How long did it take for you old time collectors to warm up & eventually fond of those toned silvers

Paradisefound

I am very new in this hobby and the tendency is to look for those shinny, bright and satiny coin free of any toning. I don't wish to spend too much both financially and timely collecting these "shiny object" and missing out on the beautiful opportunity for rainbow especially the Morgans. How did you come up to this junction where "toned" silvers became your fancy? I know exactly what is the better "toned" or "rainbow" and how to tell if it's naturally occurred. Please share your perspective. Mahalo

cameonut2011

I've always loved attractively toned silver, copper, and nickel.

lkeigwin

Which do you prefer between these two similarly graded capped bust halves?

I am really okay with a nicely cleaned, not overly-dipped, lustrous coin. But given the choice between a handsomely toned one and an acceptable dipped one I choose the former. It is a taste many but not all share.
Lance.

BryceM

I like both flashy white silver & toned coins back to say early 20th century stuff. Prior to that, white coins just don’t look right to me. There are exceptions, but the look of a coin has to be plausibly “correct” for me to like it.

As with many things, acquired tastes change as you gain experience.

RegistryCoin

I’ve always looked for the high quality rim-toned examples that show off beautiful color while allowing for the appreciation of mark-free surfaces with the naked eye.

Bochiman

Ask @ricko

ricko

I have not reached that point yet... and I have been collecting coins since I was eight years old. I am reasonably certain, at this point, that I will not, suddenly, look at tarnished coins as desirable. That being said, those old coins that have been in commerce, with honest wear, are acceptable. This is a hobby, to each his own. I spent a couple of years studying tarnish, and the many ways it is induced. I will never pay a premium for tarnish... natural or not - and 'not' is highly common on the market today. Cheers, RickO

TwoSides2aCoin

Time has a way of changing just about everything, but man’s mind. He, unfortunately, can rarely leave “as is” as it was.

giorgio11

@lkeigwin said:
Which do you prefer between these two similarly graded capped bust halves?

I am really okay with a nicely cleaned, not overly-dipped, lustrous coin. But given the choice between a handsomely toned one and an acceptable dipped one I choose the former. It is a taste many but not all share.
Lance.

Oh, @ricko ?

I like the toned one. But not all toning is pretty to me.

Kind regards,

George

CommemDude

Even as a young collector at the age of eight I considered toning to impart "personality" and beauty to a coin and found white coins very boring. But my local coin store had cases of dipped white Morgans so maybe that's why I found color so appealing.

ricko

The acceptable dipped is a nice coin..... Cheers, RickO

oih82w8

Peoples food taste changes every so many years, I would suppose this would be the same for just about anything, coins included. I do not recall when, but tone does play a major factor in my collecting taste...these days.

BillJones

I've been a serious collector since the mid 1960s. When I was kid, I liked bright and shiny silver. So did most collectors. That resulted in a lot of dipping and cleaning. It was almost impossible to find a Bust Dollar that was toned. I once owned one that was in VF-35 or EF-40 that was white. I sold it for more than double what I paid after owning it for 5 or 6 years.

Many of the articles in magazines warned collectors not to buy toned coins because toning hid circulation marks. Those writers warned you that you needed to know how to grade if you were going to take a chance on a toned coin.

I think things might have turned around in the early 1980s. That when I saw more toned coins on the market.

BIGAL2749

Early on (1970's-early 80's), I had a 95% failure rate in trying to improve a coin by dipping it.

Didn't take long to appreciate the original coins and if a coin needed to be dipped to resolve a problem I simply didn't buy it.

Couldn't pass on toners such as these.

Old dip container was only for the wife's jewelry.

In recent submissions to the grading services I probably should have dipped the 79-S thru 82-S Morgans that may have had the slightest amount of hazing or dull areas

mr1931S

I've always loved attractively toned silver, copper, and nickel.

Right. I'll say it almost again. Most of us old-timers have always loved naturally,and attractively toned silver,copper,and nickel.

Natural toning doesn't look anything like the cooked-up Frankenstein monsters one sees offerered by unscrupulous coin dealers. The individual color collector should do themselves a favor,and coin collectors in general, a favor. Buy some brightly-colored flowers for yourself and pass on perpetuating fraud in the coin industry by buying AT coins.

dpoole

Good observation, @BillJones . It's a thrill to find old original silver with honest toning.

jesbroken

I like them both, but #1 would be my choice. Love all of your bust halves that I have seen.
Jim

Catbert

I used to drink bourbon with ginger ale, but now I like it just on the rocks.

Blast white coins do nothing for me and most often, depending upon their age, look artificial. Toning can enhance a coin's character and, as with bourbon, I've learned to appreciate these distinctions in my adult years (no offense implied or intended to the ricko type collectors out there).

Walkerfan

I always liked blast white coins, when I was younger. When I started lurking the boards here and ATS around 2005; I noticed many of the long time veterans had originally toned coins in their sets. I reached out to a few of them via p.m. a few years later and they educated and mentored me. Now, although I still appreciate a blast white coin; I have a taste for some color and toning as well. My collection is a mixture of both. However, regardless of the degree of toning on a piece the coin must have good luster for me to want it in my collection. That is something that will likely not change whether it is white or richly toned.

TonerGuy

As soon I started "re-collecting" 20 years ago I migrated to toners...

First I looked at Morgans and saw many beautiful toned examples but I didnt like how common and easy they were to find. For me the hunt is everything... For personal reasons I took a liking to Peace $. And then I started asking dealers for toned Peace $ - they all laughed and told me not to waste my time so I kept looking and hunting. I actually found a good amount of toned Peace $ and dealers were happy to sell them with little to no mark up since they were not as pretty as the Morgans. And I found a lot of amazing coins in aftermarket display holders... so I bought them and submitted them myself.

Its taken years but I have quite the collection of toned Peace $. I doubt I could afford to put together my collection again based on today's premiums on these coins... If I had collected shiny untoned examples I probably would have lost money.

Kkathyl

For me it was first attraction to each unique look that natural toning creates. When it comes to silver say issued over the past 5 years, I am looking to the design aspect but also adding it to a series. White Silver is White Silver. When I buy Type set coins and see wonderful toning that is very attractive, I look for the natural toning of course, but the uniqueness as well. I picked up a Peace dollar another Forum member thought was ugly in its toning and basically dumped it. I have grown very found of the coin and am convinced it will Grade Mid 60's MS. It just grew on me over time.

Toned coins is like women all beautiful but not all eyes can see.

thevolcanogod

I’ve mostly been collecting moderns so much of the natural toning I see has been ugly yellows, browns or haze. My first experience with enjoyable toning was when I hit the Franklin years (moving backwards in time). Now there’s cool mint set and album toning. That’s where I started gaining an appreciation. I’m still a fan of blast white depending on the year and series. But I also love album toning if it’s not terminal and mint set if it doesn’t look like someone dumped mud on the coin. I actually greatly dislike the look of a dipped low-grade AU or below. Looks terrible to me.

Paradisefound

@BryceM said:
I like both flashy white silver & toned coins back to say early 20th century stuff. Prior to that, white coins just don’t look right to me. There are exceptions, but the look of a coin has to be plausibly “correct” for me to like it.

As with many things, acquired tastes change as you gain experience.

How do you gauge between what is best > good > bad ? Is it base on individual standard as far as beauty is concern?

SanctionII

I like both toned and untoned coins, both circulated and MS/PF.

Each has its appeal and its distractions. Natural toned coins can be a joy to behold. Cooked up coins with AT colors can also be attractive, but the blatant examples (i.e heated in a frying pan in cooking oil) are a turnoff.

My favorite toning is perimeter rim toning that progresses from the rim towards the center of the coin, with multiple colors in the toning, with the coin being a Cameo proof, with the rainbow rim toning framing the frosted devices.

My favorite untoned coins are ones with minimal marks or other flaws that have booming luster.

Most of the above are MS/PF coins.

For circulated coins, I like coins that have an even, clean wear, with minimal marks or other flaws, with darker toning on the fields and lighter color on the devices (a "circ cam").

Zoins

I took me until I saw this coin now owned by @AuroraBorealis. At the time, it was owned by @Newmismatist and posted with the following photos by @poorguy.

I did not know about rainbow toners at the time and was amazed by the coins I saw from the Battle Creek collection. Back then, there was a great Battle Creek reference website and the Toned Coin Collector Society (TCCS) was a great club. Both would be wonderful to have again.

mannie gray

I have been fond of toned copper for as long as I can recall.
I prefer toned coins over untoned ones generally.
But there are always exceptions and I take it on a coin to coin basis.

mannie gray

@giorgio11 said:

@lkeigwin said:
Which do you prefer between these two similarly graded capped bust halves?

I am really okay with a nicely cleaned, not overly-dipped, lustrous coin. But given the choice between a handsomely toned one and an acceptable dipped one I choose the former. It is a taste many but not all share.
Lance.

Oh, @ricko ?

I like the toned one. But not all toning is pretty to me.

Kind regards,

George

Although in most cases I prefer toned coins, comparing these two coins I prefer the 2nd coin. The first coin looks to me dipped and then album retoned, while the second, although likely cleaned at some point, looks actually more "original" to me.
Just my 2c.

Rollerman

@ricko said:
I have not reached that point yet... and I have been collecting coins since I was eight years old. I am reasonably certain, at this point, that I will not, suddenly, look at tarnished coins as desirable. That being said, those old coins that have been in commerce, with honest wear, are acceptable. This is a hobby, to each his own. I spent a couple of years studying tarnish, and the many ways it is induced. I will never pay a premium for tarnish... natural or not - and 'not' is highly common on the market today. Cheers, RickO

While I like toned Morgans, I kind of share ricko's point. When I was active in the mid to late 70's into the mid 80's, I really don't remember seeing a toned Morgan, at least not rainbow toned. I was working with a dealer who had a national reputation for silver dollars at the time. I presume there was "a whole latta dippin' going on".
Pete (who has some 50+ toned Morgans)

Paradisefound

@giorgio11 said:

@lkeigwin said:
Which do you prefer between these two similarly graded capped bust halves?

I am really okay with a nicely cleaned, not overly-dipped, lustrous coin. But given the choice between a handsomely toned one and an acceptable dipped one I choose the former. It is a taste many but not all share.
Lance.

Oh, @ricko ?

I like the toned one. But not all toning is pretty to me.

Kind regards,

George

I have way to go to learn about the dipping / naturally toned etc and to determine which is which. So much learnt already of the very thread. Thank you

Twobitcollector

I'm not good with colors, but I did buy this one.

Bullsitter

BryceM

@Paradisefound said:

@BryceM said:
I like both flashy white silver & toned coins back to say early 20th century stuff. Prior to that, white coins just don’t look right to me. There are exceptions, but the look of a coin has to be plausibly “correct” for me to like it.

As with many things, acquired tastes change as you gain experience.

How do you gauge between what is best > good > bad ? Is it base on individual standard as far as beauty is concern?

This is actually a pretty tough question to answer. Best is easy. When I see it I say "Wow!" and I start figuring out what I've got to do to acquire it. Bad is also easy. Anything terribly common, dull, boring, artificially colored, hairlined, or overgraded just turns me off. Good is harder. You're right - much of it is just personal taste. Once you become familiar with certain "looks" it makes more sense. 58-D coins acquire a certain toning from the way the mint packaged the sets. Whitman folders often imparted a certain look to coins. Etc. etc. Often, a coin just has to look right. Layers of character and patina suggest a coin that has aged well. White without luster really turns me off.

oldabeintx

As a collector for 60+ years, I can tell you that at least some older collectors have always appreciated attractively toned coins, even those that were not so attractive with original skin. I will also say that I'm not a fan of wildly toned modern coins, which may be more on point to the OP. I have a few silver coins that are 70+ years old (Mercs, Walkers, SLQs) taken from original rolls, by me, that remain virtually white as made. Reason being that they were stored properly. Makes me skeptical about some of what I've seen on recent issues. I grant they are pretty, but not my cup of tea.

AstroJoe

Collecting for 45 years. I avoid toned silver coins. Personally don't like the eye appeal. And definitely would never consider paying a premium for them, actually feel value should be on low end or below for the grade.

Paradisefound

@AstroJoe said:
Collecting for 45 years. I avoid toned silver coins. Personally don't like the eye appeal. And definitely would never consider paying a premium for them, actually feel value should be on low end or below for the grade.

I am trying to learn what the good dipping means; it is easier for my eye to spot a true gem than finding the right toned coin.

Paradisefound

Guess what I decided to get myself for 5th Christmas present (still feeling unsure about toned)

Type2

@lkeigwin said:
Which do you prefer between these two similarly graded capped bust halves?

I am really okay with a nicely cleaned, not overly-dipped, lustrous coin. But given the choice between a handsomely toned one and an acceptable dipped one I choose the former. It is a taste many but not all share.
Lance.

I'll take the bottom one. But like both.

keets

I walked away from the Hobby around 1975 when I enlisted, held onto my collection and moved it with me until around 1988. at that time I discovered that a co-worker also collected and we went to a few shows together. he left to work on the Hubble Telescope project and the collection got hidden away until around 1999. at that time I got a PC, found eBay and the forum and things really changed.

I saw a lot of things for the first time, most prominently toned coins and Deep Cameo Proofs. I was hooked!!!

ldhair

I'm good with both over time, I'm going more with pretty toning.

TonerGuy

@Paradisefound said:
Guess what I decided to get myself for 5th Christmas present (still feeling unsure about toned)

Even untoned shiny coins can be doctored... I call it dipping. Some will say that dipping isnt doctoring. I disagree. I think anything done to change the surface of a coin to improve its esthetics is doctoring - like artificial rainbow toning it is meant to increase value to the seller.

So there's a chance that shiny old coins might be just as doctored as that rainbow toned coin you are unsure about. The only difference is that there are far more people who can buy dipping solution and dip coins then there are those that can expertly rainbow tone a coin. So its more likely that you will buy a doctored dipped coin than a doctored rainbow toned coin.

If you want to collect original skin coins - those are hard to find and your collection might not be as pretty as you would like. But just because you only collect shiny silvery coins doesnt mean you arent collecting doctored coins...

Hydrant

@Catbert said:
I used to drink bourbon with ginger ale, but now I like it just on the rocks.

Oh...yea..!!

koynekwest

Doubled dies and other varieties used to be a passion of mine but these days my "thing" is rainbow toned stuff like these-

Elcontador

Have been collecting off and on since the 1960s. It depends on what you like, what you know, and what / whom you can use for reference re whether the toning on a coin is legit. A good chemist can create all sorts of colors, and some of the best of them can get coins past the TPGs.
That said, legitimately attractive toned coins are more common on some coins than others. Ie., the 38 D Nickel in supergrades often has attractive toning (I own one of them, and even in the 1960s, saw a number of them which were attractively toned. You will rarely find an attractively toned Standing Liberty Quarter or Liberty Nickel. Ditto re Barber Halves. But finding an attractively toned Capped Bust Half or Morgan Dollar is not difficult.
You have to ask yourself, as Bryce wrote, if in addition to being attractive to your eye, whether a coin looks right to you. Ie., a blast white Capped Bust Half that looks like a newly minted Roosevelt Dime doesn't work for me. Neither does a RD Large Cent which looks like a 1950s vintage RD Lincoln Cent.
If you've satisfied yourself that you like an attractively toned coin, you have to ask yourself is it worth the premium that is being asked for it? If you like the color, so does someone else. I was able to pick up my attractive, rainbow toned Liberty Nickel for no premium fifteen years ago. That rarely happens. Personally, I would never pay multiples of what a white coin of the same grade would cost for its toned cousin.