Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you..
<< <i>One should not judge an entire avocation or profession by the worst of the group. (Unless we are talking about lawyers, of course...
Excellent point! >>
Just wondering what % would be the worst of the group. Seems to be everywhere. Also, it sure seems to be a big "Group." >>
Back on-topic. Okay, I do not know what percentage, but when I go to a major show, I see guys like Julian, Rick Kay, and others shoving aside guys like me to cater to the YNs doing the scavenger hunt. (No, I am not complaining about it; I am very supportive of their participation.) Yeah, there are some bad apples in coins. Hey, maybe the majority of apples are bad. There are enough good guys that are good enough to make up for the bad guys.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
BlindTiger...Get off my "high horse"? What "high horse"? I can't really ride a horse, but that can be fixed. Just like other folks here, I strive to sustain lifetime satisfaction while leading a financially comfortable lifestyle. I cannot be held accountable for the actions or words of others. I wish you would contribute to the original topic of this thread instead of taking a personal shot at me. Instead of criticizing my observations on the general mistreatment of young hobbyists, you find opportunity to tell me to "go back to China".
Do I have bias against any particular group of people? Do do not believe so. I present what is verbally directed at me in its raw and unedited version. I cannot change or mellow out what comes out of the mouth of other people.
I'm sure everybody experiences mistreatment once in a while...it's a fact of life. On the flip side, do people ever glare at you in shock when you tell them you collect American coins? Do people ever ask you if you can actually see with slanty shaped eyes? Have you been offered chopsticks when dining out at a steakhouse in Arizona?
I am a United States citizen, a privilege that I am staunchly proud of. I have never lived in China and I do not plan to do so anytime soon. I believe my English speaking, writing and comprehension skills are more than adequate, yet I am proud to have the ability to speak three separate languages on a fluent level. If you don't mind I'll be staying in this country indefinitely. By the way, I am not mainland Chinese in nationality and I do not have any immediate family members who reside in China at this time.
Anyways...I feel bad for skewing away from the original topic, so back we go...
Follow me on Twitter @wtcgroup Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
<< <i>This is the case with almost any young collector.
I can't tell you how many times I've heard "You can't afford that" or "Don't waste my time asking prices on coins you can't buy"
Though some dealers are very kind and help ya out...most just look past kids as a purchasing power.
Its at those times that I like to pull out a wad of cash, flip through some hundreds and buy a coin from them with a $20 that costs about 10 cents.
They don't seem to think Im that funny though >>
ddbird...there are times when you feel like doing that to spite someone, but it's much more beneficial to you to save your $20 for something you need it for. Slinging a $20 bill on a 10 cent item then telling them to keep the change makes you look like a showoff or a spendthrift.
Follow me on Twitter @wtcgroup Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
<< <i>One should not judge an entire avocation or profession by the worst of the group. (Unless we are talking about lawyers, of course...
Excellent point! >>
Just wondering what % would be the worst of the group. Seems to be everywhere. Also, it sure seems to be a big "Group." >>
Back on-topic. Okay, I do not know what percentage, but when I go to a major show, I see guys like Julian, Rick Kay, and others shoving aside guys like me to cater to the YNs doing the scavenger hunt. (No, I am not complaining about it; I am very supportive of their participation.) Yeah, there are some bad apples in coins. Hey, maybe the majority of apples are bad. There are enough good guys that are good enough to make up for the bad guys. >>
I hear ya, everybody has their own opinion. I've had a few dealers mouth off to my little girl at a couple shows I took her to. She was in tears from the comments of one dealer. Soooo, this is why I might feel strongly on the subject. She also doesn't have the interest as much to go to shows anymore. BUT, I did bring a smile to her face when she heard what I told the dealer that brought tears to her eyes . All she was doing was looking through his junk box. She had 50.00 cash in her pocket (That i put there) and I would have bought her pretty much what she wanted.
Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
<< <i>One should not judge an entire avocation or profession by the worst of the group. (Unless we are talking about lawyers, of course...
Excellent point! >>
Just wondering what % would be the worst of the group. Seems to be everywhere. Also, it sure seems to be a big "Group." >>
Back on-topic. Okay, I do not know what percentage, but when I go to a major show, I see guys like Julian, Rick Kay, and others shoving aside guys like me to cater to the YNs doing the scavenger hunt. (No, I am not complaining about it; I am very supportive of their participation.) Yeah, there are some bad apples in coins. Hey, maybe the majority of apples are bad. There are enough good guys that are good enough to make up for the bad guys. >>
I hear ya, everybody has their own opinion. I've had a few dealers mouth off to my little girl at a couple shows I took her to. She was in tears from the comments of one dealer. Soooo, this is why I might feel strongly on the subject. She also doesn't have the interest as much to go to shows anymore. BUT, I did bring a smile to her face when she heard what I told the dealer that brought tears to her eyes . All she was doing was looking through his junk box. She had 50.00 cash in her pocket (That i put there) and I would have bought her pretty much what she wanted. >>
I guess I have been lucky. The dealers have treated my son very well at shows, and he really looks forward to attending shows.
My wife read this thread over my shoulder, and I found out something about her I never knew. She collected wheat pennies as a child, and had a Whitman album missing some coins. Her grandmother took her to a show, and becuase of the way she was treated, (she says she isn't sure if it was becuase she was young or female) She quit. Even today, she is only vaguely interested in coins, and the album I recently bought her, sits empty on the shelf.
"I am sorry you are unhappy with the care you recieved, is their anything I can do for you right now, how about some high speed lead therapy?" - A qoute from my wife's nursing forum
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them." – Thomas Jefferson
I don't know either if it was because she was a little girl, and the dealer thought she wouldn't spend any money. My Wife (may she RIP) was more into collecting then I was. Never good to assume anything.
Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
I for one find WTCG threads very informative, so if you don't like them then don't read them! Duh! Obviously, you're a racist yourself, with your go back to China reference. So, your solution to being mistreated is to, " Get over it?" LOL! You sir are an idiot. And why does it not surprise me that you are on the scum bag dealer's side of this thread? And instead of blaming the dealer, you blame the OP and then you blame the parents of the kid? LOL! Regardless of if the OP should have intervene or not is IRREVELENT! It does NOT excuse the dealer!!! And for anybody to focus on that point only is utterly asinine! But then again, why am I not surprise that you did! I hope this is your last post because I tired of your post and I don't want to hear about it anymore , Ok?
And when that YN a dealer treated well grows up and has a nice paying job, those few minutes of kindness will be returned ten times over. They might buy $2 coins now. Later on that same person will be able and willing to spend 1000x more.
I'm not a dealer but one day hope I might be (think retirement). Not much I can do now but I have let YN (I never really was a YN, started heavily at 19) borrow my loupe at a show, offer some advice, or once I even gave a young boy a coin I had just bought because I found a better deal at another table. He wanted a silver dime so he got an AU 1942 Merc for free. Cost to me - $0.75. Better than donating it to some *charity*.
WTB: Eric Plunk cards, jersey (signed or unsigned), and autographs. Basically anything related to him
Unfortunalty for you callawayc7, it is not my last post. It is obvious you hate dealers.., calling them "scum-bag dealers", ....You and your brother are both obvious racists.
We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
How dare you tell WTCG to "go back to China"? He is proud of who he is and has probably made far more positive contributions to the US than you ever will. Have you ever met him? If you do not know the facts then we surely don't need a dose of your ignorance! WTCG is one of my favorite dealers to work with and at the same time he is knowledgeble with excellent integrity. Shame on you!
It is hard for me to stomach how you believe the parents are to blame when they get treated badly by dealers. Nothing excuses the bad treatment of children by coin dealers, or anybody for that matter. The youngsters and children can turn into big time collectors in the future, and a bad experience can only hurt the chances of them being involved in the hobby at a later date. I have brought my children to coin shows before, and my experiences have been okay. There are dealers who aren't thrilled with entertaining children, but you find people like that in every field in society. I haven't seen my children being treated poorly yet, but it's still good to know that there are dealers who will care about educating children.
<< <i>Unfortunalty for you callawayc7, it is not my last post. It is obvious you hate dealers.., calling them "scum-bag dealers", ....You and your brother are both obvious racists.
We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you. >>
This is what I was getting at. May as well treat the kids like crap because you sure as hell are going to treat the adults like crap--and why nurture children only to turn on them when they grow up? Probably the best thing that could happen is they run into someone like you early on before they get their hopes up. Sad.
When I was 12 years old, I was given what seemed to me was a very old, worn quarter in change at a movie theater. Something told me to keep the quarter, so I didn't buy any popcorn or candy at that show.
I took the coin home and asked my father if he could take me to a coin shop so I could find out more about it. He agreed, we went to a coin shop, and this was my first coin-related encounter.
The dealer looked at the coin and explained how I should handle coins. He then asked me to bring him a Redbook off the shelf. We went through the Redbook until we found my coin. It was a 1932 Washington Quarter. Knowingly, he told me to look below the eagle on the reverse and ask if I saw anything. I said the letter 's' was there. He showed me that the coin was worth $20, which was a lot of money to me at the time. He then told me about coin grading, and how and why it was important that I learn about it.
That was in 1963. I still have that quarter. This is what can happen when a coin dealer is kind to a young kid.
"Vou invadir o Nordeste, "Seu cabra da peste, "Sou Mangueira......."
WHOA.............. Talk about opening up a can of worms.........
everything from "racist" comments to dealer bashing........... Unreal what I started here...........
Couple of thoughts.......
1.) I didn't follow the kid around..... In fact I noticed him at one table as I broused the show then a half hour later at another. 2.) I talked to the kid after the second observation of "dealer brush-off" and treated him as a young adult and asked him about his collection. Which is what the dealer should have done talked to him like a young adult not a distraction. Also, I would have given him some coins for his Whitman if I had some along but I don't as a rule carry "bags of worthless 3 cent wheaties" with me to coin shows.
BTW, all I wanted was people to THINK about how they were treated the young people in this hobby before they dismiss them because the kid you dismiss today is the customer you don't have tomorrow...........
Dealers may not realize how small their world is. By turning away people, they chase away the things that come with people. Namely, the spending power of the people. I'd be running from many of you who have the honor and respect of your peers, but I got tough skin and so it doesn't hurt me. I like coins... it's people that ruin the hobby of coin collecting. And it ain't the small people, either.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
Just what this place needs....more clowns like this.
<< <i>...They were a 1921 and 21-D, both AG. Nothing terribly expensive, but worth about $50 for the pair. I went up to one dealer and he said they were common dates and he would pay 55 cents a piece for them. I of course knew better and immediately left his table and I will NEVER buy from him or sell anything to him EVER. If I wouldn't have known better, he would have gotten away with it, and I wouldn't have been the wiser. Now adays, I drop thousands of dollars at shows, and not a cent will ever see his table. Was it worth it, basically trying to steal my $50 coins, and missing out on the money I now spend at shows? Probably not.
-Paul >>
Out him.
“When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.” — Benjamin Franklin
My icon IS my coin. It is a gem 1949 FBL Franklin.
I agree to an extent, those that are really interested will stick with coins anyway even if confronted by a grouchy dealer but it still does not excuse the rude behavior of the dealer. People are what they are and you can't just change their personality but they can be blackmarked for life without even realizing it. I have heard of collectors who were treated rudely as a kid by a dealer refuse to do any business with that person decades later when they have much more to spend as an adult. The dealer loses in the long run.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
Let's all start a Forum Policy here. If we witness dealers who are curmudgeons to kids, we all agree to go immediatly to the show promoters or information booth and complain about the dealer.
It does no good to confront the dealer in front of the kid, and start a public confrontation.
If we ALL start doing this AND we tell the promoters that we are complainig as members of this forum according to an agreed upon set of standards, then they will get used to these complaints, and the complaints may have an impact.
It happened to me at a show when I was a teenager, self righteous dealers dismissing and mistreating me. I stopped collecting for over 5 years.
I will say this, I go with my kid, and neices and nephews to shows, and in Northern california, the dealers are GREAT! Not once has my daughter been mistreated. She gets tons of freebies too!
Fortunately, some dealers are good. They welcome kids, try to teach them a little, and offer them cool little coins to help out small collections that the kids may have. Others, however, dismiss kids immediately; I even saw a deal swat at a kid like he was some kind of bird, rather than a person, trying to get him to go away from his table. Years ago, I was looking at some quarter rolls, OBW. I turned the roll over to look at the date and MM, and the dealer swiped it out of my hand and hid it behind his table so fast, I didn't know what was happening. This dealer still frequents coin shows around my area, and I make a point to avoid his table. He hurt me years ago, and I'll never buy anything from him.
Then there's guys like the dealer I frequent, he loves kids, and he's an all-around great guy! He's hapy to share any knowledge he can, and he usually makes some good deals for me.
I guess it just depends on what kind of dealer you are. A good guy, or a slimy excuse for a man.
<< <i>Let's all start a Forum Policy here. If we witness dealers who are curmudgeons to kids, we all agree to go immediatly to the show promoters or information booth and complain about the dealer. >>
I think it would be more effective to out them here. I doubt the show promoters really care as long as the dealer's check clears.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>I was at a coin show. A young lady, about 8 years old, was looking through a box of World coins in 2x2s. She picked one out and ask the seller how much. The seller simply said 'it's yours'. I know this seller and he has given away hundreds of coins to young collectors over the years. Not expensive coins, but the look on the faces of the kids is priceless. >>
I can imagine.... especially since it is one that he/she had picked out and had wanted..... something that piqued their interest....
<< <i>Some one else posted that their kid has a $20 a week coin budget, plus extra because he is skipping lunch. That is $1000 a year, and that's for a young kid. Teenagers have more money than ever, if they come from an upper middle class family, and/or have a part time job. Some of them think nothing of blowing a couple hundred or more on a weekend trip or other luxury items. >>
Also, if it's YOUNG YN, they are probably at the show with a parent, who assumedly might have some interest in numismatics too, almost certainly has more to spend, and could have the potential to be a new customer......
You just don't know.....
It reminds me of the scene from Pygmalian/My Fair Lady, when Eliza Doolittle tells Henry Higgins that he treats her terribly, and he says that he treats all women equally, he treats a Queen like a flower girl.... Whereas Eliza retorts that Colonel PIckering treats a Flower girl like a Queen........
Point being, it's how you treat people, and how they respond to you in return......
<< <i>I remember walking into Stacks in 1972 when I was 14. I began working in the summer and after school when I was 13 so I always had money to spend. My parents encouraged me to buy coins. In those days I would take the bus from New Jersey and walk from the Port Authority to save a subway fare. My parents would allow me the 30 minute commute with a friend. Today no parent in their right mind would allow a kid to do this.
I wondered over to the silver dollar counter and told the sales associate I was interested in purchasing a 1921 Peace dollar. He looked at me like I was crazy and I was going to waste his time. He brought over a few circulated coins. I told him I was interested in the best 1921 he had. I pulled out my wad of money and he became real serious. They had around 4 1921's in 63+ condition and I looked at them with my loupe. Only when he knew I was going to buy from him did he become serious. In all fairness to him he did not try to take advantage of me and he was very helpful and informative and he steered me to what he thought was the nicest coin for the price.
I finally wound up buying the second most expensive 1921 they had. It cost me $250, a lot of money back then for a coin. It's still raw, I'm guessing it's a 64 PQ or 65.
I came back to Stacks around three weeks later and I got the red carpet treatment from the staff. I remember buying an 1891CC for $200, which I still have today ungraded.
I've had multiple experiences like this when I was a kid. People wrongly assume that kids or poorly dressed people don't have money.
Bruce >>
I've heard of MANY similar stories in many different scenarios.. It all comes down to "show me the money"....
<< <i>Also, if it's YOUNG YN, they are probably at the show with a parent, who assumedly might have some interest in numismatics too, almost certainly has more to spend, and could have the potential to be a new customer...... >>
I agree with this statement, but I am not sure about the My Fair Lady quote.
A very sad story in the OP. Hopefully the kid will shake it off and stay active in the hobby.
Always took candy from strangers Didn't wanna get me no trade Never want to be like papa Working for the boss every night and day --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i> We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you. >>
Who is "we"? %%%% You and the horse you rode in on?
I don't know what the threshhold for YN is but I started pretty young. I didn't go to many shows but I don't remember ever being mistreated. People seem to be more mellow around here.
BTW - this popped up on my screen "for some reason":
I began collecting at the age of 8 (I'm 37 now). Every time I got money from my grandparents, I bought coins. Once, I went to my favorite shop, and they had 10 or so 1883 NC Liberty nickels in the case, all uncirculated. I had always wanted one, so I picked one out and paid $20 for it. Being a novice, I didn't notice that there was a spot in the obverse field. A while later, I decided to finish my '41-'58 Lincoln set, and brought the liberty nickel back to the dealer to see if I could sell it or trade it for some of the Lincolns I needed. It was still in the same holder I bought it in, and I handed it to the same guy who sold it to me. "It has a spot- it's not worth anything," he said and handed it back to me. Needless to say, I got a good schooling in how things can work in the game of life that day. That dealer is still in business today, and I have cherrypicked him at almost every show. I still have that liberty nickel, too.
There are many ways to teach someone. That dealer taught me a lot, but I don't agree with his methods. There are a lot of old men and women in this hobby, and if the dealers don't start grooming the next crop of collectors, no one will be there to buy coins from them some day. If dealers don't take the time, they're putting themselves out of business.
--Christian
You Suck! Awarded 6/2008- 1901-O Micro O Morgan, 8/2008- 1878 VAM-123 Morgan, 9/2022 1888-O VAM-1B3 H8 Morgan | Senior Regional Representative- ANACS Coin Grading. Posted opinions on coins are my own, and are not an official ANACS opinion.
<< <i>You should out those dealers. I won't tolerate that type of behavior. I would go to the show promoter to complain. And then I would get in the dealers face. They should be put out of business since they are happy to destroy the future of my hobby. And they're mean to kids...we don't need those type of curmudgeons in this hobby. >>
It's sad that some dealers can be such jerks to kids who are just beginning.
Well I thought this topic needed some input from a YN.
My local dealer is an alright guy. He gets the occasional slab in. He is pretty overpriced though. Im in there every other week and its always the same. Can I help you? You think the guy would recognise a teenage guy walking into his store. He doesnt try to strike up a conversation, or ask me anything. I usually walk out of there with nothing.
I feel that because Im a kid, he feels that he does not have to give me the same attention that he does other customers.
While at the local coin show, I was browsing a case of currency. The guys case was full of UNC notes and bricks. The dealer looked up at me, didnt say anything and then took out a key and locked the case. Right in front of me.
Basically, he thought I would try to steal from him? I dont know, but there are many many many dealers who think that kids have no money or are trying to rip them off.
Dealers should treat kids they way they treat adults because, kids can make the same type of purchases as an adult
You should have seen the dealers at the MSNS show.
When kids would come up and ask to see a coin, they opened the case right away and offered to help them all they could. Probably five dealers, just as the kids were walking away, told them to stop and come back. They would either give the kid the coin they were looking at or offer them a coin/note from a box they had behind the table for free. Now those are some damn kind people.
WTB: Eric Plunk cards, jersey (signed or unsigned), and autographs. Basically anything related to him
<< <i>Unfortunalty for you callawayc7, it is not my last post. It is obvious you hate dealers.., calling them "scum-bag dealers", ....You and your brother are both obvious racists.
We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you. >>
I guess I missed this quote until now. Hey BlindMoron...I mean BlindTiger...if you don't want me to post anymore then you're outta luck. I'll post here when I feel like doing so for the forseeable future. Go whine some more in your lurker fantasyland.
Follow me on Twitter @wtcgroup Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
If a youngster comes up to me at a show I'm happy to spend whatever time he needs. Frankly, I've been rude to adults who needed a talking to but never to the kids. I'd much rather give something at wholesale or less to a youngster and try to cultivate their interest. I can remember myself at their age getting smoked by most of the dealers. We can do better.
Just a note a thanks to all the dealers at the the Hartford show today. I took my 11 year-old son who getting to be quite the collector. The dealers went out of their way to talk to him about coins and share their expertise. A few also were gave him a of few older wheat cents that he really appreciated and put right in his Whitman. I took their cards and will be sure to do business with them in the future. Again a special thanks........
I had a guy walk into my Real Estate office, said he was looking for a 3 bed condo with all the bells and whistles for 400K --not an easy do in Chicago. I could have dismissed him as so many others may have but I gave him a list of current offerings above his target and emailed him several more as they came to market. They guy came back in and bought 4 million dollars worth of Real Estate in the next 2 years and turned his wealthy friends on to me who bout another 3 million. Be nice to everyone. They may be wealthier than you think and have wealthy friends and referrals!
"Poets are the unacknowledged legislators of the world." PBShelley
Comments
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you..
However, I think for every sour dealer out there there is also 1 or 2 good guys that will help kids out all the way
<< <i>
<< <i>One should not judge an entire avocation or profession by the worst of the group. (Unless we are talking about lawyers, of course...
Excellent point!
Just wondering what % would be the worst of the group. Seems to be everywhere. Also, it sure seems to be a big "Group." >>
Back on-topic. Okay, I do not know what percentage, but when I go to a major show, I see guys like Julian, Rick Kay, and others shoving aside guys like me to cater to the YNs doing the scavenger hunt. (No, I am not complaining about it; I am very supportive of their participation.) Yeah, there are some bad apples in coins. Hey, maybe the majority of apples are bad. There are enough good guys that are good enough to make up for the bad guys.
<< <i>WTCG.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
BlindTiger...Get off my "high horse"? What "high horse"? I can't really ride a horse, but that can be fixed. Just like other folks here, I strive to sustain lifetime satisfaction while leading a financially comfortable lifestyle. I cannot be held accountable for the actions or words of others. I wish you would contribute to the original topic of this thread instead of taking a personal shot at me. Instead of criticizing my observations on the general mistreatment of young hobbyists, you find opportunity to tell me to "go back to China".
Do I have bias against any particular group of people? Do do not believe so. I present what is verbally directed at me in its raw and unedited version. I cannot change or mellow out what comes out of the mouth of other people.
I'm sure everybody experiences mistreatment once in a while...it's a fact of life. On the flip side, do people ever glare at you in shock when you tell them you collect American coins? Do people ever ask you if you can actually see with slanty shaped eyes? Have you been offered chopsticks when dining out at a steakhouse in Arizona?
I am a United States citizen, a privilege that I am staunchly proud of. I have never lived in China and I do not plan to do so anytime soon. I believe my English speaking, writing and comprehension skills are more than adequate, yet I am proud to have the ability to speak three separate languages on a fluent level. If you don't mind I'll be staying in this country indefinitely. By the way, I am not mainland Chinese in nationality and I do not have any immediate family members who reside in China at this time.
Anyways...I feel bad for skewing away from the original topic, so back we go...
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
<< <i>This is the case with almost any young collector.
I can't tell you how many times I've heard "You can't afford that" or "Don't waste my time asking prices on coins you can't buy"
Though some dealers are very kind and help ya out...most just look past kids as a purchasing power.
Its at those times that I like to pull out a wad of cash, flip through some hundreds and buy a coin from them with a $20 that costs about 10 cents.
They don't seem to think Im that funny though >>
ddbird...there are times when you feel like doing that to spite someone, but it's much more beneficial to you to save your $20 for something you need it for. Slinging a $20 bill on a 10 cent item then telling them to keep the change makes you look like a showoff or a spendthrift.
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>One should not judge an entire avocation or profession by the worst of the group. (Unless we are talking about lawyers, of course...
Excellent point!
Just wondering what % would be the worst of the group. Seems to be everywhere. Also, it sure seems to be a big "Group." >>
Back on-topic. Okay, I do not know what percentage, but when I go to a major show, I see guys like Julian, Rick Kay, and others shoving aside guys like me to cater to the YNs doing the scavenger hunt. (No, I am not complaining about it; I am very supportive of their participation.) Yeah, there are some bad apples in coins. Hey, maybe the majority of apples are bad. There are enough good guys that are good enough to make up for the bad guys. >>
I hear ya, everybody has their own opinion. I've had a few dealers mouth off to my little girl at a couple shows I took her to. She was in tears from the comments of one dealer. Soooo, this is why I might feel strongly on the subject. She also doesn't have the interest as much to go to shows anymore. BUT, I did bring a smile to her face when she heard what I told the dealer that brought tears to her eyes
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>One should not judge an entire avocation or profession by the worst of the group. (Unless we are talking about lawyers, of course...
Excellent point!
Just wondering what % would be the worst of the group. Seems to be everywhere. Also, it sure seems to be a big "Group." >>
Back on-topic. Okay, I do not know what percentage, but when I go to a major show, I see guys like Julian, Rick Kay, and others shoving aside guys like me to cater to the YNs doing the scavenger hunt. (No, I am not complaining about it; I am very supportive of their participation.) Yeah, there are some bad apples in coins. Hey, maybe the majority of apples are bad. There are enough good guys that are good enough to make up for the bad guys. >>
I hear ya, everybody has their own opinion. I've had a few dealers mouth off to my little girl at a couple shows I took her to. She was in tears from the comments of one dealer. Soooo, this is why I might feel strongly on the subject. She also doesn't have the interest as much to go to shows anymore. BUT, I did bring a smile to her face when she heard what I told the dealer that brought tears to her eyes
I guess I have been lucky. The dealers have treated my son very well at shows, and he really looks forward to attending shows.
"I am sorry you are unhappy with the care you recieved, is their anything I can do for you right now, how about some high speed lead therapy?" - A qoute from my wife's nursing forum
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them." – Thomas Jefferson
<< <i>WTCG.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
I for one find WTCG threads very informative, so if you don't like them then don't read them! Duh!
I hope this is your last post because I tired of your post and I don't want to hear about it anymore , Ok?
<< <i>
Dealers remember: YNs grow up! >>
And when that YN a dealer treated well grows up and has a nice paying job, those few minutes of kindness will be returned ten times over. They might buy $2 coins now. Later on that same person will be able and willing to spend 1000x more.
I'm not a dealer but one day hope I might be (think retirement). Not much I can do now but I have let YN (I never really was a YN, started heavily at 19) borrow my loupe at a show, offer some advice, or once I even gave a young boy a coin I had just bought because I found a better deal at another table. He wanted a silver dime so he got an AU 1942 Merc for free. Cost to me - $0.75. Better than donating it to some *charity*.
Positive BST: WhiteThunder (x2), Ajaan, onefasttalon, mirabela, Wizard1, cucamongacoin, mccardguy1
Negative BST: NONE!
We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you.
<< <i>WTCG.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
How dare you tell WTCG to "go back to China"? He is proud of who he is and has probably made far more positive contributions to the US than you ever will. Have you ever met him? If you do not know the facts then we surely don't need a dose of your ignorance! WTCG is one of my favorite dealers to work with and at the same time he is knowledgeble with excellent integrity. Shame on you!
It is hard for me to stomach how you believe the parents are to blame when they get treated badly by dealers. Nothing excuses the bad treatment of children by coin dealers, or anybody for that matter. The youngsters and children can turn into big time collectors in the future, and a bad experience can only hurt the chances of them being involved in the hobby at a later date. I have brought my children to coin shows before, and my experiences have been okay. There are dealers who aren't thrilled with entertaining children, but you find people like that in every field in society. I haven't seen my children being treated poorly yet, but it's still good to know that there are dealers who will care about educating children.
<< <i>Unfortunalty for you callawayc7, it is not my last post. It is obvious you hate dealers.., calling them "scum-bag dealers", ....You and your brother are both obvious racists.
We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you. >>
This is what I was getting at. May as well treat the kids like crap because you sure as hell are going to treat the adults like crap--and why nurture children only to turn on them when they grow up? Probably the best thing that could happen is they run into someone like you early on before they get their hopes up. Sad.
I took the coin home and asked my father if he could take me to a coin shop so I could find out more about it. He agreed, we went to a coin shop, and this was my first coin-related encounter.
The dealer looked at the coin and explained how I should handle coins. He then asked me to bring him a Redbook off the shelf. We went through the Redbook until we found my coin. It was a 1932 Washington Quarter. Knowingly, he told me to look below the eagle on the reverse and ask if I saw anything. I said the letter 's' was there. He showed me that the coin was worth $20, which was a lot of money to me at the time. He then told me about coin grading, and how and why it was important that I learn about it.
That was in 1963. I still have that quarter. This is what can happen when a coin dealer is kind to a young kid.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
WHOA.............. Talk about opening up a can of worms.........
everything from "racist" comments to dealer bashing........... Unreal what I started here...........
Couple of thoughts.......
1.) I didn't follow the kid around..... In fact I noticed him at one table as I broused the show then a half hour later at another.
2.) I talked to the kid after the second observation of "dealer brush-off" and treated him as a young adult and asked him about his collection. Which is what the dealer should have done talked to him like a young adult not a distraction. Also, I would have given him some coins for his Whitman if I had some along but I don't as a rule carry "bags of worthless 3 cent wheaties" with me to coin shows.
BTW, all I wanted was people to THINK about how they were treated the young people in this hobby before they dismiss them because the kid you dismiss today is the customer you don't have tomorrow...........
Ray
ON WISCONSIN!!!
I'd be running from many of you who have the honor and respect of your peers, but I got tough skin and so it doesn't hurt me.
I like coins... it's people that ruin the hobby of coin collecting. And it ain't the small people, either.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
I don't know who started with WTCG, but you are out of line.
Wei, you are one of the coolest of the dealers I ever read here.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>WTCG.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
Just what this place needs....more clowns like this.
<< <i>...They were a 1921 and 21-D, both AG. Nothing terribly expensive, but worth about $50 for the pair. I went up to one dealer and he said they were common dates and he would pay 55 cents a piece for them. I of course knew better and immediately left his table and I will NEVER buy from him or sell anything to him EVER. If I wouldn't have known better, he would have gotten away with it, and I wouldn't have been the wiser. Now adays, I drop thousands of dollars at shows, and not a cent will ever see his table. Was it worth it, basically trying to steal my $50 coins, and missing out on the money I now spend at shows? Probably not.
-Paul >>
Out him.
My icon IS my coin. It is a gem 1949 FBL Franklin.
<< <i>MrEureka that was perfectly said. >>
I agree to an extent, those that are really interested will stick with coins anyway even if confronted by a grouchy dealer but it still
does not excuse the rude behavior of the dealer. People are what they are and you can't just change their personality but they
can be blackmarked for life without even realizing it. I have heard of collectors who were treated rudely as a kid by a dealer refuse to
do any business with that person decades later when they have much more to spend as an adult. The dealer loses in the long run.
<< <i>WTCG.
Not to take offense, But I am a relativly new poster here, Although, I have lurked for months.......
And when I saw your first/original thread, about you being treated at shows...
I am going to say now what I felt then......Your a RACIST yourself.!!!!!!!!!.
Everytime a topic comes up with ANY type of mis-treatment, you throw in your THREAD!! GET OVER IT!!
WE ALL ARE MIS-TREATED at one time or another,!! I am tired of your story...
If we went to China, and could speak speak chinese, we would be treated the same way!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!
We all go to these shows, we have to deal with too!!! Get off your high horse, or go back to China, It is apart of living in the usa, or we living in China,,,,,,,,,
We don't want to hear about it anymore ok>.........Thank you.. >>
Please go back to lurking.
Sounds to me like the 10 year old was the only professional involved!
It does no good to confront the dealer in front of the kid, and start a public confrontation.
If we ALL start doing this AND we tell the promoters that we are complainig as members of this forum according to an agreed upon set of standards, then they will get used to these complaints, and the complaints may have an impact.
It happened to me at a show when I was a teenager, self righteous dealers dismissing and mistreating me. I stopped collecting for over 5 years.
I will say this, I go with my kid, and neices and nephews to shows, and in Northern california, the dealers are GREAT! Not once has my daughter been mistreated. She gets tons of freebies too!
Then there's guys like the dealer I frequent, he loves kids, and he's an all-around great guy! He's hapy to share any knowledge he can, and he usually makes some good deals for me.
I guess it just depends on what kind of dealer you are. A good guy, or a slimy excuse for a man.
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<< <i>Let's all start a Forum Policy here. If we witness dealers who are curmudgeons to kids, we all agree to go immediatly to the show promoters or information booth and complain about the dealer. >>
I think it would be more effective to out them here. I doubt the show promoters really care as long as the dealer's check clears.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>I was at a coin show. A young lady, about 8 years old, was looking through a box of World coins in 2x2s. She picked one out and ask the seller how much. The seller simply said 'it's yours'. I know this seller and he has given away hundreds of coins to young collectors over the years. Not expensive coins, but the look on the faces of the kids is priceless. >>
I can imagine.... especially since it is one that he/she had picked out and had wanted..... something that piqued their interest....
<< <i>Some one else posted that their kid has a $20 a week coin budget, plus extra because he is skipping lunch. That is $1000 a year, and that's for a young kid. Teenagers have more money than ever, if they come from an upper middle class family, and/or have a part time job. Some of them think nothing of blowing a couple hundred or more on a weekend trip or other luxury items. >>
Also, if it's YOUNG YN, they are probably at the show with a parent, who assumedly might have some interest in numismatics too, almost certainly has more to spend, and could have the potential to be a new customer......
You just don't know.....
It reminds me of the scene from Pygmalian/My Fair Lady, when Eliza Doolittle tells Henry Higgins that he treats her terribly, and he says that he treats all women equally, he treats a Queen like a flower girl.... Whereas Eliza retorts that Colonel PIckering treats a Flower girl like a Queen........
Point being, it's how you treat people, and how they respond to you in return......
<< <i>I remember walking into Stacks in 1972 when I was 14. I began working in the summer and after school when
I was 13 so I always had money to spend. My parents encouraged me to buy coins. In those days I would take the bus from New Jersey and walk from the Port
Authority to save a subway fare. My parents would allow me the 30 minute commute with a friend. Today no parent in their right mind would allow a kid to do this.
I wondered over to the silver dollar counter and told the sales associate I was interested in purchasing a 1921
Peace dollar. He looked at me like I was crazy and I was going to waste his time. He brought over a few circulated
coins. I told him I was interested in the best 1921 he had. I pulled out my wad of money and he became real
serious. They had around 4 1921's in 63+ condition and I looked at them with my loupe. Only when he knew
I was going to buy from him did he become serious. In all fairness to him he did not try to take advantage of me
and he was very helpful and informative and he steered me to what he thought was the nicest coin for the price.
I finally wound up buying the second most expensive 1921 they had. It cost me $250, a lot of money back then for a coin.
It's still raw, I'm guessing it's a 64 PQ or 65.
I came back to Stacks around three weeks later and I got the red carpet treatment from the staff. I remember
buying an 1891CC for $200, which I still have today ungraded.
I've had multiple experiences like this when I was a kid. People wrongly assume that kids or poorly dressed people
don't have money.
Bruce >>
I've heard of MANY similar stories in many different scenarios.. It all comes down to "show me the money"....
<< <i>Also, if it's YOUNG YN, they are probably at the show with a parent, who assumedly might have some interest in numismatics too, almost certainly has more to spend, and could have the potential to be a new customer...... >>
I agree with this statement, but I am not sure about the My Fair Lady quote.
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>
We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you. >>
Who is "we"? %%%% You and the horse you rode in on?
I don't know what the threshhold for YN is but I started pretty young. I didn't go to many shows but I don't remember ever being mistreated. People seem to be more mellow around here.
BTW - this popped up on my screen "for some reason":
There are many ways to teach someone. That dealer taught me a lot, but I don't agree with his methods. There are a lot of old men and women in this hobby, and if the dealers don't start grooming the next crop of collectors, no one will be there to buy coins from them some day. If dealers don't take the time, they're putting themselves out of business.
--Christian
Yes, I have my favorite dealer to Cherrypick from as well! They ripped me off for a consignment I sent them.
Payback is a ...well you know.
<< <i>You should out those dealers. I won't tolerate that type of behavior. I would go to the show promoter to complain. And then I would get in the dealers face. They should be put out of business since they are happy to destroy the future of my hobby. And they're mean to kids...we don't need those type of curmudgeons in this hobby. >>
It's sad that some dealers can be such jerks to kids who are just beginning.
My local dealer is an alright guy. He gets the occasional slab in. He is pretty overpriced though. Im in there every other week and its always the same. Can I help you? You think the guy would recognise a teenage guy walking into his store. He doesnt try to strike up a conversation, or ask me anything. I usually walk out of there with nothing.
I feel that because Im a kid, he feels that he does not have to give me the same attention that he does other customers.
While at the local coin show, I was browsing a case of currency. The guys case was full of UNC notes and bricks. The dealer looked up at me, didnt say anything and then took out a key and locked the case. Right in front of me.
Basically, he thought I would try to steal from him?
I dont know, but there are many many many dealers who think that kids have no money or are trying to rip them off.
Dealers should treat kids they way they treat adults because, kids can make the same type of purchases as an adult
LAX
When kids would come up and ask to see a coin, they opened the case right away and offered to help them all they could. Probably five dealers, just as the kids were walking away, told them to stop and come back. They would either give the kid the coin they were looking at or offer them a coin/note from a box they had behind the table for free. Now those are some damn kind people.
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Negative BST: NONE!
<< <i>Unfortunalty for you callawayc7, it is not my last post. It is obvious you hate dealers.., calling them "scum-bag dealers", ....You and your brother are both obvious racists.
We dont want to see you or him post here again......Negavity to our beloved hobby by your over and over whinning is nothing we want apart of...Deal with it or move back to your native country....no biggie.. Thank you. >>
I guess I missed this quote until now. Hey BlindMoron...I mean BlindTiger...if you don't want me to post anymore then you're outta luck. I'll post here when I feel like doing so for the forseeable future. Go whine some more in your lurker fantasyland.
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
roadrunner