<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
You are joking, right? The rightful owner will likely not see the coins for a long time.
<< <i>It may be that HA ultimately gets this thing right, that remains to be seen. In the meantime, the problem is that they have not acted in a way that would cause the OP (or any of us if we were in her shoes) to feel any reassurance-in fact, just the opposite. Major PR/customer service error if nothing else. >>
Would you feel the same way if you had consigned the coins and, for all you knew, had good title to them? It is more prudent and responsible for them NOT to act rashly and to sort things out in a manner that is fair to all innocent parties. I am confident that they will do the right thing >>
Yup. If they "taint" or cancel an auction based on allegations that coins auctioned are stolen, they're screwing an innocent consignor should the allegation prove false. If they let it run to completion, they can always invoke rule 46 of their terms and conditions, which includes:
"In the event that Auctioneer cannot deliver the lot or subsequently it is established that the lot lacks title, or other transfer or condition issue is claimed, In such cases the sole remedy shall be limited to rescission of sale and refund of the amount paid by Bidder;"
They should have explained this to the OP. Letting the auction run to completion will also serve to establish current fair market value for the stolen items.
<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
Coins aren't going anywhere, HA has them. After that they will be forwarded to the evidence locker where they will hopefully gain in value.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
I think some are confusing some random call that "the coins are mine and they are stolen" versus a reported theft months ago to them and telling them that "the coins that I told you were stolen months ago are now up for auction by you". Had the OP not informed them when the coins were stolen, then I see why Hertiage would keep the auctions running. But we also have an HA representative posting into this thread stating that the auctions are "being pulled as I type" yet almost 24 hours later, they are still up and running. In addition, according to the OP, the police have faxed HA the police report which would have listed the cert #s. Why keep them running at that point when the title is in question?
The "rush" is that the auction is almost over and if the winning bidder picks them up in person, they can disappear quickly. And any chance to recover them would be gone. I personally don't trust the entire chain of command when timing is critical. This isn't just at HA, it's my trust level any company that I deal with.
But again, other forces outside of our knowledge (police) may have requested that they keep them running.
Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F."
Markets (governments) can remain irrational longer than an investor can remain solvent.
<< <i>Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession.
I've been watching and reading just to follow along as an interested party. They are still up this morning and that's okay, too. Don't tip the perp by pulling as previously mentioned. At least until the police have what they need. But, if they were mine I'd have my neighbor or best friend or somebody I knew place nuclear bids on them. Win them and then you have the option of paying for them and getting them back and suing HA. Or, not paying for them and dragging it out as long as possible to keep in the loop.
Hope this works out like it should.
bob
Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
<< <i>I've been watching and reading just to follow along as an interested party. They are still up this morning and that's okay, too. Don't tip the perp by pulling as previously mentioned. At least until the police have what they need. But, if they were mine I'd have my neighbor or best friend or somebody I knew place nuclear bids on them. Win them and then you have the option of paying for them and getting them back and suing HA. Or, not paying for them and dragging it out as long as possible to keep in the loop.
Hope this works out like it should.
bob >>
That is an interesting strategy, but I would be concerned that bidding on the coins would confuse the situation and muddle the case down the road.
<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
Coins aren't going anywhere, HA has them. After that they will be forwarded to the evidence locker where they will hopefully gain in value. >>
<< <i>Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
At least he knows where they are at.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>But again, other forces outside of our knowledge (police) may have requested that they keep them running. >>
What purpose could possibly be served by letting them run other than having a disappointed buyer and as stated earlier, running the risk that the successful buyer gets possession of the coins through some twist of circumstance?
This is looking very strange for Heritage.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA.
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?
As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?
As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related. >>
If it were, it might change things a bit, no? But, of course, Heritage should have taken down the auctions and immediately sent the coins to the rightful owner.
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?
As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related. >>
If it were, it might change things a bit, no? But, of course, Heritage should have taken down the auctions and immediately sent the coins to the rightful owner. >>
Only Heritage knows why they haven't taken the auctions down and they obviously aren't talking.
Well, they kinda did but what was said was happening, didn't actually happen.
A search of psxchelly sure shows a lot of PR70DCAM coin requests.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list? As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related. >>
Not likely with the situation that was presented on the original thread where the coins were listed as stolen.
<< <i>Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better.
<< <i>The coins are being pulled from the auction as I write this. Thank you to everyone who brought this to our attention. >>
I posted this as a direct result of seeing an e-mail from the highest level instructing that the coins be withdrawn from the auction. The person who was instructed to pull the coins was in transit to Houston at the time, but has now pulled the coins from the auction. The coins may still show up in the search results for a short time because of the way our website works, but it is no longer possible to bid on them.
We have also identified another item in our Houston auction that appear on the police report that was provided to us last night (a Proof-70 bicentennial half), and we are in the process of determining whether we should pull a fifth coin that is currently slated for a future Internet auction.
Please know that we took this matter very seriously from the beginning. We must operate under State and Federal laws and have very specific protocols and procedures for these matters. As others have surmised, we are frequently contacted by people who claim that an item we’re offering for sale appears to be an item that was stolen from them. The vast majority of these claims turn out to be false, so in fairness to everybody involved we can’t act without some deeper investigation and certain documents – such as a police report. Quite often we find the matter has been resolved or the report is mistaken.
The consignor of the coins is well-known to us, has a solid reputation and has cooperated fully. From the beginning, I have also been in contact with Doug at www.numismaticcrimes.org.
We recognize and appreciate those of you in this forum who have been understanding and helpful to the victim and to us. Thank you.
Sincerely,
Stewart Huckaby mailto:stewarth@HA.com ------------------------------------------ Heritage Auctions Heritage Auctions
<< <i>they could easily make a database of cert number to "be on the look out for"
when the cert number is enetered into the auction database, the system would automatically check the "look out" list.
it's a very simple thing to set up. >>
Yes, I agree. This is exactly what Rolex does for stolen watches. You send them a copy of the police report with the serial number/model number and whenever that watch is serviced and is checked against it's stolen watch database it's pulled and returned to the owner.
It is not that life is short, but that you are dead for so very long.
<< <i>Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better. >>
So the secretary who answered the phone should have canceled the auction and mailed the coins to the OP? Should that happen whenever someone calls Heritage and claims that a coin in their auction is stolen and belongs to them?
<< <i>[The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?. >>
Don't care. If it comes up against the database, a red flag should be raised and an internal investigation launched. Contact the person who originally reported the coins as stolen and see if there has been a resolution. Contact the police departments that have been involved.
In all reality there should be a third party database of stolen coins that all auction houses/dealers can check against. It would make it much, much easier to keep up-to-date if the victim only had one place to contact to report stolen/recovered items, etc. I'm sure if it were set up or backed by someone reputable in the hobby, then getting the major auction houses on board would not be that difficult.
Again, I'm not saying just because the coin comes up flagged that it is automatically pulled from the auction.. just that an investigation happens to ensure that if the coin is still stolen, that it is not sold off again.
<< <i>Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better. >>
So the secretary who answered the phone should have canceled the auction and mailed the coins to the OP? Should that happen whenever someone calls Heritage and claims that a coin in their auction is stolen and belongs to them? >>
No, but apparently your comprehension is not that good. I never stated as such. I did state that good customer service begins at the people that answer the phones on a daily basis, and that didn't happen in this case, otherwise there wouldn't be this entire thread.
The person on the phone should have stated something to the effect of, "while I am unfamiliar to the history of this issue, I will escalate this issue at once and we will be in communication!".
That is proper customer service. To be coy and treat the caller as though there would be no action simply proves they need to improve their customer service process.
<< <i>Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better. >>
So the secretary who answered the phone should have canceled the auction and mailed the coins to the OP? Should that happen whenever someone calls Heritage and claims that a coin in their auction is stolen and belongs to them? >>
No, but apparently your comprehension is not that good. I never stated as such. I did state that good customer service begins at the people that answer the phones on a daily basis, and that didn't happen in this case, otherwise there wouldn't be this entire thread.
The person on the phone should have stated something to the effect of, "while I am unfamiliar to the history of this issue, I will escalate this issue at once and we will be in communication!".
That is proper customer service. To be coy and treat the caller as though there would be no action simply proves they need to improve their customer service process. >>
Given that there is ample evidence that we are only getting one side of the story here (the whole story), do you think it is even remotely possible that the OP might be overstating Heritage's lack of cooperation? Jeez, the auction came down within 24 hours. Is that not fast enough, and if so, what is the standard for the time lag between when they are called to when the auction is pulled.
By now, you have surely read swhuck's post in which he confirms that Heritage gets these calls all the time and has a protocol for dealing with them. I am more comforted knowing that than I am disturbed that the secretary may not have been kind enough on the phone.
you continue to read and respond to only half the story.
My response to you, yes, it's possible we are only getting half the story. But the fact remains that it took someone contacting an executive at HA before there was any (apparent) activity. The customer service representative made no effort to make a "potential" owner of stolen material comfortable that the right thing was being done.
I return to the fact that we have a huge thread to indicate something went wrong at the outset of this issue.
Had psxchelly been reassured (even if not told what would be done), the initial post most likely wouldn't be here and there would be no further discussion.
That goes back to my statement that customer service begins in the trenches. Although everyone needs to be part of the process, if it isn't being done with your customer facing side, you are missing the point of customer service.
you continue to read and respond to only half the story.
My response to you, yes, it's possible we are only getting half the story. But the fact remains that it took someone contacting an executive at HA before there was any (apparent) activity. The customer service representative made no effort to make a "potential" owner of stolen material comfortable that the right thing was being done.
I return to the fact that we have a huge thread to indicate something went wrong at the outset of this issue.
Had psxexually been reassured (even if not told what would be done), the initial post most likely wouldn't be here and there would be no further discussion.
That goes back to my statement that customer service begins in the trenches. Although everyone needs to be part of the process, if it isn't being done with your customer facing side, you are missing the point of customer service. >>
Based on my interpretation of the events and the only facts that we really have (that the coins are alleged to be stolen and the auctions were taken down within 24 hours), I believe that Heritage acted appropriately. The rest of our argument is conjecture based on interpretation of the OP's posts, which, IMO, were rather emotional and may or may not reflect what happened on the phone. I cannot condemn Heritage based on the facts that are provided.
RYK and LanLord are very respected on these threads. From reading this thread, HA has responded well in many of our eyes, possibly due to the action taken by some members here. I do agree with LanLord in that HA needs to make their customer service aware of sensitive issues such as these. It's their front line that will make or break them, and I'm sure there is a learning curve at their headquarters concerning what has taken place here. Well done, all, and let cooler heads prevail.
<< <i>RYK and LanLord are very respected on these threads. From reading this thread, HA has responded well in many of our eyes, possibly due to the action taken by some members here. I do agree with LanLord in that HA needs to make their customer service aware of sensitive issues such as these. It's their front line that will make or break them, and I'm sure there is a learning curve at their headquarters concerning what has taken place here. Well done, all, and let cooler heads prevail. >>
Hey! There's no reason to sully RYK's name like that! ;p
<< <i>Please know that we took this matter very seriously from the beginning. We must operate under State and Federal laws and have very specific protocols and procedures for these matters. As others have surmised, we are frequently contacted by people who claim that an item we’re offering for sale appears to be an item that was stolen from them. The vast majority of these claims turn out to be false, so in fairness to everybody involved we can’t act without some deeper investigation and certain documents – such as a police report. Quite often we find the matter has been resolved or the report is mistaken. >>
<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
You are joking, right? The rightful owner will likely not see the coins for a long time. >>
Versus possibly not ever seeing the coins at all? He doesn't have the coins now, the coins were stolen remember? Waiting for the coins is still infinitely better than never having them. Capiche?
You'd better have another cup of coffee before posting next time. LOL
I hope things work out for the OP. A couple of days later to look on HA and she might have missed them completely. I hope to hear how this all turned out George
Hey everyone, first of all I just want to say that I appreciate everyone's support.
Secondly I wanted to say that this thread wasn't intended to start disagreements, so *pretty please don't get mad at one another*.
I have been reading some of the posts, and I just want everyone to understand that this in no way was a "domestic dispute" as some of you have assumed. This was a theft. A person broke into my house while I was taking my husband to the hospital back on July 6th 2010. The thief found my 2 safes and broke them open. I reported it *immediately* to the police and they took a report, a list of stolen items, fingerprints and everything else the police do.
Even though this next part was at first personal, (and now its not going to be) those particular coins I posted mean more to me than just $$$. I have been collecting all my coins for about 10ish years. When I originally posted about the theft in July, and now, I just didn't feel like sharing at the time that my husband became ill right around when we bought our first Ike in Aug of 2006. My husband and I collected those 3 Ikes together, for something to share together with one another. We sat together, and participated in the auction together. Hes a little sicker now, and if anything happens to him the whole point of us buying and collecting the coins was that I would have something to hold and remember what we did together. We all collect coins for one reason or another, and that's my reason... now I'm sad at work ugh.
So please, if you have something you wish to say or ask me, please PM me.
I agree with Landlord that the front line person could have been more helpful and put the OP at ease knowing that the matter WAS going to be addressed.
I also believe that Heritage went threw the proper steps to assure that the coins were indeed stolen.
The only problem I see here is someone with influence had to go to the top to get things started. Or at least it looks that way.
<< <i>Hey everyone, first of all I just want to say that I appreciate everyone's support.
Secondly I wanted to say that this thread wasn't intended to start disagreements, so *pretty please don't get mad at one another*.
I have been reading some of the posts, and I just want everyone to understand that this in no way was a "domestic dispute" as some of you have assumed. This was a theft. A person broke into my house while I was taking my husband to the hospital back on July 6th 2010. The thief found my 2 safes and broke them open. I reported it *immediately* to the police and they took a report, a list of stolen items, fingerprints and everything else the police do.
Even though this next part was at first personal, (and now its not going to be) those particular coins I posted mean more to me than just $$$. I have been collecting all my coins for about 10ish years. When I originally posted about the theft in July, and now, I just didn't feel like sharing at the time that my husband became ill right around when we bought our first Ike in Aug of 2006. My husband and I collected those 3 Ikes together, for something to share together with one another. We sat together, and participated in the auction together. Hes a little sicker now, and if anything happens to him the whole point of us buying and collecting the coins was that I would have something to hold and remember what we did together. We all collect coins for one reason or another, and that's my reason... now I'm sad at work ugh.
So please, if you have something you wish to say or ask me, please PM me.
edited to add: Thanks everyone -Michelle >>
I truly wish you and your husband well Michelle.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>Mark and Ryk, I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
I can't see it taking "years" as long as the OP has proper evidence of previous purchase and ownership.
I agree with a previous post...get an attorney and I think the coins could be returned quickly.
<< <i>I agree with Landlord that the front line person could have been more helpful and put the OP at ease knowing that the matter WAS going to be addressed.
I also believe that Heritage went threw the proper steps to assure that the coins were indeed stolen.
The only problem I see here is someone with influence had to go to the top to get things started. Or at least it looks that way.
JMHO >>
Dimeman could say in a few lines what I was trying to say. Thank you.
And I too with the OP and her husband all the best.
I can't believe the foolishness of the OP in starting this thread. Anything involving stolen merchandise should not be discussed in public, as it tips off the their that they are being investigated. As an auctioneer who ran 50 auctions a year in the 1990s, I cannot tell you how many times someone claimed that an auction item we listed "must be" their stolen item. Not once had this proven true, but we investigated every claim at considerable expense. Anyone can make such an accusation, but without a police report or documentation auctioneers cannot withdraw an item from sale just because someone makes an accusation.
Frank Provasek - PCGS Authorized Dealer, Life Member ANA, Member TNA. www.frankcoins.com
A couple of things I have learned from this thread. The first is Heritage needs to follow up on getting a data base running to check cert numbers for possibly stolen coins and use it diligently. I like Heritage and they always seem to get my order/win correct. The second is to start keeping a receipt for all the coins I purchase. It never crossed my mind that someday I may have to prove that I am the rightful owner of the coins I possess.
"May the silver waves that bear you heavenward be filled with love’s whisperings"
"A dog breaks your heart only one time and that is when they pass on". Unknown
Michelle, wishing you and your husband the best, and hope he gets to feeling better.
Heritage, in my view, has handled this well. The frontline maybe could have been a little better, but overall, I think it was well done. As for bringing it on the forum in a post.....I doubt there is much that someone could do to hide their involvement, if they were guilty, at this point. Heritage has the coins. The coins are still in the plastic with the same serial numbers. There is a record of who submitted them. Etc. It isn't likely that the original thief reads these forums else they probably would have tried to crack them and resubmit (hey...a 70 is a 70 is a 70, right? )
I believe she, the OP, did the right thing in her circumstances in bringing this here. And since they were in the same slabs and numbers, it isn't like she wouldn't know, and couldn't prove that they were hers...unlike auctions of things that are serial numbered/reported to the police with proof.
Comments
<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
You are joking, right? The rightful owner will likely not see the coins for a long time.
<< <i>
<< <i>It may be that HA ultimately gets this thing right, that remains to be seen. In the meantime, the problem is that they have not acted in a way that would cause the OP (or any of us if we were in her shoes) to feel any reassurance-in fact, just the opposite. Major PR/customer service error if nothing else. >>
Would you feel the same way if you had consigned the coins and, for all you knew, had good title to them? It is more prudent and responsible for them NOT to act rashly and to sort things out in a manner that is fair to all innocent parties. I am confident that they will do the right thing >>
Yup. If they "taint" or cancel an auction based on allegations that coins auctioned are stolen, they're screwing an innocent consignor should the allegation prove false. If they let it run to completion, they can always invoke rule 46 of their terms and conditions, which includes:
"In the event that Auctioneer cannot deliver the lot or subsequently it is established that the lot lacks title, or other transfer or condition issue is claimed, In such cases the sole remedy shall be limited to rescission of sale and refund of the amount paid by Bidder;"
They should have explained this to the OP. Letting the auction run to completion will also serve to establish current fair market value for the stolen items.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
Coins aren't going anywhere, HA has them. After that they will be forwarded to the evidence locker where they will hopefully gain in value.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
The "rush" is that the auction is almost over and if the winning bidder picks them up in person, they can disappear quickly. And any chance to recover them would be gone. I personally don't trust the entire chain of command when timing is critical. This isn't just at HA, it's my trust level any company that I deal with.
But again, other forces outside of our knowledge (police) may have requested that they keep them running.
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F."
<< <i>Mark and Ryk,
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession.
still up this morning and that's okay, too. Don't tip the perp by pulling as previously
mentioned. At least until the police have what they need.
But, if they were mine I'd have my neighbor or best friend or somebody I knew place
nuclear bids on them. Win them and then you have the option of paying for them and
getting them back and suing HA. Or, not paying for them and dragging it out as long
as possible to keep in the loop.
Hope this works out like it should.
bob
<< <i>I've been watching and reading just to follow along as an interested party. They are
still up this morning and that's okay, too. Don't tip the perp by pulling as previously
mentioned. At least until the police have what they need.
But, if they were mine I'd have my neighbor or best friend or somebody I knew place
nuclear bids on them. Win them and then you have the option of paying for them and
getting them back and suing HA. Or, not paying for them and dragging it out as long
as possible to keep in the loop.
Hope this works out like it should.
bob >>
That is an interesting strategy, but I would be concerned that bidding on the coins would confuse the situation and muddle the case down the road.
<< <i>
<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
Coins aren't going anywhere, HA has them. After that they will be forwarded to the evidence locker where they will hopefully gain in value. >>
And at the very least need to be reholdered!!
<< <i>
<< <i>Mark and Ryk,
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
At least he knows where they are at.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>Letting the auction run to completion will also serve to establish current fair market value for the stolen items. >>
The fair market value for PR70DCAM IKE's was established quite a while ago and letting these coins continue to run serves absolutely no purpose.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>But again, other forces outside of our knowledge (police) may have requested that they keep them running. >>
What purpose could possibly be served by letting them run other than having a disappointed buyer and as stated earlier, running the risk that the successful buyer gets possession of the coins through some twist of circumstance?
This is looking very strange for Heritage.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?
As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?
As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related. >>
If it were, it might change things a bit, no? But, of course, Heritage should have taken down the auctions and immediately sent the coins to the rightful owner.
<< <i>If it is actually the thief who consigned them, he is an absolute idiot. >>
I would suspect that the consigner is someone who bought them from the thief (probably unaware of the theft). If so, they are in for an ugly surprise.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?
As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related. >>
If it were, it might change things a bit, no? But, of course, Heritage should have taken down the auctions and immediately sent the coins to the rightful owner.
Only Heritage knows why they haven't taken the auctions down and they obviously aren't talking.
Well, they kinda did but what was said was happening, didn't actually happen.
A search of psxchelly sure shows a lot of PR70DCAM coin requests.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>
<< <i>For those that said it would be difficult or impossible for Heritage to check for large numbers of reported stolen cert numbers: that's just wrong. It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. Setting up a database of stolen cert numbers to check every lot against would take negligible time or money. Not only should it be set up, I can't believe it hasn't been set up and running since the beginning of HA. >>
The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list? As a side note, I'm beginning to wonder if this is "domestic dispute" related. >>
Not likely with the situation that was presented on the original thread where the coins were listed as stolen.
This lot has been withdrawn from this auction. Bids are no longer accepted and previous bids are cancelled.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>
<< <i>Mark and Ryk,
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better.
<< <i>The coins are being pulled from the auction as I write this. Thank you to everyone who brought this to our attention. >>
I posted this as a direct result of seeing an e-mail from the highest level instructing that the coins be withdrawn from the auction. The person who was instructed to pull the coins was in transit to Houston at the time, but has now pulled the coins from the auction. The coins may still show up in the search results for a short time because of the way our website works, but it is no longer possible to bid on them.
We have also identified another item in our Houston auction that appear on the police report that was provided to us last night (a Proof-70 bicentennial half), and we are in the process of determining whether we should pull a fifth coin that is currently slated for a future Internet auction.
Please know that we took this matter very seriously from the beginning. We must operate under State and Federal laws and have very specific protocols and procedures for these matters. As others have surmised, we are frequently contacted by people who claim that an item we’re offering for sale appears to be an item that was stolen from them. The vast majority of these claims turn out to be false, so in fairness to everybody involved we can’t act without some deeper investigation and certain documents – such as a police report. Quite often we find the matter has been resolved or the report is mistaken.
The consignor of the coins is well-known to us, has a solid reputation and has cooperated fully. From the beginning, I have also been in contact with Doug at www.numismaticcrimes.org.
We recognize and appreciate those of you in this forum who have been understanding and helpful to the victim and to us. Thank you.
Stewart Huckaby
mailto:stewarth@HA.com
------------------------------------------
Heritage Auctions
Heritage Auctions
2801 W. Airport Freeway
Dallas, Texas 75261
Phone: 1-800-US-COINS, x1355
Heritage Auctions
<< <i>they could easily make a database of cert number to "be on the look out for"
when the cert number is enetered into the auction database, the system would automatically check the "look out" list.
it's a very simple thing to set up. >>
Yes, I agree. This is exactly what Rolex does for stolen watches. You send them a copy of the police report with the serial number/model number and whenever that watch is serviced and is checked against it's stolen watch database it's pulled and returned to the owner.
<< <i>What!!?? Call the police or something!
-Paul >>
Call now if you haven't already.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Mark and Ryk,
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better. >>
So the secretary who answered the phone should have canceled the auction and mailed the coins to the OP? Should that happen whenever someone calls Heritage and claims that a coin in their auction is stolen and belongs to them?
<< <i>[The other side of this statement is kinda like running a Credit Bureau. Once a Cert Number gets added to the list, how long does it take to get it off of the list?. >>
Don't care. If it comes up against the database, a red flag should be raised and an internal investigation launched. Contact the person who originally reported the coins as stolen and see if there has been a resolution. Contact the police departments that have been involved.
In all reality there should be a third party database of stolen coins that all auction houses/dealers can check against. It would make it much, much easier to keep up-to-date if the victim only had one place to contact to report stolen/recovered items, etc. I'm sure if it were set up or backed by someone reputable in the hobby, then getting the major auction houses on board would not be that difficult.
Again, I'm not saying just because the coin comes up flagged that it is automatically pulled from the auction.. just that an investigation happens to ensure that if the coin is still stolen, that it is not sold off again.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Mark and Ryk,
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better. >>
So the secretary who answered the phone should have canceled the auction and mailed the coins to the OP? Should that happen whenever someone calls Heritage and claims that a coin in their auction is stolen and belongs to them? >>
No, but apparently your comprehension is not that good. I never stated as such. I did state that good customer service begins at the people that answer the phones on a daily basis, and that didn't happen in this case, otherwise there wouldn't be this entire thread.
The person on the phone should have stated something to the effect of, "while I am unfamiliar to the history of this issue, I will escalate this issue at once and we will be in communication!".
That is proper customer service. To be coy and treat the caller as though there would be no action simply proves they need to improve their customer service process.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Mark and Ryk,
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
The bold above is where I disagree.
good customer service begins with the guy/gal that is on the front line, the one answering the phones every day with your customer. Not just the upper echelon that will do the right thing if you're lucky enough to know how to contact them.
The fact that a report of stolen material was made months ago and was acknowledged by HA, with a verbal agreement to act accordingly - and nothing was apparently followed through on. That shows many missteps.
Did the guy at the top do it right? Maybe. Still remains to be seen. But how would it be if every time you needed proper customer service you needed to call/email the president/CEO etc. of a business. That's no way to show customer service. An executive can't be available to everyone, but the people on the phones are, and they need to be doing it better. >>
So the secretary who answered the phone should have canceled the auction and mailed the coins to the OP? Should that happen whenever someone calls Heritage and claims that a coin in their auction is stolen and belongs to them? >>
No, but apparently your comprehension is not that good. I never stated as such. I did state that good customer service begins at the people that answer the phones on a daily basis, and that didn't happen in this case, otherwise there wouldn't be this entire thread.
The person on the phone should have stated something to the effect of, "while I am unfamiliar to the history of this issue, I will escalate this issue at once and we will be in communication!".
That is proper customer service. To be coy and treat the caller as though there would be no action simply proves they need to improve their customer service process. >>
Given that there is ample evidence that we are only getting one side of the story here (the whole story), do you think it is even remotely possible that the OP might be overstating Heritage's lack of cooperation? Jeez, the auction came down within 24 hours. Is that not fast enough, and if so, what is the standard for the time lag between when they are called to when the auction is pulled.
By now, you have surely read swhuck's post in which he confirms that Heritage gets these calls all the time and has a protocol for dealing with them. I am more comforted knowing that than I am disturbed that the secretary may not have been kind enough on the phone.
you continue to read and respond to only half the story.
My response to you, yes, it's possible we are only getting half the story. But the fact remains that it took someone contacting an executive at HA before there was any (apparent) activity. The customer service representative made no effort to make a "potential" owner of stolen material comfortable that the right thing was being done.
I return to the fact that we have a huge thread to indicate something went wrong at the outset of this issue.
Had psxchelly been reassured (even if not told what would be done), the initial post most likely wouldn't be here and there would be no further discussion.
That goes back to my statement that customer service begins in the trenches. Although everyone needs to be part of the process, if it isn't being done with your customer facing side, you are missing the point of customer service.
edit: Sorry for the misspelling of the OP's name
"I just called them, and they are acting like they dont want to cooperate... omg. this is incredible."
Thursday December 02, 2010 9:25 AM
"looks like the lots were taken down by ha."
Definitely a lack of cooperation. Whatever could they be thinking?
<< <i>RYK,
you continue to read and respond to only half the story.
My response to you, yes, it's possible we are only getting half the story. But the fact remains that it took someone contacting an executive at HA before there was any (apparent) activity. The customer service representative made no effort to make a "potential" owner of stolen material comfortable that the right thing was being done.
I return to the fact that we have a huge thread to indicate something went wrong at the outset of this issue.
Had psxexually been reassured (even if not told what would be done), the initial post most likely wouldn't be here and there would be no further discussion.
That goes back to my statement that customer service begins in the trenches. Although everyone needs to be part of the process, if it isn't being done with your customer facing side, you are missing the point of customer service. >>
Based on my interpretation of the events and the only facts that we really have (that the coins are alleged to be stolen and the auctions were taken down within 24 hours), I believe that Heritage acted appropriately. The rest of our argument is conjecture based on interpretation of the OP's posts, which, IMO, were rather emotional and may or may not reflect what happened on the phone. I cannot condemn Heritage based on the facts that are provided.
<< <i>RYK and LanLord are very respected on these threads. From reading this thread, HA has responded well in many of our eyes, possibly due to the action taken by some members here. I do agree with LanLord in that HA needs to make their customer service aware of sensitive issues such as these. It's their front line that will make or break them, and I'm sure there is a learning curve at their headquarters concerning what has taken place here. Well done, all, and let cooler heads prevail. >>
Hey! There's no reason to sully RYK's name like that! ;p
<< <i>Please know that we took this matter very seriously from the beginning. We must operate under State and Federal laws and have very specific protocols and procedures for these matters. As others have surmised, we are frequently contacted by people who claim that an item we’re offering for sale appears to be an item that was stolen from them. The vast majority of these claims turn out to be false, so in fairness to everybody involved we can’t act without some deeper investigation and certain documents – such as a police report. Quite often we find the matter has been resolved or the report is mistaken. >>
Heritage reacted precisely as they should have.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>Hard to believe that "crackpots" with verified names and addresses are calling coin auction sites and claiming their stolen coins are being auctioned. Heritage should take the OP at his word, immediately take down the auction, hold the coins in storage (or perhaps the police would take the coins) and then allow for a police investigation into the matter...and resolve the problem by returning the coins ASAP to the rightful owner. >>
You are joking, right? The rightful owner will likely not see the coins for a long time. >>
Versus possibly not ever seeing the coins at all? He doesn't have the coins now, the coins were stolen remember? Waiting for the coins is still infinitely better than never having them. Capiche?
You'd better have another cup of coffee before posting next time. LOL
George
My War Nickels https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/nickels/jefferson-nickels-specialty-sets/jefferson-nickels-fs-basic-war-set-circulation-strikes-1942-1945/publishedset/94452
Secondly I wanted to say that this thread wasn't intended to start disagreements, so *pretty please don't get mad at one another*.
I have been reading some of the posts, and I just want everyone to understand that this in no way was a "domestic dispute" as some of you have assumed. This was a theft. A person broke into my house while I was taking my husband to the hospital back on July 6th 2010. The thief found my 2 safes and broke them open. I reported it *immediately* to the police and they took a report, a list of stolen items, fingerprints and everything else the police do.
Even though this next part was at first personal, (and now its not going to be) those particular coins I posted mean more to me than just $$$. I have been collecting all my coins for about 10ish years. When I originally posted about the theft in July, and now, I just didn't feel like sharing at the time that my husband became ill right around when we bought our first Ike in Aug of 2006. My husband and I collected those 3 Ikes together, for something to share together with one another. We sat together, and participated in the auction together. Hes a little sicker now, and if anything happens to him the whole point of us buying and collecting the coins was that I would have something to hold and remember what we did together. We all collect coins for one reason or another, and that's my reason... now I'm sad at work ugh.
So please, if you have something you wish to say or ask me, please PM me.
edited to add:
Thanks everyone
-Michelle
I also believe that Heritage went threw the proper steps to assure that the coins were indeed stolen.
The only problem I see here is someone with influence had to go to the top to get things started. Or at least it looks that way.
JMHO
<< <i>Hey everyone, first of all I just want to say that I appreciate everyone's support.
Secondly I wanted to say that this thread wasn't intended to start disagreements, so *pretty please don't get mad at one another*.
I have been reading some of the posts, and I just want everyone to understand that this in no way was a "domestic dispute" as some of you have assumed. This was a theft. A person broke into my house while I was taking my husband to the hospital back on July 6th 2010. The thief found my 2 safes and broke them open. I reported it *immediately* to the police and they took a report, a list of stolen items, fingerprints and everything else the police do.
Even though this next part was at first personal, (and now its not going to be) those particular coins I posted mean more to me than just $$$. I have been collecting all my coins for about 10ish years. When I originally posted about the theft in July, and now, I just didn't feel like sharing at the time that my husband became ill right around when we bought our first Ike in Aug of 2006. My husband and I collected those 3 Ikes together, for something to share together with one another. We sat together, and participated in the auction together. Hes a little sicker now, and if anything happens to him the whole point of us buying and collecting the coins was that I would have something to hold and remember what we did together. We all collect coins for one reason or another, and that's my reason... now I'm sad at work ugh.
So please, if you have something you wish to say or ask me, please PM me.
edited to add:
Thanks everyone
-Michelle >>
I truly wish you and your husband well Michelle.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>
<< <i>Mark and Ryk,
I think you are both saying you would give HA an A+ on their treatment of the consignor. I don't think anyone is debating that. Yet, what grade would you give them on their treatment of the OP? I am suggesting that it is no better than a "D." I think initially, the OP would have felt it was an "F." >>
Heritage's primary obligation is to the consignor, and they are also obligated to follow their terms and the letter of the law. As far as I am concerned, they have not (yet) made any missteps.
It could be many months or even years before the OP sees the coins, as they will likely become evidence in the case that will be built that will likely require investigation. Ask Julian about his stolen coins, that were recovered, and, to my knowledge, many months later still not in his possession. >>
I can't see it taking "years" as long as the OP has proper evidence of previous purchase and ownership.
I agree with a previous post...get an attorney and I think the coins could be returned quickly.
<< <i>I agree with Landlord that the front line person could have been more helpful and put the OP at ease knowing that the matter WAS going to be addressed.
I also believe that Heritage went threw the proper steps to assure that the coins were indeed stolen.
The only problem I see here is someone with influence had to go to the top to get things started. Or at least it looks that way.
JMHO >>
Dimeman could say in a few lines what I was trying to say. Thank you.
And I too with the OP and her husband all the best.
I would like to see with their next round of software enhancement, inclusion of a search but cert numbers
having such a deep and diversified auction sales history and database, has really helped many collectors
sadly, it also has made life easier for crooks who have 'lifted' these numbers for their fake slabs, sandwich coins, fake inserts
psxchelly, I hope you get your coins back in a timely manner
"A dog breaks your heart only one time and that is when they pass on". Unknown
Heritage, in my view, has handled this well. The frontline maybe could have been a little better, but overall, I think it was well done.
As for bringing it on the forum in a post.....I doubt there is much that someone could do to hide their involvement, if they were guilty, at this point. Heritage has the coins. The coins are still in the plastic with the same serial numbers. There is a record of who submitted them. Etc. It isn't likely that the original thief reads these forums else they probably would have tried to crack them and resubmit (hey...a 70 is a 70 is a 70, right?
I believe she, the OP, did the right thing in her circumstances in bringing this here. And since they were in the same slabs and numbers, it isn't like she wouldn't know, and couldn't prove that they were hers...unlike auctions of things that are serial numbered/reported to the police with proof.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Russ, NCNE
If Russ is satisfied, I'm satisfied.
Michelle - if you don't mind me asking, what kind of safes were they, that were so easily broken into?