The great thing about keeping related posts within one thread is that you can easily browse what others said. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to look over all 200+ posts but I do know that I was confident Alex's suspension would be longer than Braun's and closer to the initial 210 games. I'm just as confident that Alex played his last game. I could be wrong but so far, eh, so good...
It not like I was screaming from the rafters and declaring Alex wouldn't be suspended for even one game, like fanboy.
Heh.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
I'm not mad, or sad. I knew he'd see a suspension, and am laughing at dolts like you who let your emotions get in the way of rational thought.
<< <i>The great thing about keeping related posts within one thread is that you can easily browse what others said. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to look over all 200+ posts but I do know that I was confident Alex's suspension would be longer than Braun's and closer to the initial 210 games. I'm just as confident that Alex played his last game. I could be wrong but so far, eh, so good... >>
You said you were 99.9999% sure. So far, so good? He's under contract until 2017. He'll be back on the field proving you wrong, once again, in 2015.
<< <i>It not like I was screaming from the rafters and declaring Alex wouldn't be suspended for even one game, like fanboy.
Heh.
>>
I find it funny that your team has one of the worst records in baseball history in regards to PED use (Caminiti, Clemens, Petite, etc.) but you've been the loudest detractor of Arod in this whole affair. Kettle much?
Alex won't serve a day of suspension really means knew he'd serve a suspension. DUH!
English is hard but what do you expect from a devoted tabloid trash reader.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
<< <i>Bosch feared for his life, CBS reporter Scott Pelley of "60 Minutes" says he was told, because associates of A-Rod threatened Bosch's life after failing to bribe him. So he turned to MLB for protection. >>
It will come on immediately and shown in its entirety after the SD/DEN game. As an added bonus, it's conveniently on the same channel (CBS 8:00 - 7:00 PM ET/CT).
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
Yes, let's take the testimony of a guy who was first targeted by MLB, which then paid him off for his 'testimony'. The guy's a fraud and MLB buying cash for his testimony proves this guy is completely unreliable as a witness.
And MLB is in the protection business now? LOL This guy really is a piece of work. No wonder stown is a fan of his.
"MLB's Manfred tells Pelley that he believes the threats Bosch says he received could be legitimate. "The concerns seemed credible, particularly given that he identified individuals that we had our own concerns about."
But Bosch once denied he ever gave anyone performance enhancing drugs. Manfred and MLB dropped a lawsuit against him and are now paying for security guards and have agreed to cover his legal fees in return for his cooperation. In Rodriguez's own lawsuit against MLB, he charges that this arrangement is essentially a $5 million bribe, which Manfred says is "absolutely untrue."
Pressed by Pelley that the security and legal fee arrangement is plenty of incentive for Bosch to lie, potentially undermining his credibility..."
<< <i>"MLB's Manfred tells Pelley that he believes the threats Bosch says he received could be legitimate. "The concerns seemed credible, particularly given that he identified individuals that we had our own concerns about."
But Bosch once denied he ever gave anyone performance enhancing drugs. Manfred and MLB dropped a lawsuit against him and are now paying for security guards and have agreed to cover his legal fees in return for his cooperation. In Rodriguez's own lawsuit against MLB, he charges that this arrangement is essentially a $5 million bribe, which Manfred says is "absolutely untrue."
Pressed by Pelley that the security and legal fee arrangement is plenty of incentive for Bosch to lie, potentially undermining his credibility..." >>
He lied like ALL THE PLAYERS did when they were first asked/suspected of steroid use. He, like the players, weren't going to confess until there was evidence, and then they were forced to confess. In the case of the players, their confessions were all basically admission of guilt by 'not knowing' what they were doing, or "one time mistakes," all BS of course, but that was their m/o.
When Arod himself admitted to using steroids, he claimed they were only for the three years in Texas. All BS of course, but he was trying to save his false legacy.
The truth is, Arod was a big time user, and we already knew he was/is a big time liar and the ultimate douche.
Why do you keep defending his use so strongly?
In the past, BEFORE Arod got caught, you were strongly against all the users, and calling them cheaters, etc... Just look at your quote when it was asked what was worse, Rose or Giambi and PED use:
<< <i>Rose's actions didn't directly affect the game like these cheaters. >>
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
<< <i> In the past, BEFORE Arod got caught, you were strongly against all the users, and calling them cheaters, etc... Just look at your quote when it was asked what was worse, Rose or Giambi and PED use:
<< <i>Rose's actions didn't directly affect the game like these cheaters. >>
>>
Because that was 10 years ago, and I realize now that they didn't affect the game, that since everyone was doing it, it was still a level (albeit elevated) playing field.
<< <i> In the past, BEFORE Arod got caught, you were strongly against all the users, and calling them cheaters, etc... Just look at your quote when it was asked what was worse, Rose or Giambi and PED use:
<< <i>Rose's actions didn't directly affect the game like these cheaters. >>
>>
Because that was 10 years ago, and I realize now that they didn't affect the game, that since everyone was doing it, it was still a level (albeit elevated) playing field. >>
I noticed that you did a complete 180 on your stance, and were entrenched on each end. Seems most guys who change their mind on that subject aren't as entrenched when they do evolve their opinion I just found it coincidental that your favorite player getting caught for roids, just happened to occur in-between your changing of opinion on the matter.
I have to ask, is Arod a liar on the subject of him doing PED's? Or, to phrase it differently, did he completely lie about doing PED's everytime he was asked prior to 2009?
<< <i> I noticed that you did a complete 180 on your stance, and were entrenched on each end. Seems most guys who change their mind on that subject aren't as entrenched when they do evolve their opinion I just found it coincidental that your favorite player getting caught for roids, just happened to occur in-between your changing of opinion on the matter. >>
Arod isn't my favorite player, far from it.
<< <i>I have to ask, is Arod a liar on the subject of him doing PED's? Or, to phrase it differently, did he completely lie about doing PED's everytime he was asked prior to 2009? >>
Who knows? The rumor and innuendo would seem to suggest he is, but wouldn't you, or any one of us, done the same exact thing? I read a great summation of PED use, and I ask it of any one who is critical of PED users:
If you could take a substance, that your work doesn't test for, that would increase your productivity a significant amount and that increase would enable to make vast sums of money, would you take it?
The short answer is yes, each and every one of us would, and why PED use was so widespread in baseball. There was no testing, and if you were careful with who you associated with, no one would ever find out.
Ax, come on. It isn't rumor or innuendo. The guy is a flat out liar...the video Stown just posted makes that pretty obvious.
Yes, I am sure I would deny it too if I were doing PED...but then i wouldn't expect people to make excuses for me, and THAT is the part I find funny and why I am calling you out on it with regard to Arod; you yourself changing your stance because he got caught, and you still not even being able to say that he is a liar(instead halfheartedly saying so). Just say it. The guy is a liar.
I had the chance to take PED, and I didn't. I was aware of possible side effects, and I never wanted that risk. I'm not sure how it would have played out financially, but I didn't want to go the way of Lyle Alzado either.
That isn't just for sports either. Steroids are also taken to look sharp and hot, and that is a benefit too. However, one can get 'hot enough' without them, and then just be a fun and confident man to get chicks anyway.
I was also always aware how much better it feels with unprotected sex...but I'd rather not get warts, so I passed that extra pleasure too
And before you ask, yes I eat like a King, and I party like one too. However, I also monitor my health status in regard to all of that, and as long as I am at the top of the health charts, I will continue to live my life full like that. The moment it looks like I am slipping on the chart, then I eat better and party less.
So, in a nutshell, my life is as full as can be, and I don't see how Alzado's was any more fun or fulfilling...just that he had a bigger bank account. He died, and I'm still ticking(knock on wood).
I wouldn't trade my life for his bank account, ever.
I had the chance to take PED, and I didn't. I was aware of possible side effects, and I never wanted that risk. I'm not sure how it would have played out financially, but I didn't want to go the way of Lyle Alzado either. >>
That's not what I was asking. I was asking if you could take a substance that your work didn't test for that could give you tens of millions of dollars and elevate you to levels of fame and fortune these players did. Any honest person would say yes to that.
<< <i>That isn't just for sports either. Steroids are also taken to look sharp and hot, and that is a benefit too. However, one can get 'hot enough' without them, and then just be a fun and confident man to get chicks anyway. >>
Completely off topic and has no bearing on the conversation.
<< <i>I was also always aware how much better it feels with unprotected sex...but I'd rather not get warts, so I passed that extra pleasure too >>
Again, off topic. Please stick to the conversation at hand.
<< <i>And before you ask, yes I eat like a King, and I party like one too. However, I also monitor my health status in regard to all of that, and as long as I am at the top of the health charts, I will continue to live my life full like that. The moment it looks like I am slipping on the chart, then I eat better and party less.
So, in a nutshell, my life is as full as can be, and I don't see how Alzado's was any more fun or fulfilling...just that he had a bigger bank account. He died, and I'm still ticking(knock on wood). >>
We all die, and Alzado was an outlier.
<< <i>I wouldn't trade my life for his bank account, ever. >>
It's easy to say that given that the option isn't there. But to sit there and suggest you wouldn't trade lives, and the security his wealth brings? That just reeks of insincerity.
Alex's council reminds me of the typical dbag defense attorney that relies on theatrics and technicalities instead of laying out facts.
<< <i>Joe Tacopina: Absolutely not. He didn't bribe anyone. There was no allegation that he bribed anyone. And the notion that Bosch is now coming on a television interview without the benefit of cross-examination or an oath is laughable. >>
You know what's really laughable? Demanding a TV interviewee be under oath and available for a cross-examination. Guess Judge Wapner and/or Judy were unavailable....
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
Your question of me taking PED's that would make me tens of millions of dollars? A)If I am already making sevens of millions of dollars, NO, I wouldn't take them. . If I know that there is a chance they can kill me, and I am already healthy, no, I wouldn't take them. My life is worth more than money can buy.
No, I wouldn't trade lives with Alzado. I have a great time already, am secure enough, and am surrounded by good people with mutual love and respect. To give that up for a chance for more money, with the tradeoff for the chance for an earlier death, or the chance for loss of credibility...NO, I wouldn't do it.
Maybe you would, but don't assume you know what I would or wouldn't do.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
Bud Selig absolutely created an environment where steroid use was not only encouraged but it was rewarded. He didn't personally inject these players but he might as well have.
<< <i>Bud Selig absolutely created an environment where steroid use was not only encouraged but it was rewarded. He didn't personally inject these players but he might as well have. >>
I've already defeated your notion in another thread, no need to rehash. Whatever scorn/blame is directed at Selig for "ruining the game," must also be directed at Arod, and more so, because Arod actually did it. But enough...you can read all that in the other thread.
However, I would be very hard pressed to find anyone that thinks Bud is a good commissioner!
That being said, I don't think the PED users or Bud ruined the game. They may have ruined their reputations, but not the game.
I'm just here to call the homers out on their typical ridiculous defense of their heroes, as is the case with your defense with Arod.
I've already shown the errors of your way in assuming what I(or anybody would do) too. You should probably recant that statement, and say, "this is what 1985fan would do."
After sitting out this coming season he is looking at turning 40 and I don't see him staying viable for long past that, especially sans steroids, particularly not for the stupid numbers his current contract provides. NYY should pay him off and cut him loose. He's going to be nothing but a liability and a bad PR machine for them. Not that I have any sympathy for the Yanks... he was already busted for juicing in Texas so it's not like they didn't know what they were getting into, yet they still decided to pay him unbelievably stupid money anyway. Can't blame him for taking it I guess.
Bud Selig needed PED users to mash home runs to bring fans back from the world series he and his fellow owners cancelled. Cal Ripken breaking the consecutive games streak wasn't a big enough deal, and after he broke it there was literally nothing happening to bring the casual fan back.
Enter McGwire and Sosa, 1998. The home run chase is well documented. What's not as well known is McGwire admitted to taking andro DURING the chase! Yet Selig and his fellow owners did nothing to step in, did nothing to raise doubt - they needed those seats filled and TV's tuned in.
Fast forward many years - baseball is flush with cash, from national TV deals but more importantly from enormous local TV contracts. Suddenly Selig can play the 'we tried so hard but the union was keeping us from testing!' card. He can shove his hands in his pocket as he watches Barry Bonds best the most hallowed record in all of sports. He can try to play the fool, the unwitting 'victim', but those of us with an open mind know he was the one solely responsible for creating an environment in which PED use was not only accepted, but actively encouraged and rewarded.
I'm sorry that you want to absolve Bud of any and all blame for PED use. Yes, the players took it upon themselves to take these substances, but with no testing, and a TV market tuning in, and even Nike campaigns about 'chicks digging the long ball' you can't blame them.
At first, I was 99.999999% confident he saw his last MLB pitch. Now, I'm closer to 99.99999999999999999999999% confident.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
<< <i> I'm sorry that you want to absolve Bud of any and all blame for PED use. Yes, the players took it upon themselves to take these substances, but with no testing, and a TV market tuning in, and even Nike campaigns about 'chicks digging the long ball' you can't blame them. >>
There were other commissioners who could have instituted drug testing, but also choose not to. Selig could have instituted drug testing earlier, but eventually he was able to stand up against every one else. You say he was wrong not to have drug testing. Then you say he was wrong because he did force the league to start drug testing, It's pretty clear your view is completely illogical and ridiculous
<< <i> I'm sorry that you want to absolve Bud of any and all blame for PED use. Yes, the players took it upon themselves to take these substances, but with no testing, and a TV market tuning in, and even Nike campaigns about 'chicks digging the long ball' you can't blame them. >>
There were other commissioners who could have instituted drug testing, but also choose not to. Selig could have instituted drug testing earlier, but eventually he was able to stand up against every one else. You say he was wrong not to have drug testing. Then you say he was wrong because he did force the league to start drug testing, It's pretty clear your view is completely illogical and ridiculous >>
Also, it was the union that resisted all drug testing, hence no drug policy in place. Lets not forget that...but of course, when your hero is caught, that stuff tends to be forgotten.
<< <i>He can try to play the fool, the unwitting 'victim', but those of us with an open mind know he was the one solely responsible for creating an environment in which PED use was not only accepted, but actively encouraged and rewarded. >>
Axtel, your above quote may be the most unopened minded claim ever on these boards, and is prime evidence that your ridiculous defense is based purely on your hero being caught cheating. In fact, prior to him being caught, you were on the complete opposite side saying they were all cheaters...then he was caught, and now it is Bud's fault. LOL.
Face it, your hero got caught. He isn't as good as you thought he was. His legacy is gone...and he still remains the all-time leader in one category; douchebaggery.
<< <i>“The Players Association has vigorously defended Mr. Rodriguez’s rights throughout the Biogenesis investigation, and indeed throughout his career,” Clark said. “Mr. Rodriguez’s allegation that the association has failed to fairly represent him is outrageous, and his gratuitous attacks on our former executive director, Michael Weiner, are inexcusable. When all is said and done, I am confident the Players Association will prevail.” >>
Alex is taking the same path as Lance, which didn't end well.
IMO, Alex should admit cheating (again), ask for forgiveness, accept the punishment for his own actions, and then move on. We are a forgiving Nation but that cannot happen until Alex comes clean, pun kinda intended.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
It's cute you care so much about Arod, stown, but given your team's substantial historical record of PED use it's not entirely surprising you would be so enamored of the story.
Instead of admitting you were wrong on every count, you chose to throw a weak jab, and to deflect the argument to a different point.
That m/o, along with hero worship(which is the only explanation for your illogical defense of Arod all this time), is really why so many people dislike your contributions.
Instead of admitting you were wrong on every count, you chose to throw a weak jab, and to deflect the argument to a different point.
That m/o, along with hero worship(which is the only explanation for your illogical defense of Arod all this time), is really why so many people dislike your contributions. >>
(1) It's M.O. (which stands for Modus Operandi). (2) Wrong on every count? I said he wouldn't be banned for life, as stown so was so sure of happening. He's serving a year. I was wrong on the not serving a day, though, that much I will admit. (3) Hero worship? Hardly. I will say that Arod traded a year of his baseball life for over half a billion dollars. A trade that EACH and EVERY one of his detractors would take in a heartbeat. (4) People with the inability to reason and debate dislike my contributions. I have received plenty of PMs from folks agreeing with my stances, in supporting what I have to say. Unlike some here (*cough* fitz *cough*) I don't take it personally. Once I close the browser window I don't give this board a second thought.
You were completely wrong in EVERYTHING you said on this whole Arod topic, and your irrational defense of him stems from hero worship. Doesn't matter if you 'try' to say it isn't hero worship, because it is clear it is.
Been through this with you already...but you say "it is Bud Selig's fault Arod cheated," lol. Dumbest stance in the history of sports topics, and you own that distinction!
Same for not giving this board a second thought after you close your browser window...if you ever even close it to begin with.
And you are full of it...edmundfitzgerald pulled up an old post from you in my Steve Garvey MVP thread, showing your hypocrisy at its fullest, like this quote from you below:
<< <i>Who has the time or energy to research an MVP race from 30+ years ago?
Quit trying to impress people with your 'knowledge' and 'superior intellect'...it's just annoying >>
Problem is, it is you who spends all his time and energy on the same stuff...and you attempt to show knowledge, but you really don't have it. Heck, you didn't even know the difference between a hit and a fielders choice!
And you have over 2,000 posts since joining back a year ago....so yeah, looking at that, and the insane amount of posts at the time of the Garvey thread, you are full of BS, again.
Funny how you also say "HR hitters are overrated when talking about your other hero Ichiro, but when it came to talking about McGwire vs Biggio, you said that opposite.
All that garbage BS from you is what I am talking about. That is why I find it so funny when you claim hero worship to other posters...you are the BIGGEST culprit of that of anyone! lol.
Been through this with you already...but you say "it is Bud Selig's fault Arod cheated," lol. >>
I *never*, ever said this. What I said was Selig created a work environment in which cheating was not only condoned, but encouraged. No, Selig didn't inject Arod with anything, but to sit there and suggest that anyone with the talent Arod had wouldn't take advantage of an environment in which there was no PED testing and could make in excess of half a billion dollars, well, you're a liar.
<< <i>Dumbest stance in the history of sports topics, and you own that distinction! >>
Again, I never said that. But it's clear that you can't grasp the distinction between my view and the view you're trying to pin on me.
<< <i>Same for not giving this board a second thought after you close your browser window...if you ever even close it to begin with. >>
Why would I think about it? Saying as such tells me YOU do, though.
<< <i>And you are full of it...edmundfitzgerald pulled up an old post from you in my Steve Garvey MVP thread, showing your hypocrisy at its fullest, like this quote from you below:
<< <i>Who has the time or energy to research an MVP race from 30+ years ago?
Quit trying to impress people with your 'knowledge' and 'superior intellect'...it's just annoying >>
>>
How is that hypocritical? If anything it proves my point that some people not me take these boards far too seriously.
<< <i>Problem is, it is you who spends all his time and energy on the same stuff...and you attempt to show knowledge, but you really don't have it. Heck, you didn't even know the difference between a hit and a fielders choice! >>
Oh boy, this again? You really are a dense one, you know that? Of course I know the difference.
<< <i>And you have over 2,000 posts since joining back a year ago....so yeah, looking at that, and the insane amount of posts at the time of the Garvey thread, you are full of BS, again. >>
You have nearly 500 and you joined in August. Who's got too much time on his hands again?
Aww, Tinkerbell is so distraught that he's attempting to rewrite history and what others have said, just like Russia's failed attempt to whitewash the Cold War era from the opening ceremonies. Liar.
Speaking of, I bet he replaced his life-sized bedroom poster of a shirtless Alex with one of a shirtless Putin.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
Your attempt to make any points still fall short. I grasp your view perfectly, it is irrational and based entirely in hero worship.
I suggest you do the math on a your history of posts, divide it by the number of days, and we will see who has more time on their hands.
So instead of spinning that, just go ahead and figure it out. In that Garvey MVP thread, your thread count was 13,000.
Now, in one year, you have 2,000 posts. In a half a year, I have 500. Is simple math another thing you cannot comprehend? So here is another opportunity to admit you are wrong, but you will gloss over it or spin it to something else.
Based on your understanding of baseball math measurements in the Biggio/McGwire thread, I already know you don't comprehend too well....which is another point you glossed over. You state power hitters are overrated when defending Ichiro, but when it came to Bagewll and Biggio, you did the opposite.
It still stands, everything you said in defense of Arod has either been flat out wrong, or just plain delusional.
And no, you did not know the difference between a hit and fielders choice...until it was explained to you.
Finally, previous to Arod getting caught, your stance on steroid takers was one of scorn, and you said they were cheaters. Your hero got caught, and you coincidentally changed that view, lol ...which exemplifies your double talk perfectly!
Comments
<< <i>Alex sues MLB and now I'm 99.999999% sure his MLB career is over.
Lawsuit (PDF) >>
Well, we've seen time and again how wrong you are. This just continues the trend.
Bless your little heart.
The great thing about keeping related posts within one thread is that you can easily browse what others said. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to look over all 200+ posts but I do know that I was confident Alex's suspension would be longer than Braun's and closer to the initial 210 games. I'm just as confident that Alex played his last game. I could be wrong but so far, eh, so good...
It not like I was screaming from the rafters and declaring Alex wouldn't be suspended for even one game, like fanboy.
Heh.
<< <i>Awww, fanboy is mad. >>
I'm not mad, or sad. I knew he'd see a suspension, and am laughing at dolts like you who let your emotions get in the way of rational thought.
<< <i>The great thing about keeping related posts within one thread is that you can easily browse what others said. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to look over all 200+ posts but I do know that I was confident Alex's suspension would be longer than Braun's and closer to the initial 210 games. I'm just as confident that Alex played his last game. I could be wrong but so far, eh, so good... >>
You said you were 99.9999% sure. So far, so good? He's under contract until 2017. He'll be back on the field proving you wrong, once again, in 2015.
<< <i>It not like I was screaming from the rafters and declaring Alex wouldn't be suspended for even one game, like fanboy.
Heh.
I find it funny that your team has one of the worst records in baseball history in regards to PED use (Caminiti, Clemens, Petite, etc.) but you've been the loudest detractor of Arod in this whole affair. Kettle much?
English is hard but what do you expect from a devoted tabloid trash reader.
<< <i>Bosch feared for his life, CBS reporter Scott Pelley of "60 Minutes" says he was told, because associates of A-Rod threatened Bosch's life after failing to bribe him. So he turned to MLB for protection. >>
It will come on immediately and shown in its entirety after the SD/DEN game. As an added bonus, it's conveniently on the same channel (CBS 8:00 - 7:00 PM ET/CT).
60 Minutes Preview
And MLB is in the protection business now? LOL This guy really is a piece of work. No wonder stown is a fan of his.
But Bosch once denied he ever gave anyone performance enhancing drugs. Manfred and MLB dropped a lawsuit against him and are now paying for security guards and have agreed to cover his legal fees in return for his cooperation. In Rodriguez's own lawsuit against MLB, he charges that this arrangement is essentially a $5 million bribe, which Manfred says is "absolutely untrue."
Pressed by Pelley that the security and legal fee arrangement is plenty of incentive for Bosch to lie, potentially undermining his credibility..."
<< <i>"MLB's Manfred tells Pelley that he believes the threats Bosch says he received could be legitimate. "The concerns seemed credible, particularly given that he identified individuals that we had our own concerns about."
But Bosch once denied he ever gave anyone performance enhancing drugs. Manfred and MLB dropped a lawsuit against him and are now paying for security guards and have agreed to cover his legal fees in return for his cooperation. In Rodriguez's own lawsuit against MLB, he charges that this arrangement is essentially a $5 million bribe, which Manfred says is "absolutely untrue."
Pressed by Pelley that the security and legal fee arrangement is plenty of incentive for Bosch to lie, potentially undermining his credibility..." >>
He lied like ALL THE PLAYERS did when they were first asked/suspected of steroid use. He, like the players, weren't going to confess until there was evidence, and then they were forced to confess. In the case of the players, their confessions were all basically admission of guilt by 'not knowing' what they were doing, or "one time mistakes," all BS of course, but that was their m/o.
When Arod himself admitted to using steroids, he claimed they were only for the three years in Texas. All BS of course, but he was trying to save his false legacy.
The truth is, Arod was a big time user, and we already knew he was/is a big time liar and the ultimate douche.
Why do you keep defending his use so strongly?
In the past, BEFORE Arod got caught, you were strongly against all the users, and calling them cheaters, etc... Just look at your quote when it was asked what was worse, Rose or Giambi and PED use:
<< <i>Rose's actions didn't directly affect the game like these cheaters. >>
<< <i>
In the past, BEFORE Arod got caught, you were strongly against all the users, and calling them cheaters, etc... Just look at your quote when it was asked what was worse, Rose or Giambi and PED use:
<< <i>Rose's actions didn't directly affect the game like these cheaters. >>
>>
Because that was 10 years ago, and I realize now that they didn't affect the game, that since everyone was doing it, it was still a level (albeit elevated) playing field.
<< <i>
<< <i>
In the past, BEFORE Arod got caught, you were strongly against all the users, and calling them cheaters, etc... Just look at your quote when it was asked what was worse, Rose or Giambi and PED use:
<< <i>Rose's actions didn't directly affect the game like these cheaters. >>
>>
Because that was 10 years ago, and I realize now that they didn't affect the game, that since everyone was doing it, it was still a level (albeit elevated) playing field. >>
I noticed that you did a complete 180 on your stance, and were entrenched on each end. Seems most guys who change their mind on that subject aren't as entrenched when they do evolve their opinion I just found it coincidental that your favorite player getting caught for roids, just happened to occur in-between your changing of opinion on the matter.
I have to ask, is Arod a liar on the subject of him doing PED's? Or, to phrase it differently, did he completely lie about doing PED's everytime he was asked prior to 2009?
<< <i>
I noticed that you did a complete 180 on your stance, and were entrenched on each end. Seems most guys who change their mind on that subject aren't as entrenched when they do evolve their opinion I just found it coincidental that your favorite player getting caught for roids, just happened to occur in-between your changing of opinion on the matter. >>
Arod isn't my favorite player, far from it.
<< <i>I have to ask, is Arod a liar on the subject of him doing PED's? Or, to phrase it differently, did he completely lie about doing PED's everytime he was asked prior to 2009? >>
Who knows? The rumor and innuendo would seem to suggest he is, but wouldn't you, or any one of us, done the same exact thing? I read a great summation of PED use, and I ask it of any one who is critical of PED users:
If you could take a substance, that your work doesn't test for, that would increase your productivity a significant amount and that increase would enable to make vast sums of money, would you take it?
The short answer is yes, each and every one of us would, and why PED use was so widespread in baseball. There was no testing, and if you were careful with who you associated with, no one would ever find out.
Ax, come on. It isn't rumor or innuendo. The guy is a flat out liar...the video Stown just posted makes that pretty obvious.
Yes, I am sure I would deny it too if I were doing PED...but then i wouldn't expect people to make excuses for me, and THAT is the part I find funny and why I am calling you out on it with regard to Arod; you yourself changing your stance because he got caught, and you still not even being able to say that he is a liar(instead halfheartedly saying so). Just say it. The guy is a liar.
I had the chance to take PED, and I didn't. I was aware of possible side effects, and I never wanted that risk. I'm not sure how it would have played out financially, but I didn't want to go the way of Lyle Alzado either.
That isn't just for sports either. Steroids are also taken to look sharp and hot, and that is a benefit too. However, one can get 'hot enough' without them, and then just be a fun and confident man to get chicks anyway.
I was also always aware how much better it feels with unprotected sex...but I'd rather not get warts, so I passed that extra pleasure too
And before you ask, yes I eat like a King, and I party like one too. However, I also monitor my health status in regard to all of that, and as long as I am at the top of the health charts, I will continue to live my life full like that. The moment it looks like I am slipping on the chart, then I eat better and party less.
So, in a nutshell, my life is as full as can be, and I don't see how Alzado's was any more fun or fulfilling...just that he had a bigger bank account. He died, and I'm still ticking(knock on wood).
I wouldn't trade my life for his bank account, ever.
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I had the chance to take PED, and I didn't. I was aware of possible side effects, and I never wanted that risk. I'm not sure how it would have played out financially, but I didn't want to go the way of Lyle Alzado either.
>>
That's not what I was asking. I was asking if you could take a substance that your work didn't test for that could give you tens of millions of dollars and elevate you to levels of fame and fortune these players did. Any honest person would say yes to that.
<< <i>That isn't just for sports either. Steroids are also taken to look sharp and hot, and that is a benefit too. However, one can get 'hot enough' without them, and then just be a fun and confident man to get chicks anyway. >>
Completely off topic and has no bearing on the conversation.
<< <i>I was also always aware how much better it feels with unprotected sex...but I'd rather not get warts, so I passed that extra pleasure too
Again, off topic. Please stick to the conversation at hand.
<< <i>And before you ask, yes I eat like a King, and I party like one too. However, I also monitor my health status in regard to all of that, and as long as I am at the top of the health charts, I will continue to live my life full like that. The moment it looks like I am slipping on the chart, then I eat better and party less.
So, in a nutshell, my life is as full as can be, and I don't see how Alzado's was any more fun or fulfilling...just that he had a bigger bank account. He died, and I'm still ticking(knock on wood). >>
We all die, and Alzado was an outlier.
<< <i>I wouldn't trade my life for his bank account, ever. >>
It's easy to say that given that the option isn't there. But to sit there and suggest you wouldn't trade lives, and the security his wealth brings? That just reeks of insincerity.
Wow.
Alex's council reminds me of the typical dbag defense attorney that relies on theatrics and technicalities instead of laying out facts.
<< <i>Joe Tacopina: Absolutely not. He didn't bribe anyone. There was no allegation that he bribed anyone. And the notion that Bosch is now coming on a television interview without the benefit of cross-examination or an oath is laughable. >>
You know what's really laughable? Demanding a TV interviewee be under oath and available for a cross-examination. Guess Judge Wapner and/or Judy were unavailable....
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Your question of me taking PED's that would make me tens of millions of dollars? A)If I am already making sevens of millions of dollars, NO, I wouldn't take them.
No, I wouldn't trade lives with Alzado. I have a great time already, am secure enough, and am surrounded by good people with mutual love and respect. To give that up for a chance for more money, with the tradeoff for the chance for an earlier death, or the chance for loss of credibility...NO, I wouldn't do it.
Maybe you would, but don't assume you know what I would or wouldn't do.
<< <i>Bud Selig absolutely created an environment where steroid use was not only encouraged but it was rewarded. He didn't personally inject these players but he might as well have. >>
I've already defeated your notion in another thread, no need to rehash. Whatever scorn/blame is directed at Selig for "ruining the game," must also be directed at Arod, and more so, because Arod actually did it. But enough...you can read all that in the other thread.
However, I would be very hard pressed to find anyone that thinks Bud is a good commissioner!
That being said, I don't think the PED users or Bud ruined the game. They may have ruined their reputations, but not the game.
I'm just here to call the homers out on their typical ridiculous defense of their heroes, as is the case with your defense with Arod.
I've already shown the errors of your way in assuming what I(or anybody would do) too. You should probably recant that statement, and say, "this is what 1985fan would do."
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
Enter McGwire and Sosa, 1998. The home run chase is well documented. What's not as well known is McGwire admitted to taking andro DURING the chase! Yet Selig and his fellow owners did nothing to step in, did nothing to raise doubt - they needed those seats filled and TV's tuned in.
Fast forward many years - baseball is flush with cash, from national TV deals but more importantly from enormous local TV contracts. Suddenly Selig can play the 'we tried so hard but the union was keeping us from testing!' card. He can shove his hands in his pocket as he watches Barry Bonds best the most hallowed record in all of sports. He can try to play the fool, the unwitting 'victim', but those of us with an open mind know he was the one solely responsible for creating an environment in which PED use was not only accepted, but actively encouraged and rewarded.
I'm sorry that you want to absolve Bud of any and all blame for PED use. Yes, the players took it upon themselves to take these substances, but with no testing, and a TV market tuning in, and even Nike campaigns about 'chicks digging the long ball' you can't blame them.
At first, I was 99.999999% confident he saw his last MLB pitch. Now, I'm closer to 99.99999999999999999999999% confident.
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I'm sorry that you want to absolve Bud of any and all blame for PED use. Yes, the players took it upon themselves to take these substances, but with no testing, and a TV market tuning in, and even Nike campaigns about 'chicks digging the long ball' you can't blame them. >>
There were other commissioners who could have instituted drug testing, but also choose not to. Selig could have instituted drug testing earlier, but eventually he was able to stand up against every one else. You say he was wrong not to have drug testing. Then you say he was wrong because he did force the league to start drug testing, It's pretty clear your view is completely illogical and ridiculous
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<< <i>
I'm sorry that you want to absolve Bud of any and all blame for PED use. Yes, the players took it upon themselves to take these substances, but with no testing, and a TV market tuning in, and even Nike campaigns about 'chicks digging the long ball' you can't blame them. >>
There were other commissioners who could have instituted drug testing, but also choose not to. Selig could have instituted drug testing earlier, but eventually he was able to stand up against every one else. You say he was wrong not to have drug testing. Then you say he was wrong because he did force the league to start drug testing, It's pretty clear your view is completely illogical and ridiculous >>
Also, it was the union that resisted all drug testing, hence no drug policy in place. Lets not forget that...but of course, when your hero is caught, that stuff tends to be forgotten.
<< <i>He can try to play the fool, the unwitting 'victim', but those of us with an open mind know he was the one solely responsible for creating an environment in which PED use was not only accepted, but actively encouraged and rewarded. >>
Axtel, your above quote may be the most unopened minded claim ever on these boards, and is prime evidence that your ridiculous defense is based purely on your hero being caught cheating. In fact, prior to him being caught, you were on the complete opposite side saying they were all cheaters...then he was caught, and now it is Bud's fault. LOL.
Face it, your hero got caught. He isn't as good as you thought he was. His legacy is gone...and he still remains the all-time leader in one category; douchebaggery.
<< <i>“The Players Association has vigorously defended Mr. Rodriguez’s rights throughout the Biogenesis investigation, and indeed throughout his career,” Clark said. “Mr. Rodriguez’s allegation that the association has failed to fairly represent him is outrageous, and his gratuitous attacks on our former executive director, Michael Weiner, are inexcusable. When all is said and done, I am confident the Players Association will prevail.” >>
Alex is taking the same path as Lance, which didn't end well.
IMO, Alex should admit cheating (again), ask for forgiveness, accept the punishment for his own actions, and then move on. We are a forgiving Nation but that cannot happen until Alex comes clean, pun kinda intended.
<< <i>
IMO, Alex should admit cheating (again) >>
I like that subtle humor there.
Only the blindest of the blind would believe Arod at this point...he is nothing but a liar. Why would anyone believe him? lol
<< <i>alex drops lawsuit >>
It's cute you care so much about Arod, stown, but given your team's substantial historical record of PED use it's not entirely surprising you would be so enamored of the story.
Instead of admitting you were wrong on every count, you chose to throw a weak jab, and to deflect the argument to a different point.
That m/o, along with hero worship(which is the only explanation for your illogical defense of Arod all this time), is really why so many people dislike your contributions.
<< <i>1985fan,
Instead of admitting you were wrong on every count, you chose to throw a weak jab, and to deflect the argument to a different point.
That m/o, along with hero worship(which is the only explanation for your illogical defense of Arod all this time), is really why so many people dislike your contributions. >>
(1) It's M.O. (which stands for Modus Operandi).
(2) Wrong on every count? I said he wouldn't be banned for life, as stown so was so sure of happening. He's serving a year. I was wrong on the not serving a day, though, that much I will admit.
(3) Hero worship? Hardly. I will say that Arod traded a year of his baseball life for over half a billion dollars. A trade that EACH and EVERY one of his detractors would take in a heartbeat.
(4) People with the inability to reason and debate dislike my contributions. I have received plenty of PMs from folks agreeing with my stances, in supporting what I have to say. Unlike some here (*cough* fitz *cough*) I don't take it personally. Once I close the browser window I don't give this board a second thought.
or Missouri
You were completely wrong in EVERYTHING you said on this whole Arod topic, and your irrational defense of him stems from hero worship. Doesn't matter if you 'try' to say it isn't hero worship, because it is clear it is.
Been through this with you already...but you say "it is Bud Selig's fault Arod cheated," lol. Dumbest stance in the history of sports topics, and you own that distinction!
Same for not giving this board a second thought after you close your browser window...if you ever even close it to begin with.
And you are full of it...edmundfitzgerald pulled up an old post from you in my Steve Garvey MVP thread, showing your hypocrisy at its fullest, like this quote from you below:
<< <i>Who has the time or energy to research an MVP race from 30+ years ago?
Quit trying to impress people with your 'knowledge' and 'superior intellect'...it's just annoying >>
Problem is, it is you who spends all his time and energy on the same stuff...and you attempt to show knowledge, but you really don't have it. Heck, you didn't even know the difference between a hit and a fielders choice!
And you have over 2,000 posts since joining back a year ago....so yeah, looking at that, and the insane amount of posts at the time of the Garvey thread, you are full of BS, again.
Funny how you also say "HR hitters are overrated when talking about your other hero Ichiro, but when it came to talking about McGwire vs Biggio, you said that opposite.
All that garbage BS from you is what I am talking about. That is why I find it so funny when you claim hero worship to other posters...you are the BIGGEST culprit of that of anyone! lol.
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Been through this with you already...but you say "it is Bud Selig's fault Arod cheated," lol. >>
I *never*, ever said this. What I said was Selig created a work environment in which cheating was not only condoned, but encouraged. No, Selig didn't inject Arod with anything, but to sit there and suggest that anyone with the talent Arod had wouldn't take advantage of an environment in which there was no PED testing and could make in excess of half a billion dollars, well, you're a liar.
<< <i>Dumbest stance in the history of sports topics, and you own that distinction! >>
Again, I never said that. But it's clear that you can't grasp the distinction between my view and the view you're trying to pin on me.
<< <i>Same for not giving this board a second thought after you close your browser window...if you ever even close it to begin with. >>
Why would I think about it? Saying as such tells me YOU do, though.
<< <i>And you are full of it...edmundfitzgerald pulled up an old post from you in my Steve Garvey MVP thread, showing your hypocrisy at its fullest, like this quote from you below:
<< <i>Who has the time or energy to research an MVP race from 30+ years ago?
Quit trying to impress people with your 'knowledge' and 'superior intellect'...it's just annoying >>
>>
How is that hypocritical? If anything it proves my point that some people not me take these boards far too seriously.
<< <i>Problem is, it is you who spends all his time and energy on the same stuff...and you attempt to show knowledge, but you really don't have it. Heck, you didn't even know the difference between a hit and a fielders choice! >>
Oh boy, this again? You really are a dense one, you know that? Of course I know the difference.
<< <i>And you have over 2,000 posts since joining back a year ago....so yeah, looking at that, and the insane amount of posts at the time of the Garvey thread, you are full of BS, again. >>
You have nearly 500 and you joined in August. Who's got too much time on his hands again?
Speaking of, I bet he replaced his life-sized bedroom poster of a shirtless Alex with one of a shirtless Putin.
Your attempt to make any points still fall short. I grasp your view perfectly, it is irrational and based entirely in hero worship.
I suggest you do the math on a your history of posts, divide it by the number of days, and we will see who has more time on their hands.
So instead of spinning that, just go ahead and figure it out. In that Garvey MVP thread, your thread count was 13,000.
Now, in one year, you have 2,000 posts. In a half a year, I have 500. Is simple math another thing you cannot comprehend? So here is another opportunity to admit you are wrong, but you will gloss over it or spin it to something else.
Based on your understanding of baseball math measurements in the Biggio/McGwire thread, I already know you don't comprehend too well....which is another point you glossed over. You state power hitters are overrated when defending Ichiro, but when it came to Bagewll and Biggio, you did the opposite.
It still stands, everything you said in defense of Arod has either been flat out wrong, or just plain delusional.
And no, you did not know the difference between a hit and fielders choice...until it was explained to you.
Finally, previous to Arod getting caught, your stance on steroid takers was one of scorn, and you said they were cheaters. Your hero got caught, and you coincidentally changed that view, lol