclosed package.
Not so...eBay does supply a return label, if the sellers parameters allow returns handled by eBay.
But the buyer said he didn't have a printer or apparently access to one. So he was old school with that, but new school with online ordering, strange. And old school in being an obstreperous, crusty demanding customer, lacking understanding of human misunderstandings, at least when it comes to other people. "The customer is always right", an imbecilic motto.
.. and increased fees to all sellers as eBay needs t keep their profit margin
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Selling/Ebay-seller-gets-unhappy-customer-on-400-plus-item-Ebay-says/td-p/27593931
Not quite. You "win" in that you're not out money, which is good, but now the buyer is encouraged to keep acting in this way. I remember I once had a buyer damage an item before returning it (his reason for the item not being as described was also false--his claim was literally exactly how I described the item), and when I called eBay, they said they're refund it instead. I wasn't happy with that because this was a case where the buyer wasn't right, but he was made whole. I firmly believe in making people whole if I make a mistake, but I don't think they deserve to win every case just because they're the buyer. The last thing I want is for such buyers to feel like they can keep acting a certain way because they're going to be covered.