Could you hold the coins a little closer to the phone so I could get a better look?

Russ

I guess Littlewicher got told!

Bwuahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!

Russ, NCNE

LucyBop

You go HepDaddyHall.......!!!!

keithdagen

I nominate homerunhall for the POTD!

kieferscoins

He deserved it. Mr. Hall takes his own nightime off to answer questions and gets that supposedly "question." Littlewithcher could have spent 10 hours with his 10 power loupe on those two coins, but if he dosen't know what to look for, he will never see some slight rub which could knock it down to the AU-58 grade. He should have gone about it more diplomatic instead of upfront accousing PCGS.

Cameron Kiefer

keithdagen

I like those AU-58 no rub coins. I've bought a lot of them. Have two MS-63/64 pieces that PCGS or NGC thought had a little wear, and under a loupe, no wear. Much rather pay a premium for an AU-58 and get MS-63 quality.

truthteller

That was very, very funny.

TRUTH

mdwoods

I second Keiths nomination for POTD. That is funny.

DHeath

Which tier service will LW be billed for?

LucyBop

When the HepDaddy gives a Presidential review, he doesn't mess around!!!!!

Clankeye

Right on to that response.

cosmicdebris

AT least the wicher got a reply. I have asked several questions over the last 3 months and not one answer.

ccr

<< <i>Which tier service will LW be billed for? >>



If he actually did it, $100 for express service. Postage due and reverse charges as well.

EVillageProwler

I agree that LW didn't handle this one well at all. However, I think it would have been better if we had PM'ed LW with constructive, private commentary instead of publicly laughing at and chastising him like this.

Remember - we're the adults...

EVP

PS I thought HRH's response was hilarious, and appropriate!

TheNumish

Personally I think a person in David Halls position should be above making sarcastic answers when someone, even Littlewitcher, asks a question. He could have suggested getting a second opinion on the coin, or scanning it to the board for members to look at or ask him to send the coins to him. I don't see anything constructive happening from that answer other than getting a few chuckles.

geb209

I don't get it. Does DH think that a computer is the phone?

littlewicher

Well, I guess we can see who are the more mature ones in this bunch. He didn't answer my question that I asked. That's what really made me mad. Maybe if Hall wasn't so arrogant and self-centered he could answer like a human being, without sarcasm. It truly is sad that these kind of people are running the coin world.

kieferscoins

LW:

Remember my pm's from a few months ago: Many people read these boards from all over the coin hobby. People will rememeber how you presented yourself on the boards, even if it wasn't your fault. That may be a deciding factor when a job hiring comes into play.

Cameron Kiefer

MICHAELDIXON

LW,
I didn't see a question in your post for David Hall to answer. If you had posed a direct question, he could have given a direct answer, but this was nothing but ranting about the AU58 grades.

baccaruda

maybe PCGS was overly harsh on the grading, maybe not, but you can't question something like that. if they took the submitter's input on their opinion of the coin, then "third-party" grading would become a misnomer.

i don't think it would have been out-of-bounds to request a reason for an AU58 grade with the return however. i've seen a lot of complaints about AU58 grades, perhaps if one grades at that level they could have a slip of paper with a stock xerox picture of the coin where the grader could simply mark the problem area.

at least you wouldn't have to drive yourself nuts wondering why.

TheNumish

Littlewhitcher isn't the only person in the world to send coins to PCGS and be dissapointed in the grades. Lot's of those people are reading David Halls answers. It's up to David Hall to explain to the novice collector why the coins might have graded AU-58 and where to go to learn what the difference is. It's not just about Littlewhitcher.

"hold the coins closer to the phone" is a typical Hall answer that he thinks shows how smart and funny he is.

littlewicher

First of all I didn't mean to sound so mean in it. I was basically asking if weak strikes can be mistaken for wear when the graders look at the coins so quickly. That's all I needed an answer for.

LucyBop

well then you should have asked like you just did now.....

littlewicher

I wrote the message right after I got the grades. If I could have changed it, I would have.

kieferscoins

<< <i>First of all I didn't mean to sound so mean in it. >>



Ok. If you didn't mean to then that is a little different. Collectors get fired up about their coins and sometmes posts go crazy or come across another way than you expected. Next week, try asking the question again and simply state the facts, or just add photos - along with a direct question. I bet Mr. Hall will give a better answer and you can learn from it.

Cameron Kiefer

MadMarty

I know all about the 58s, you look at the coin and say "how the hell did this get a 58?". Crack them, take pictures and re-submit. If they come back 63, then you have a beef. If the come back 58s, again. Then well, take it like a man!

But I have to admit HRHs respone was funny as hell!

Android

The real problem was that LW didn't ask a question, he made a statement. People using the Q and A forum shouldn't be asking about specific submissions anyway. That is why PCGS has a customer service department with a phone number. (I won't debate the issues of PCGS customer service). I'm not necessarily a big fan of Mr. Hall or PCGS, but I appreciated the obvious light hearted humor he demonstrated with his response. Had I made a similar statement, I would have had a chuckle when I read his answer.

Andy

satootoko

<< <i>I wrote the message right after I got the grades. If I could have changed it, I would have. >>



When I'm really ticked off I:

1. Immediately write to the other party with full spleen vent.

2. Then I wait a day or two, shred my first response, and do another.

3. Then I wait a day or two and either go back to No. 2 or send it.

Very rarely have to say "If I could have changed it, I would have."

littlewicher

Okay, okay, I will admit it was a little funny, and I probably should have left my submission results out. I guess anger can overtake anyone.

DCAMFranklin

<< <i>I agree that LW didn't handle this one well at all. However, I think it would have been better if we had PM'ed LW with constructive, private commentary instead of publicly laughing at and chastising him like this.

Remember - we're the adults...

EVP

PS I thought HRH's response was hilarious, and appropriate! >>




EVP- Some members sole purpose of posting is to belittle and chastise. And you suggest they show some maturity? Guffaw!

FrattLaw

I'm on board with Numish on this one. This is a guy that is running the show over there, he shouldn't be making sarcastic remarks to Board Members/Customers, whether it's Laura or Littlewicher, just to show how witty and comical he is. The arrogance is amazing.

Matter of fact, instead of spending his time posting to this Board -- how about getting into the grading room and churning out some submissions, mine's been sitting there since 1/28. 50 day turn around times and he comes on to the Forums and post nasty little remarks, c'mon, have some respect.

Perhaps, offering a "Presidential Review" to Littlewicher would have been the right response. But then again, he would have to act "presidential" in order to provide that kind of service.

Michael

presleyh

Well once again I say the written word, as on this forum, can be interpreted many different ways when no face to face emotion is included. Maybe lw wasn't as mean as the words came across and maybe dh wasn't as sarcastic as some have taken him. It's fun to watch people take sides so quickly, without having a true concept of what would be said face to face.

KlectorKid

I think that LW chose the absolute wrong way to go about telling Mr. Hall. Go onto a Q and A forum tell the head of PCGS that they are crap and that your coin is an ms-62 not an au-58 dont ask why, dont show pics just tell a guy that has been in the bizz for way over the amount of years you have been on the earth that he is wrong. Not going to get u very far.


Edited to add: Oops I forgot to metion calling him quote "arrogant and self-centered" and going on to say "It truly is sad that these kind of people are running the coin world."

FatMan

Right or wrong I'm not going to judge...........but HRH certainly made me laugh.

FrattLaw

As someone who basically makes my living from the written word, you have to be even more careful on how things are phrased since there's no body/facial language that can be interpreted from your statement. Both LW and DH may have been able to phrase their posts better, but the oenous is on DH as the President of PCGS/CU to step up to the plate and handle a customer complaint without a sarcastic remark. Even though he posts to this Forum, he should never be confused as being just a regular "forum member" he owns the friggin' thing!

I would expect better from Mr. Hall. As for face to face, I actual wouldn't expect anything different. The ONE and ONLY ONE interaction I had with him face to face, he also made a sarcastic comment as to a fingerprint and hair on a coin I presented to him at Long Beach.

Michael

littlewicher

<< <i>I think that LW chose the absolute wrong way to go about telling Mr. Hall. Go onto a Q and A forum tell the head of PCGS that they are crap and that your coin is an ms-62 not an au-58 dont ask why, dont show pics just tell a guy that has been in the bizz for way over the amount of years you have been on the earth that he is wrong. Not going to get u very far.

Edited to add: Oops I forgot to metion calling him quote "arrogant and self-centered" and going on to say "It truly is sad that these kind of people are running the coin world." >>



As I said before, KK, the AU-58 grade simply served as a premise for my statement. I was basically asking if a weak strike can be mistaken for wear, due to the fact that graders don't take much time to look at coins. Plus you also state that "just tell a guy that has been in the bizz for way over the amount of years you have been on the earth that he is wrong," where did I ever say that Mr. Hall was specifcially wrong? Second of all, I never said the coin was a MS-62. I strongly suggest you get your facts straight before you just reply with completely false information.

Oh, also, what are you trying to prove by saying that I called him those things? In my opinion, it's irrelevant in the argument you're making.

Bear

If we expect the head of a large company to always be sweet and kind and lovable

it just isnt going to happen. Many of these executives get to the top by being tough.

All we want or need from Mr Hall is to correct the major problems at PCGS and get it back

to an efficient, smooth running operation that even makes some money. If he does these things,

I dont really care how lovable he is. He does have an interesting sense of humour, that is sharp

and a bit pungent. When you ask a question that is attacking in nature, many people get defensive

and a bit sarcastic. Human beings are strange creatures all right. Glad Im a bear.

KlectorKid

Sorry you never said he was wrong you just said the grades were crap. My mistake. I dont see how the grade u wanted them to be other than MS makes a differance either.

littlewicher

Don't take it so hard, KK. I'm just practicing for my future litigating career.

fcloud

From my first hand experience,

They screwed up my coin.
Tried to make it better and made it worse.
And they claim they can't see anything in the picture I posted the other day.
I have now spent more on shipping than a coin is worth.

I think it could have been handled better.

supercoin

Well, a sarcastic, humorous response is still a response. No sympathy here.

FrattLaw

Bear -- with all due respect, if you're the guy taking my money on 1/28/03 to grade my coins and it's now 3/12/03 and I still don't have them, either I want you to come on this Board and let me/us know how you're going to fix the problems, or shut your mouth and go fix them. When DH comes here and insults any customer, whether he's being funny, goofy, or non-lovable, doesn't really matter, he in essence is mocking us all. I'd love to be able to run a business where I get to screw over my customers and then laugh in their face about it. If I ever said to one of my clients "gee, I only over billed you $1000.00 today, ha ha!" I wouldn't have any clients left to mock.

Supercoin --- that's a great pic -- you should tweak it and make it look like a Wanted Dead or Alive Poster, or a milkcart missing person add.

Michael

IrishMike

Heh, I think Hall's response was not only funny but appropriate. He met a personal attack with some humor, nothing wrong with that.

DCAMFranklin

Bear- Couldn't disagree more. Just a really poor response. Yes, a great number of executives get to their current positions by "being tough". They may be tough negotiating with their suppliers. They may be tough with their employees. They may be tough with their subordinate executives. I've never seen a good, long-lasting executive thrive by "being tough" with their customers while 8,000 other customers watch on. Have you?? I doubt it.

The response was childish, rude and in very poor taste. Such a flippant little smarta$$ remark may be funny to some, but it was totally uncalled for from the President of a public corporation with a $300,000 salary. I know a good number of corporate heads and not one of them would tolerate such abuse of a customer from one of their employees! They certainly wouldn't do it themselves. They have more composure and maturity.

One can't help but wonder what you hope to gain from your post. He blew it and you know it.

zenny

<< <i>When DH comes here and insults any customer, whether he's being funny, goofy, or non-lovable, doesn't really matter, he in essence is mocking us all. I'd love to be able to run a business where I get to screw over my customers and then laugh in their face about it. >>




Michael

I gave myself a day before chiming in on this one, but my initial reaction was pretty much the same as yours.

(After reading your posts here for the last few months I doubt seriously that you'd actually enjoy treating people this way, even if you felt you could "get away with it.")

It's obvious that perhaps LW's wasn't the best possible choice of questions to respond to, as it seems there are numerous serious issues that have been raised and ignored.

Mr. Hall won't go in the grading room to help out because his time is so valuable, but there is time to search out a whiny non-question and respond with absolute condescension?

I'm sure it's no picnic to deal with basically the kind of problems that "customer service" departments were developed to handle, especially if you earn an embarassingly high salary, but the phrase "the customer is always right" while being a bit pollyannaish and perhaps outdated, was born of a certain nugget of truth.

If only 50 people in the world can grade coins, it pretty much goes without saying that a kid from NJ isn't going to be one of them. Unfortunately, even some of those 50 have been treated to some fairly rude and disrespectful treatment on these forums, and at this point it appears no customer is beyond being treated like some sort of nuisance.

z

DCAMFranklin

ttt

RegistryCoin

Interesting thread guys. No offense, but, It seems that LW volunteered to be a straight man. "Crap" and "piss" don't lend themselves to a well phrased question for a CEO's Q & A forum, and, being serious (which is asking a whole lot), there was no question asked. At least your observation got a response, and the funniest one yet. (imho)
Prepare next week's straight line, and let's see if DH can top "Could you hold the coins a little closer to the phone so I could get a better look?" You gotta admit, that's a crack-up.

baccaruda

i think his response was amusing. what was he supposed to say? "By the power vested in me, there will be no more AU58 grades assigned".

Clankeye

Couldn't agree more with RegistryCoin. LW set the table and got fed the lunch he deserved.

When are people going to get a clue that you don't talk to anyone that way? Not the president of the firm, not the janitor, not the person that mows your lawn. Not anyone.

Clankeye

DesertLizard

I think some of you need to wear more loose fitting underwear. Try boxers.

We are talking about coins right?

Bear

Politeness gets a polite response, an insulting statement or comment gets either a humerous reply or

a harsh reply. Mr Hall chose to give a humerous reply which under the circumstances seemed

appropriate. In my opinion. Bear

LucyBop

<< <i>I think some of you need to wear more loose fitting underwear >>



I DISAGREE!