all sorts of coins in other holders but you clearly put PCGS in the title. Some may not consider that keyword spamming because you have them sent to PCGS but I do.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Not to mention the terms are unbelievably complicated. The coin is at PCGS for mint error service, but it's in a different holder now. You can buy it today, and see what happens at PCGS. If it crosses at same grade, buyer gets the coin at the auction price. If it crosses at a lower grade or not at all, then buyer can back out. No mention of what happens if the coin gets the same grade but not the error designation advertised.
New collectors, please educate yourself before spending money on coins; there are people who believe that using numismatic knowledge to rip the naïve is what this hobby is all about.
<< <i>Perhaps you were unaware, but your link to "Phanthom Bidder" IN YOUR LISTING is against eBay rules <a class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=617&item=9117167253" target=blank><STRONG>LINK</STRONG></A>. Let's all get in a tizzy, shall we. >>
Sadly, no one sniped my Sex and the City DVDs. I think I should've got a bit more money for them. Carrie deserved better!
I have no grudge against you. I have a chip on my shoulder for sellers that do the crap you do.
I frequently search for PCGS as well as NGC coins and it pisses me off to come across lowlifes that Spam auctions with coins that are not holdered by PCGS or NGC and in the process waste my time. I encounter your "PCGS?" coins all the damn time and then see that they are indeed holdered but by ANACS, NGC, NTC, SEGS.
I find it amusing that you want to come on here and publicly attempt to blast someone for a beef you have with their policy which is clearly within ebay rules at the same time you are running NINETY auctions which clearly VIOLATE ebay rules!!!
<< <i>1. It is CLEAR my intention is to sell PREDOMINANTLY PCGS graded coins. 3. The use of "PCGS?" in the title WILL NOT come up in any search for "PCGS" (especially since it is a store listing). 9. I ALWAYS spell out in the subtitle EXACTLY what the grading service & status is (i.e. either to be sent to PCGS or at PCGS). >>
The bottom line is that if the coin is not currently in a PCGS slab, you should not include the acronym "PCGS" in your auction title. You should use the subtitle to put your PCGS information, to keep it out of the searches.
Example:
Not good: 1960 DOUBLED DIE REV FS-036 JEFFERSON PCGS? PR65 TOP100 CURRENTLY IN PCI HOLDER. WAS SENT 2 PCGS 2GET CROSSED
Better: 1960 DOUBLED DIE REV FS-036 JEFFERSON PCI PR65 TOP100 CURRENTLY IN PCI HOLDER. WAS SENT 2 PCGS 2GET CROSSED
Same information, but without any spamming or implied deception.
<< <i>Bob, if you were to list that way and I did a search for PCGS .... ....., would it show up if I did not select the option to search descriptions??? >>
If you searched for descriptions it'd show up, but limiting keywords in descriptions is going to far, methinks.
1st, my listings WON'T come up in searches of the keyword "PCGS" in ANY category of coins (e.g. small cents, nickels, etc.). 2nd, I never accused legend of violating any eBay rules. 3rd, it's interesting how you are such a big defender of them. 4th, I disagree with YOUR interpretation of eBay keyword spamming policy. 5th, I'm not trying to decieve anyone.
Also, while I'm at it & before you bring it up, please tell me what's wrong with my consignment policy as well:
1. Professional Imaging. 2. Maximum Exposure: our eBay store, eBay category listings in either an auction (with or without a buy-it-now) or fixed price format, & on our website. 3. Immediate Payment: NOT after we get paid but we pay as soon as the auction or buy-it-now item closes (subject to item not selling for an absurd price - e.g. a 2005 PCGS MS65RD Lincoln cent being bid up to $782). 4. We assume ALL risks of non-payment, returned payments, lost shipments (to buyer from us) &/or lost payments (from us to you). 5. We eat all returns & don't hold your money until after our return period has ended or chase after you if one of your consigned items got returned. 6. Interest-free cash advances on your consigned coins. 7. Normal fees as low as 15% of the gross sale (even less for "big" items") out of which we cover the eBay listing fees, final value fees, PayPal/credit card fees, & packaging/shipping. 8. Our EXTREME Flexibility. 9. Excellent, timely, & accurate communications. 10. Items can be listed as soon as you let us know what you want to sell & we agree on the terms. 11. Secure bank vault storage while coins are in our possession (except while being imaged).
Well, your "BS" link was news to me. I also would've thought the subtitle would appear as well. Of course, your search was NOT for JUST "PCGS"
I find it amusing that you want to come on here and publicly attempt to blast someone for a beef you have with their policy which is clearly within ebay rules at the same time you are running NINETY auctions which clearly VIOLATE ebay rules!!!
I think that sums it up nicely.....
My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable !
"So If I wanted to list my Chevy on Ebay and stuck it in the Car section and listed it as "2001 Chevy Venture Van Honda? Saab? Toyota?", I guess that would be just fine if I put some sort of followup line in the subtitle possibly that I was contemplating buying a Saab, Honda, or Toyota"
A completely inappropriate analogy. A Chevy will never be a Honda but 95%+ of the coins YOU have a problem with WILL BE in a PCGS holder.
Not only am I not pissed, I appreciate the free advertising in a forum that I would NEVER advetrtise in.
<< <i><STRONG>"So If I wanted to list my Chevy on Ebay and stuck it in the Car section and listed it as "2001 Chevy Venture Van Honda? Saab? Toyota?", I guess that would be just fine if I put some sort of followup line in the subtitle possibly that I was contemplating buying a Saab, Honda, or Toyota"
</strong>A completely inappropriate analogy. A Chevy will never be a Honda but 95%+ of the coins YOU have a problem with <STRONG>WILL BE</strong> in a PCGS holder.
Not only am I not pissed, I appreciate the free advertising in a forum that I would NEVER advetrtise in.
Have fun playing with your little baseball cards. >>
No more inappropriate then the manner you are listing your coins. PERIOD! You are a Spammer and you do that merely to increase the hits on your listings. You are no different then the people that put PCGS in the title of raw coins or coins not in PCGS holders. Your coins are not holdered by PCGS, well the 90 aren't anyways.
No comment about them showing up in searches huh?
I think the advertising you are receiving is not the kind that generates sales but if you're happy with it, I'll be glad to help this thread along a bit later.
as far as the cards, they are my fathers....I am selling them for him. He bought them as a yoot.
Well, I stand corrected Russ. You are 110% right & I'm am 110% wrong. I didn't think they did/would. I actually did a search in the small cent category a few minutes ago for just PCGS & they didn't.
But in any case. I still disagree that it is spam. The customer is contracting to buy a PCGS graded coin that just hasn't been graded yet & THAT's what I'm selling. Period.
The more words one uses to defend, the guiltier they are.
Of course you'll take any kind of payment. The faster you get the cash, the faster you can run before the customer finds out they don't have a PCGS slab...
Pure and simple it is an extremely aggressive selling style, and a turn off for many people. Same with your spamming in other people's feedback, knocking out BIN's when you have no intention of making a reasonable bid, having six or eight ID's, keyword spamming, and I could go on.
How does anyone know that you are actually submitting the coins to PCGS? You could just sit on the coin for a week or two and then contact the buyer and say it didn't cross, and would they like you to send them the coin anyway. You already have their money, right?
It would be less misleading if you would sell it as-is, or wait until the coin is actually graded by PCGS, like the rest of the coin collecting community does.
<< <i>The customer is contracting to buy a PCGS graded coin that just hasn't been graded yet & THAT's what I'm selling. >>
Well, that's kinda like a pre-sale then, right? And pre-sales must have the item ready for shipment in 30 days. Since you sent the coins into PCGS Economy (as stated in your auction), you won't even see them back for 65 days. So, you're breaking eBay's rules here as well. (That's 2 for you, 1 for me, for those keeping score at home, or even if you're not.)
Furthermore, consider this coin. It's an NGC MS63, which is currently sitting in the PCGS warehouse. If I buy that coin today for $300, what exactly do I get? What if PCGS doesn't cross it? What if PCGS decides it's an MS65?
Keyword spamming notwithstanding, your auctions are wrought with red flags, despite your glowing business policies. I like sales to be simple: this is what you're getting, and this is what you're paying. Cut and dried -- no mysteries. We both already know that eBay buyers can be dumb as rocks sometimes -- why make it so much harder for them?
"Pure and simple it is an extremely aggressive selling style"
Agreed
"and a turn off for many people"
Like some sellers return policies &/or payment policies?
"How does anyone know that you are actually submitting the coins to PCGS?
Because I give them the submission number & I am honest.
"It would be less misleading if you would sell it as-is, or wait until the coin is actually graded by PCGS, like the rest of the coin collecting community does."
As to misleading, I totally disagree. Anyone that can read, e-mail, & pick up a phone would not be misled OR confused. My experience has been that MY customers are happy with it.
Why should I sit on a coin for 90 days while PCGS twittles their thumbs (like "the rest of the coin collecting - actually you probably meant to say dealing - community does") when there ARE willing buyers out there that want the coin, are willing to pay for it, AND wait for PCGS to be done with it.
Is that not better for a buyer than buying a coin, sending it to PCGS, having whatever return period they might have had (5 days?) elapse, and THEN be disappointed when the coin either doesn't grade or downgrades?
Flaminio, NO, it's NOT a pre-sale. The customer that buys the coin owns the coin knowing that they will get their money back if PCGS doesn't do what they hope. As for your assertion that "buyers being dumb", I find that variety customers are probably more sophisticated than the average eBay buyer. Just my personal experiance. As for "what you'd get" in the listing linked above, feel free to read it, email me thru eBay for clarifiaction, or give me a call. My number is in the listing.
I agree with the premise of this thread and I, for one, do not like this practice.
I have a question for you---Are you going to continue this practice or will you be "re-thinking" this and being a little more----honest may be a strong word, but...........???
If you want to use 'PCGS' in your ads (as it's obvious you love to), why not wait until they are slabbed before offering them for sale?
Are you in that much of a rush to get cash in your pocket that you can't wait?
It is indeed keyword spamming if you are putting PCGS in the ad and you aren't selling a PCGS coin. Plain and simple. In fact, I'd suspect this is as shady a practice as the guy who sells sports cards graded in another company, but promising it will come in a PSA slab.
The listings are stupid and convoluted. It would be much better if you waited for the crossover results and then just sell them. But I guess you like to play stupid games with your customers.
Keyword Spamming for sure. And the fact that he is defending his actions as legitimate only leads me to believe he is pure scum. Sorry, but that is the way it is.
Comments
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Russ, NCNE
-Daniel
-Aristotle
Dum loquimur fugerit invida aetas. Carpe diem quam minimum credula postero.
-Horace
8390411766,8390413886,8390415390,8390417140,8371494913,8371496695,8371498271,8371501724,8371502792,8371508139
8371509340,8371511803,8371513012,8371514525,8394049517,8394052198,8394056417,8394062222,8394089675,8394090812
8372141555,8372274920,8372278782,8372287615,8394390614,8394392306,8372412405,8395055623,8395058174,8395059142
Link for reporting Keyword Spam (click on "Email us").
You know what to do...
Rella
Totaltravelsolutions
I know there are more than two.
Not to mention the terms are unbelievably complicated. The coin is at PCGS for mint error service, but it's in a different holder now. You can buy it today, and see what happens at PCGS. If it crosses at same grade, buyer gets the coin at the auction price. If it crosses at a lower grade or not at all, then buyer can back out. No mention of what happens if the coin gets the same grade but not the error designation advertised.
New collectors, please educate yourself before spending money on coins; there are people who believe that using numismatic knowledge to rip the naïve is what this hobby is all about.
Maybe the seller is here to entertain us. Remember the bizarre "Roger vs Roger" threads?
let me tell you, it was a real pain in the ass reporting all 90 of them since ebay only allows 10 per report.
I specialize in Wisconsin currency! Looking for information on WI national banknotes. Census stands at 12,318 notes.
**"Wisconsin National Bank Notes - 2nd Edition" is out!!!" Only $20PPd!!!
It's not regular spam, it's keyword spam!!
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
i reported it as spam anyway, but maybe he just doesnt know the difference........happy face winking
Perhaps you were unaware, but your link to "Phanthom Bidder" IN YOUR LISTING is against eBay rules LINK. Let's all get in a tizzy, shall we.
<< <i>Let's all get in a tizzy, shall we >>
Yes, lets.
<< <i>Perhaps you were unaware, but your link to "Phanthom Bidder" IN YOUR LISTING is against eBay rules <a class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=617&item=9117167253" target=blank><STRONG>LINK</STRONG></A>. Let's all get in a tizzy, shall we. >>
Sadly, no one sniped my Sex and the City DVDs. I think I should've got a bit more money for them. Carrie deserved better!
I frequently search for PCGS as well as NGC coins and it pisses me off to come across lowlifes that Spam auctions with coins that are not holdered by PCGS or NGC and in the process waste my time. I encounter your "PCGS?" coins all the damn time and then see that they are indeed holdered but by ANACS, NGC, NTC, SEGS.
I find it amusing that you want to come on here and publicly attempt to blast someone for a beef you have with their policy which is clearly within ebay rules at the same time you are running NINETY auctions which clearly VIOLATE ebay rules!!!
Frankly, it's hilarious.
16. The feedback you leave for others.
It is not appropriate for you to advertise in a customers personal feedback.
<< <i>1. It is CLEAR my intention is to sell PREDOMINANTLY PCGS graded coins.
3. The use of "PCGS?" in the title WILL NOT come up in any search for "PCGS" (especially since it is a store listing).
9. I ALWAYS spell out in the subtitle EXACTLY what the grading service & status is (i.e. either to be sent to PCGS or at PCGS). >>
The bottom line is that if the coin is not currently in a PCGS slab, you should not include the acronym "PCGS" in your auction title. You should use the subtitle to put your PCGS information, to keep it out of the searches.
Example:
Not good:
1960 DOUBLED DIE REV FS-036 JEFFERSON PCGS? PR65 TOP100
CURRENTLY IN PCI HOLDER. WAS SENT 2 PCGS 2GET CROSSED
Better:
1960 DOUBLED DIE REV FS-036 JEFFERSON PCI PR65 TOP100
CURRENTLY IN PCI HOLDER. WAS SENT 2 PCGS 2GET CROSSED
Same information, but without any spamming or implied deception.
Always in my opinion, of course.
<< <i>Bob, if you were to list that way and I did a search for PCGS .... ....., would it show up if I did not select the option to search descriptions??? >>
If you searched for descriptions it'd show up, but limiting keywords in descriptions is going to far, methinks.
<< <i>3. The use of "PCGS?" in the title WILL NOT come up in any search for "PCGS" (especially since it is a store listing). >>
BS
<< <i>2. The listings you point out are ONLY in my eBay store - sort of a semi-parking place UNTIL PCGS finishes grading them >>
so, it's ok to spam if it's in an ebay store?
1st, my listings WON'T come up in searches of the keyword "PCGS" in ANY category of coins (e.g. small cents, nickels, etc.).
2nd, I never accused legend of violating any eBay rules.
3rd, it's interesting how you are such a big defender of them.
4th, I disagree with YOUR interpretation of eBay keyword spamming policy.
5th, I'm not trying to decieve anyone.
Also, while I'm at it & before you bring it up, please tell me what's wrong with my consignment policy as well:
1. Professional Imaging.
2. Maximum Exposure: our eBay store, eBay category listings in either an auction (with or without a buy-it-now) or fixed price format, & on our website.
3. Immediate Payment: NOT after we get paid but we pay as soon as the auction or buy-it-now item closes (subject to item not selling for an absurd price - e.g. a 2005 PCGS MS65RD Lincoln cent being bid up to $782).
4. We assume ALL risks of non-payment, returned payments, lost shipments (to buyer from us) &/or lost payments (from us to you).
5. We eat all returns & don't hold your money until after our return period has ended or chase after you if one of your consigned items got returned.
6. Interest-free cash advances on your consigned coins.
7. Normal fees as low as 15% of the gross sale (even less for "big" items") out of which we cover the eBay listing fees, final value fees, PayPal/credit card fees, & packaging/shipping.
8. Our EXTREME Flexibility.
9. Excellent, timely, & accurate communications.
10. Items can be listed as soon as you let us know what you want to sell & we agree on the terms.
11. Secure bank vault storage while coins are in our possession (except while being imaged).
Well, your "BS" link was news to me. I also would've thought the subtitle would appear as well. Of course, your search was NOT for JUST "PCGS"
Chevy's.............????I thought this was the coin forum...............
I think that sums it up nicely.....
A completely inappropriate analogy. A Chevy will never be a Honda but 95%+ of the coins YOU have a problem with WILL BE in a PCGS holder.
Not only am I not pissed, I appreciate the free advertising in a forum that I would NEVER advetrtise in.
Have fun playing with your little baseball cards.
<< <i>Of course, your search was NOT for JUST "PCGS" >>
This search is for 1960 PCGS in Jeffersons and your spammed listing shows up.
The fact is, you're wrong that the listings don't show in a search on PCGS. They do, even if you use only PCGS in the search.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>1st, my listings WON'T come up in searches of the keyword "PCGS" in ANY category of coins (e.g. small cents, nickels, etc.). >>
Sorry, dude, but that's simply not true.
<< <i><STRONG>"So If I wanted to list my Chevy on Ebay and stuck it in the Car section and listed it as "2001 Chevy Venture Van Honda? Saab? Toyota?", I guess that would be just fine if I put some sort of followup line in the subtitle possibly that I was contemplating buying a Saab, Honda, or Toyota"
</strong>A completely inappropriate analogy. A Chevy will never be a Honda but 95%+ of the coins YOU have a problem with <STRONG>WILL BE</strong> in a PCGS holder.
Not only am I not pissed, I appreciate the free advertising in a forum that I would NEVER advetrtise in.
Have fun playing with your little baseball cards.
No more inappropriate then the manner you are listing your coins. PERIOD! You are a Spammer and you do that merely to increase the hits on your listings. You are no different then the people that put PCGS in the title of raw coins or coins not in PCGS holders. Your coins are not holdered by PCGS, well the 90 aren't anyways.
No comment about them showing up in searches huh?
I think the advertising you are receiving is not the kind that generates sales but if you're happy with it, I'll be glad to help this thread along a bit later.
as far as the cards, they are my fathers....I am selling them for him. He bought them as a yoot.
But in any case. I still disagree that it is spam. The customer is contracting to buy a PCGS graded coin that just hasn't been graded yet & THAT's what I'm selling. Period.
I guess we'll see what eBay thinks come Monday.
Of course you'll take any kind of payment. The faster you get the cash, the faster you can run before the customer finds out they don't have a PCGS slab...
How does anyone know that you are actually submitting the coins to PCGS? You could just sit on the coin for a week or two and then contact the buyer and say it didn't cross, and would they like you to send them the coin anyway. You already have their money, right?
It would be less misleading if you would sell it as-is, or wait until the coin is actually graded by PCGS, like the rest of the coin collecting community does.
<< <i>The customer is contracting to buy a PCGS graded coin that just hasn't been graded yet & THAT's what I'm selling. >>
Well, that's kinda like a pre-sale then, right? And pre-sales must have the item ready for shipment in 30 days. Since you sent the coins into PCGS Economy (as stated in your auction), you won't even see them back for 65 days. So, you're breaking eBay's rules here as well. (That's 2 for you, 1 for me, for those keeping score at home, or even if you're not.)
Furthermore, consider this coin. It's an NGC MS63, which is currently sitting in the PCGS warehouse. If I buy that coin today for $300, what exactly do I get? What if PCGS doesn't cross it? What if PCGS decides it's an MS65?
Keyword spamming notwithstanding, your auctions are wrought with red flags, despite your glowing business policies. I like sales to be simple: this is what you're getting, and this is what you're paying. Cut and dried -- no mysteries. We both already know that eBay buyers can be dumb as rocks sometimes -- why make it so much harder for them?
Agreed
"and a turn off for many people"
Like some sellers return policies &/or payment policies?
"How does anyone know that you are actually submitting the coins to PCGS?
Because I give them the submission number & I am honest.
"It would be less misleading if you would sell it as-is, or wait until the coin is actually graded by PCGS, like the rest of the coin collecting community does."
As to misleading, I totally disagree. Anyone that can read, e-mail, & pick up a phone would not be misled OR confused. My experience has been that MY customers are happy with it.
Why should I sit on a coin for 90 days while PCGS twittles their thumbs (like "the rest of the coin collecting - actually you probably meant to say dealing - community does") when there ARE willing buyers out there that want the coin, are willing to pay for it, AND wait for PCGS to be done with it.
Is that not better for a buyer than buying a coin, sending it to PCGS, having whatever return period they might have had (5 days?) elapse, and THEN be disappointed when the coin either doesn't grade or downgrades?
Flaminio, NO, it's NOT a pre-sale. The customer that buys the coin owns the coin knowing that they will get their money back if PCGS doesn't do what they hope. As for your assertion that "buyers being dumb", I find that variety customers are probably more sophisticated than the average eBay buyer. Just my personal experiance. As for "what you'd get" in the listing linked above, feel free to read it, email me thru eBay for clarifiaction, or give me a call. My number is in the listing.
<< <i> He bought them as a yoot. >>
what is a yoot?
I have a question for you---Are you going to continue this practice or will you be "re-thinking" this and being a little more----honest may be a strong word, but...........???
Carry On...
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
Are you in that much of a rush to get cash in your pocket that you can't wait?
It is indeed keyword spamming if you are putting PCGS in the ad and you aren't selling a PCGS coin. Plain and simple. In fact, I'd suspect this is as shady a practice as the guy who sells sports cards graded in another company, but promising it will come in a PSA slab.
Shady, shady, shady.
George