Buy some lube because he is going to ride your a$$ until it hurts bad. That's my graphic way of saying you are going to get screwed. Walk in front of a truck if you have insurance; at least you'll leave your family something they can appreciate.
<< <i>Buy some lube because he is going to ride your a$$ until it hurts bad. That's my graphic way of saying you are going to get screwed. Walk in front of a truck if you have insurance; at least you'll leave your family something they can appreciate. >>
Yeah, but how do you REALLY feel?
Seems like I saw these guys at LB; there was a string of people making a wide berth around the front of his table. Now I know why
<< <i>He threw the coins down on his table after barely a glance and said they all sucked. Thank goodness the coins were in slabs! >>
I don't give a flying f*** if they were all spotted VF commmon date Memorial Cents, slabs or not. If a dealer EVER pulled that on me, just threw my coins on the table, his HEAD would be thrown down on the table
<< <i>You guys complain too much, marginality will always exist in the coin business--------------------------BigE >>
I'm just glad my industry doesn't have these sorts of ill-tempered people in it.
<< <i>I don't quite agree with the statement that the size of the Coin World ad is inversely proportional to the quality, since there are still some high end dealers advertising prominently there. (My all-time best coin was from a full-page CW ad from Alpine/David Olmstead, and I have been burned by those paying for a small classified ad in the back). Still, there are precious few dealers advertising raw coins of quality in print, and these don't advertise coins at bargain prices. >>
I haven't purchased anything from Alpine in years, but David always sent me nice coins worth the price.
<< <i>He threw the coins down on his table after barely a glance and said they all sucked. Thank goodness the coins were in slabs! >>
<< <i>I don't give a flying f*** if they were all spotted VF commmon date Memorial Cents, slabs or not. If a dealer EVER pulled that on me, just threw my coins on the table, his HEAD would be thrown down on the table >>
I think if I was trying to deal with a ventor at a coin show and he throw my coins down on the table (whether slabbed or not). I would pick up my coins and then try to see if his would stay on his own table when it was inverted.
<< <i>Reading this post about the infamous John Paul Sarosi, dragged up from over a year ago, puts me in mind of my favorite JPS story which I will recount here. If I have told this story before on this forum, I shall not apologize, as I think it is appropriate to remind people of this dealer's severe lack of customer service skills in an attempt to avoid similar incidents in the future.
At a large national coin show a couple of years ago, a good friend and fellow Bust collector made the unfortunate choice to stop at the Sarosi table to check out his Bust dime offerings. My friend looked at several early dimes, and finding one of interest, he refered to the Bust dime book to confirm an attribution before making the purchase. Upon seeing this, JPS blew into a rage, and threatened that he did not like those "@#$!& variety collectors", and told him in no uncertain terms that he was not welcome at his table. My friend, not seeking any confrontation, immediately complied, stood up and left his table. Not content to have made his point, JPS started yelling loudly that he did not like "@#$!& variety collectors at his table, trying to cherrypick him". His tyraid grew more vehement in nature as my friend simply walked away, not responding to his insults. It grew so loud that it attracted the attention of the show promoters and security, who were forced to admonish JPS that if his foul language did not cease, they would be forced to remove him from the bourse floor. He continued to sputter and fume for a long time after the incident had occured, prompting several of us to stop by his table to inform him that, as "@#$!& variety collectors", we, too, would no longer darken his doorstep nor reward him with our business. This reminder of lost business continued throughout the several days of the show, and for several days afterward via telephone, using his nationally advertised 800 number.
My friend is acutely aware of the rules of bourse etiquette, and was not covering the dealer's table with books, nor wasting his time attempting to 'cherrypick' him. He was merely pursuing his hobby by collecting Bust dimes by die marriage and by die state. He was seeking to make a purchase from the dealer, and for that, he was publicly insulted by this arrogant and contemptuous dealer who seems intent to drive potential collectors away from his table.
From the many posts on this and similar threads, collectors are left to make their own decisions on the worthiness of Mr. JPS. For myself and many other "@#$!& variety collectors" that choice is an easy one. >>
Too bad I don't live in Pennsylvania. I'd like to go to his table and whip out a book on trade dollar varieties when examining his coins (I don't need the book, but it would be a great way to see a coin conniption up close.
John Paul Sarosi, Inc. 106 Market Street Johnstown , PA 15901
Contact: John Paul Sarosi Phone #: 814-535-5766 Fax: 814-535-2978 Hours: Monday-Friday 9-5 Specialties: United States Coins, Gold Coins, Dollars, Colonial Coins, Bullion Coins, 20th Century Coins, Small Cents, Currency, Ancient Coins, World Coins, Tokens/Medals, Mint Errors, Territorial Issues, Patterns, Nickel Coinage, Early Copper, Commemoratives, Modern Coins, 19th Century Silver Coins, Early Type Services: Retail, Wholesale, Internet sites, Appraisals, Buying and Estate Liquidation, Newsletter, Auctions
Return to Dealer Listings
PCGS, Professional Coin Grading Service P.O. Box 9458 Newport Beach, CA 92658 Tele: (800) 447-8848 (949) 833-0600 info@pcgs.com A Division of Collectors Universe
<< <i>This seems to be the only positive thing to be said about this dealer. They handle refunds really well. I guess that makes sense if you so something enough you get really good at it! >>
I think the CA attitude is that "we don't care how many people you screw over; just refund their money if they ask".
<< <i>Have you noticed that just about every single one of the grades in their ads show the coin as a choice grade (VF30, XF45, AU55). It seems like they don't know the meaning of proper grading or that they're sooooo lucky as to only purchase choice coins. >>
I don't know anything about the guy you are talking about, but I do know that for the most part, I only buy decent coins, so consequently, if I end up selling them, they'll be decent grades (generally). Sometimes I get some dogs in estate sales or auctions, but I do describe them, like you said, i.e., AG, G-4, etc. I'm not a dealer, just a collector, but from time to time, either to raise money to buy something I really want that's pricey or to pay for sending things into PCGS, or just because I'm broke, I sell off my coins and then, I also sell off anything I get that's either a duplicate or something I don't collect that I come across in a lot somewhere.
If the guy's a dealer, though, I don't see how he never gets anything but high grades, so good point. Thanks for all the tips, everybody.
A friend of mine was showing off his latest acquisition at the coin club last night. It was an 1896 Morgan Dollar in a 2X2 marked as MS64. It was crap. It had no luster and a whitish haze all over. It was dead. To me the coin is worth bullion, but he paid $40 for it. Sarosi ripped him a new one. He said it was too late to return it. I talked with him for a little while on what was wrong with it and what a "proper" UNC should look like (I showed him an MS60 in our auction for comparison). Hopefully, this will be a cheap lesson for him.
The funny thing is reading all these first-hand accounts with JPS and his wife, and seeing recent CW ads telling people to look for their "smiling faces" at an upcoming show or something like that...
I have no experience with them one way or another, but I did think it rather funny...
Three people have mentioned receiving coins with a peculiar whitish haze...
Sounds like what I initially thought was PVC contamination might not be that, but rather some sort of "doctoring " compound intentionally applied to the coins to mask defects.
"Wars are really ugly! They're dirty and they're cold. I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole." Mary
It would seem to me that if subscribers to Coin World complained to them all the problems with doing business with JPS, Coin World may have to react and maybe JPS wouldn't be able to advertise anymore. I thought I remembered reading something in a print issue about the advertisers having to abide by some code of ethics.
Edited to add: By the way, I've done some business with other Coin World advertisers with no problem, so I don't think it's fair to lump them all in together to say that everyone that has a big ad is a crook!
I suspect they are very good about paying their advertising bill to Coin World -- which means Coin World is extremely unlikely to turn away their business.
A few pages ago I outlined my reaction to the unpleasantness which confronted me when trying to do business with JPS based on responding to an ad in CW. I thought about it for a couple days, then placed a call to the ad director of CW, intending to relate my experience, and to make the case that if she had other complaints, or unpleasant personal experiences herself, with this bunch, that this might reflect badly on not only CW itself, but also on the other advertisers who I assumed were trying to represent themselves in a positive light, and spending good money to do so. ( I was in the ad business for years, and in my experience JPS was not breaking laws, or defrauding people, although a case could be made -and I was going to make it- that their "special" grading system was fraudulent by its nature i.e. designed to obfuscate coin conditions relative to existing industry standards, and that their statement in their ad not to call and ask questions about coins before buying them, was an unfair business practice.) So I called, couldn't get through to the AD, and left a message that I had a complaint about an advertiser, left a message to that effect but not mentioning JPS, left my name and #. I got a call back 2 or 3 days later (I forget) when I was out. I had lost my head of steam, did not call back, and I never got a follow-up call from her. When I was an ad director (6 million a year in sales) I would have made sure to get to the bottom of the problem, but maybe she was busy. If I was her, or her boss, I bet they would be interested in the perceptions expressed in this thread about the integrity of large CW advertisers. I would be. I may write more later. mike
"If someone says 'A penny for your thoughts' and you give them your 2 cents worth, what happens to the extra penny?" G.Carlin
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
How does this guy still get a table with any traffic at Long Beach (as of '06 at least)? That puzzles me beyond belief, considering the lousy way he treats customers. I guess some people like the abuse, maybe it reminds them of home.
I did a google search using JP's name and this thread was the first link listed.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Interesting that they are authorised PCGS dealers and list web-sites as one of their "services" yet they claim to not have e-mail which I absolutely do not believe for a minute.
You would think they would have a web site just to maket their coins.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
WOW I used to set up at the Pan shows in the early 80s .. sold JPS a lot of misc. coins ... always pleasant to me and the checks were always good... always one on one and I never bought through an ad but this is just a 180 from my experiences.... but this was a generation ago and things do change
If you can't swim you better stay in the boat.......
What's sad is the guy who wrote the complaint said he was an experienced numismatist, and KNEW the coins could not possibly be the grade advertised for the price asked..YET HE ORDERED THEM ANYWAY.
Frank Provasek - PCGS Authorized Dealer, Life Member ANA, Member TNA. www.frankcoins.com
Who wants to be the one to send all these damning threads to the editors of CW, NN, etc? With the donnybrooks on half their advertisers, one would think SOMETHING would be done....SOMEONE would be used as a guinea pig...SOMEONE would have to be made an example of. With the way these 'dealers' have taken a beating, and you ALL know CW, NN, etc, would HAVE to think someone on this site knows something about coins, and if people 'in the know' think this highly of your Coast to Coast, Paul Sims, Coin Depot, John Sarosi, well, somethin's wrong in Wonderland.
Refer to my statements on the Coast to Coast thread. Buyers need to be informed about these businesses before they look to buy.
I called JPS about three years ago regarding a Buffalo 1916 DDO. It was graded AG with a very low price. I would have been pleased to receive a dateless coin with a doubled image for the listed price; however, I did not want an acid treated coin. So I called. What a rude response I received when I asked if it was acid treated. Then he hung up on me.
If one cannot get a description of a coin over the phone without being verbally abused, why bother.
ANY business, no matter how big or small, HAS to have a website, and at the VERY least, email...EVERYONE has email access....if you dont have a comp at home, any library, friend, etc can let you get on and pick up a Hotmail email address. Any dealer that says he has no website, or email, quite frankly, is stretches the truth a bit.
Edited to add: changed a little bit at the end to 'stretches the truth a bit'. I had written something else, but dont want to get 'served', like some others out here have been. Though, it was a four letter word, and rhymes with tire.
I saw an ad in Coin World with bust quarters in it from John Paul Sarosi so I decided to do a search on the coin forum to see if he had any threads. Wow! I have talked with him once and thought maybe he was just having a bad day. Guess not. Sorry to bring back an old thread but I am relatively new to the forum and this one was very informative.
I've been hung up on during the course of my initiative to call him, and I've been cursed at by him at his table at a P.A.N. convention. That was at least 10 years ago. Never looked back since. A real tool.
I bought a half dozen "MS 63-64" Liberty Head "V" Nickels from them back in 1994. Last year I sent a large group of Nickels into PCGS and all of the Sarosi coins came back MS 64.
I have to admit though, I have not bought from them again, as I got into other series and only Certified coins. [ neither of which were handled by them.]
Mike Hayes ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
I consider the mistake that I made by ever purchasing a coin from this outfit as part of my "tuition" for the education I received, since I did not chose to send the coin back (it was a 1914 D they had graded as VG) Paid $130 for it...I think it might be a G-6 and lightly cleaned. Never bought from them again! This was back in '03. I think, by now maybe it's actually worth what I paid. I just hope this thread stays near the top so someone else doesn't have to pay the price of learning not to deal with these folks. I've been lurking here for a year or so and finally have something to add. I have been learning a lot here and am here a few times every week.
Comments
I remember way back when before slabs - and never want to go back there again.
<< <i>Buy some lube because he is going to ride your a$$ until it hurts bad. That's my graphic way of saying you are going to get screwed. Walk in front of a truck if you have insurance; at least you'll leave your family something they can appreciate. >>
Yeah, but how do you REALLY feel?
Seems like I saw these guys at LB; there was a string of people making a wide berth around the front of his table. Now I know why
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
<< <i>He threw the coins down on his table after barely a glance and said they all sucked. Thank goodness the coins were in slabs! >>
I don't give a flying f*** if they were all spotted VF commmon date Memorial Cents, slabs or not. If a dealer EVER pulled that on me, just threw my coins on the table, his HEAD would be thrown down on the table
<< <i>You guys complain too much, marginality will always exist in the coin business--------------------------BigE >>
I'm just glad my industry doesn't have these sorts of ill-tempered people in it.
<< <i>I don't quite agree with the statement that the size of the Coin World ad is inversely proportional to the quality, since there are still some high end dealers advertising prominently there. (My all-time best coin was from a full-page CW ad from Alpine/David Olmstead, and I have been burned by those paying for a small classified ad in the back). Still, there are precious few dealers advertising raw coins of quality in print, and these don't advertise coins at bargain prices. >>
I haven't purchased anything from Alpine in years, but David always sent me nice coins worth the price.
Obscurum per obscurius
<< <i>He threw the coins down on his table after barely a glance and said they all sucked. Thank goodness the coins were in slabs! >>
<< <i>I don't give a flying f*** if they were all spotted VF commmon date Memorial Cents, slabs or not. If a dealer EVER pulled that on me, just threw my coins on the table, his HEAD would be thrown down on the table >>
I think if I was trying to deal with a ventor at a coin show and he throw my coins down on the table (whether slabbed or not). I would pick up my coins and then try to see if his would stay on his own table when it was inverted.
<< <i>Reading this post about the infamous John Paul Sarosi, dragged up from over a year ago, puts me in mind of my favorite JPS story which I will recount here. If I have told this story before on this forum, I shall not apologize, as I think it is appropriate to remind people of this dealer's severe lack of customer service skills in an attempt to avoid similar incidents in the future.
At a large national coin show a couple of years ago, a good friend and fellow Bust collector made the unfortunate choice to stop at the Sarosi table to check out his Bust dime offerings. My friend looked at several early dimes, and finding one of interest, he refered to the Bust dime book to confirm an attribution before making the purchase. Upon seeing this, JPS blew into a rage, and threatened that he did not like those "@#$!& variety collectors", and told him in no uncertain terms that he was not welcome at his table. My friend, not seeking any confrontation, immediately complied, stood up and left his table. Not content to have made his point, JPS started yelling loudly that he did not like "@#$!& variety collectors at his table, trying to cherrypick him". His tyraid grew more vehement in nature as my friend simply walked away, not responding to his insults. It grew so loud that it attracted the attention of the show promoters and security, who were forced to admonish JPS that if his foul language did not cease, they would be forced to remove him from the bourse floor. He continued to sputter and fume for a long time after the incident had occured, prompting several of us to stop by his table to inform him that, as "@#$!& variety collectors", we, too, would no longer darken his doorstep nor reward him with our business. This reminder of lost business continued throughout the several days of the show, and for several days afterward via telephone, using his nationally advertised 800 number.
My friend is acutely aware of the rules of bourse etiquette, and was not covering the dealer's table with books, nor wasting his time attempting to 'cherrypick' him. He was merely pursuing his hobby by collecting Bust dimes by die marriage and by die state. He was seeking to make a purchase from the dealer, and for that, he was publicly insulted by this arrogant and contemptuous dealer who seems intent to drive potential collectors away from his table.
From the many posts on this and similar threads, collectors are left to make their own decisions on the worthiness of Mr. JPS. For myself and many other "@#$!& variety collectors" that choice is an easy one. >>
Too bad I don't live in Pennsylvania. I'd like to go to his table and whip out a book on trade dollar varieties when examining his coins (I don't need the book, but it would be a great way to see a coin conniption up close.
Obscurum per obscurius
----------------------------------
John Paul Sarosi, Inc.
106 Market Street
Johnstown , PA 15901
Contact: John Paul Sarosi
Phone #: 814-535-5766
Fax: 814-535-2978
Hours: Monday-Friday 9-5
Specialties: United States Coins, Gold Coins, Dollars, Colonial Coins, Bullion Coins, 20th Century Coins, Small Cents, Currency, Ancient Coins, World Coins, Tokens/Medals, Mint Errors, Territorial Issues, Patterns, Nickel Coinage, Early Copper, Commemoratives, Modern Coins, 19th Century Silver Coins, Early Type
Services: Retail, Wholesale, Internet sites, Appraisals, Buying and Estate Liquidation, Newsletter, Auctions
Return to Dealer Listings
PCGS, Professional Coin Grading Service
P.O. Box 9458 Newport Beach, CA 92658
Tele: (800) 447-8848 (949) 833-0600
info@pcgs.com
A Division of Collectors Universe
<< <i>This seems to be the only positive thing to be said about this dealer. They handle refunds really well. I guess that makes sense if you so something enough you get really good at it! >>
I think the CA attitude is that "we don't care how many people you screw over; just refund their money if they ask".
edited to correct typo!!
<< <i>Have you noticed that just about every single one of the grades in their ads show the coin as a choice grade (VF30, XF45, AU55). It seems like they don't know the meaning of proper grading or that they're sooooo lucky as to only purchase choice coins. >>
I don't know anything about the guy you are talking about, but I do know that for the most part, I only buy decent coins, so consequently, if I end up selling them, they'll be decent grades (generally). Sometimes I get some dogs in estate sales or auctions, but I do describe them, like you said, i.e., AG, G-4, etc. I'm not a dealer, just a collector, but from time to time, either to raise money to buy something I really want that's pricey or to pay for sending things into PCGS, or just because I'm broke, I sell off my coins and then, I also sell off anything I get that's either a duplicate or something I don't collect that I come across in a lot somewhere.
If the guy's a dealer, though, I don't see how he never gets anything but high grades, so good point. Thanks for all the tips, everybody.
Kind regards,
Linda
A friend of mine was showing off his latest acquisition at the coin club last night. It was an 1896 Morgan Dollar in a 2X2 marked as MS64. It was crap. It had no luster and a whitish haze all over. It was dead. To me the coin is worth bullion, but he paid $40 for it. Sarosi ripped him a new one. He said it was too late to return it. I talked with him for a little while on what was wrong with it and what a "proper" UNC should look like (I showed him an MS60 in our auction for comparison). Hopefully, this will be a cheap lesson for him.
I have no experience with them one way or another, but I did think it rather funny...
Sounds like what I initially thought was PVC contamination might not be that, but rather some sort of "doctoring " compound intentionally applied to the coins to mask defects.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
Edited to add:
By the way, I've done some business with other Coin World advertisers with no problem, so I don't think it's fair to lump them all in together to say that everyone that has a big ad is a crook!
I think Russ rips him on DEEP Cameo's--but uses a chichen disguise
She's the worst!
Camelot
Bruce Scher
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Steve
10-4,
My Instagram picturesErik
My registry sets
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Bruce
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Hi Kranky.
Jade Rare Coin eBay Listings
<< <i>So, is he still president of PAN?
He's listed as the bourse chairman but Kathy seems to do all the work.
I called JPS about three years ago regarding a Buffalo 1916 DDO. It was graded AG with a very low price. I would have been pleased to receive a dateless coin with a doubled image for the listed price; however, I did not want an acid treated coin. So I called. What a rude response I received when I asked if it was acid treated. Then he hung up on me.
If one cannot get a description of a coin over the phone without being verbally abused, why bother.
Garrow
Edited to add: changed a little bit at the end to 'stretches the truth a bit'. I had written something else, but dont want to get 'served', like some others out here have been. Though, it was a four letter word, and rhymes with tire.
<< <i>I heard JPS doesn't have a computer and doesn't know about any of this. >>
Talk about stone age!
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.americanlegacycoins.com
<< <i>His mother probably still loves him, but she buys her coins elsewhere.
I bought a half dozen "MS 63-64" Liberty Head "V" Nickels from them back in 1994.
Last year I sent a large group of Nickels into PCGS and all of the Sarosi coins came back MS 64.
I have to admit though, I have not bought from them again, as I got into
other series and only Certified coins. [ neither of which were handled by them.]
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
Tom