eBay "Return to sender"

mt_msla · January 4, 2018 7:00PM

Hey guys, quick question.

If an ebayer purchases something, and it's shipped out, but the customer then refuses the package and writes "Return to sender" on the unopened package, is the customer going to be valid for a refund?

Thanks for any insight.

OPA · January 4, 2018 7:06PM

Never had that happen to me. Did he give you any indications as to why he's returning the item? That would be the determination.

ms70 · January 4, 2018 7:15PM

Sounds like a case of buyer's remorse.

jwitten · January 4, 2018 7:16PM

Buyers can pretty much get a refund just for telling ebay they want a refund. Just give him a refund when it arrives back, block him, then move on.

Coinstartled · January 4, 2018 7:37PM

Upon receipt issue the refund and move on.

3keepSECRETif2rDEAD · January 4, 2018 7:46PM

...looks like they made their decision while she was in transit...no need for an up-close, in-hand look...and really no need to spend $$$ on return shipping so basically screw you...that’s what happened from how I read it...a loser is a loser

3keepSECRETif2rDEAD · January 4, 2018 7:49PM

Oh and I forgot...YES on the refund unfortunately

3keepSECRETif2rDEAD · January 4, 2018 7:52PM

Oh and one more post just for count...stored Karma can’t be good for these type of people I bet so breath easy

JBK · January 4, 2018 7:56PM

Then again, maybe you never knew they wrote RTS on it since you never received it back...

Kkathyl · January 4, 2018 8:03PM

If goods are ok. Open under camera to ensure no swap out. Just refund not worth the bother.

BruceS · January 4, 2018 8:04PM

They won or bought a product from you, then paid and you shipped. If they refused delivery then what are they disputing? It can't be a snad if they didn't open it.

But on the other hand. If you have a return policy then that doesn't matter. And ebay will be on the buyers side as is the case the majority of the time. At least you know it wasn't messed with. Re-list and move on.

amwldcoin · January 4, 2018 8:21PM

I had an ebayer with buyers remorse do that. He messaged me 4 days after he purchased and said he would refuse the package. All worked out in the end and surprisingly the USPS returned it for free! The buyer actually told me after a few neutral exchanges to deduct my shipping cost.

jt88 · January 4, 2018 8:35PM

I have a return case that buyer opened on eBay, I accepted the return but somehow post office sent the return package to the wrong post office. Anyway eBay closed the case after some times because buyer did not provide tracking. 10 days after the case closed I received the return. So I told the buyer to talk to eBay to see if eBay can refund the money because I can't do it on eBay since the case was closed. EBay told the buyer to open a case with PayPal (can you believe this?). To make the story short I refunded the buyer from PayPal after deducted the eBay fee (buyer OK with it). If I don't do that buyer can still open a case with PayPal as eBay suggested him to do. I will lose the case and the fee for sure since I received the return package.

AUandAG · January 4, 2018 8:37PM

What if you refuse the return postage payment and just tell them to "sbtb" (ship back to buyer)?

bob

jwitten · January 4, 2018 8:37PM

Another thing to add.... if he's already decided he wants to return it, at least this way you don't have to pay for return shipping

jt88 · January 4, 2018 8:39PM

You can't fight the buyer on ebay and paypal or even the credit card. As many people said on this board just refund the money and move on. You can block the buyer. If you fight you might be end up losing the fee and get a Cases closed without seller resolution.

derryb · January 4, 2018 9:26PM

tracking will show it returned. Ebay will side with buyer. If you want to avoid the ebay FV fee, ask the seller to request a transaction cancellation first, then make the refund.

mt_msla · January 4, 2018 9:39PM

ok thanks much guys

BAJJERFAN · January 4, 2018 9:50PM

@AUandAG said:
What if you refuse the return postage payment and just tell them to "sbtb" (ship back to buyer)?

bob

If the recipient writes refuse on the package, there is AFAIK no extra postage to have it come back.

AUandAG · January 4, 2018 9:53PM

Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

ricko · January 5, 2018 8:55AM

Yep... refund if the package has not been tampered with.... Cheers, RickO

SamByrd · January 5, 2018 9:19AM

technically they waive the buyer protection by refusing the package. I would as others have suggested refund the transaction , promptly after receiving the return.

johnny9434 · January 5, 2018 9:32AM

@jwitten said:
Buyers can pretty much get a refund just for telling ebay they want a refund. Just give him a refund when it arrives back, block him, then move on.

yeah,what he said

1630Boston · January 5, 2018 10:08AM

These are the subtle, yet very important, aspects that need to be learned and taken into account when selling on ebay
Thanks for posting this thread

TwoSides2aCoin · January 5, 2018 10:18AM

Just take it back and issue refund. Any more from me will be ranting.

BAJJERFAN · January 5, 2018 10:42AM

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I sent a registered package to a board member. Since there was a misunderstanding about price I told him to refuse the package at the window. It came back to me with no extra postage due. If it went unclaimed and got returned to the sender, it may have been different.

BIGAL2749 · January 5, 2018 10:55AM

Even if you get charged for return postage just consider it "cost of business"

BuffaloIronTail · January 5, 2018 11:54AM

@Coinstartled said:
Upon receipt issue the refund and move on.

I agree.........the customer definitely got cold feet. Of course, you do have a legal right to fight it.

Problem is you already have the coin returned. Not a nice thing to do in any respect.

Pete

mustangmanbob · January 5, 2018 4:04PM

@BuffaloIronTail said:

@Coinstartled said:

Of course, you do have a legal right to fight it.

>
Can you quote what part of the United States Code gives you a legal right?

jmlanzaf · January 5, 2018 4:49PM

@3keepSECRETif2rDEAD said:
...looks like they made their decision while she was in transit...no need for an up-close, in-hand look...and really no need to spend $$$ on return shipping so basically screw you...that’s what happened from how I read it...a loser is a loser

Actually, they saved you money on shipping. IF they accept it, file an eBay "item not as described" case, then you are on the hook for the return postage as well as the refund.

jmlanzaf · January 5, 2018 4:52PM

@mustangmanbob said:

@BuffaloIronTail said:

@Coinstartled said:

Of course, you do have a legal right to fight it.

>
Can you quote what part of the United States Code gives you a legal right?

Doesn't it depend on whether it was an auction or a BIN? In an auction, most states interpret the bid and acceptance as a contract. In the case of a retail purchase, no transaction occurs until the exchange is complete. Isn't that at least partly true?

It would be easier to sue in reverse, citing any difference between photo and item as misrepresentation.

jmlanzaf · January 5, 2018 4:55PM

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I've never been charged return postage for any package returned to me as undeliverable. That said, if you read the USPS fine print, they do claim the right to do just that.

jmlanzaf · January 5, 2018 4:56PM

@derryb said:
tracking will show it returned. Ebay will side with buyer. If you want to avoid the ebay FV fee, ask the seller to request a transaction cancellation first, then make the refund.

You don't need to ask the seller to request a transaction cancellation. You can initiate the cancellation yourself.

jmlanzaf · January 5, 2018 5:03PM

These are the problems I don't mind. At MOST you are out one-way shipping. [Negotiate with the buyer for the shipping fee. He/she may be reasonable.]

I once had someone buy an AU/Unc liberty nickel with a small green spot - pictured AND described. They got the coin, scrubbed it with a brillo pad and then sent it back when they didn't like the way it looked. THOSE BOTHER ME.

Simple return? No fuss, no bother, no problem.

Let he who has never returned a coin throw the first stone. Treat the customer the way you would want to be treated.

drei3ree · January 6, 2018 5:19AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@derryb said:
tracking will show it returned. Ebay will side with buyer. If you want to avoid the ebay FV fee, ask the seller to request a transaction cancellation first, then make the refund.

You don't need to ask the seller to request a transaction cancellation. You can initiate the cancellation yourself.

Call eBay. Almost always gets you the best result if you do. At one time, ebay had a policy that said buyers weren't covered if they refused shipment...

jmlanzaf · January 6, 2018 5:37AM

@drei3ree said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@derryb said:
tracking will show it returned. Ebay will side with buyer. If you want to avoid the ebay FV fee, ask the seller to request a transaction cancellation first, then make the refund.

You don't need to ask the seller to request a transaction cancellation. You can initiate the cancellation yourself.

Call eBay. Almost always gets you the best result if you do. At one time, ebay had a policy that said buyers weren't covered if they refused shipment...

Why would you NOT refund the money?

I want to see you on these boards after you send a $500 coin back to Heritage and they tell you they won't refund your money.

MWallace · January 6, 2018 5:55AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I've never been charged return postage for any package returned to me as undeliverable. That said, if you read the USPS fine print, they do claim the right to do just that.

Mail/Parcels send First Class, Priority, and Express, are returned at no additional charge if returned unopened for any reason (refused, deliverable as addressed, insufficient address, no such number, etc.). If parcel is sent at the parcel post rate, return postage is charged to the original sender. If the original sender refuses to pay return postage (usually because the item is worth less than the postage), then the parcel is sent to the dead letter office.

jmlanzaf · January 6, 2018 6:03AM

@MWallace said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I've never been charged return postage for any package returned to me as undeliverable. That said, if you read the USPS fine print, they do claim the right to do just that.

Mail/Parcels send First Class, Priority, and Express, are returned at no additional charge if returned unopened for any reason (refused, deliverable as addressed, insufficient address, no such number, etc.). If parcel is sent at the parcel post rate, return postage is charged to the original sender. If the original sender refuses to pay return postage (usually because the item is worth less than the postage), then the parcel is sent to the dead letter office.

They don't really use that term anymore. Is that USPS ground?

MWallace · January 6, 2018 6:17AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@MWallace said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I've never been charged return postage for any package returned to me as undeliverable. That said, if you read the USPS fine print, they do claim the right to do just that.

Mail/Parcels send First Class, Priority, and Express, are returned at no additional charge if returned unopened for any reason (refused, deliverable as addressed, insufficient address, no such number, etc.). If parcel is sent at the parcel post rate, return postage is charged to the original sender. If the original sender refuses to pay return postage (usually because the item is worth less than the postage), then the parcel is sent to the dead letter office.

They don't really use that term anymore. Is that USPS ground?

Parcel Post? Yes. USPS Ground was formally parcel post.

jmlanzaf · January 6, 2018 6:18AM

@MWallace said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@MWallace said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I've never been charged return postage for any package returned to me as undeliverable. That said, if you read the USPS fine print, they do claim the right to do just that.

Mail/Parcels send First Class, Priority, and Express, are returned at no additional charge if returned unopened for any reason (refused, deliverable as addressed, insufficient address, no such number, etc.). If parcel is sent at the parcel post rate, return postage is charged to the original sender. If the original sender refuses to pay return postage (usually because the item is worth less than the postage), then the parcel is sent to the dead letter office.

They don't really use that term anymore. Is that USPS ground?

Parcel Post? Yes. USPS Ground was formally parcel post.

Thanks!

I don't have any coins that heavy. LOL.

AUandAG · January 6, 2018 9:07AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@MWallace said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I've never been charged return postage for any package returned to me as undeliverable. That said, if you read the USPS fine print, they do claim the right to do just that.

Mail/Parcels send First Class, Priority, and Express, are returned at no additional charge if returned unopened for any reason (refused, deliverable as addressed, insufficient address, no such number, etc.). If parcel is sent at the parcel post rate, return postage is charged to the original sender. If the original sender refuses to pay return postage (usually because the item is worth less than the postage), then the parcel is sent to the dead letter office.

They don't really use that term anymore. Is that USPS ground?

Thank you as that is how my two packages were sent. They were quite heavy cast iron items that were expensive to ship in the first place. My customer bought two heavy cast iron tobacco cutters and I shipped separately due to their weight. One got delivered no problem and the other came back. Post office just scratched their head over why or how that could happen Both had labels printed through the ebay system and were identical.
Hmmmmmmm

bob

BAJJERFAN · January 6, 2018 9:23AM

@logger7 said:
That is pretty rude since the guy bought the item, did not communicate and returned it via denying delivery. Pretty inhuman, but I guess you are just out the shipping cost. Idiot.

Unless you offered free shipping, just deduct the shipping from the refund. In this case it would be warranted.

BAJJERFAN · January 6, 2018 9:24AM

@AUandAG said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@MWallace said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@AUandAG said:
Really, not familiar enough but I sent a package to Michigan and it was not deliverable (sent two packages on the same day to the same address and one was delivered no problem). When it arrived back the PO charged me return postage. Not the same here if it actually was refused by a person?
bob

I've never been charged return postage for any package returned to me as undeliverable. That said, if you read the USPS fine print, they do claim the right to do just that.

Mail/Parcels send First Class, Priority, and Express, are returned at no additional charge if returned unopened for any reason (refused, deliverable as addressed, insufficient address, no such number, etc.). If parcel is sent at the parcel post rate, return postage is charged to the original sender. If the original sender refuses to pay return postage (usually because the item is worth less than the postage), then the parcel is sent to the dead letter office.

They don't really use that term anymore. Is that USPS ground?

Thank you as that is how my two packages were sent. They were quite heavy cast iron items that were expensive to ship in the first place. My customer bought two heavy cast iron tobacco cutters and I shipped separately due to their weight. One got delivered no problem and the other came back. Post office just scratched their head over why or how that could happen Both had labels printed through the ebay system and were identical.
Hmmmmmmm

bob

Identical except for tracking numbers of course.

BuffaloIronTail · January 6, 2018 9:59AM

@mustangmanbob said:

@BuffaloIronTail said:

@Coinstartled said:

Of course, you do have a legal right to fight it.

>
Can you quote what part of the United States Code gives you a legal right?

I can't quote anything, really. I will rephrase it by taking it back and saying no more about it.

Lesson learned

Pete

derryb · January 6, 2018 11:05AM

When creating an ebay listing I always include this in the "additional return policy details:"

"seller's actual shipping cost will be deducted from refund."

Most of my shipments are registered mail at a cost of $20+.

Coinstartled · January 6, 2018 11:09AM

@derryb said:
When creating an ebay listing I always include this in the "additional return policy details:"

"seller's actual shipping cost will be deducted from refund."

Most of my shipments are registered mail at a cost of $20+.

My returns have never exceeded 2% of unit sales. Only got burned on a returned registered ($25) one time. Returns are not the problem, EBay's escalating fees are.

derryb · January 6, 2018 11:12AM

Paying return postage is always a problem when it comes out of the seller's pocket. It allows buyers to sample the goods at the seller's expense. I don't mind returns as long as buyer eats the cost.

Coinstartled · January 6, 2018 11:45AM

@derryb said:
Paying return postage is always a problem when it comes out of the seller's pocket. It allows buyers to sample the goods at the seller's expense. I don't mind returns as long as buyer eats the cost.

I don't disagree, but on Ebay, once in a while you take a nominal hit. Bigger problem is that the fee on the $2000 coin has surged from $37 to $125. That is, if you shell out $25 a month for the tore.

eBay "Return to sender"

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