450 million for a DaVinci Painting........
OldIndianNutKase
Posts: 2,717 ✭✭✭✭✭
Apparently in the art business, some doctoring of an original is of no issue. Provenance is everything? Numismatics and art seem to be governed by vastly different rules........ I wonder how the art market has gone so far without "TPG grading".
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Cool !!!
If I paid that much for a painting I’d need to see him paint it personally.
Interesting story about how it was attributed to an understudy and partially painted over, then “Restored” to its original glory...
Silly money for a not so authentic painting real or not.
Did Legend buy it? Would it CAC?
Would not CAC. It’s been cleaned.
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It's an awesome painting, but I'd rather have "Portrait of Adele Bloch-Bauer I" if I had to pick one to hang on the wall.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_paintings
It would take you that many years to get the loot together.
Crap. I was the underbidder.
Lance.
I passed because the buyers commision was 12.5%. I'f it was only 10% it would be hanging on my wall.
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
$450M here, $450M there....and pretty soon you’re talking real money.
How many silver eagles could I get for 450.3 million?????
Where would I store all of them?????
Just be glad that someone isn't out there dropping $450M on coins... within a year they'd be in first place in everyone's registry set categories... you know, those sets you've been working on for years. Oh, wait. Nevermind.
It’s time for some museums to deaccession more national treasures, for all the obvious reasons.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Funny!
Assuming you're buying monster boxes (500 coins) from Apmex at today's price of $9,785 per box ($19.57/coin) you could get 23,009,708 American Silver Eagles. That would leave you with $14 leftover; enough to buy yourself lunch after moving them all into storage.
That's over 46,000 monster boxes. You'll work up quite an appetite!
Interesting fact: For every 4.345 cents change in the price of 1 ounce of silver, you would either gain or lose $1,000,000 in value.
the rarest coins are cheap!
I have a Modigliani that I picked up at the Smithsonian about 35 years ago. Now where did I put it!!!
It soulds like it went cheap. The news report I saw said that it was expected to bring $100 million. The news said that there are just 15 DaVinci paintings known.
This is also the only DaVinci in private hands! I can easily see the painting selling for what it sold for!
$450M is cheap compared to a $100M presale estimate???
bad buy---only older collectors are in the Old World Masters art market. The younger people are playing video games, etc. Art market will be gone in a few years
Amwld beat me to it, it's not a Da Vinci, it's THE Da Vinci still in private hands...now we wait to see if it still is.
What is the annual insurance premium if you keep it at your house?
This is a market for the world's billionaires, and the product is a major status symbol. No doubt, given that the world continues on the current path for a while, the investment can at least be recouped and the next billionaire will display it at cocktail parties for a few years.
Cheers, RickO
Don't forget to budget for some full time staff!
15 years ago last August,
many of us were in that
same room, watching the
'33 Double Eagle sell.
The primary reason is: The "old farts" have the money and most of the "whipper snappers" do not. Review the list & you'll find a few "young-ums." Big money (old age or young age) is not interested in coins, stamps nor "baseball cards," they want paintings, statues, vacation heavens etc, which btw, have done very well over the centuries.
The $100 million was a guarantee someone put on it
It would clash with my decor style.................I let it go
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
The article says that DiVinci painted this piece circa 1500. Here is as close as I am going to get to it, a couple of groats from British King Henry VII who ruled from 1485 to 1509.
Here is a medieval style groat of Henry VII
And here is a Renaissance style groat of Henry VII.
I understand that this piece was once in Charles I's collection. Charles lost his head in the English Revolution so that is probably why the piece fell out of his hands. Here is a Charles the I gold piece.
Must go check my attic, dust off the spider webs, who knows what I will find???
anyone have an educated guess?
there are some older framed images of something in a box ever since i bought this house 15 years ago.! seriously.., no joke or pan. I always wanted to do a cleaning job there. problem is I have to get a working coverall first which has a zippered hat.
will let you know next few days what I found...
From $10,000 to $450 million... first found at an estate sale after being sold in 1900 in for $59...
Who's kicking themselves now over selling it for $10,000?
http://www.newsweek.com/leonardo-da-vinci-art-most-expensive-christies-713119
At current spot + $2 of $19.06 that would be 23,625,393 coins or 47,251 monster boxes. Roughly 6 months production for the mint. The mint might store them for you. It would take around 28 [give or take] semi trucks to deliver them to your door.
Half a million. Lol
One of the anecdotes I read today was that the Christie's marketing on this piece was brilliant. Apparently they even used a third party marketing first for the first time and some are crediting the results to the way the piece was, well... marketed outside the usual art world. Lessons for the coin industry here.
Whitman Brands: President/CEO (www.greysheet.com; www.whitman.com)
PNG: Executive Director (www.pngdealers.org)
ALL OF THEM!
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Really interesting "trail" with this piece. First, it took 6 years to properly restore. As I understand it there was a consortium of art dealers who purchased the painting for 80M and "flipped' it the owner for 125+M. This resulted in lawsuits where the buyer was suing the sellers for "excessive markup", among other things. The owner put it in auction where the auction company guaranteed the seller $100M regardless of the bidding action. If it had gone for 50M, the auction company would be down a quick 50M. I wonder what will happen with the lawsuits after selling for 450M? The sellers will probably countersue that they sold it way too cheap and are entitled to more money!
The guarantors receive a share of the profit, too, since it sailed past their $100M guarantee.
There are some creative ways to get rich in our country.
--Severian the Lame
,> @Kyle said:
I better get a crew in here and start re-enforcing the floor before I take delivery
Revised to say the estimate I heard was $100 million and it sold for over $400 million. But what's an extra ""0" got to do with anything? Just think. I could have bid the $100 million estimate and been perfectly safe!
APMEX could sell them at $0.01 over cost, pay shipping and still have a decent payday.
My suspicion is that the Vatican swiped it.
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How would you even transport something like this?
For only $104M one could have purchased this:
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2010/02/giacometti_walking_man_sculptu.html
Just boggles the mind. If I had it and couldn't sell it it would go for recycling. Just unreal.
I wonder how many artists are working on the 16th.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
The Giacometti doesn't make sense at $100 million unless you know about Giacometti and his work, and about the art market in general. The DaVinci doesn't make sense at 450 unless you know about DaVinci and his work, and about the art market in general. Think about how much you would have to know about coins before a 100K price on some rarity would make sense.
In other words, the more you know, the more insanity makes sense.
Or in other other words, our dogs are right. We're all crazy.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Yeah, a bunch of coin collectors criticizing just about -anyone- paying a lot of money at auction for something subjectively beautiful, historical, and interesting, will have trouble avoiding the appearance of irony, if not hipocracy.
It's a remarkable work of art.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
LoL, that said, I think the Rothko is ridiculous, a kid can paint better
and the Twombly... a monkey can paint better!
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Jesus with a crystal ball? Now that's rich. Hopefully, the buyer will toss it in a burn pile.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
If a painting can go for $450M I wonder what needs to happen so coins up further, say up to even $50M.
As the OP, I was less impressed by the astronomical price realized by the daVinci, but more by the degree of restoration on this painting. Perhaps PCGS would have graded this painting "Genuine-Questionable Authentication" . There is very little concern in the art world if a painting is not totally original, but in numismatics orginality is everything. And art sells for many multiples of coins and the orginalityof the surface is questionable.
In our hobby, many coins that have spectacular toning are graded very low by TPG's while coins with very unattractive toning are highly graded........ If coins were graded as art, perhaps value might also increase.
OINK
Ouch! I wonder if the buyer is getting nervous?!
http://www.dailywire.com/news/23647/it-fake-da-vinci-painting-fetched-450-million-joseph-curl?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_content=062316-news&utm_campaign=benshapiro