How often do you see dealers stating their coin should grade LOWER than the certified grade?

ER

I mean, when you look at their coins, it 's a variation on the same theme. "This should have been in a MS66 holder (instead of 65). The services were too hard on this coin. We don 't know what the grading sevices were thinking when they gave it this grade." Don 't you find it annoying? Especially when a dealer doing it on nearly all of his/her coins.
I wish they would just give it a rest. Just describe the coin and let us decide.
I would like to see some dealer describe his/her coin as "....this coin was certified PCGS MS62, but frankly, we find it quite repugnant, and it should have been in a AU58 holder. So, we 'll let you have it for AU58 price."

ARCO

NO. That is why buying the coin not the holder turns out to be somewhat comical. It should be "agree with the slabbed grade or pass". I guess personal skill and experience to grade for oneself turns out to be the greatest power there is.

Tyler

MrEureka

Speaking for myself, I usually don't try to retail coins that I consider overgraded. Instead, I sell them into the wholesale market as fast as I can.

The exception is with extremely rare coins for which the grade is of secondary importance. In such cases, I'm usually very blunt about the grade. I want to get that issue out in the open ASAP before the potential buyer reflexively rejects the coin because of the grade on the holder.

itsnotjustme

I beleive Alpine often comments if they feel the grade is high, I've seen comments like "XF45 (ANACS AU50)"

jcping

Does it matter? Any dealer who advertises VF20 (ANACS VF30) or EF45 (NGC 50) wants the same money for the coin.

I never saw this PCGS EF45 .... $200 and EF45 (NGC 50) .... $200

Is any wrong in this picture

Robgetty

I once sold a gold dollar that was slabbed by ACG (FORGIVE ME, I WAS YOUNG AND
DIDN'T KNOW WHAT I WAS DOING WHEN I BOUGHT IT!!!) and adverrtised it as a lower
grade than the slab said. I didn't feel right trying to screw someone just because I
had been.

stman

Like I've been saying for a while and should make it my sig line...."Save The Stories And Just Tell Me How Much."

dorkkarl

jack beymer has several. i saw a slabed ef-45 that he called vf-30, a slabed au-55 that he called au-50, a F-12 he called VG-10, a AU-58 he called AU-55. jadecoin also has several. i saw a slabed ms-64 that they called ms-60, a slabed PCGS ms-63 bust half that they call au-55, a slabed ms-62 that they call au-58. ALL the slabs i'm mentioning were PCGS or NGC (except 1 ANACS)

curiousity about both these dealers. beymer's prices on the regaded slabs reflects the lower grade - BUT his prices are high to begin with, so you end up paying full retail for the slabed grade anyhow. jadecoin stamps the lowered grade right up front on the slabe - BUT their prices are for the slabed grade, so again, you end up paying full retail for the slabed grade.

bottom line, although they busted the grades down, the prices were still for the slabed grade. but at least they were up front about it. the point: these are the ONLY 2 sellers that i saw that had the guts to slam the plastic where appropriate, & both of them were in rosemont

i didn't buy anything from either of them

K S

Askari

Here's a recent one from one of our own. But, no, it's not often enough. Perhaps that's why it adds immensely to that particular dealer's credibility.

oldcameoproofsguy

I saw a dealer write up a coin in his inventory once, that the coin barely makes the grade, how he wondered how it made the holder and that it was about the ugliest thing he'd ever seen. He had it listed at about 1/4 sheet.

That's about the only time I remember ever seeing this. It could be a sales tactic. He figures that if you see him being brutally honest about his inventory, then the coins that he describes as MONSTERS are just that.

BillJones

If you follow EAC (Early American Copper) dealer offerings and auctions, you will quite often see them describe the coins with lower grades than those that appear on the holders.

The PCGS and NGC get them back by body bagging choice early copper out of mean spiritedness and ignorance.

MadMonk

I can believe that Jack Beymer would do this...He is a no nonsense, salt of the earth kind of guy. I have had dealers make such a comment. It's rare, but it does happen.

MS68

About as often as I see a collector offer to pay more than they get quoted for a coin.

topstuf

Can't say. Never been in a confession booth.

dorkkarl

<< <i>If you follow EAC (Early American Copper) dealer offerings and auctions, you will quite often see them describe the coins with lower grades than those that appear on the holders. >>

hey billjones, that's not "lowering the grade" to eac standards, it's a whole different grading standard! ie. "commecial vf" is irrelevant to "vf" re: eac, they are not the same grading standards.

K S

Russ

<< <i>About as often as I see a collector offer to pay more than they get quoted for a coin. >>



I did that at a show once. The dealer had a 1965 SMS set that had a toned quarter and dime in it. I asked him how much for the set and he said $1.50. I gave him $2.

Russ, NCNE

Dave99B

Beymer does it all the time. I've never seen anyone else do it.

Dave

mdwoods

Rick Tomaska has a Franklin Half that he says, more or less, is graded to high. Only one
I've seen lately. I have had dealers recommend I not buy a particular coin because it is
only so-so for the grade. Mark Feld for one. mdwoods

baccaruda

The dealer had a 1965 SMS set that had a toned quarter and dime in it. I asked him how much for the set and he said $1.50. I gave him $2.

he was asking $1.50 for a 65 SMS set? at a show?

Russ

<< <i>he was asking $1.50 for a 65 SMS set? at a show? >>



Yep. He had about a half dozen, all for $1.50. Old guy, and I got the distinct impression that he thought anything minted after about 1900 was just garbage and an annoyance. It was a nice 13 fold return selling the two toners.

Russ, NCNE

jadecoin

This was the first thread on the forum - coincidentally we ended up getting mentioned in it somehow!

Yes, as someone pointed out, we do sometimes knock down grades on certified coins, but you must understand the circumstances as to why we still have a "high" price. In the examples you mentioned, they are all consignment coins, and the price is actually set by the consignor. However, we require the consignor to allow us to regrade the coins to what we feel are the appropriate standards. Our customers tend to be BHNC, EAC, etc. members who by nature are distrustful of slabs. So, we feel compelled to spell out our opinion of the correct grades. But regardless, the consignor still wants X amount of dollars, so we have no choice but to post the higher price.

Given the option, we would rather price the coins at the regraded level. HERE is an actual ebay example where PCGS graded a coin F-15, and we netted it down to VG-10. This was not a consignment, and we allowed the market to determine the value. In spite of our warnings in the description, the coin still closed at the wholesale value for a Fine+.

Thanks for reading this explanation.

scher

I love MS68's response..about as often as a collecter offers to pay more than the quoted price..im a collecter an must admit we can be bad too..funny David...
bruce scher

NumisEd

jade coin, the image is missing from the ebay auction you linked. Ed

Elcontador

In his many years at Bowers, Frank Van Halen would give no-nonsense assessments of auction coins whenever I asked re a particular lot.

I don't know how many times he talked me out of bidding on a lot with comments like, "I don't know how that coin got slabbed," or, "I don't know why _______ (the name of the grading service) put this AU coin in an MS 64 holder." OTOH, when he said a coin was nice for the grade, I could take that comment at face value & was never disappointed.

teapartycoin

Standing Liberty Quarters 1916 MS-61 SEGS We grade the coin an AU-58+. It has been lightly cleaned at one time, although it has toned back in light pastel hues. The strike is phenomenal with 75% of the head detail present as well as a razor sharp date and full breast feathers on the eagle. Miss Liberty's knee is fully rounded. One of just 52,000 coined. Hurry on this nice piece. 8000

njcoincrank

As a wholesaler I can honestly say that I haven't. But, I have got a coin back from a major grading service and given it back to them and offered to have them change the grade lower. I wanted to give them the opportunity to re-evaluate, or regrade, the piece before I made it available to the marketplace.

njcoincrank

Lakesammman

EERC does it all the time - just look for the coins that aren't photosealed.

dorkkarl

ttt

sliderider

Geez Russ, you really held back on the guy. For a buck and a half each, I'd have had his entire inventory.

Robgetty

Wow, this is really pulling up an old thread!! (15 months dormant, and it lives!!)

my3cents

when's this gonna happen?

majorbigtime

Jack Beymer occasionally advertises that a coin is actually graded lower that the slab indicates.