1900 $2 1/2 Liberty graded as Altered Surface
jwitten
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Can anyone shed some light? Looks absolutely gorgeous in hand, and in these pictures. What did PCGS see here?
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I can't see what is wrong with that coin from those photos. if it has been smoothed some how, the coin doctor did a heck of a job.
Here is an example with the same date that NGC graded MS-62 long ago. This was my type coin from many years ago, purchased from a photo, record and coin shop called "Rodgers Photom" just off the boardwalk, in Rehoboth Beach, Delaware. The building still stands, but the business is long gone, to a t shirt shop the last time I checked.
This was one of my purchases when I was in high school. The coin brings back good memories.
Really "bright" areas around the three stars above Miss Liberty on obverse and in the area of TATES on reverse. I don't know what was done, but it does appear that something was done
I think that might be bright from the placement of the lights?
Does the area around "1/2" on the reverse look a little off? How about the rims?
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Is the curl (on the front, below the ear) too long? Might be re-engraved or a love token of some sort. IS that common for that date?
the coin has been smoothed in the area above the eagle, behind it's head. it also looks like it may have been smoothed on the obverse, but i can't tell as good there.
I agree, I think that is just the luster.
After studying the pictures carefully, I was wondering if that was the area. It almost looks like there were a few light marks they were trying to cover up. It was probably a MS62 coin and they were shooting for a 64 or something.
To me the color in front of Liberty's face on the Obverse seems a bit unnatural...and is there an attempt to cover graffiti above her hair??
i think you nailed it.
The fields show typical chatter and grazing as expected on an AU-MS62 coin. Fwiw I once cracked out what seemed to be a near flawless PCGS MS64 $10 Lib and resubmitted to both PCGS and NGC. It came back "altered surfaces" both times. I was stunned. The 4th submission (not by me) yielded an NGC MS66. A finding of "altered surfaces" may only be a temporary condition.
It could be the lighting. But, the coin looks a bit light in color, fuzzy and dullish in some places. Maybe very lightly puttied/waxed or whatever?
The luster does look a little bit off. Still a nice looking coin.
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Yeah, something like this is unfortunately at the hands of the person who is grading the coin at NGC. I can see it going either way, which is unfortunate. Maybe this is their way of tying more people up with grading fees?
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Reconsideration is a consideration here. Might be just find.
I don't know how you can determine what is wrong with that coin from one set of pictures. As Roadrunner posted sometimes a coin gets the shaft, and sometimes it gets a grade. I'm not saying that is true in this case, but I am saying that we don't have enough evidence.
What needs to be done is for a expert to see the coin in person, swirl it under a strong light source and perhaps put a 10X on it, which might not be necessary. Problem might be eviident after you have seen the surfaces from different light source angles.
I don't think PCGS will details holder a coin if it has putty on it, can anyone confirm.
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send it ATS
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I had a friend piggy-back some Buffalo nickels in my last submission. One came back "smoothed". Neither of us could figure out where the offending area was. I don't claim either one of us are experts on that kind of thing....but you would think ONE of us, with coin in hand, could at least identify the area that looked "different" than usual.
It may be a case where the right lighting makes it "pop"...but in everyday conditions, is just easy to miss.
didn't expert(s) already see the coin in person?
Looks really nice to me from the photo - try for a second opinion at one of the others - NGC, ICG, Anacs? Otherwise unless keeper would start around melt on the Bay.....I believe it would get a lot of bids.
After looking at the super enormous version here:
https://images.pcgs.com/TrueView/83554964_Max.jpg
It does appear that some of the surfaces have been altered.
They have, but from long experience I can tell that there have been coins that got a body bag in the old days, which is the same as a "details" grade today, that got a straight grade on a second submission. I had this happen a few times when I was a dealer and as a collector.
I had a 1797 cent that was body bagged for corrosion when I owned it. I sold it raw. Later it appeared in a major auction in a straight graded EF-45 holder. I can cite other examples.
If by "ATS" you mean, "Immediately to PCGS" than we are in firm agreement.
I had a 1911 $2 1/2 Indian that I knew was a weak D. Took a couple submissions for graders to agree.
I'd try it again at some point or have a big submitter examine it in hand.
Judging from those pictures is a gamble at best.... It 'appears' that the area behind the neck and over the Eagle's head may have been smoothed in some manner.... I agree with Bill.... in hand, under different lights (maybe even a blacklight) would be the only way to confirm it, if, indeed, it has been altered at all. Cheers, RickO