I am honestly not being a smart alec, but
piecesofme
Posts: 6,669 ✭✭✭
do sellers here that are trying to get full melt value for 90% silver realize why they have to keep bumping their thread? $17.20 x face? I've seen as much as $17.75 x face??? Gimme a break. If Silvertowne or APMEX will give you that (some claim) then why waste your time here? It has to be shipped either way.
Forgive me if it seems i'm coming off as a smart arse, but I really think it needed to be said.
Forgive me if it seems i'm coming off as a smart arse, but I really think it needed to be said.
To forgive is to free a prisoner, and to discover that prisoner was you.
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Last I checked was $500 FV min.
<< <i>AMPEX ~ 90% buy price
Last I checked was $500 FV min. >>
That makes their buy/sell spread 17.0 and 17.7......thats a fairly tight spread on 90% in a heated commodity market.
Take shipping, payment, communications, etc. into account.
--Severian the Lame
<< <i>Apmex is not especially easy to deal with re: shipping and payment.
Take shipping, payment, communications, etc. into account. >>
An excellent point! You could order some 5oz silver bars at the advertised price of .79 over spot, yet easily end up actually paying $2.00 over spot by the time your doorbell rings!
Now I've got my buyer hat on and want to buy from APMEX. I have to lay out $17,631 to get $1000 FV??????? Who is willing to risk $17,631 at these levels and HAVE to purchase $1000 FV to get that price?
edited for spelling errors
What a final customer will end up paying if he buys the same item(s) from one of the major dealer or B&M? As far as the seller asks for the current market price (give or take) I don't see it as a waste of time. JMO
Randy
Thats why I said sellers are having to bump their own threads for days when asking those out of line prices...no one in their right mind will pay that.
I approached a crusty old dealer at a show once and inquired about a particular uncertified coin, asked to look at it, examine it with a loop, and asked what he wanted for it. He said $595.
I said I just bought the exact coin down the way from another dealer for $425, here, look at it, would you agree it grades right about the same as yours?
He said, I dont have time to look at what you bought somewhere else, thats my price...I have more than anyone else in the room.
I said, there's a reason why you have more than anyone else in the room...smiled, handed his overpriced coin back to him and said, greed is a terrible thing, isnt it?
<< <i>If someone is out of line with their pricing, no deal gets done - simple as that.
Thats why I said sellers are having to bump their own threads for days when asking those out of line prices...no one in their right mind will pay that.
I approached a crusty old dealer at a show once and inquired about a particular uncertified coin, asked to look at it, examine it with a loop, and asked what he wanted for it. He said $595.
I said I just bought the exact coin down the way from another dealer for $425, here, look at it, would you agree it grades right about the same as yours?
He said, I dont have time to look at what you bought somewhere else, thats my price...I have more than anyone else in the room.
I said, there's a reason why you have more than anyone else in the room...smiled, handed his overpriced coin back to him and said, greed is a terrible thing, isnt it? >>
With all due respect, I don't see how a free man asking for what he believes is fair value for his own personal property can be considered greedy. He isn't forcing anybody to buy it.
>
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This thread is not about what you can buy for, it's what sellers here are trying to sell for...$17.50ish x face. I bought for $16 x face at every single table I bought from yesterday at a coin show. God is my witness on that. So ok, now I want to try and sell what I bought at $16 x face...APMEX will give me $16.88 x face...BUT I have to sell them a minimum of $1000 FV to even get THAT price. What if I dont have $1000 FV? Guess what, I dont get that buy price from them then, it's going to be lower.
Each to their own is what I say. I think this is purely a philosophical discussion as to me (and I would wager many others) it is no skin off my back if someone wants a higher price than what I want to pay.
I knew it would happen.
It is pretty obvious that some sellers are "fishin" to see what they can get and have no real intentions to sell. The difference in how I handle that is I ask on the U.S. Coin Forum what people are willing to pay as evidenced here.
asking how much people will pay for something
Creating a thread with inflated prices takes up room on the BST Board for people who actually DO want to sell, and not fish. All im saying is just that...it takes up room for real sellers and I hope those fishers realize that why their stuff isnt selling and why their having to constantly bump their own threads is because we arent dummies here and most of know how much 90% is currently worth at any given time, not like when someone tried showing what APMEX's sell prices were and tried to say that it was their buy price LOL, not to mention that you have to do $1000 FV to get that price.
What the hell, im all for "to each his own", just be realistic.
He had them priced a bit too low, probably and decided not to sell them to me. In my mind, I made out better because I now know not to deal with him on something more important.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>I'd much rather see a high price on a item than a eBay plug any day on the BST. JMHO >>
This statement, although a completely different issue, deserves ALOT of attention!
While I don't do much BST business I generally don't click over to any eBay links inBST posts.
If not, why not.
bob
Yes I do and thats a good point. Just because it might seem high doesnt mean you cant make an offer, but when I see completely unrealistic asks like, at or over melt when melt is insanely high right now, I dont make an offer because in my experiences the seller really actually thinks they can get what theyre asking and that tells me that theyre fishing, or they really dont want to sell and again, is just fishin...and taking up space on the BST thread for people who genuinely want to use the forum for what it is intended for.
I'd much rather see a high price on a item than a eBay plug any day on the BST. JMHO
Completely agree. Mention it in a PM if someone asks', but please keep eBay as far away as you can from this place...please!
You never know... silver could go much higher, and what you see as "insanely high" may be a bargain down the road... Buyers and sellers will even things out. No need to have a spazz about what people are asking/bidding.
<< <i>I don't do any business with the BST, but I do check out what's available. It appears to me, that a number of members solely use the BST as their B&M...with a free plug to their eBay account. PCGS needs to address that issue if they want to maintain the no charge BST forum. All references to eBay or other outside links should not be allowed on the BST, unless the seller is willing to pay PCGS's going rate for adds on their website. Just my 2 cents worth. >>
And you are exactly right!
Using gsa1fan's link, you get an APMEX buy price of 17.83x and a sell price of 17.08x or a spread of 0.75x or 4.4%
Tulving is currently at 17.76x and 17.26x or a spread of 0.50x or 2.9%
Who is "correct"? They both are.
I see no issue at all with someone posting a price they want to get or think they can get. Or maybe they are fishing. Just because some people want / expect / hope to get more than others does not make any of them right or wrong. Perhaps they are hedging in case they can't monitor these threads all day long and are hoping spot increases over the next 3, 6 or 12 hours while they are away. Perhaps they are adding in the face value on top of the silver value.
<< <i>ok, with that logic, then why dont they sell for $16 x face when theyre into it for $12 x face when melt is at $17.50ish now? Dare I say gr***? I better not for fear of being lambasted since this is a dealer heavy forum.
Because on the flipside of that, if a dealer is into silver at $25, and it slides to $17, he wont be selling it at $25 just cuz that was his cost.
<< <i>ok, with that logic, then why dont they sell for $16 x face when theyre into it for $12 x face when melt is at $17.50ish now? Dare I say gr***? I better not for fear of being lambasted since this is a dealer heavy forum.
That makes no sense to me whatever. Dealers work their margins and make their money moving volume through their spreads. (3% to 4%) What "they are into it at" has almost zero to do with it as that silver is long gone. This is especially true if they are a high volume dealer as their inventory turns over semi-weekly if not daily.
MJ
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
A couple lame thoughts
1. I suspect many coin collectors simply don't need the money. It is a bit of fishing game "oh well, if I sell it at my price, fine, if not, no big deal" ...... and since I like seeing my name in print, I'll just keep bumping my thread.
2. There's a very thin margin to work when it comes to Bullion when both parties are privy of melt value. It's hard to make a living doing that.
3. One of the worst dis-services to us that buy/sell bullion is the stinkin web sites that people plug in the face value and it returns the actual melt value, which is substantially higher than true market value. A person can go nutz trying to explain to a seller that it just doesn't work that way. I always encounter some seller that won't budge.
4. I eliminate the frustration by rarely looking at the BST.
5. Spot price has been so volitile lately that it really doesn't matter if you buy slightly over or under Market. It's like the weather, by the time you get physical possesion off the BST, you've already made up for paying the few dollars extra ..... or you've lost so much that arguing over pennies on the buy side turns out to not be that relevant to the amount you've lost in value during transit.
6. Bottom line ......... forget trying to squeeze out a small bullion profit as a buyer on BST.
Many members on this forum that now it cannot fit in my signature. Please ask for entire list.
<< <i>So, if the price, in your opinion, is a bit high you make offers?
Yes I do and thats a good point. Just because it might seem high doesnt mean you cant make an offer, but when I see completely unrealistic asks like, at or over melt when melt is insanely high right now, I dont make an offer because in my experiences the seller really actually thinks they can get what theyre asking and that tells me that theyre fishing, or they really dont want to sell and again, is just fishin...and taking up space on the BST thread for people who genuinely want to use the forum for what it is intended for.
I'd much rather see a high price on a item than a eBay plug any day on the BST. JMHO
Completely agree. Mention it in a PM if someone asks', but please keep eBay as far away as you can from this place...please! >>
----- Not everyone here sells for outrageous prices! I myself sold a 2007W proof Platinum half ounce PCGS graded PR70DECAM here on BST and only got $350.00! WAY BELOW MELT!. You have to agree that there are good deals to be found here on BST.
(x2,Meltdown),cajun,Swampboy,SeaEagleCoins,InYHWHWeTrust, bstat1020,Spooly,timrutnat,oilstates200, vpr, guitarwes,
mariner67, and Mikes coins
the day. I'm retired now and selling a bit here and a bit there. Don't absolutely need the
money today. My gold was obtained prior to 1988 and most well under $300 an ounce.
As a collector and not a dealer I don't have any sheets or other sources for pricing. I look
at the red book for coins, Ebay past sales, and PCGS and Numismedia for the rest. Can't
see what BST sales have done but that would be nice if it were possible. I see the OP and
others selling stuff every day but never have privy to the prices received. I don't know if
you are standing firm or wheeling and dealing. As a collector I have a bit of a disadvantage.
I know that silver and gold have been on a rise for the last ten years and the
likelihood is that they will continue up. I don't know if I have anything of extra value as I
don't stay up on it much so I post pics and price a bit high looking for a little bonus. If I don't
get the price I just drop it slowly until it sells. The BST gets the first shot at it and then off
to Ebay if there are no BST takers. I do know my bottom line just not the upper line.
I look at all offers and often accept or negotiate the offer. Perhaps I just am part of the problem
but I don't see it that way. My silver, gold and coins sell on the BST proably 95% of the time.
I too don't like the Ebay advertising and links to outside sales.
bob
Just for information: I've sold as much as 13 ounces of gold in one transaction on the BST. Several
dealers and I have done silver in excess of 5k at a time. But, I've done a ton of small, itsy-bitsy to
a dealer, transactions as well. Just an old collector here.
<< <i>Apmex is not especially easy to deal with re: shipping and payment.
Take shipping, payment, communications, etc. into account. >>
What are the issues when selling to APMEX?
<< <i>Not everyone here sells for outrageous prices! I myself sold a 2007W proof Platinum half ounce PCGS graded PR70DECAM here on BST and only got $350.00! WAY BELOW MELT!. You have to agree that there are good deals to be found here on BST. >>
That sounds like a tall tale to me. Why anyone would sale 1/2 oz of platinum for less than half of melt value is beyond me.
It reminds me of the story of some guy that mortgaged his house to broker a 300 oz gold deal.
<< <i>I'm not sure why this thread was started but if you don't like the price then pass. Pretty simple.
<< <i>Not everyone here sells for outrageous prices! I myself sold a 2007W proof Platinum half ounce PCGS graded PR70DECAM here on BST and only got $350.00! WAY BELOW MELT!. You have to agree that there are good deals to be found here on BST. >>
That sounds like a tall tale to me. Why anyone would sale 1/2 oz of platinum for less than half of melt value is beyond me.
It reminds me of the story of some guy that mortgaged his house to broker a 300 oz gold deal.
A few saw when this happened here. I auctioned the coin and took bids with no set reserve (my mistake). I am a honest man so I had to take the highest bid (no matter how low). Yes, I took a hit but honesty pays when using the BST. I guess some might back out of a deal that doesnt make them money I don't. I will make up the difference with later sales I am sure. Sometimes you win and sometimes you loose!. The buyer was happy though and asked if I had any more.
(x2,Meltdown),cajun,Swampboy,SeaEagleCoins,InYHWHWeTrust, bstat1020,Spooly,timrutnat,oilstates200, vpr, guitarwes,
mariner67, and Mikes coins
That is not what I did. If you took the time to READ, you would clearly see that that is not remotely what I said. I already had a cash-out refi IN PROGRESS before I was even made aware the old timer wanted to sell his life long Au hoard. I used some of the funds from the refi to purchase the remaining oz.'s that I didnt have the $ to purchase to completely complete the transaction. Get your story straight before you (continue) to make an ass out of your self bud.
<< <i>It reminds me of the story of some guy that mortgaged his house to broker a 300 oz gold deal.
That is not what I did. If you took the time to READ, you would clearly see that that is not remotely what I said. I already had a cash-out refi IN PROGRESS before I was even made aware the old timer wanted to sell his life long Au hoard. I used some of the funds from the refi to purchase the remaining oz.'s that I didnt have the $ to purchase to completely complete the transaction. Get your story straight before you (continue) to make an ass out of your self bud. >>
zzzzz, does anyone care?
obviously TWQG and you do enough to keep bringing it up when I'll admit, it's old news now.