Why has no one dethroned Ebay in coins?

musicman · October 3, 2012 7:25AM

Coins & cars are where ebay make their money. Why has no one really challenge them in over 10yrs? Google or Amazon?

Ebay fees are insane, then layer on Paypal.

I welcome competition.

ricko · October 3, 2012 7:28AM

Ebay was in early and was very good.... there have been challenges, but weak and not sustained. They make a lot of money from other venues besides cars and coins. Cheers, RickO

Jcarney · October 3, 2012 7:30AM

If you think ebay/paypal fees are insane, take a look at the other options. Heritage, Teletrade et al are more expensive.

airplanenut · October 3, 2012 7:47AM

<< If you think ebay/paypal fees are insane, take a look at the other options. Heritage, Teletrade et al are more expensive. >>

What he said. Not to mention with eBay you get paid when the sale is done, not after a month.

JamesMurray · October 3, 2012 7:50AM

<< Coins & cars are where ebay make their money. Why has no one really challenge them in over 10yrs? Google or Amazon?

Ebay fees are insane, then layer on Paypal.

I welcome competition. >>

I'd need a little more convincing ebay "make their money" from coins and car sales , the fee's while they may seem high as most users are accustomed to less percentages in fee's it's still much cheaper to list than any other main auction service. Amazon have done more than just challange ebay , ebay want to be just like them so somethings working somewhere for amazon.

musicman · October 3, 2012 7:54AM

<< If you think ebay/paypal fees are insane, take a look at the other options. Heritage, Teletrade et al are more expensive. >>

Agree, but.........

they print catalogs, manage/safe keep coins, write descriptions, etc . Ebay does nothing.

Where does the little guy go sell low priced items w/o high fees?

derryb · October 3, 2012 7:57AM

their business model has been updated to encourage the Ebay Store. This may push out a lot of the little guys. Time will tell.

LanceNewmanOCC · October 3, 2012 8:16AM

<< their business model has been updated to encourage the Ebay Store. This may push out a lot of the little guys. Time will tell. >>

i agree with a lot of the positive aspects mentioned thus far but wanted to add a comment to derry's post and then give my opinion to the topic of this post.

to further push out the little guys, or at least low dollar items, sellers must maintain a 90% tracking uploaded average to qualify for discounts, but low dollar items are not cost-effective for tracking and an

ebay employee told me definitively that if you sell items without tracking you put your TRS and/or discounts at risk. Seems dumb to me since my opinion is the quantity of low-dollar listing fees will be

significantly more than the higher dollar listings, but it required more band with, there are more customer issues. ebay is pushing for a higher average clientel, both seller/buyer.

to stay on-topic, why has no one dethroned ebay.

ebay is an easy format aka user friendly, great exposure, great market share, fee percentages get lower the higher value the item at auction, a reliable payment service with decent protection from both

sides, allow user control within reason of how, when, how much an item is listed and will possibly sell for, and there are many more perks.

easy to get a feel for sellers and their business models. when i go to amazon, it is much more of a pain to buy and sell compared to ebay imo and without a mass-marketed protection policy. most people do

not want to have to have a PhD in computer sciences to list a few trinkets and/or to buy a few, ebay has nearly everyone else trumped in spades in several areas of their format/market and imo even with

some of their frustrating policies, deserve the market share they have.

Only three ways i can think of off-hand to take the spot light away from ebay: 1. ebay does themselves in by doing sellers in. 2. someone else makes it easier to buy/sell such a large variety of items 3.

someone else makes it as safe and/or safer to buy/sell items of such a large variety. - those 3 things may be a short list but pretty much encompass all other details. i'm tired so there may be a few others.

OPA · October 3, 2012 8:18AM

<< Coins & cars are where ebay make their money. Why has no one really challenge them in over 10yrs? Google or Amazon?

Ebay fees are insane, then layer on Paypal.

I welcome competition. >>

Unlikely...coins & cars are a very small percentage of their overall sales. Last figures I saw, it was something like around 5% of their total sales. Just as a comparison...there are currently approx 325K items listed in the coin & currency section...small potatoes compared to shoes..over 4 million listing

123cents · October 3, 2012 8:21AM

I think Yahoo Auctions was a viable alternative but when they went to free listings the site when down the tubes!

ebaytrader · October 3, 2012 8:29AM

In years past when an upstart got some, or any traction, feepay was quick to buy them out. The exception was Yahoo auctions. Yahoo looked at the administrative costs and closed it down. Cutting overhead will be on the front burner for feepay and I would expect them to hammer the small sellers with even higher costs, or to simply chase them away as their administrative costs for small sellers are not conducive to the ever higher bottom line numbers they need to generate.

LanceNewmanOCC · October 3, 2012 8:33AM

<< In years past when an upstart got some, or any traction, feepay was quick to buy them out. >>

very, very good point, buy-outs did slip my mind and easily one of the most important factors.
i actually would like to change buy-outs to assimilation, kinda like the Borg!

AMRC · October 3, 2012 8:34AM

I have to disagree about the fees. My average cost is still less than HALF of what I pay at Heritage. And please save me the hype about it is a "buyers fee." In the end eBay is still an incredible bargain and that is why it continues to prosper.

OPA · October 3, 2012 8:35AM

<< 

<< If you think ebay/paypal fees are insane, take a look at the other options. Heritage, Teletrade et al are more expensive. >>

What he said. Not to mention with eBay you get paid when the sale is done, not after a month. >>

Ebay fees are insane, then layer on Paypal.

I suppose it depends on what you're selling and what volume you're generating.
I have an eBay store and sell only coins or bullion. Last month I had $6k in sales on 8 items, my eBay fees amounted to $213. PayPal fees approx 3%.
On the other hand, if most of your sales are under $50, yes the fees will eat you.

OPA · October 3, 2012 8:42AM

<< In years past when an upstart got some, or any traction, feepay was quick to buy them out. >>

Really? Please name more than 2 AUCTION SITES that eBay bought out.

coinsarefun · October 3, 2012 8:45AM

eBay is a very broad user based sales outlet with enormous amounts of money behind the machine.
I don't think there will be any real competition for a very long time to come. They have become as generic
Kleenex (tissue paper)or Jacuzzi( whirlpool).

Even though they have slowed down, the TV adds have been going strong for over two years.

It will take people with very deep pockets and tenacity to overcome them and even then it
will be quite an endeavor as most investors do not want to pay to reinvent the wheel.....
.......only how to make it cheaper.

But.......this is only my opinion

ebaytrader · October 3, 2012 9:04AM

<< 

<< In years past when an upstart got some, or any traction, feepay was quick to buy them out. >>

Really? Please name more than 2 AUCTION SITES that eBay bought out. >>

Here you go: I count at least eight auction sites they've bought out.

In the future, please do your own homework. I'm not your mommy. Don't treat me like I am. Thanks.

LanceNewmanOCC · October 3, 2012 9:15AM

<< Here you go: I count at least eight auction sites they've bought out. >>

hey thanks for that list. let that be a lesson to anyone wanting to know about top-level corps and conglomerates and how they sometimes get there and most often stay there for a long time

i'd even wager a LARGE bet that most of the top 500-1,500 offered at some point to buy out a company that became their major competitor because they did not sell out. hehe

buying out potential future competitors has always been SOP and plays NO small part to many corps success :-)
.

greghansen · October 3, 2012 9:15AM

Agree, but.........

they print catalogs, manage/safe keep coins, write descriptions, etc . Ebay does nothing.

Where does the little guy go sell low priced items w/o high fees?

EBAY provides a very sophisticated platform usuable across a wide variety of product auctions. Do you think someone give that to them for free? Or maybe did they have to develop it, improve it, maintain it, etc.

The world does not owe the 'little guy' a place to go to sell low priced items w/o fees you find high. You can rent a stall at a local flea market, you can sell out of the back of your car, you can sell door to door or any other avenue. After you've done a few of those I'd be interested in your opinion as to whether EBAY fees are still 'high' compared to other avenues that give you the same number of eyeballs exposure. In truth, EBAY is rediculously cheap for the audience you gain. You literally have a national, even worldwide, audience if you want it. I'm told that back during the depression when describing folks who couldn't seem to be satisfied even with a good thing, my Grandpa used to say, 'some folks will cry even with a loaf of bread under their ams'.

streeter · October 3, 2012 9:28AM

I was under the impression that EBAY CORP derives more profits from PAYPAL that auctions. Correct me if I'm wrong but that was my understanding.

Article in WSJ awhile back quotes Donahoe as stating that your smart phone will be the wallet of the future and PAYPAL or similar will be your cash in your smartphone.

Everything you have in your wallet now...in 6-10 years will be digitized in your phone. Cash, ID, pictures, credit cards.

LanceNewmanOCC · October 3, 2012 9:34AM

<< I was under the impression that EBAY CORP derives more profits from PAYPAL that auctions. Correct me if I'm wrong but that was my understanding. >>

wouldn't surprise me since paypal services businesses other than ebay worldwide. The figures are probably available for paypal. I know ebay's are.
.

JohnMaben · October 3, 2012 10:02AM

Very simple.... because they are a 50 billion dollar global company. Who could compete with that? Google is not interested. Amazon model doesn't fit coins, too costly to sell on there. Also, I do not believe they make their money on cars and coins, yes that is some of it, and cars more so than coins, but coins are a drop in their bucket, thus they are classified as an "emerging vertical market". So in short, we are on their radar but not a major revenue source at least for now.

John

BryceM · October 3, 2012 10:15AM

Because so far, the free market has determined that eBay is doing it better than anyone else. There is a lot of wisdom in Greg Hansen's comments.

I'm of the opinion that eBay has gotten a little too big for their britches when it comes to customer service and a one-size-fits-all mentality. In the end it might upset their virtual corner on the market. Their fees are pretty steep, but people still go there to buy and sell so obviously what they are doing is working for their shareholders. They make a profit which is exactly what is supposed to happen.

pennyannie · October 3, 2012 10:17AM

I can list an item on ebay, have it sold in 20 minutes and be paid right then and there. I can take the same item to a B&M and they may or may not want it and recieve 20 to 40 percent of what i can sell it for on ebay.

I run most of my things on a 7 day auction with a BIN or a price and make offer option.

For ever issue i have on ebay i have 100's of non issues.

When another company comes along with something better i will gladly leave ebay.

TwoSides2aCoin · October 3, 2012 10:21AM

ebay led me here. That led me to seek better coins. That led me to submit them, and that led me to buy a coin shop and make a website, which led me back to eBay. It's not a throne, it's a venue. As much as I knock it, it's been there 24/7/365.... even when I'm not.

Tiny · October 3, 2012 10:29AM

<< 

<< If you think ebay/paypal fees are insane, take a look at the other options. Heritage, Teletrade et al are more expensive. >>

Agree, but.........

they print catalogs, manage/safe keep coins, write descriptions, etc . Ebay does nothing.

Where does the little guy go sell low priced items w/o high fees? >>

I have been using Great Collections Auctions to sell coins without all the troubles of other sites.
Sure you may wait a month to get paid but it is worth it to not have the headaches. Their fees
are the lowest I have found and service is much more personable compared to other sites.

Unknown · October 3, 2012 10:29AM

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Jinx86 · October 3, 2012 10:30AM

Ebay is so simple to use, Amazon kinda sucks when Ive tried using it, to complicated of a format. With Ebay I have a premium store for lowering my costs, I have about 300-350 items in my store monthly and list items daily to keep at that number. Takes an hour a day to list, hour to package, then a quick trip to the PO.

DoubleEagle59 · October 3, 2012 10:31AM

Ebay over the years has become more expensive to use and possibly more complicated/irritating (?) also.

However, it is still by far, the best venue to sell merchandise.

Dice21 · October 3, 2012 10:35AM

As an e-bay buyer/seller since 2003 I can count on 7 fingers the problems all these years (yes I have been lucky) but I also take care of issues in a quick fashion and most have come from purchases and not sales.......I do not accept returns as I sell 95 percent pcgs graded 70 coins........I could probably improve my sales numbers by offering returns but I am somewhat old school and believe that a deal is a deal if I hold up my end (which I do).......sooner or later e-bay is going to force sellers to accept returns and I will make the choice when the time comes........BUT.........there is no other venue that I can sell at my price and have the low overhead of selling from my home office without the rent factor of a store that has to be maintained (staffed)........right now the fees are high (higher than when I started) but still managable and show a profit.........Plus having exposure 24/7 to over 2 million potential buyers and it cost me .20 cents per month per listing........until someone with very deep (VERY) pockets comes along e-bay will dominate that type of selling venue..........as always my 2 cents

BaseballAbs · October 3, 2012 10:38AM

I think in today's market you would be very hard pressed to start up a online auction company a do what Ebay has done.

Tiny · October 3, 2012 10:44AM

Here is the closest thing to eBay I have found and have even boughtg a few coins
from this site. I've never checked out the seller's fees so it might be moot in that aspect.

Another eBay

BaseballAbs · October 3, 2012 10:45AM

<< 

<< 

<< In years past when an upstart got some, or any traction, feepay was quick to buy them out. >>

Really? Please name more than 2 AUCTION SITES that eBay bought out. >>

Here you go: I count at least eight auction sites they've bought out.

In the future, please do your own homework. I'm not your mommy. Don't treat me like I am. Thanks. >>

OH SNAP!

LindeDad · October 3, 2012 10:56AM

See post below lost the quote.

LindeDad · October 3, 2012 10:58AM

<< Here is the closest thing to eBay I have found and have even boughtg a few coins
from this site. I've never checked out the seller's fees so it might be moot in that aspect.

Another eBay >>

I listed about sixty items at below normal eBay prices on there for sixty days.
Had Nada for sales and most items did good if they even got a single viewer during the listing.

LanceNewmanOCC · October 3, 2012 11:10AM

.
just for those that didn't view the companies/services ebay purchased, here is a low number they've spent, most likely much more.

$11,000,000,000.00+
.

mustangmanbob · October 3, 2012 11:31AM

While it is not apples to apples, I sell old Mustang parts. Right now, there is nobody who can touch the visibility I get from ebay, so the fees are just what I build into my price structure.

4 examples:

1) This weekend, went to an automotive swap meet to buy, not sell. It was lightly raining when I got there, stopped raining for 20 minutes or so, light rain and I finally left. Changed to hard rain. Most sellers who set up, never untarped. Over 2/3's of the SOLD spaces never were occupied by the purchasers due to weather, and the drive up, pay for a spot crowd was wiped out. Bought some stuff CHEAP. It never rains on ebay.

2) Had a pair of NOS (New Old Stock) Lincoln emblems from the 1960's. They went to 5+ years of swap meets, for $5, no takers. Tossed them up on ebay, sold to a person in Australia for $160. I will pay the 9% for that sale.

3) For coins, my son used ebay to sell 50 coin sets that met the Coin Collecting Merit Badge requirement for foreign coins. The coins were donated to help his Eagle Project Fundraising. He sold over 60 sets at $5 a set (10 cents a coin).

4) I had a Thunderbolt carburetor (1964 Ford Race car). No local interest, but tossed it on ebay, and it went for over $1000. Happy to pay the ebay fee on that one again.

DoubleEagle59 · October 3, 2012 12:33PM

<< While it is not apples to apples, I sell old Mustang parts. Right now, there is nobody who can touch the visibility I get from ebay, so the fees are just what I build into my price structure.

4 examples:

1) This weekend, went to an automotive swap meet to buy, not sell. It was lightly raining when I got there, stopped raining for 20 minutes or so, light rain and I finally left. Changed to hard rain. Most sellers who set up, never untarped. Over 2/3's of the SOLD spaces never were occupied by the purchasers due to weather, and the drive up, pay for a spot crowd was wiped out. Bought some stuff CHEAP. It never rains on ebay.

2) Had a pair of NOS (New Old Stock) Lincoln emblems from the 1960's. They went to 5+ years of swap meets, for $5, no takers. Tossed them up on ebay, sold to a person in Australia for $160. I will pay the 9% for that sale.

3) For coins, my son used ebay to sell 50 coin sets that met the Coin Collecting Merit Badge requirement for foreign coins. The coins were donated to help his Eagle Project Fundraising. He sold over 60 sets at $5 a set (10 cents a coin).

4) I had a Thunderbolt carburetor (1964 Ford Race car). No local interest, but tossed it on ebay, and it went for over $1000. Happy to pay the ebay fee on that one again. >>

Great examples why Ebay is still #1.

notwilight · October 3, 2012 12:39PM

<< Coins & cars are where ebay make their money. ...
. >>

Not sure I agree with this statement. ebay coin sales seem to be decreasing rapidly. My business has gone from 99% ebay sales to 90% off ebay. Even new customers often figure a way to find me off ebay to save the fees. When fees are 10%, that makes a big difference to cost conscious coin purchasers looking at price guides and sheets.

The new policy of "only one auction running at a time" drives off even more modern coin sales.

Those comparing ebay to Heritage or Teletrade are not comparing apples to apples. Heritage provides a quality auction, photo, description and Lots of advertising and buyers who come to every auction. Teletrade does something similar. On ebay I do all the work and the buyers don't know when the auction will be so they show up sometimes.

--Jerry

musicman · October 3, 2012 1:18PM

<< 

<< Coins & cars are where ebay make their money. Why has no one really challenge them in over 10yrs? Google or Amazon?

Ebay fees are insane, then layer on Paypal.

I welcome competition. >>

Unlikely...coins & cars are a very small percentage of their overall sales. Last figures I saw, it was something like around 5% of their total sales. Just as a comparison...there are currently approx 325K items listed in the coin & currency section...small potatoes compared to shoes..over 4 million listing >>

CARS #1 CATEGORY IN SALES ---- COINS FASTEST GROWING CATEGORY

LanceNewmanOCC · October 3, 2012 2:12PM

.
musicman

what exactly do those numbers reflect. how much in those categories ebay shows as sold per second?

i am being serious as i do not follow precisely those numbers are telling us besides the growth percentage which won't mean as much until i get more info

thanks!
.

Unknown · October 4, 2012 1:45AM

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streeter · October 4, 2012 1:47AM

Something that Ebay offers that is hard to beat is the education you can receive if you study other auctions and completed auction prices in many categories.

The time you spend studying sometimes invites you to participate as a seller and a buyer.

I own a lot of 'stuff' and Ebay sure helps me get up to speed on the current market for a lot of items. No other site even comes close. I'm not talking about just coins but all collectibles.

One heck of a research tool.

mrpotatoheadd · October 4, 2012 2:00AM

<< Why has no one dethroned Ebay in coins? >>

When eBay started out, they weren't entering into competition with an already established website with millions of users. eBay has since grown to such a size that any newcomer now has an enormous hurdle to clear- being able to immediately provide the buyers that sellers need to make their businesses successful. There was a time when Amazon and Yahoo had a shot at being competitive with eBay in coin sales, but they chose to do different things.

Twinturbo · October 4, 2012 4:58AM

Someone needs to do something soon
I had an auction pulled this morning 15 minutes before auction ending on a 10 day listing

Not only did I get a 24 hour auction selling ban. This was the message received from coin community watch.
" 100 counterfeit being sold as genuine
Horrible morphology for observe
Definitely counterfeit and produced in chine"

Not only did a second grader type this the coin is in a PCGS genuine holder to boot!!!

In return I'm looking at all auctions ending within 24 hrs and any over $500 I'm reporting
Btw so far I've got 81 auctions pulled cause I allege their counterfeit

Oh we'll sucks to be an eBay coin seller today

JCMhouston · October 4, 2012 6:30AM

You are quite a fine human being twinturbo.

mingot · October 4, 2012 6:49AM

Anyone know twin turbos ebay id?

They could probably use a heads up.

Jcarney · October 4, 2012 7:01AM

<< Someone needs to do something soon
I had an auction pulled this morning 15 minutes before auction ending on a 10 day listing

Not only did I get a 24 hour auction selling ban. This was the message received from coin community watch.
" 100 counterfeit being sold as genuine
Horrible morphology for observe
Definitely counterfeit and produced in chine"

Not only did a second grader type this the coin is in a PCGS genuine holder to boot!!!

In return I'm looking at all auctions ending within 24 hrs and any over $500 I'm reporting
Btw so far I've got 81 auctions pulled cause I allege their counterfeit

Oh we'll sucks to be an eBay coin seller today >>

Unreal. So because something crappy happened to you, you're reporting random auctions? Must suck to be you.

GoldenEyeNumismatics · October 4, 2012 7:07AM

<< Coins & cars are where ebay make their money. >>

Really? Cars seems like a logical money-maker but do coins make up a large portion of their revenue?

OPA · October 4, 2012 7:35AM

<< 

<< Someone needs to do something soon
I had an auction pulled this morning 15 minutes before auction ending on a 10 day listing

Not only did I get a 24 hour auction selling ban. This was the message received from coin community watch.
" 100 counterfeit being sold as genuine
Horrible morphology for observe
Definitely counterfeit and produced in chine"

Not only did a second grader type this the coin is in a PCGS genuine holder to boot!!!

In return I'm looking at all auctions ending within 24 hrs and any over $500 I'm reporting
Btw so far I've got 81 auctions pulled cause I allege their counterfeit

Oh we'll sucks to be an eBay coin seller today >>

Unreal. So because something crappy happened to you, you're reporting random auctions? Must suck to be you. >>

I don't know about you, but I have a difficult time believing that story. BTW does PCGS slab: "questionable authenticity" coins? If so, it may have been a counterfeit.

TwoSides2aCoin · October 4, 2012 8:16AM

I have to thank the coin community watch group. My nephew's been doing the listing on ebay for almost 2 years. He can't stand it, but I told him it comes with the territory.
Recently had a 1922 "No D" listed and rec'd that email that the watch group think tank determined coin had the mint mark, so the auction was pulled. Embarassed and a little upset, of course, I go see my nephew and the coin. It's obviously a weak D. I asked him to be more diligent with my reputation, it's bad enough/...or call me if he doesn't know or can't see. He relisted it as a 1922 D and it sold for $28. Now he wants to buy all my wheat cents for a nickel because he suddenly got better vision.

Why has no one dethroned Ebay in coins?

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