I'm loving the love-fest and the outcome. Good for both of you. It's nice to see something that could be ugly into the weekend turn out civil...for chance.
I don't know what the private apology was. But, I don't think it's a done deal until tee135 ponies up some money and pays for not only the inconvenience but the loss of physical assets. There is compensation owed in my mind. I don't care about the legality it's the morality.
bob
Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
just got on the BST and read this post.. Wont even go into the trade offer I was working on with this person of intrest just a day ago. It was beyond insulting and certainly most on this board would think the person of intrest was drinking, smoking or doing drugs. I will NEVER do any deals with this person. I think theres more out there and spoiled fruit dont fall far from the tree. I hate rotten fruit! Nuff Said.. but I thought it should be said.
If one bites off more than they can chew then they should pay up....plain and simple. After all it's just money. This isn't much different than fraud. Borrowing from Peter to pay Paul in a never ending daisy chain. Comparable to buying/selling on margin without telling the dealer you borrowed anything.
I once recommended to my brother than he buy stock in the company I worked for after the share price got pummeled immediately following after 9-11. I was convinced it would bounce back after a -90% hit. Well it didn't. He lost $5,000 on my recommendation when the stock went essentially to zero...I lost multiples of that in my 401K. While I was certainly not obligated in any way I eventually made him whole and then some. There's just times you do what's right.
<< <i>If you think a 3 party deal can get complicated, wait until you want to trade your 3000 eggs for bread and bacon and oranges so you can have breakfast, but the butcher isn't slaughtering pigs until friday, and the bread was baked 2 days ago and is getting stale, and the oranges are still green on the tree. >>
.....and nobody's accepting dollars.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>I don't know what the private apology was. But, I don't think it's a done deal until tee135 ponies up some money and pays for not only the inconvenience but the loss of physical assets. There is compensation owed in my mind. I don't care about the legality it's the morality.
bob >>
Both you and RoadRunner make valid points about compensation for something like this. Although I probably dont have a legal leg to stand on, its more of an ethics/morals issue anyway. Thus far, nothing other than an "im sorry" has been offered. If the seller....Tee135....feels its right to make a small financial compensation for the trouble he has caused me, I would be thrilled to accept the offer, and have him send the money to charity. Airplane Nut's pancreatic research charity comes to mind.
After a couple more PMs, seller Tee135 has decided to make a $50 donation to charity on my suggestion. I have contacted AirplaneNut about this and await his mailing address.
It seems we may end up with a bit of a "silver lining" on this unfortunate exchange.
<< <i>If you think a 3 party deal can get complicated, wait until you want to trade your 3000 eggs for bread and bacon and oranges so you can have breakfast, but the butcher isn't slaughtering pigs until friday, and the bread was baked 2 days ago and is getting stale, and the oranges are still green on the tree. >>
which is one reason we should all be very thankful for the blessings we have.
What Alain did was wrong, and there is no excuse for it, however we all step on our...er make mistakes from time to time. I have had some dealings with Alain and he has always been prompt with his payments. We have had quite a few PM's and I don't think that he is a bad guy, and I think he has learned a lesson.
We all want to give and are entitled to our opinion on this, but I think the decision on how to handle it is ultimately up to Phil imo. Being that it sounds like Phil is ok with it all at this point for the most part and Alain has publicly apologized, I think, and again it's just my opinion, that we shouldn't drag this on anymore. It was a public lessoned learned for everyone, so let's just let it be that and be big enough to leave it at that. Agreed?
To forgive is to free a prisoner, and to discover that prisoner was you.
<< <i>1st of all I would like to thank Phil for his kind words in spite of what I did..thank you Phil I am again very sorry...I was wrong wrong wrong in speculating of the silver prices, I hope that somehow I can change everyone ideas about me...I am usually not this way, I guess I over extended myself...sales came in much to fast...I have had sales of 15k and many sales 1k-2k in value...all were delivered in a speedy manner...all were completed with the buyers 100% satisfaction...I am asking for a 2nd chance..I have learned and will certainly not let this happen again...I am asking in public for a 2nd chance, a chance to do what I enjoy so much...let me do it in a honest and honorable way!!! alain, >>
I forgive when it involves family and friends.
I don't forgive when it has to do with business matters.
No transactions will ever be done between us.
"Gold is money, and nothing else" (JP Morgan, 1912)
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
I've done several transactions with tee including a four figure deal a few days ago. Every transaction went smoothly and I wouldn't hesitate to deal with him in the future.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Not cool! Even an apology and $50 donation seems inadequate given the size of the deal
An apology, when given sincerely, is adequate. But that's easy for me to say not being the one been lied to. It's a tough call, but as I said earlier, the only one that really matters is Phils.
To forgive is to free a prisoner, and to discover that prisoner was you.
<< <i>Not cool! Even an apology and $50 donation seems inadequate given the size of the deal
An apology, when given sincerely, is adequate. But that's easy for me to say not being the one been lied to. It's a tough call, but as I said earlier, the only one that really matters is Phils. >>
I agree to an extent that the only opinion that matters in this case is Phil's as long as we restrict that to the evaluation of how aggravated or harmed Phil had become and how he is at the present time. However, the opinion of each of us is mightily important for future dealings with respect to various folks on the boards. In the past I had never done a deal with either member, but I can assure you that in the future I would not engage in a deal with Alain. There are simply too many avenues one can follow for a deal to voluntarily ignore warning signs and put oneself in jeopardy. I would also warn others if I were asked an opinion on the matter.
<< <i>Not cool! Even an apology and $50 donation seems inadequate given the size of the deal
An apology, when given sincerely, is adequate. But that's easy for me to say not being the one been lied to. It's a tough call, but as I said earlier, the only one that really matters is Phils. >>
I agree to an extent that the only opinion that matters in this case is Phil's as long as we restrict that to the evaluation of how aggravated or harmed Phil had become and how he is at the present time. However, the opinion of each of us is mightily important for future dealings with respect to various folks on the boards. In the past I had never done a deal with either member, but I can assure you that in the future I would not engage in a deal with Alain. There are simply too many avenues one can follow for a deal to voluntarily ignore warning signs and put oneself in jeopardy. I would also warn others if I were asked an opinion on the matter. >>
DITTOOOO DITTOOOO... BETTER SAFE THEN SORRY....SHOWING HIS COLORS AFTER BEING CALLED ON IT!.. NO DEAL!
I have sent the money order as per agreement...I am asking all for a 2nd chance...please please and another please... I can do coins, I just over extended myself...this should be a lesson for all those do sometimes get ahead of themselves.. alain
I haven't been on the board lately because I've been flying a lot this month, so, this is the first I've heard of this. This does sound very bad, but, I did just complete a $15000 deal with Tee135 (Alain) last month and he was completely honest with me and delivered within a week of the deal. We talked on the phone several times and we continue to PM each other a few times a week. I don't know the exact details or have talked to Alain about this, but, I hope that some of you can forgive him and allow him to continue to post here. Although I'm not buying any PMs at this price, I would still feel comfortable buying from him in the in future. Again, I'm not defending him, but, I would give him a second chance.
<< <i>I haven't been on the board lately because I've been flying a lot this month, so, this is the first I've heard of this. This does sound very bad, but, I did just complete a $15000 deal with Tee135 (Alain) last month and he was completely honest with me and delivered within a week of the deal. We talked on the phone several times and we continue to PM each other a few times a week. I don't know the exact details or have talked to Alain about this, but, I hope that some of you can forgive him and allow him to continue to post here. Although I'm not buying any PMs at this price, I would still feel comfortable buying from him in the in future. Again, I'm not defending him, but, I would give him a second chance. >>
Zubie, it was that 500 oz deal you did with him just a short while ago that gave me enough confidence to commit to a deal with Alain. I remember you giving glowing praise for how easy the deal was, and what an honest seller he was. Basically it was the only reason I trusted him at his word. I have forgiven him...however, there will not be any more deal talking between us again. Alain has made things right by donating $50 to charity.....Im out 200 Engelhards that I did not want to sell.....but the sun is still going to come up this morning.
Totally reminds me of another incident/seller not so long ago , selling silver he simply did not have.That didn't end well either did it ? I guess some learn while others...not so much.
<< <i>Totally reminds me of another incident/seller not so long ago , selling silver he simply did not have.That didn't end well either did it ? I guess some learn while others...not so much. >>
Are you talking about Cameron? You are right, it didn't end well.
Since we are going off topic here, I'd like to thank Tee for the nice California Crown Mint 10 oz kit-kat style silver bar that just came today. It's a nice looking silver bar and he shipped it before he even got my check.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Totally reminds me of another incident/seller not so long ago , selling silver he simply did not have.That didn't end well either did it ? I guess some learn while others...not so much. >>
Are you talking about Cameron? You are right, it didn't end well. >>
In my short time here i've lost count of the deals that soured from the BST. A lot of people seem to think it easy to make money flipping metals,having the said metal in the first place is kinda vital.
I have contacted Tee in regards to some coins he had for sale on the BST, while we could not agree on a pair price he was pleasant both before and after I passed on the deal. No problems here and he is okay in my book.
In the past I had never done a deal with either member, but I can assure you that in the future I would not engage in a deal with Alain. There are simply too many avenues one can follow for a deal to voluntarily ignore warning signs and put oneself in jeopardy. I would also warn others if I were asked an opinion on the matter.
I don't sell coins I don't have. Why should anyone else? When the market turns against such a person, who do you go to? It's bad policy and it's a bad idea to accomodate someone else on those terms.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>I have contacted Tee in regards to some coins he had for sale on the BST, while we could not agree on a pair price he was pleasant both before and after I passed on the deal. No problems here and he is okay in my book. >>
I've been ripped off half a dozen times in my collecting career and in each case the other party was quite pleasant and cordial before and during the early stages of a transaction. The politeness didn't help much after they had my coins and/or money.
I guess I get offended by different things than most folks. I read all this and unless I overlooked a post it looks like all the acrimony against the seller was because he was 'speculating' on silver, by his own admission, and selling a product he didn't have in hand.
I don't like that...but I'm more offended by the fact that when the buyer called to make the payment, the sellers excuse for not being able to go through was no 'Im in over my head from speculation'.....it was 'medical'. So not only did he misrepresent his capacity to do the deal while it was ongoing...when it went south, he chose to mislead the buyer about the reason he couldn't complete the deal.
Quite frankly, his veracity leaves much to be desired and I wouldn't trust him on a $100 deal let alone something larger. Just my opinion.
<< <i>So, you have someone selling something they don't have, to someone who can't afford to buy it all.
And the deal went bad.
What a shocker. >>
I thought the point was that the buyer had disposed of something he would not otherwise have disposed of in order to raise the funds to cover the purchase, at which point he COULD afford to buy it all.
That is why the "no harm, no foul" rule does not apply in this case.
That said, an apology has been made and accepted, a token fine has been paid, and why can't we just all get along with our lives???
TD
"The end of the world is over there. This ain't it!"
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
"I thought the point was that the buyer had disposed of something he would not otherwise have disposed of in order to raise the funds to cover the purchase, at which point he COULD afford to buy it all."
That is the part of this deal I do not understand. Why he sold 200 1oz Engs so he could buy 400 1oz Engs? Why not just get the 200 1oz Engs the combined deals would net? Maybe I missed something.
<< <i>"I thought the point was that the buyer had disposed of something he would not otherwise have disposed of in order to raise the funds to cover the purchase, at which point he COULD afford to buy it all."
That is the part of this deal I do not understand. Why he sold 200 1oz Engs so he could buy 400 1oz Engs? Why not just get the 200 1oz Engs the combined deals would net? Maybe I missed something. >>
You did miss something....its in the very 1st post of this thread. My co-workers wanted some silver too, so as a buddy, I sold them 200 oz of my stash. The moral of the story is that no good deed goes unpunished. However, had Tee135 actually had the 400oz that he commited to me.....we wouldnt have been talking about any of this.
The first post did not mention what type of silver you sold. I thought it was generic so you could get Engs, which would make sense. Also, the first post did not mention your friends also wanted some silver: "Because I could only absorb half of the 400oz for myself, I got a few co-workers on board." Thats what made it confusing.
Agree about the confusing part. I read the OP as "I wanted to buy 400 oz., talked some co-workers into going in on half of it because I couldn't cash flow all 400 oz, seller didn't have the 400 oz., so when the deal went bad, to save face with my co-workers I took 200 oz. of my own and sold them to said co-workers". Thus my response earlier. Where have I erred in my interpretation?
<< <i>Agree about the confusing part. I read the OP as "I wanted to buy 400 oz., talked some co-workers into going in on half of it because I couldn't cash flow all 400 oz, seller didn't have the 400 oz., so when the deal went bad, to save face with my co-workers I took 200 oz. of my own and sold them to said co-workers". Thus my response earlier. Where have I erred in my interpretation? >>
A co-worker had asked me previously (last month) to let him know if I found any decent silver deals as he was ready to buy some. After asking Tee how many bars he had (he said 400), I then told my buddy at work. Three others also wanted in as my buddy and I talked about the silver on/about March 4th. I told them that 400oz was available, but I could only do 200oz. The other 4 guys decided on 50oz each, so I told them I needed the cash by March 9th, as I was gonna buy on the 10th. So now all 4 guys commit to 50oz each, and Tee ASSURES me he has 400oz off to the side for me. On March 9th, I bring 200 oz of my personal Engelhards to work, and deliver the bars and collect the cash. The morning of March 10th, I message Tee that im ready with the cash as agreed to, and he flakes out.
Anyone who is attempting to turn this into my fault is a complete moron, or has an agenda. If everyone sticks to their word, then everyone is happy. Of the 6 people involved in this transaction, just a single person flaked....and he has come here to not only admit to it, but also apologize for it. Its nice to see you show your true colors though telephoto. Please keep the antagonizing up so more people can see you for what you really are.
I've tried to avoid commenting on these type of threads across the board, and I've seen a bunch in 10 years.
Geck, sometimes the middle man get's burned. That sometimes is only when the middle man moves first with funds or product.
You sold your coworkers 200oz, they got what they wanted at the price+ last week. I don't see why you didn't just put the deal together and deliver as delivered to you. How hard would it have been to say "hey I might have a guy lined up to make this happen at such and such a price to YOU" and go from there. Are you trying to play your coworkers? What was the net for you, had to be something, which makes me think this wasn't a friendly deal from your standpoint at all if you wouldn't just point your buds to 200oz from tee w/o profit...? Yes time is worth something, but an ultimate what, 30-60 minutes on the board here that you hang out at anyway...
Yes the deal commit was hosed, and that sucks, but you jumped the gun and speculated yourself, took your 'hit' (if you can call it that) and are not taking much responsibility for it. You sold 200 engs for spot+ right, delivered, and the issue is your replacement line up had a problem. You say you have replacement all but in possession now, and silver is down from last week, so how much were you making or losing from your work buds...?
Just asking as you're getting defensive with folks not really 100% siding with you because you didn't get your cut right, when you jumped the gun.
<< <i>I've tried to avoid commenting on these type of threads across the board, and I've seen a bunch in 10 years.
Geck, sometimes the middle man get's burned. That sometimes is only when the middle man moves first with funds or product.
You sold your coworkers 200oz, they got what they wanted at the price+ last week. I don't see why you didn't just put the deal together and deliver as delivered to you. How hard would it have been to say "hey I might have a guy lined up to make this happen at such and such a price to YOU" and go from there. Are you trying to play your coworkers? What was the net for you, had to be something, which makes me think this wasn't a friendly deal from your standpoint at all if you wouldn't just point your buds to 200oz from tee w/o profit...? Yes time is worth something, but an ultimate what, 30-60 minutes on the board here that you hang out at anyway...
Yes the deal commit was hosed, and that sucks, but you jumped the gun and speculated yourself, took your 'hit' (if you can call it that) and are not taking much responsibility for it. You sold 200 engs for spot+ right, delivered, and the issue is your replacement line up had a problem. You say you have replacement all but in possession now, and silver is down from last week, so how much were you making or losing from your work buds...?
Just asking as you're getting defensive with folks not really 100% siding with you because you didn't get your cut right, when you jumped the gun. >>
On what basis do you make the accusation that he was making a "net" from his co-workers? That is nowhere in evidence. Obviously you have never been in a position where you could trust your co-workers, or they could trust you.
There are places and professions in the world where you can trust your co-workers, and where you cut your friends in on deals at no benefit to yourself just because they are your friends.
I think you own Phil an apology.
TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
Comments
tee135 - just remember, honesty is the best policy. You seem to be on the right track but I am sure people will be watching.
tee135 ponies up some money and pays for not only the inconvenience but the
loss of physical assets. There is compensation owed in my mind. I don't care about
the legality it's the morality.
bob
just got on the BST and read this post.. Wont even go into the trade offer I was working on with this person of intrest just a day ago. It was beyond insulting and certainly most on this board would think the person of intrest was drinking, smoking or doing drugs. I will NEVER do any deals with this person. I think theres more out there and spoiled fruit dont fall far from the tree. I hate rotten fruit! Nuff Said.. but I thought it should be said.
Borrowing from Peter to pay Paul in a never ending daisy chain. Comparable to buying/selling on margin without telling the dealer you borrowed anything.
I once recommended to my brother than he buy stock in the company I worked for after the share price got pummeled immediately following after 9-11. I was convinced it would
bounce back after a -90% hit. Well it didn't. He lost $5,000 on my recommendation when the stock went essentially to zero...I lost multiples of that in my 401K.
While I was certainly not obligated in any way I eventually made him whole and then some. There's just times you do what's right.
roadrunner
<< <i>If you think a 3 party deal can get complicated, wait until you want to trade your 3000 eggs for bread and bacon and oranges so you can have breakfast, but the butcher isn't slaughtering pigs until friday, and the bread was baked 2 days ago and is getting stale, and the oranges are still green on the tree. >>
.....and nobody's accepting dollars.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>I don't know what the private apology was. But, I don't think it's a done deal until
tee135 ponies up some money and pays for not only the inconvenience but the
loss of physical assets. There is compensation owed in my mind. I don't care about
the legality it's the morality.
bob >>
Both you and RoadRunner make valid points about compensation for something like this. Although I probably dont have a legal leg to stand on, its more of an ethics/morals issue anyway. Thus far, nothing other than an "im sorry" has been offered. If the seller....Tee135....feels its right to make a small financial compensation for the trouble he has caused me, I would be thrilled to accept the offer, and have him send the money to charity. Airplane Nut's pancreatic research charity comes to mind.
Sorry.
Loves me some shiny!
It seems we may end up with a bit of a "silver lining" on this unfortunate exchange.
<< <i>Tee135 is doing 15k deals he's got the bucks to make this right...just too cheap. Tee135 blocked. >>
DITTOOOO!
<< <i>If you think a 3 party deal can get complicated, wait until you want to trade your 3000 eggs for bread and bacon and oranges so you can have breakfast, but the butcher isn't slaughtering pigs until friday, and the bread was baked 2 days ago and is getting stale, and the oranges are still green on the tree.
which is one reason we should all be very thankful for the blessings we have.
clears.
bob
You got some good karma going for you G...
Enough said.
<< <i>
<< <i>Hi...I made a mistake and its my fault...I do not know what else to say... >>
Goodbye would be a good start. >>
Very well put!
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
<< <i>1st of all I would like to thank Phil for his kind words in spite of what I did..thank you Phil
I am again very sorry...I was wrong wrong wrong in speculating of the silver prices, I hope that somehow I can change everyone ideas about me...I am usually not this way, I guess I over extended myself...sales came in much to fast...I have had sales of 15k and many sales 1k-2k in value...all were delivered in a speedy manner...all were completed with the buyers 100% satisfaction...I am asking for a 2nd chance..I have learned and will certainly not let this happen again...I am asking in public for a 2nd chance, a chance to do what I enjoy so much...let me do it in a honest and honorable way!!!
alain, >>
I forgive when it involves family and friends.
I don't forgive when it has to do with business matters.
No transactions will ever be done between us.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
An apology, when given sincerely, is adequate. But that's easy for me to say not being the one been lied to. It's a tough call, but as I said earlier, the only one that really matters is Phils.
<< <i>Not cool! Even an apology and $50 donation seems inadequate given the size of the deal
An apology, when given sincerely, is adequate. But that's easy for me to say not being the one been lied to. It's a tough call, but as I said earlier, the only one that really matters is Phils. >>
I agree to an extent that the only opinion that matters in this case is Phil's as long as we restrict that to the evaluation of how aggravated or harmed Phil had become and how he is at the present time. However, the opinion of each of us is mightily important for future dealings with respect to various folks on the boards. In the past I had never done a deal with either member, but I can assure you that in the future I would not engage in a deal with Alain. There are simply too many avenues one can follow for a deal to voluntarily ignore warning signs and put oneself in jeopardy. I would also warn others if I were asked an opinion on the matter.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>
<< <i>Not cool! Even an apology and $50 donation seems inadequate given the size of the deal
An apology, when given sincerely, is adequate. But that's easy for me to say not being the one been lied to. It's a tough call, but as I said earlier, the only one that really matters is Phils. >>
I agree to an extent that the only opinion that matters in this case is Phil's as long as we restrict that to the evaluation of how aggravated or harmed Phil had become and how he is at the present time. However, the opinion of each of us is mightily important for future dealings with respect to various folks on the boards. In the past I had never done a deal with either member, but I can assure you that in the future I would not engage in a deal with Alain. There are simply too many avenues one can follow for a deal to voluntarily ignore warning signs and put oneself in jeopardy. I would also warn others if I were asked an opinion on the matter. >>
DITTOOOO DITTOOOO... BETTER SAFE THEN SORRY....SHOWING HIS COLORS AFTER BEING CALLED ON IT!.. NO DEAL!
I can do coins, I just over extended myself...this should be a lesson for all those do sometimes get ahead of themselves..
alain
I don't know the exact details or have talked to Alain about this, but, I hope that some of you can forgive him and allow him to continue to post here.
Although I'm not buying any PMs at this price, I would still feel comfortable buying from him in the in future.
Again, I'm not defending him, but, I would give him a second chance.
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<< <i>I haven't been on the board lately because I've been flying a lot this month, so, this is the first I've heard of this. This does sound very bad, but, I did just complete a $15000 deal with Tee135 (Alain) last month and he was completely honest with me and delivered within a week of the deal. We talked on the phone several times and we continue to PM each other a few times a week.
I don't know the exact details or have talked to Alain about this, but, I hope that some of you can forgive him and allow him to continue to post here.
Although I'm not buying any PMs at this price, I would still feel comfortable buying from him in the in future.
Again, I'm not defending him, but, I would give him a second chance. >>
Zubie, it was that 500 oz deal you did with him just a short while ago that gave me enough confidence to commit to a deal with Alain. I remember you giving glowing praise for how easy the deal was, and what an honest seller he was. Basically it was the only reason I trusted him at his word. I have forgiven him...however, there will not be any more deal talking between us again. Alain has made things right by donating $50 to charity.....Im out 200 Engelhards that I did not want to sell.....but the sun is still going to come up this morning.
<< <i>Totally reminds me of another incident/seller not so long ago , selling silver he simply did not have.That didn't end well either did it ? I guess some learn while others...not so much. >>
Are you talking about Cameron? You are right, it didn't end well.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>
<< <i>Totally reminds me of another incident/seller not so long ago , selling silver he simply did not have.That didn't end well either did it ? I guess some learn while others...not so much. >>
Are you talking about Cameron? You are right, it didn't end well. >>
In my short time here i've lost count of the deals that soured from the BST. A lot of people seem to think it easy to make money flipping metals,having the said metal in the first place is kinda vital.
I don't sell coins I don't have. Why should anyone else? When the market turns against such a person, who do you go to? It's bad policy and it's a bad idea to accomodate someone else on those terms.
I knew it would happen.
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mariner67, and Mikes coins
<< <i>I have contacted Tee in regards to some coins he had for sale on the BST, while we could not agree on a pair price he was pleasant both before and after I passed on the deal. No problems here and he is okay in my book. >>
I've been ripped off half a dozen times in my collecting career and in each case the other party was quite pleasant and cordial before and during the early stages of a transaction.
The politeness didn't help much after they had my coins and/or money.
roadrunner
And the deal went bad.
What a shocker.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
I don't like that...but I'm more offended by the fact that when the buyer called to make the payment, the sellers excuse for not being able to go through was no 'Im in over my head from speculation'.....it was 'medical'. So not only did he misrepresent his capacity to do the deal while it was ongoing...when it went south, he chose to mislead the buyer about the reason he couldn't complete the deal.
Quite frankly, his veracity leaves much to be desired and I wouldn't trust him on a $100 deal let alone something larger. Just my opinion.
Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum
<< <i>So, you have someone selling something they don't have, to someone who can't afford to buy it all.
And the deal went bad.
What a shocker. >>
I held up my end.....not sure im understanding your point.
<< <i>So, you have someone selling something they don't have, to someone who can't afford to buy it all.
And the deal went bad.
What a shocker. >>
I thought the point was that the buyer had disposed of something he would not otherwise have disposed of in order to raise the funds to cover the purchase, at which point he COULD afford to buy it all.
That is why the "no harm, no foul" rule does not apply in this case.
That said, an apology has been made and accepted, a token fine has been paid, and why can't we just all get along with our lives???
TD
"The end of the world is over there. This ain't it!"
That is the part of this deal I do not understand. Why he sold 200 1oz Engs so he could buy 400 1oz Engs? Why not just get the 200 1oz Engs the combined deals would net? Maybe I missed something.
<< <i>"I thought the point was that the buyer had disposed of something he would not otherwise have disposed of in order to raise the funds to cover the purchase, at which point he COULD afford to buy it all."
That is the part of this deal I do not understand. Why he sold 200 1oz Engs so he could buy 400 1oz Engs? Why not just get the 200 1oz Engs the combined deals would net? Maybe I missed something. >>
You did miss something....its in the very 1st post of this thread. My co-workers wanted some silver too, so as a buddy, I sold them 200 oz of my stash. The moral of the story is that no good deed goes unpunished. However, had Tee135 actually had the 400oz that he commited to me.....we wouldnt have been talking about any of this.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
<< <i>Agree about the confusing part. I read the OP as "I wanted to buy 400 oz., talked some co-workers into going in on half of it because I couldn't cash flow all 400 oz, seller didn't have the 400 oz., so when the deal went bad, to save face with my co-workers I took 200 oz. of my own and sold them to said co-workers". Thus my response earlier. Where have I erred in my interpretation? >>
A co-worker had asked me previously (last month) to let him know if I found any decent silver deals as he was ready to buy some. After asking Tee how many bars he had (he said 400), I then told my buddy at work. Three others also wanted in as my buddy and I talked about the silver on/about March 4th. I told them that 400oz was available, but I could only do 200oz. The other 4 guys decided on 50oz each, so I told them I needed the cash by March 9th, as I was gonna buy on the 10th. So now all 4 guys commit to 50oz each, and Tee ASSURES me he has 400oz off to the side for me. On March 9th, I bring 200 oz of my personal Engelhards to work, and deliver the bars and collect the cash. The morning of March 10th, I message Tee that im ready with the cash as agreed to, and he flakes out.
Anyone who is attempting to turn this into my fault is a complete moron, or has an agenda. If everyone sticks to their word, then everyone is happy. Of the 6 people involved in this transaction, just a single person flaked....and he has come here to not only admit to it, but also apologize for it. Its nice to see you show your true colors though telephoto. Please keep the antagonizing up so more people can see you for what you really are.
Geck, sometimes the middle man get's burned. That sometimes is only when the middle man moves first with funds or product.
You sold your coworkers 200oz, they got what they wanted at the price+ last week. I don't see why you didn't just put the deal together and deliver as delivered to you. How hard would it have been to say "hey I might have a guy lined up to make this happen at such and such a price to YOU" and go from there. Are you trying to play your coworkers? What was the net for you, had to be something, which makes me think this wasn't a friendly deal from your standpoint at all if you wouldn't just point your buds to 200oz from tee w/o profit...? Yes time is worth something, but an ultimate what, 30-60 minutes on the board here that you hang out at anyway...
Yes the deal commit was hosed, and that sucks, but you jumped the gun and speculated yourself, took your 'hit' (if you can call it that) and are not taking much responsibility for it. You sold 200 engs for spot+ right, delivered, and the issue is your replacement line up had a problem. You say you have replacement all but in possession now, and silver is down from last week, so how much were you making or losing from your work buds...?
Just asking as you're getting defensive with folks not really 100% siding with you because you didn't get your cut right, when you jumped the gun.
<< <i>I've tried to avoid commenting on these type of threads across the board, and I've seen a bunch in 10 years.
Geck, sometimes the middle man get's burned. That sometimes is only when the middle man moves first with funds or product.
You sold your coworkers 200oz, they got what they wanted at the price+ last week. I don't see why you didn't just put the deal together and deliver as delivered to you. How hard would it have been to say "hey I might have a guy lined up to make this happen at such and such a price to YOU" and go from there. Are you trying to play your coworkers? What was the net for you, had to be something, which makes me think this wasn't a friendly deal from your standpoint at all if you wouldn't just point your buds to 200oz from tee w/o profit...? Yes time is worth something, but an ultimate what, 30-60 minutes on the board here that you hang out at anyway...
Yes the deal commit was hosed, and that sucks, but you jumped the gun and speculated yourself, took your 'hit' (if you can call it that) and are not taking much responsibility for it. You sold 200 engs for spot+ right, delivered, and the issue is your replacement line up had a problem. You say you have replacement all but in possession now, and silver is down from last week, so how much were you making or losing from your work buds...?
Just asking as you're getting defensive with folks not really 100% siding with you because you didn't get your cut right, when you jumped the gun. >>
On what basis do you make the accusation that he was making a "net" from his co-workers? That is nowhere in evidence. Obviously you have never been in a position where you could trust your co-workers, or they could trust you.
There are places and professions in the world where you can trust your co-workers, and where you cut your friends in on deals at no benefit to yourself just because they are your friends.
I think you own Phil an apology.
TD
<< <i>
I think you own Phil an apology. >>
Whole heartedly agree. I never try to profit from friends / coworkers. Not that everyone has the same beliefs...but don't sling undue mud.