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The value of wonderfully toned coins
RichieURich
Posts: 8,372 ✭✭✭✭✭
It is certain that wonderfully toned coins trade at a premium compared with the same coins without the wonderful toning. The question is, how much of a premium?
Up until now, we have to examine auction records or private sale prices individually to estimate what the premium would be.
Now, however, Legend in their market report has given us some useful information on this topic:
"There is one coin in Stacks that has a huge buzz. All we'll say is its got gorgeous colors and you never see any like it. We predict it will easily sell for 5x-10x what a regular one would. You'll see this happen each time the situation warrents."
Up until now, we have to examine auction records or private sale prices individually to estimate what the premium would be.
Now, however, Legend in their market report has given us some useful information on this topic:
"There is one coin in Stacks that has a huge buzz. All we'll say is its got gorgeous colors and you never see any like it. We predict it will easily sell for 5x-10x what a regular one would. You'll see this happen each time the situation warrents."
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My WAG ?
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.americanlegacycoins.com
Rainbow Stars
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.americanlegacycoins.com
<< <i>RU, don't you typically use 2x when you price your toned wonder's.....I guess this means you are thinking about upping it.
It depends on the coin. Biggest premium on a toner was one I paid 10x, sold for 12x.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
<< <i>You'll see this happen each time the situation warrents." >>
And when it does not warrent? Is it 3X? No X? This is a meaningless comment. It is self-fulfilling.
Collector: "Wow, that coin looks nice, how much is it?"
Seller: "7X Grey Sheet"
Collector: "Wow, how come so much?"
Seller: "It's warrented"
Collector: "I thought different collectors liked different things, how does a seller come up with 7X?"
Seller: "Some dealers are getting 10X for coins like this, this is a deal!, Besides, Legend says so. "
Collector: "I see, thanks"
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<< <i>Sure glad I do not collect tarnish.... leaves money for more good stuff. Cheers, RickO >>
unfortunately you make a valid point, I wish dealerswouldn't support the premiums for toners, and i wish collectorswouldn't support the dealers who do. >>
His point was that he does not collect color. Not to aboloish the market.
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<< <i>Sure glad I do not collect tarnish.... leaves money for more good stuff. Cheers, RickO >>
unfortunately you make a valid point, I wish dealerswouldn't support the premiums for toners, and i wish collectorswouldn't support the dealers who do. >>
Just as people will choose one car over another with similar specs if it has a nicer look to the body, even if the price is more expensive. Automakers price these at the top end of what market studies have shown people would pay for said eye appeal. Same goes for sunroofs, moonroofs, bells and whistles, ect. Why you or anyone would want to change or restrict the freedoms of individuals to spend their own money how they so choose is beyond me.
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<< <i>Sure glad I do not collect tarnish.... leaves money for more good stuff. Cheers, RickO >>
unfortunately you make a valid point, I wish dealerswouldn't support the premiums for toners, and i wish collectorswouldn't support the dealers who do. >>
Just as people will choose one car over another with similar specs if it has a nicer look to the body, even if the price is more expensive. Automakers price these at the top end of what market studies have shown people would pay for said eye appeal. Same goes for sunroofs, moonroofs, bells and whistles, ect. Why you or anyone would want to change or restrict the freedoms of individuals to spend their own money how they so choose is beyond me. >>
Then we will never be able to stop what motivates coin doctors if there are those who are willing to pay ridiculous premiums for strictly the eye poppong appeal of wildly toned coins that no one knows were toned last Friday on 8/5/2011 or the SAME DAY OF THE WEEK 8/5/1834. >>
If you honestly believe that the #1 reason people doctor coins is to add purdy colors, you are sorely mistaken. It does occur but not as dominant as doctoring to hide hairlines, cover wear, deepen mirrors, hide defects, dipping off the original toning for a grade bump, ect. The latter of these, as we have seen recently, have ruined many numismatic treasures. These are what make money for doctors and is MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more difficult to discern than a wildly toned POS that even a newbie can smell the sulfur on from a mile away. Those untoned/barely toned early US coins you raise up on a pedestal and the prices paid drive more doctoring than the tiny niche market for Monster toners.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
In recent years (for Morgan dollars anyway) the premiums have continued to go up and up for really top end pieces with exceptionally vivid colors and/or patterns. It used to be about 10 - 15 yrs. ago you could buy a superb toned dollar from a dealer who specialized in them for anywhere from 8 - 15X bid, and perhaps somewhat more for a really world class piece. Now the premiums have far surpassed those levels if you want a true monster, and it appears the sky is now the limit for true world class toned dollars. The problem is that many sellers with either inferior to very marginal toned coins see these monsters sell at huge premiums and think their coins are worth a lot more than they really are.
Please show us examples of many of these coins.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.americanlegacycoins.com
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<< <i>Sure glad I do not collect tarnish.... leaves money for more good stuff. Cheers, RickO >>
unfortunately you make a valid point, I wish dealerswouldn't support the premiums for toners, and i wish collectorswouldn't support the dealers who do. >>
This is a market niche where I would urge those who do not appreciate these coins to simply avoid these pieces and refuse to pay the premium. Additionally, for those who love these coins I would tell them to study, think analytically, gain experience and enjoy the coins that they are willing and/or able to purchase at whatever premium, if any, these coins cost vs. "average" or "typical" pieces for the grade and issue. It is of course up to the individual, but it seems like it might be an example of cutting off one's nose to spite his face if you avoid an honest, knowledgeable dealer with integrity who strives to incorporate such coins in his inventory when the opportunity presents itself.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
coins is quite interesting. Antique people are crazy over original patina on an unmessed with piece regardless of how worn or abused the piece might be otherwise. In coins, it's
getting harder to figure out what's real patina and what isn't.
If Legend is thinking a multiple of 5X or 10X the price for a monster toner, then it's probably not a US type coin or pre-1860 piece. Early type and federal coinage does not typically
bring more than a 50-100% premium for wild original toning, primarily because 99% of them don't tone that way....until they are dipped and subjected to secondary toning. Could
be something like a dated Morgan, classic commem, dated early 20th or late 19th century piece in a completable REG set (ie Walker, Buff, Merc, SLQ, etc.). But my best guess might
be that 1882 Hawaii one rial token or some other early colonial/medal/off the beaten track type of coin.
roadrunner
100% Positive BST transactions
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<< <i>Sure glad I do not collect tarnish.... leaves money for more good stuff. Cheers, RickO >>
unfortunately you make a valid point, I wish dealerswouldn't support the premiums for toners, and i wish collectorswouldn't support the dealers who do. >>
Just as people will choose one car over another with similar specs if it has a nicer look to the body, even if the price is more expensive. Automakers price these at the top end of what market studies have shown people would pay for said eye appeal. Same goes for sunroofs, moonroofs, bells and whistles, ect. Why you or anyone would want to change or restrict the freedoms of individuals to spend their own money how they so choose is beyond me. >>
Then we will never be able to stop what motivates coin doctors if there are those who are willing to pay ridiculous premiums for strictly the eye poppong appeal of wildly toned coins that no one knows were toned last Friday on 8/5/2011 or the SAME DAY OF THE WEEK 8/5/1834. >>
If you honestly believe that the #1 reason people doctor coins is to add purdy colors, you are sorely mistaken. It does occur but not as dominant as doctoring to hide hairlines, cover wear, deepen mirrors, hide defects, dipping off the original toning for a grade bump, ect. The latter of these, as we have seen recently, have ruined many numismatic treasures. These are what make money for doctors and is MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more difficult to discern than a wildly toned POS that even a newbie can smell the sulfur on from a mile away. Those untoned/barely toned early US coins you raise up on a pedestal and the prices paid drive more doctoring than the tiny niche market for Monster toners. >>
I believe you have just misunderstood my point. I ONLY collect naturally (hopefully) toned original (hopefully) surfaces. I was not discussing toned pos/ amazingly toned coins. I was discussing exactly what you wrote, beautfiuully toned coins that hide problems and past cleanings including with that past dippings where the coin gets either amazing multiples or gets a bump up or two in grade due to the artists fine work at hiding all the negative attributes with gorgeous toning. Maybe you might remember a certain 1827 10c ms65 ngc that I presented here it was bought on approval from a dealer and returned, that is exactly what I am talking about , which is also btw going to be auctioned on HA or Stacks/Bowers I can't remember shortly. It has all sort of problems, it appears to be AT and the Bean company agreed, and it appears to be overgraded where the dark dramatic toning hides all the coins flaws and thus imho and the Bean companies opinion isn't deserving of a 65. This is what I am speaking of, I am a lover of all original umnessed with coins, beauties or not, I would rather have an ugly original coin in high grade than a blast white one any day of the week and wish the coin doctors stayed away fromt he original ones. >>
I appreciate you clarifying your point. I hope you can see how some may have interpreted your original comments. In my experience and what honest logic would assume, when doctors cover up problems on coins, rarely do they cover it with flagrant explosive beautiful colors. That would draw attention and additional scrutiny. Sort of like a sniper dressing like the drunken offspring of a neon billboard and a clown. It doesn't make sense. That being said, doctors who want to make beautifully toned AT coins would choose already problem free coins. See my logic in this? I agree with all of your well made points so this response is not in opposition to your post.
well , then you knew the answer to your question all along ..............
The premium for a wonderfully toned coin is dependent on the degree of the exoticism of the toning as well as the magnitude of the desirability of it ;
and that desirability is either universal or created by a single individual .
So the multiple can be as small as 2 X's ..or as large as 100 X
Here's what I gave up on...
Oh wait... Before you click on the link, think to yourself what a 1937 Arkansas Commem in PCGS MS64 is worth...
then click here
<< <i><<< The question is, how much of a premium? >>>
In recent years (for Morgan dollars anyway) the premiums have continued to go up and up for really top end pieces with exceptionally vivid colors and/or patterns. It used to be about 10 - 15 yrs. ago you could buy a superb toned dollar from a dealer who specialized in them for anywhere from 8 - 15X bid, and perhaps somewhat more for a really world class piece. Now the premiums have far surpassed those levels if you want a true monster, and it appears the sky is now the limit for true world class toned dollars. The problem is that many sellers with either inferior to very marginal toned coins see these monsters sell at huge premiums and think their coins are worth a lot more than they really are. >>
Dragon is correct,and i truly believe that most folks have never owned a truly MONSTER toned Morgan."In this thread",Brandon,Dragon,Toneddollars,Tom B.,and I may be the exceptions,and if i missed someone,it was not intentional.
Took me a year to find someone as crazy as I was just to make me whole.
<< <i>and i truly believe that most folks have never owned a truly MONSTER toned Morgan."In this thread" >>
You may be correct. And not just in this thread you may be correct as well. But IMO sometimes this statement is used against folks that
just don't care to pay up for these pieces, or think they're overpriced. Just to be clear IMO, just because some don't care to pay up, or think they are overpriced doesn't mean they've never seen or owned one. I'm only saying this because I've seen many sellers and supporters state this through the years.
roadrunner
Yet a beautifully toned gem trade dollar trades maybe 10-20% premium....maybe....
Same can be said of other gem type coins that are beautifully toned.....they don'tseem to bring huge premiums....
So either gem common morgans that exhibit beautiful toning are over priced or gem type with beautifultoning are undervalued.....
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners.
<< <i>I was buried as I once paid 17 times PCGS values for a toner...
Took me a year to find someone as crazy as I was just to make me whole.
But, you found someone. there is a seat for every arse in the world
Rainbow Stars
<< <i>Consider Morgans where a gem beautiful toned coin can bring 10 times........
Yet a beautifully toned gem trade dollar trades maybe 10-20% premium....maybe....
Same can be said of other gem type coins that are beautifully toned.....they don'tseem to bring huge premiums....
So either gem common morgans that exhibit beautiful toning are over priced or gem type with beautifultoning are undervalued..... >>
MS trade dollars are generally considerably more costly than most comparable grade Morgans. Trade dollars were generally not stored away in bags for years upon years like the Morgans were and thus never achieved the kind of undisturbed toning that is common to Morgans. Most trade dollars were toned by other than bag storage, therefore it is unusual to see monster toned tradies like you see with Morgans. The relative abundance and associated low cost of common date Morgans makes 10x or 15x sheet for a 84-o in 64 relatively cheap when compared to ms64 tradies.
This toning on a tradie would surely bring more than it would on a Morgan; and even more than that if it was on the obverse.
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
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<< <i>Consider Morgans where a gem beautiful toned coin can bring 10 times........
Yet a beautifully toned gem trade dollar trades maybe 10-20% premium....maybe....
Same can be said of other gem type coins that are beautifully toned.....they don'tseem to bring huge premiums....
So either gem common morgans that exhibit beautiful toning are over priced or gem type with beautifultoning are undervalued..... >>
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe it has to do with another area I question and know the answer. If you have an R-5 coin in lets VF it w can sell for 20x-30x but if the same R05 coin is found in ms there is often a much much smaller premium,maybe 10-20% , i ahve beent old that is due to the fact that the coin is already expensive and thus the multiples drop dramatically. Well I don't get that, if something is rare and in high grade isn't the the perfect storm and thus should be worthy mega bucks....wellobviously not since i am tho only one who appears to think that way so i am forced to go along with the majority.
Well the same goes withMorgans, they are a lot cheaper than bust or seated materialand thus when Morgans are nicely toned there are the highe multiples and when the more expensive busts and seated material are similarly toned no such huge multiples just the typical 10-20% premium. >>
This is a perfect example of supply and demand. A typical MS64-MS66 Morgan dollar costs around $100-$400 and this means that not only can a huge number of folks play in this arena, but also that those relatively few wonderfully toned pieces can be avidly chased by a significant subset of these collectors who desire to incorporate such coins into their collections. Therefore, demand is very large and since the basal price is relatively low ($100-$400 for typical coins) it means that the premium can be large on a percentage or fold basis while not always being huge on a real dollar basis. As an example, an 1881-S Morgan dollar in MS64 is actually rather low end for the grade range of this issue, but with outstanding color it might fetch $400 so that we talk about 4x fold increase or 400% of Greysheet sales price. This appears enormous, but in reality is only $300.
In the other corner we have wonderfully preserved and beautifully toned earlier type. Not only is high grade earlier type very thinly collected relative to our Morgan dollar example, but these coins cost far more on average than the Morgan dollars used previously. So, even though wonderfully preserved and beautifully toned earlier type is downright scarce there is simply not the huge number of folks who play in that market, which drives down demand dramatically. Of course, it is not unusual to pay more real dollars as a premium for such a wonderful type coin vs. a common date Morgan dollar, but the percentage or fold increase is necessarily lower because the entry point is significantly higher.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
I've noted that people have numbers set in their head when they make purchases based on subjective valuation such as toned coins. Some collectors buy color coins in the $100 to $500 range. That is their comfort zone. They don't mull over in their heads % over sheet. They have $500 and know what kind of color they are looking for comparitvely to the market research they have done. If they see a toned morgan for say $750 and then find another one for $300 that has nicer color. That is a sweet deal. It gets bought. Now, the coin may have a sheet value of $50 but that doesn't matter to them because sheet values are not market values because they do not reflect what said buyer is actually buying. They know what colors sell for by comparisons of what they have seen/handled in the past including auction results. It does not matter much at all that the coin without color is a $50 coin. That's a $250 premium on a $50 coin. 5x.
Now, take a coin with a base value of $5,000. To top things off, only a fraction of the market has that much money to burn at any one moment completely blowing away any demand by collectors who will not pay more than $2,000 for a toned Morgan. 90% of the demand (or people that can even afford it) is left at the launchpad when that puppy goes to auction. Additionally, the coin is just as beautiful as the aforementioned $300 coin, eye appeal wise. Nice blazing rainbow shades and the coins are almost identical with the exception of some contact marks or something holding back the grade. Therefore, most of the value lies in the base value of the coin, and not the color and since people have numbers in their heads what color is worth and since they are buying beauty, not grade (well, excessive contact marks detract from the eye appeal so that is also a consideration but if an MS63 is a blazer and has few contact marks, all the better), a $5,000 base coin simply may just not have $5,000 color. It may have a $5,000 grade but the color of a $300 morgan toner. Therefore the coin has to be an absolute beast to be worth a premium over the $5,000 base. In other words, if it doesn't have $5,000 color but the coin is graded at the $5,000 level, no more demand by toned collectors for that coin leaving only the greysheet crowd i.e. low toning premium.
So, to summarize:
If a $5,000 does not have $5,000 color, don't expect the premium to be much of anything. Inversely, if a $50 has $5,000 color, expect the premiums to be through the roof.
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<< <i>Consider Morgans where a gem beautiful toned coin can bring 10 times........
Yet a beautifully toned gem trade dollar trades maybe 10-20% premium....maybe....
Same can be said of other gem type coins that are beautifully toned.....they don'tseem to bring huge premiums....
So either gem common morgans that exhibit beautiful toning are over priced or gem type with beautifultoning are undervalued..... >>
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe it has to do with another area I question and know the answer. If you have an R-5 coin in lets VF it w can sell for 20x-30x but if the same R05 coin is found in ms there is often a much much smaller premium,maybe 10-20% , i ahve beent old that is due to the fact that the coin is already expensive and thus the multiples drop dramatically. Well I don't get that, if something is rare and in high grade isn't the the perfect storm and thus should be worthy mega bucks....wellobviously not since i am tho only one who appears to think that way so i am forced to go along with the majority.
Well the same goes withMorgans, they are a lot cheaper than bust or seated materialand thus when Morgans are nicely toned there are the highe multiples and when the more expensive busts and seated material are similarly toned no such huge multiples just the typical 10-20% premium. >>
This is a perfect example of supply and demand. A typical MS64-MS66 Morgan dollar costs around $100-$400 and this means that not only can a huge number of folks play in this arena, but also that those relatively few wonderfully toned pieces can be avidly chased by a significant subset of these collectors who desire to incorporate such coins into their collections. Therefore, demand is very large and since the basal price is relatively low ($100-$400 for typical coins) it means that the premium can be large on a percentage or fold basis while not always being huge on a real dollar basis. As an example, an 1881-S Morgan dollar in MS64 is actually rather low end for the grade range of this issue, but with outstanding color it might fetch $400 so that we talk about 4x fold increase or 400% of Greysheet sales price. This appears enormous, but in reality is only $300.
In the other corner we have wonderfully preserved and beautifully toned earlier type. Not only is high grade earlier type very thinly collected relative to our Morgan dollar example, but these coins cost far more on average than the Morgan dollars used previously. So, even though wonderfully preserved and beautifully toned earlier type is downright scarce there is simply not the huge number of folks who play in that market, which drives down demand dramatically. Of course, it is not unusual to pay more real dollars as a premium for such a wonderful type coin vs. a common date Morgan dollar, but the percentage or fold increase is necessarily lower because the entry point is significantly higher. >>
Very well put, Tom B, very well put.
Larry L.
Edited to add: Excellent analysis as well, Brandon.
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<< <i>Consider Morgans where a gem beautiful toned coin can bring 10 times........
Yet a beautifully toned gem trade dollar trades maybe 10-20% premium....maybe....
Same can be said of other gem type coins that are beautifully toned.....they don'tseem to bring huge premiums....
So either gem common morgans that exhibit beautiful toning are over priced or gem type with beautifultoning are undervalued..... >>
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe it has to do with another area I question and know the answer. If you have an R-5 coin in lets VF it w can sell for 20x-30x but if the same R05 coin is found in ms there is often a much much smaller premium,maybe 10-20% , i ahve beent old that is due to the fact that the coin is already expensive and thus the multiples drop dramatically. Well I don't get that, if something is rare and in high grade isn't the the perfect storm and thus should be worthy mega bucks....wellobviously not since i am tho only one who appears to think that way so i am forced to go along with the majority.
Well the same goes withMorgans, they are a lot cheaper than bust or seated materialand thus when Morgans are nicely toned there are the highe multiples and when the more expensive busts and seated material are similarly toned no such huge multiples just the typical 10-20% premium. >>
This is a perfect example of supply and demand. A typical MS64-MS66 Morgan dollar costs around $100-$400 and this means that not only can a huge number of folks play in this arena, but also that those relatively few wonderfully toned pieces can be avidly chased by a significant subset of these collectors who desire to incorporate such coins into their collections. Therefore, demand is very large and since the basal price is relatively low ($100-$400 for typical coins) it means that the premium can be large on a percentage or fold basis while not always being huge on a real dollar basis. As an example, an 1881-S Morgan dollar in MS64 is actually rather low end for the grade range of this issue, but with outstanding color it might fetch $400 so that we talk about 4x fold increase or 400% of Greysheet sales price. This appears enormous, but in reality is only $300.
In the other corner we have wonderfully preserved and beautifully toned earlier type. Not only is high grade earlier type very thinly collected relative to our Morgan dollar example, but these coins cost far more on average than the Morgan dollars used previously. So, even though wonderfully preserved and beautifully toned earlier type is downright scarce there is simply not the huge number of folks who play in that market, which drives down demand dramatically. Of course, it is not unusual to pay more real dollars as a premium for such a wonderful type coin vs. a common date Morgan dollar, but the percentage or fold increase is necessarily lower because the entry point is significantly higher. >>
Very well put, Tom B, very well put.
Larry L.
Edited to add: Excellent analysis as well, Brandon.
3 different poster all pretty much said the same thing. Another point too is that what constitutes monster or great toning on many coins is just so so on a Morgan.
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
<< <i>3 different poster all pretty much said the same thing. Another point too is that what constitutes monster or great toning on many coins is just so so on a Morgan. >>
Yeah, funny. I noticed that too. We all must have heard the same voices in our heads.
Good point about the toning on morgans vs. other coins. Morgans and Commems are typically the most beautiful so that's where the money flows for those buying eye appeal. Just as toning on morgans is dependent on the surfaces: Velvety O-mint morgans, Prooflike S-mint morgans explains why the most monsterfull dates are the best struck ones and usually bring the highest premium so is the premiums between morgans/commems vs. other early US coins. As different from price guides as can be
<< <i>There is a coin on eBay that I would love to own, however the price is $1200 for color, $175 for white. The coin is graded ms63 and priced at ms66+ levels.
The coin is far from rare. I refuse to buy the coin. When I asked the seller if they would come down in price he became quite annoyed. Why would anyone pay
6x for toning on ms63 surfaces is beyond me. >>
The toning didn't have much choice about the quality of the surface that it ended up on in the same way that it didn't choose reverse over obverse. It just happened. That same toning on a 66 surface would likely bring more than double the $1200.
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
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<< <i>3 different poster all pretty much said the same thing. Another point too is that what constitutes monster or great toning on many coins is just so so on a Morgan. >>
Yeah, funny. I noticed that too. We all must have heard the same voices in our heads.
Good point about the toning on morgans vs. other coins. Morgans and Commems are typically the most beautiful so that's where the money flows for those buying eye appeal. Just as toning on morgans is dependent on the surfaces: Velvety O-mint morgans, Prooflike S-mint morgans explains why the most monsterfull dates are the best struck ones and usually bring the highest premium so is the premiums between morgans/commems vs. other early US coins. As different from price guides as can be >>
For those of you who havent read it,Brandon has written an EXCELLENT article on monster toned Morgans,and i think another reason for the higher premiums is that the Morgan appeals to the most collectors,though other type coins are probably better buys.JMO
As to the premiums themselves: I don't see how this is really any different than the premiums paid between an MS62 and, say, an MS67 coin. Why is that somehow legit and not paying a premium for a nicely toned piece? Because it's published in a price sheet? That is ONE dimensional way of looking at coin market, IMO. The best thing to do is research as best you can auction records and look at a lot of coins. Over time it will make more sense....
jom
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<< <i>Sure glad I do not collect tarnish.... leaves money for more good stuff. Cheers, RickO >>
unfortunately you make a valid point, I wish dealers wouldn't support the premiums for toners, and i wish collectors wouldn't support the dealers who do. >>
Me too, so I could finally buy beautiful toners at a decent price!
- Jim
are rare enough on their own to not need any additional attributes to create demand (ie strike, color, etc.). But in the case of very common coins like Morgans, Mercs, SLQ, Roosies,
Franklins, etc., the hobby has promoted additional attributes to make a rarer segment....hence FSB, FBL, FH, FB, DMPL, etc. While "toner" is not yet an attibute of the TPGs, it has basically been assigned by the hobby, esp in Morgans and Classic Commems. Interesting that Morgans never got a "strike" attribute. Probably because some dates always come well struck, and other dates never do. So instead, toners have filled that void because as already stated, mint bags, cardboard tabs, and the like have produced a fairly decent supply of Morgans and commems that can be traded at strong premiums. As the market continues to mature there will be more additions to the system. I'm still waiting for FC (full corn) on Lib nickels...or better yet FDC....full dat corn.
roadrunner
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
<< <i>No two monster toned coins are exactly the same and nor should their prices...............MJ >>
A cool thread and some very good points made by everyone... Nice evaluations Brandon!
MJ hit the nail smack on the head with that statement... We all hear about the price guide verses prices paid for toned coins and even common dates... When i look at purchasing a true MONSTER toner certain characteristics are what i search for...Has to have eye appeal, clean in your face surfaces (meaning not an obvious distraction) and this which MJ`s statement points to "It`s one of a kind character"...Pretty simple and that`s the ones i love to collect...
AB
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."