1864 $2.50, for those that don't know.
HandH
Posts: 438 ✭✭✭
What a true American rarity. When a gold quarter eagle minted during the US Civil War is the rarest quarter eagle of the entire series, collectors should be tweaked. This circulation strike has an estimated population of 18-24 per Doug Winter. To say this is rare is an underatatement of the highest degree. Most likely a top three known. Just an awesome coin!
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Latin American Collection
Super Civil War Quarter Eagle!
A prize for any Civil War Gold Collection.
Andrew Blinkiewicz-Heritage
Why does the strike seem to almost resemble a proof?
Great rarity either way.
The proofs are more common that the business strikes. You have to figure that with only 2824 minted, the dies were pretty fresh for each one struck. It may be that proof dies were reused for striking the business strikes. With a bit of research I'm sure that could be proven or disproven but certainly possible.
Latin American Collection
Why does the strike seem to almost resemble a proof?
Great rarity either way.
The proofs are more common that the business strikes. You have to figure that with only 2824 minted, the dies were pretty fresh for each one struck. It may be that proof dies were reused for striking the business strikes. With a bit of research I'm sure that could be proven or disproven but certainly possible.
it could also be one of the first business strikes...which tend to have a PL surface. maybe if it was one of the first struck, it was put away for keeping instead released into circulation.
Never having collected quarter-eagles by date, I was unaware of the rarity of this, but would've admired it as a type coin anyway.
I certainly don't deny its rarity and therefore its 'wow' factor.
When I first looked at it, I noticed the tell tale sign of cleaning - the box outline surrounding the date (and other areas of 'doubt').
Can we for a moment ignore the rare date and look at this coin as if it were a common gold coin and then judge it as being cleaned or not?
I'm certainly not even close to being an expert on gold coins so your opinions on this cleaning matter would be educational for me.
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Why does the strike seem to almost resemble a proof?
Great rarity either way.
Quite often when the dies are placed in service they have surfaces that will produce P-L coins. As the mintage continues that is worn off the dies.
When the mintage are very low, which is the case with this coin, the P-L comes though on the entire mintage.
You find this with on many quarter eagles from 1820s and gold dollars from the 1880s. In the case of the gold dollars, it's sometimes hard to distinguish the Proofs from the business strike coins.
Congratulations of finding a truly rare coin, HandH!
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The business strikes are easily distinguishable from the mishandled proof strikes in that Liberty's ear is filled in on the former while it is clean on the latter. Great discussion everyone, and thanks Bill for your input. I always look to you as a highly respected numismatist. Allow me to present a better background on the 1864 quarter eagle than my simple declaration of its rarity in my OP.
Due to the still ongoing Civil War and the continued suspension of specie in the North, the mintage of quarter Eagles plunged after the onset of the war. With a paltry mintage of 2,824 business strikes (and 50 proof strikes ) the estimated survivors for business strikes is 18-20. Doug Winter estimates 15 exist including several that have been harshly cleaned. For proofs the estimated survivors are about 30. As such, the surviving business strikes are far rarer than the proof strikes. Doug Winter has stated the 1864 $2.50 is among the rarest quarter Eagles ever produced and one of the rarest Liberty Head issues of ANY denomination struck for general circulation. PCGS has graded 13 examples ( several undoughtably re-submissions ) in all grades. NGC has graded even fewer with just 8 coins recorded ( again, re-submissions included ). The 1864 is considerably rarer than the highly regarded 1875 quarter eagle with a mintage of 400, but with a survivirship of 63 estimated. Doug Winter states that the 1864 $2.50 is his all-time favorite "sleeper" issue. The 1864 $2.50 is a numismatic rarity of R-9.1 in all grades, R-9.8 in mint state and R-10.0 in gem or better. The finest known is the incredible Byron Reed example graded PCGS MS 66. This HandH example, graded PCGS AU 58 CAC is clearly condition census and likely a top 3 known. Ex Legend Numismatics, HA 10/12:5593. It is very well struck with few signs of circulation and well preserved surfaces. It is of greenish gold color with much original luster. Some proof like reflectivity near the devices. A minor tick near star nine serves as a pedigree marker. PCGS population 2 in AU 58, with 1 finer. CAC has certified 2 in AU 58 with none finer.
This is a rough outline of the coin's history with citations omitted. It is an honor to be the current custodian of this piece as it is for many of you that have shared your rarities with the forum.
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That is an outstanding and genuinely rare coin.
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Its as rare as the 1854-S $ 2 1/2 but no where near the price No doubt due to the presence of a small quantity of proofs available.
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Segoja:
I wrote about 1864 Quarter Eagles in 2012. I then pointed out that the PCGS CoinFacts site then estimated that twenty-eight business strikes exist. A few weeks before I wrote that article, Doug Winter said that “around twenty or so [business strikes are] known in all grades.” I then estimated, in contrast, that business strikes are about as rare as Proof 1864 Quarter Eagles, fourteen to seventeen of each are around. Admittedly, I have not thought much about 1864 QEs since 2012. How many do forum members estimate survive?
Not Yet Famous 1864 Quarter Eagles
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Thank you for your post. As usual, it is on point. I've read your linked article in the past and have re-read it after your post. As you indicated in the article it is primarily about proof strikes. In this article you seem to suggest that the proof strikes and business strikes are about equal in their survivorship. Your reference is the only reference I can find that suggests this. Every reference I've researched including historical writings, modern writings and auction records, suggests the business strike has far fewer survivors than the proofs struck for collectors.
I'll be the first to tell you I am an amateur. Numismatics is not my career, nor am I probably very good at it. But, I would love to see a professionally written thesis regarding the historically important and rare 1864 $2.50. As you've mentioned before, and Doug Winter, and many others, this coin deserves it.
US Civil War coinage
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US Civil War coinage
Historical Medals
US Civil War coinage
Historical Medals
Because when there are only a few strikes, all the strikes are an early die state.
First, you can't assume that all business strikes are proof-like. The superb Byron Reed coin is not PL at all. Maybe a little satiny, but that's it.
Second, a business strike is much more desirable because more people collect business strikes by date.
If you want to figure out if the coin in the OP is a business strike or a proof, the first step should be to compare the dies. (Start with the position of the date.) I haven't done it yet, but I suspect that PCGS got it right. They're pretty good about that sort of thing.
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I missed that before. Interesting.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
That Byron Reed coin....wow. I lived in Omaha for 2 years and never made it to the Western Heritage Museum where the remaining Reed coins are I believe. Thanks for posting that MrE.
Latin American Collection
The Reed coin is certainly a nice one.
It looks slightly proof-like with a little natural haze on it.
Thankfully it escaped the abuse that many of the museum held Reed coins experienced
Latin American Collection
The Reed coin is certainly beautiful and exceptional.. Cheers, RickO
Thanks for showing this, I'd never seen one before, and had always wanted to.
Why is it so dark around the date?
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