I am new to collecting Dan Carr's master pieces but not new to the game of investing. I could think of no greater return on investment than a limited mintage gold octagonal piece in MS70 so I pulled the trigger. Very happy with my purchase.
@burlguy said:
I am new to collecting Dan Carr's master pieces but not new to the game of investing. I could think of no greater return on investment than a limited mintage gold octagonal piece in MS70 so I pulled the trigger. Very happy with my purchase.
@renman95 said:
Welcome burlguy. Awesome first post.
Between you and me, we own 28% of the market ....
for this year. ;-)
Nice.... I see you have a variation with rounded edges. Would you like me to adopt it? Let me know what you need for it.
Interesting. Your 'slug' looks like it has a wire edge. Mine looks like it was rounded, as you say. Geez, I hope the weight is true. I wonder if DC knows how many of each he made?
@renman95 said:
Welcome burlguy. Awesome first post.
Between you and me, we own 28% of the market ....
for this year. ;-)
Nice.... I see you have a variation with rounded edges. Would you like me to adopt it? Let me know what you need for it.
Interesting. Your 'slug' looks like it has a wire edge. Mine looks like it was rounded, as you say. Geez, I hope the weight is true. I wonder if DC knows how many of each he made?
The "rounded edges" are due to slightly less striking force than the "wire edge". Both are fully struck in the centers and out to the rim. Striking pure gold is tricky. Just a little bit more striking force and all of the sudden you have a high "finned" wire edge (which I try to avoid).
Anyway, I think the rounded edge was struck first and then the wire edge a little later. I don't know the totals, but probably 3 or 4 of each (7 total).
@renman95 said:
Welcome burlguy. Awesome first post.
Between you and me, we own 28% of the market ....
for this year. ;-)
Nice.... I see you have a variation with rounded edges. Would you like me to adopt it? Let me know what you need for it.
Interesting. Your 'slug' looks like it has a wire edge. Mine looks like it was rounded, as you say. Geez, I hope the weight is true. I wonder if DC knows how many of each he made?
The "rounded edges" are due to slightly less striking force than the "wire edge". Both are fully struck in the centers and out to the rim. Striking pure gold is tricky. Just a little bit more striking force and all of the sudden you have a high "finned" wire edge (which I try to avoid).
Anyway, I think the rounded edge was struck first and then the wire edge a little later. I don't know the totals, but probably 3 or 4 of each (7 total).
Very happy with my wire edge variety.... Any chance we could see you do a strike of the $100 union?
I have the 2005 Smithsonian issue 5oz with the "$100 Dollars" reverse. Which they promptly removed from any future strikes. Something having to do with it being a mint pattern?
I wish the back of the 5oz round had a more creative approach than the styling they used.
They got the front of the round correct minus the volcanoes erupting. They dropped the ball with the back of the coin. If they had just used the next page in Morgans sketch book they would have seen the flying eagle he drew in for the reverse. It was framed in by the round outline of the Obverse that had printed onto the next page from rubbing.....
Very happy with my wire edge variety.... Any chance we could see you do a strike of the $100 union?
I have the 2005 Smithsonian issue 5oz with the "$100 Dollars" reverse. Which they promptly removed from any future strikes. Something having to do with it being a mint pattern?
I wish the back of the 5oz round had a more creative approach than the styling they used.
They got the front of the round correct minus the volcanoes erupting. They dropped the ball with the back of the coin. If they had just used the next page in Morgans sketch book they would have seen the flying eagle he drew in for the reverse. It was framed in by the round outline of the Obverse that had printed onto the next page from rubbing.....
Was the reverse for the Smithsonian $100 Union coin completely made up for that issue (I think it was) ?
Can you post a picture of Morgan's reverse sketch ?
Very happy with my wire edge variety.... Any chance we could see you do a strike of the $100 union?
I have the 2005 Smithsonian issue 5oz with the "$100 Dollars" reverse. Which they promptly removed from any future strikes. Something having to do with it being a mint pattern?
I wish the back of the 5oz round had a more creative approach than the styling they used.
They got the front of the round correct minus the volcanoes erupting. They dropped the ball with the back of the coin. If they had just used the next page in Morgans sketch book they would have seen the flying eagle he drew in for the reverse. It was framed in by the round outline of the Obverse that had printed onto the next page from rubbing.....
Was the reverse for the Smithsonian $100 Union coin completely made up for that issue (I think it was) ?
Can you post a picture of Morgan's reverse sketch ?
Here is the front of the $100 union and the reverse. It looks like Morgan was choosing a design very similar to the Morgan Dollar but with a more majestic eagle. The Smithsonian used a design that is very similar to one that he had planned for the trade dollar.
A couple pages later in the sketch book Morgan tried and succeeded in refining his Eagle wing and Talon.
Here is a couple of pages of his sketch book showing him working through his design process. It looks as if he was still contemplating how the back should look in the later pages of his sketch book.
I wonder how much the Smithsonian was behind the first issue vs. The New York Mint. The N.Y. Mint was mentioned in all the early ads as the producer of these.
Wow - is this something recently exposed? The eagle still can be turkey-like but still very cool!!
Refs: MCM,Fivecents,Julio,Robman,Endzone,Coiny,Agentjim007,Musky1011,holeinone1972,Tdec1000,Type2,bumanchu, Metalsman,Wondercoin,Pitboss,Tomohawk,carew4me,segoja,thebigeng,jlc_coin,mbogoman,sportsmod,dragon,tychojoe,Schmitz7,claychaser, Bullsitter, robeck, Nickpatton, jwitten, and many OTHERS
@Zoins said:
I wonder how much the Smithsonian was behind the first issue vs. The New York Mint. The N.Y. Mint was mentioned in all the early ads as the producer of these.
Modern Coin Mart bought out the New York Mint but the articles for the strike are still on their website. The Smithsonian may have allowed high detail scans of the sketch book but they obviously did not strike the $100 union.
@Akbeez said:
Wow - is this something recently exposed? The eagle still can be turkey-like but still very cool!!
The sketch book and the $100 Union design was lost to time but rediscovered in early 2000-2005, I have read 2003 somewhere. Certainly earlier than the Govmint articles state as mine was graded by NGC in 2005 and adds from 2005 mention the sketch book being found.
I saw the design and the 5 ounces of gold in a proposed currency and had to have one..... If you find a 5 ounce gold $100 union, make sure you get the 2005 issue as they only made 300 of them. It is also the only year the 5 ounce had the $100 Dollars on the back of the "coin". I got lucky and bought mine sight unseen just hoping I got the first year issue.
Its likely that the gold price run up caused many of them to be sent in to refiners, would not surprise me to hear that less than 100 remain. Just like the Monaco Humbert Commemorative, 1000 struck in 2005 but 40 sent back to Monaco to be smelted and countless melted as bullion.
Govmint has contacted me about buying my $100 Union and is very interested in removing it from market. I dont know why the enthusiastic interest from them? Perhaps a government agency demanded removal?
Obviously a Dan Carr strike would be more limited and have his artistic touches added to the reverse and would be true to form on the obverse. The New York Mint didnt even put the paddle wheel in place correctly.
Now I need to start saving again.... Mr Carr, please dont strike one for at least a couple of months, my piggy bank is low.
As a biologist, the eagle looks to be wretching (ie getting ready to barf a scat), and Liberty worn-out tired. The execution would not leave French or Italian designers breathless...
Love that Milled British (1830-1960) Well, just Love coins, period.
@7Jaguars said:
As a biologist, the eagle looks to be wretching (ie getting ready to barf a scat), and Liberty worn-out tired. The execution would not leave French or Italian designers breathless...
LOL.....so I take it you wont be purchasing one.....
The eagle, appears to be drying its wings and warming itself, a "biologist" should recognize this. Perhaps you are critiquing the sketch book and the trade dollar variations?
As a collector I can see the appeal to things that may not be appealing to your eye. It looks like the $100 Union design has once again caused much interest.
How about we get the thread back on track
Mr, Carr if you would like any other pictures of the inside of the sketch book I will send them in private message.
The 2018 and 2019 Gold Baby Owls are both sold out, final mintage of 19 each which is very low compared to the '16 and '17 pieces. The 2018 and 2019 pieces have the Second Liberty Head design which is new to the series.
I have in mind a 50mm 5-troy-oz 999 gold "Union" that I could do.
But it doesn't involve any of the Morgan designs shown in this thread.
I'm first going to do a 50mm 3-troy-oz 999 silver version.
If that works out, then I will consider the Union.
@Bullsitter said:
The 2018 and 2019 Gold Baby Owls are both sold out, final mintage of 19 each which is very low compared to the '16 and '17 pieces. The 2018 and 2019 pieces have the Second Liberty Head design which is new to the series.
DARN!!!!! I was going to get those same 2 gold owls but I just put if off. I had no idea the mintage was so low on them or I would have pulled the trigger.
5 oz gold Union...whoa...that's high roller material. Silver or brass for us common folk?
So what would be used for a 5 oz gold blank?
Refs: MCM,Fivecents,Julio,Robman,Endzone,Coiny,Agentjim007,Musky1011,holeinone1972,Tdec1000,Type2,bumanchu, Metalsman,Wondercoin,Pitboss,Tomohawk,carew4me,segoja,thebigeng,jlc_coin,mbogoman,sportsmod,dragon,tychojoe,Schmitz7,claychaser, Bullsitter, robeck, Nickpatton, jwitten, and many OTHERS
@dcarr said:
I have in mind a 50mm 5-troy-oz 999 gold "Union" that I could do.
But it doesn't involve any of the Morgan designs shown in this thread.
I'm first going to do a 50mm 3-troy-oz 999 silver version.
If that works out, then I will consider the Union.
@dcarr said:
I have in mind a 50mm 5-troy-oz 999 gold "Union" that I could do.
But it doesn't involve any of the Morgan designs shown in this thread.
I'm first going to do a 50mm 3-troy-oz 999 silver version.
If that works out, then I will consider the Union.
@Akbeez said:
5 oz gold Union...whoa...that's high roller material. Silver or brass for us common folk?
So what would be used for a 5 oz gold blank?
Since gold is denser than silver, a 50mm 3-troy-oz silver piece would be approximately the same thickness as a 50mm 5-troy-oz gold piece. So I could potentially use the same die pair for both (and then mark the edge with the metallic content). I will definitely make the silver version. So there will be a chance to buy that one.
I make my own 50mm 3-troy-oz silver blanks. My first (and so far only) use of those was the 2018 Knights of the Coin Table medals. I have not made any 50mm gold blanks, but the mechanics would be the same as the silver.
@Akbeez said:
5 oz gold Union...whoa...that's high roller material. Silver or brass for us common folk?
So what would be used for a 5 oz gold blank?
Since gold is denser than silver, a 50mm 3-troy-oz silver piece would be approximately the same thickness as a 50mm 5-troy-oz gold piece. So I could potentially use the same die pair for both (and then mark the edge with the metallic content). I will definitely make the silver version. So there will be a chance to buy that one.
I make my own 50mm 3-troy-oz silver blanks. My first (and so far only) use of those was the 2018 Knights of the Coin Table medals. I have not made any 50mm gold blanks, but the mechanics would be the same as the silver.
I must say those 2018 Knights of the Coin Table medals are impressive
.
@Akbeez said:
5 oz gold Union...whoa...that's high roller material. Silver or brass for us common folk?
So what would be used for a 5 oz gold blank?
I make my own 50mm 3-troy-oz silver blanks. My first (and so far only) use of those was the 2018 Knights of the Coin Table medals. I have not made any 50mm gold blanks, but the mechanics would be the same as the silver.
YEAH BABY! Those 3 oz KOTCTs are the bomb! Hope to see more this year...
Refs: MCM,Fivecents,Julio,Robman,Endzone,Coiny,Agentjim007,Musky1011,holeinone1972,Tdec1000,Type2,bumanchu, Metalsman,Wondercoin,Pitboss,Tomohawk,carew4me,segoja,thebigeng,jlc_coin,mbogoman,sportsmod,dragon,tychojoe,Schmitz7,claychaser, Bullsitter, robeck, Nickpatton, jwitten, and many OTHERS
A private message from a poster here theorized what I might have in mind for the design of the 50mm "Union".
They were basically correct. So I will unveil the intended design here for the first time (next post).
When I did the initial Saint Gaudens Winged Liberty sculpt, I took all possible elements from one of the original coins and added the shield and wings from the Saint Gaudens original rough sketch. While doing this, I attempted to keep the original sculpted elements from the coin as intact as possible. I liked the result. But the extra-long flowing hair and the sun rays seen on the original coins was meant to fill up the vast spaces on either side of Liberty's body. With the wings added, the long flowing hair and sun rays clashed somewhat with the rest of the design, in my opinion. I still liked it, but thought it could be better.
So my plan is to mint the Union using the sculpt illustrated next, in EXTRA HIGH relief with significantly dished fields.
I hope I can pull that off with 400 tons to work with. In 2017 I had a very difficult time getting full strikes on the 50mm Knights of the Coin Table medals. But those were 2-troy-oz 999 silver. Then for the 2018 medals I went with 3-troy-oz 50mm blanks (50% thicker) and that made a big difference.
I'll be pushing it with the relief I have in mind and 400 tons. We'll see what happens.
Comments
They became memorabilia loooong before your retirement ...... You are a STAR alright
Bravo
*courtesy of S&B
Finally, but worth the wait. Virtually no ghosting.
I like.
Third in the series. Nice detail in the hair.
Why not get a REAL coin?
I am new to collecting Dan Carr's master pieces but not new to the game of investing. I could think of no greater return on investment than a limited mintage gold octagonal piece in MS70 so I pulled the trigger. Very happy with my purchase.
A nice one to grab when you see it. Congrats.
Welcome burlguy. Awesome first post.
Between you and me, we own 28% of the market ....
for this year. ;-)
Heck of a first post! Welcome, and nice piece!
Nice.... I see you have a variation with rounded edges. Would you like me to adopt it? Let me know what you need for it.
Interesting. Your 'slug' looks like it has a wire edge. Mine looks like it was rounded, as you say. Geez, I hope the weight is true. I wonder if DC knows how many of each he made?
What can I say other than WELCOME @burlguy ..... although your slug is the focal point of my interest
Good pick up!
Oh LQQK! The OFR built a wall, no entry without proper ID. Sad for youse. ;-)
The "rounded edges" are due to slightly less striking force than the "wire edge". Both are fully struck in the centers and out to the rim. Striking pure gold is tricky. Just a little bit more striking force and all of the sudden you have a high "finned" wire edge (which I try to avoid).
Anyway, I think the rounded edge was struck first and then the wire edge a little later. I don't know the totals, but probably 3 or 4 of each (7 total).
The OFR .....IS....a wall.
Very happy with my wire edge variety.... Any chance we could see you do a strike of the $100 union?
I have the 2005 Smithsonian issue 5oz with the "$100 Dollars" reverse. Which they promptly removed from any future strikes. Something having to do with it being a mint pattern?
I wish the back of the 5oz round had a more creative approach than the styling they used.
They got the front of the round correct minus the volcanoes erupting. They dropped the ball with the back of the coin. If they had just used the next page in Morgans sketch book they would have seen the flying eagle he drew in for the reverse. It was framed in by the round outline of the Obverse that had printed onto the next page from rubbing.....
Was the reverse for the Smithsonian $100 Union coin completely made up for that issue (I think it was) ?
Can you post a picture of Morgan's reverse sketch ?
Here is the front of the $100 union and the reverse. It looks like Morgan was choosing a design very similar to the Morgan Dollar but with a more majestic eagle. The Smithsonian used a design that is very similar to one that he had planned for the trade dollar.
A couple pages later in the sketch book Morgan tried and succeeded in refining his Eagle wing and Talon.
Here is a couple of pages of his sketch book showing him working through his design process. It looks as if he was still contemplating how the back should look in the later pages of his sketch book.
I wonder how much the Smithsonian was behind the first issue vs. The New York Mint. The N.Y. Mint was mentioned in all the early ads as the producer of these.
Wow - is this something recently exposed? The eagle still can be turkey-like but still very cool!!
Modern Coin Mart bought out the New York Mint but the articles for the strike are still on their website. The Smithsonian may have allowed high detail scans of the sketch book but they obviously did not strike the $100 union.
The sketch book and the $100 Union design was lost to time but rediscovered in early 2000-2005, I have read 2003 somewhere. Certainly earlier than the Govmint articles state as mine was graded by NGC in 2005 and adds from 2005 mention the sketch book being found.
I saw the design and the 5 ounces of gold in a proposed currency and had to have one..... If you find a 5 ounce gold $100 union, make sure you get the 2005 issue as they only made 300 of them. It is also the only year the 5 ounce had the $100 Dollars on the back of the "coin". I got lucky and bought mine sight unseen just hoping I got the first year issue.
Its likely that the gold price run up caused many of them to be sent in to refiners, would not surprise me to hear that less than 100 remain. Just like the Monaco Humbert Commemorative, 1000 struck in 2005 but 40 sent back to Monaco to be smelted and countless melted as bullion.
Govmint has contacted me about buying my $100 Union and is very interested in removing it from market. I dont know why the enthusiastic interest from them? Perhaps a government agency demanded removal?
Obviously a Dan Carr strike would be more limited and have his artistic touches added to the reverse and would be true to form on the obverse. The New York Mint didnt even put the paddle wheel in place correctly.
Now I need to start saving again.... Mr Carr, please dont strike one for at least a couple of months, my piggy bank is low.
IMO that is a butt-ugly design on both the eagle and Ms. Liberty....
Well, just Love coins, period.
I love the Obverse. Its helpful to understand where Morgan came from, the intention of the design and the denomination.....
Its definitely not for everyone.
As a biologist, the eagle looks to be wretching (ie getting ready to barf a scat), and Liberty worn-out tired. The execution would not leave French or Italian designers breathless...
Well, just Love coins, period.
LOL.....so I take it you wont be purchasing one.....
The eagle, appears to be drying its wings and warming itself, a "biologist" should recognize this. Perhaps you are critiquing the sketch book and the trade dollar variations?
As a collector I can see the appeal to things that may not be appealing to your eye. It looks like the $100 Union design has once again caused much interest.
How about we get the thread back on track
Mr, Carr if you would like any other pictures of the inside of the sketch book I will send them in private message.
The 2018 and 2019 Gold Baby Owls are both sold out, final mintage of 19 each which is very low compared to the '16 and '17 pieces. The 2018 and 2019 pieces have the Second Liberty Head design which is new to the series.
I have in mind a 50mm 5-troy-oz 999 gold "Union" that I could do.
But it doesn't involve any of the Morgan designs shown in this thread.
I'm first going to do a 50mm 3-troy-oz 999 silver version.
If that works out, then I will consider the Union.
That sounds great Dan. I will be watching for it's debut. Thanks
DARN!!!!! I was going to get those same 2 gold owls but I just put if off. I had no idea the mintage was so low on them or I would have pulled the trigger.
I guess if you snooze you lose,
5 oz gold Union...whoa...that's high roller material. Silver or brass for us common folk?
So what would be used for a 5 oz gold blank?
Does either of the popular TPGs for Dan's pieces have a holder big enough for a 5oz gold?
I know PCGS does, but will they slab it?
I'm very interested......
You got me so excited Dan
look forward to it.
Since gold is denser than silver, a 50mm 3-troy-oz silver piece would be approximately the same thickness as a 50mm 5-troy-oz gold piece. So I could potentially use the same die pair for both (and then mark the edge with the metallic content). I will definitely make the silver version. So there will be a chance to buy that one.
I make my own 50mm 3-troy-oz silver blanks. My first (and so far only) use of those was the 2018 Knights of the Coin Table medals. I have not made any 50mm gold blanks, but the mechanics would be the same as the silver.
Gone to get some Lotto tickets...
I must say those 2018 Knights of the Coin Table medals are impressive
.
INYNWHWeTrust-TexasNationals,ajaan,blu62vette
coinJP, Outhaul ,illini420,MICHAELDIXON, Fade to Black,epcjimi1,19Lyds,SNMAN,JerseyJoe, bigjpst, DMWJR , lordmarcovan, Weiss,Mfriday4962,UtahCoin,Downtown1974,pitboss,RichieURich,Bullsitter,JDsCoins,toyz4geo,jshaulis, mustanggt, SNMAN, MWallace, ms71
@colonialcoin, I notice you LOL a lot of the responses in here. Why so much stalking in the Daniel Carr forum with no comments?? Comment away!
ANACS better start prepping smoe 50mm holders.
There's no 50mm holder according to an ANACS Rep at the Long Beach Show last Fall. But maybe that's changed.
Anyway, if enough people ask for a 50mm holder, maybe ANACS will step up.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
Where do we submit our request?
For that type of inquiry, I think email is best: CustomerService@ANACS.com
Or you could call or mail: http://www.anacs.com/contentPages/Contact.aspx
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
YEAH BABY! Those 3 oz KOTCTs are the bomb! Hope to see more this year...
A private message from a poster here theorized what I might have in mind for the design of the 50mm "Union".
They were basically correct. So I will unveil the intended design here for the first time (next post).
When I did the initial Saint Gaudens Winged Liberty sculpt, I took all possible elements from one of the original coins and added the shield and wings from the Saint Gaudens original rough sketch. While doing this, I attempted to keep the original sculpted elements from the coin as intact as possible. I liked the result. But the extra-long flowing hair and the sun rays seen on the original coins was meant to fill up the vast spaces on either side of Liberty's body. With the wings added, the long flowing hair and sun rays clashed somewhat with the rest of the design, in my opinion. I still liked it, but thought it could be better.
So my plan is to mint the Union using the sculpt illustrated next, in EXTRA HIGH relief with significantly dished fields.
I hope I can pull that off with 400 tons to work with. In 2017 I had a very difficult time getting full strikes on the 50mm Knights of the Coin Table medals. But those were 2-troy-oz 999 silver. Then for the 2018 medals I went with 3-troy-oz 50mm blanks (50% thicker) and that made a big difference.
I'll be pushing it with the relief I have in mind and 400 tons. We'll see what happens.
Unique look, I like the spread out stars.
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistry/publishedset.aspx?s=142753
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
Thanks. There are 50 of them.
Good to know. That's what I was hoping for and guessing.
Any possibility of using a Roman numeral date instead of "2019"?
Fantastic Dan. Can't wait.
Like the stars and Liberty's hair looks much better imo.
Dang, that's a great looking piece !!
MMXIX * LIBERTY