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No dealer disappoints, love it when promises are kept but what else is new.
Broadstruck
Posts: 30,497 ✭✭✭✭✭
So I've just been pondering trying to think during my 8 years on these boards when the last time I had an issue with a dealer 
Answer = Never
Nothing but buttery smooth transactions which lead toward building great business relationships and friendships
Please post here if you've only ever experienced the same as this is not a dealer bashing thread
Answer = Never
Nothing but buttery smooth transactions which lead toward building great business relationships and friendships
Please post here if you've only ever experienced the same as this is not a dealer bashing thread
To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!
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Not really looking for much these days but if I were, it might be a toner.
After reading some of the other threads on this subject,
I was wondering if, after 43 years as a full-time dealer,
I should simply.......stop. Was startin' to feel a bit mis-understood.
1) Buy
2) Pay
3) Receive
4) Happy
Latin American Collection
Guess I can't.
You must not be trying hard enough
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
RO
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>No problems with any dealer? In 8 years?
You must not be trying hard enough
<< <i>You are very lucky. I have never asked for problems; they just happen. >>
And I agree with you, Bill!
Tom
No bad experiences at B&M shops or online.
The only problems seem to have been with "dealers" on eBay ... and even those are very rare.
Many of the career professional dealers are also wonderful people and their quirkiness only adds to the mix.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
bob
High maintenance or petulant buyers seem to have trouble based on what one sees on the various coin forums these folks attract drama and have issues frequently.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I could write a book on specific instances with a dozen or two dealers over the years. That would start with 3 of my local dealers back in the 1970's that ripped me a new one. In the 1980's I had numerous dealers ship me junk in the mail for anywhere from 3X to 10X what it was really worth. And some of these guys were the biggest in the industry. It was very hard to get a nice coin out of 1 and 2 page advertisers in Coin World in the 1974-1979 period. I got bust dollars and barber halves with hacks, scratches, etc. All were called choice or gem. I returned about 90% of the stuff sent to me before I gave up. I can't think of a single major retailer in the 1970's where I got consistent fair value that I kept going back to them. It was one and done for most everyone. So I started doing auctions from 1975-1978.
I've had major dealers back out of $75K deals 2 days later. I've had a major dealer (on this forum) sell me a $5K figure AT coin that they wanted nothing to do with once it wouldn't slab. They offered no buy back price whatsoever...I was hoping for a 75% to 80%. I think I ended up getting about 75% for that coin. I've had coins promised to me several times that ended up going to other collectors. I've had dealers tell me to give them first shot on specific high value coins (that they sold me) if I ever sold them again. And then refuse to make an offer. One of my local dealers in the 1970's was selling me raw MS65 commems but refused to make an offer to buy any of them back in 1980, at any price. He said he just couldn't use them....said he had no customers for them....lol. That was the end of that relationship. In 1974 I won $900 in better date seated and bust coins via a Coin World mail bid sale. I got the coins but they were mostly 1/2 to 1 grade lower than advertised. The 1855-s half was only VF/XF and not full XF. That was $300 vs. $500. They told me to send them all back if I wasn't happy. I did that. Then they gave me the run around for a few weeks and months....until they disappeared altogether. I was out the full $900. Should have kept the coins....they'd be worth $3K today in those lower grades.
At a major auction in 1984 I purchased a raw gem/MS65 1831 bust quarter for $6500. I pre-screened the coin in NY City for about 10 minutes. It was wonderful. I was the high bidder. When the coin was shipped it looked sort of like what I bid on...except for the 2 huge old obverse scratches from rim to rim. I missed that? They were like "rail road" tracks they were so big and deep. I contacted a dealer friend of mine who was able to bail me out of that coin for $4500. He knew those guys well since they both got their start from the same dealer in the 1970's. I suspect he forced that coin back to those guys, but I was out $2K. The coin with those scratches was probably only worth $2K to $3K. I was lucky...lol. Funny thing, that dealer went to prison for coin fraud about 5-10 years ago. What goes around, comes around. The worst coin ever sent to me in the 1980's was a "gem unc" 1858-0 quarter for $3500. It was from one of the biggest retailers in the nation...everyone here knows their name. The coin ended up being a cleaned AU55 worth about $350-$500. Another time a major retailer came to my door for a cold call since they were in the area. I figured, why not? Maybe I'll learn something. The dealer (and owner) proceeded to offer me cleaned and damaged type coins for thousands each. Hey, that same guy was gigged by the FTC a couple years later. Their business was shuttered. I think he either paid a big fine or got some jail time...or both.
In 1988 a dealer I had been selling heavy wholesale to for about a year all of a sudden went "quiet." I finally was told their assets were seized by the FEDs as part of money laundering/drug scheme. Huh? I had a couple of coins on consignment ($5K) with them at the time. I was lucky to get about 75% of what I was asking for them. Up until that point they bought 90% of what I shipped sight-unseen. It was unfortunate because one of the buyers in that group is a great guy and still around today. One of the most honest guys out there too. In 1990 I consigned a $50K coin to a leading dealer. Whatever they could get above that amount was theirs. It didn't sell after a few months of trying. When I got it back it was in another dealer's flip with an asking price of $65,000. That didn't go over so well with me since the market was peaking at this exact time and the opportunity was lost. The first time I ever tried a consignment was in the 1970's with a local dealer. We agree on prices and grades and it should have worked. Except they ended up asking 50% more than we agreed on and didn't sell a single coin. Don't ask me how I found out but I did. In their mind they weren't going to work for 10-15%, they wanted the full boat score...or nothing. I never worked with them again. Most other collectors and dealers told me that same story about them over the next 20 years. I find it so hard to believe that no one else here has had any issues with their local or national dealers. To me, it's a national pastime.
And the piece-de-resistance? Old Beavertown Coin...life member of ANA, PCGS, NGC, SDRT, and ICTA member. In 1991-1992 I consigned them $20K in MS64 $20 Saints to flip over into other generic gold coins....working on 5-10% for their efforts. They sold half of them (or all) before they ran into trouble and then new coins stopped coming. They gave me excuses for a long time...then went Chapter 11 in 1997. My only mistake was not bringing a hammer down on them much earlier. They kept saying I'd be rewarded for sticking with them. In essence I was giving them a free $10K loan. I was the last to know of the Ch11. I solicited the ANA and other organizations but they couldn't help...and wouldn't. Dave Runfeldt of Beavertown was back in business again a few years later not too far from their stomping grounds in Lincoln Park, NJ. I had no shortage of dealers that said what a great guy Rundfeldt was. My most trusted dealer even recommended him. Just goes to show you never know. I think today he's living the high life in Florida retirement.
Problem with dealers? Not a single one here.............Now, all I need is a publisher. And this is only the 20% or so off the top of my head.
There are probably just as many "good" stories. But like always, the bad ones cost real money and you never forget your first reaming.
Hoard the keys.
What you don't seem to get is that it doesn't matter how deep your pockets are as once you step on enough toes in this hobby your money is no good.
Dealers would rather flush a coin down the toilet then deal with a headache.
I later found out it was puttied.
I tried to sell it back to the dealer .
He would not buy it .
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
<< <i>One time I bough almost a 6 figure coin ....
I later found out it was puttied.
I tried to sell it back to the dealer .
He would not buy it . >>
If you were a collector at that time that's a problem. But dealer to dealer transactions can be without safety nets. While most would probably work something out with a fellow dealer they wanted to maintain a relationship with, there are those that would rather just stick to someone rather than eat a significant loss on a near 6 figure coin. If the coin was slabbed you should have been reasonably protected by a PCGS/NGC guarantee.
Around 2004 I had purchased a pop top, finest graded (MS66) coin at auction. There wasn't even a MS65 at that time. I bid on the coin as a decent 65 figuring I couldn't really get hurt on it as an ok MS65 would still be a finest known. The auction photo didn't show anything glaring and the house description was very positive (surprise!). What I didn't count on was black swan grading and the "potted plant" in the auction room. The coin went to nearly my max bid. When I finally got the coin a couple of weeks later, it was a nightmare. The coin was a 63+ to me. It had an old cleaning, uglyish secondary toning, hairlines, and only about 85% luster. It did have no rub though....lol. This was a grading mistake of the highest order. Rather than the finest known, it was probably exceeded in quality by several MS64's.
The auction house really didn't want to hear about my comments. They said I was basically stuck with it. But....they would send it back to for a formal TPG review if I liked. That wasn't definitive enough for me for such a lousy coin. That was a big disappointment. I eventually got help from one of the most influential dealers in the country who was willing to go the extra mile for me if the coin was as lousy as I said. They got the coin downgraded and I was made whole. Now that was a BIG TIME - no disappointment move. I was surprised how easily they got it done. Saved me $14K. Had I not been a long time customer of theirs I wonder if it could have been done?
I never figured a pop top on a rarer date could be 2 grades off. The irony of the situation is that the next time out the coin realized MS64 money. Obviously, Mr. Potted Plant didn't attend that auction where it once again realized MS64 money.
I've had minor personal friction with one dealer (who does not post here), but in the two transactions I had with him (sold to him once, bought from him once) I came out pretty well and made money both times.
Collector since 1976. On the CU forums here since 2001.
Got down around the Kansas border to a junk yard dealer of car parts.
The proprietor had pulled a chrome door handle from an old Model A (IIRC). The customer drove miles to get there. When the junk yard dealer told him "Twenty bucks", the guy started squawking. The dealer tossed the handle out into the field adjacent to his porch, and his place. Then he ordered the guy off his property. Don't understand why there's a need for drama, but it makes the coin world stay 'round. Every dealer is just another working stiff with a handle on it.
Not that this has anything to do with error coins, or classics.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
As a dealer, I always resolve any misunderstandings.
Error collectors are more sophisticated than the average collector.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
<< <i>What you don't seem to get is that it doesn't matter how deep your pockets are as once you step on enough toes in this hobby your money is no good.
Dealers would rather flush a coin down the toilet then deal with a headache. >>
This x 1000. I want business as much as the next guy and we will do what we reasonably can to accommodate a buyer, but the reality is that there are unfortunately some customers we can't afford to have.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>What you don't seem to get is that it doesn't matter how deep your pockets are as once you step on enough toes in this hobby your money is no good.
Dealers would rather flush a coin down the toilet then deal with a headache. >>
This x 1000. I want business as much as the next guy and we will do what we reasonably can to accommodate a buyer, but the reality is that there are unfortunately some customers we can't afford to have. >>
Please explain how you are aware that I have renigged, not paid or not paid in a timely manner, or hurt any dealer in any way other than make reasonable purchases and pass their name along when warranted. Please name any dealer that I have screwed or slandered or how about that I have done business with. Broadstruck doesn't know me from Adam and is completely money oriented. It isn't all about the money but you wouldn't know that here since most on this board attempt to make a living here. Do you know the ole adage don't mix business with pleasure, that says it all. we are missing business with a hobby here, it is only a hobby for me and I don't care about the money aspect of it. >>
Huh? I never said or inferred anything about you. My agreement was with the philosophy espoused in the bolded sentence above. Peace brother.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
I knew it would happen.
Was mildly ripped off by a guy on ebay - selling an 1909-S Indian cent, photos made it look really nice for the grade, but they were all at angles which just happened to minimize the big carbon spot on the obverse. After I got the coin, I was irked, but then went back to the photos and sure enough, the spot was in the picture, once I knew what to look for. Last time I bought anything significant on ebay.
Successful BST (me as buyer) with: Collectorcoins, PipestonePete, JasonRiffeRareCoins
But I wonder, how many collectors have tried to liquidate a substantial portion of their collection.
Not just a cherry pick here and there where they made a profit, but actually selling the highlights of a collection along with the lesser coins.
This can be eye opening and not only tells you something about the offers that are received but also tells you something about the original purchases, the advice that was given, problems that were not mentioned, the prices that were paid and ultimately how they were treated.