lurked long enough - toning is just plain old dirt
coolcoinz
Posts: 20
sorry but it only looks to me that all of the hype about toning is going to go away when everyone wises up and realizes that it's just DIRT! Yes, that's right, it's just dirt!
Sure it may be "pretty" dirt, but face it: it's still just dirt. And one day soon, the "grading geniuses" will wake up from their dirty dreams and have an "AHA" moment and realize that all this time they have been fooled/taken in by dirt.
I am oversimplifying and for the toning "lover" out there, I will be more precise: toning is the deposition whether slowly or rapidly (sometimes referred to as AT) of a foreign substance(dirt, trash, chemical, metal, oxide, etc. etc.) upon a coin surface. I guess you could coat a coin with GOLD and call it toning, right? Or does it depend upon the gold being deposited on the coin over a long period of time and the "gold vapor" being mixed in the air so it would deposit on the coin and make it look pretty?
As is quoted so often here: "BWHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!"
Give it a break and a rest. EVERYONE with any sense knows that toning is nothing more than dirt or dust or a foreign material that is simply coating the coin. It may be "pretty" or it may make the coin BUTT UGLY, but it's still just dirt.
That's a FACT.
So - why are "pretty" toned coins worth sooooooo much more? Cause the dirt is pretty???
Sure it may be "pretty" dirt, but face it: it's still just dirt. And one day soon, the "grading geniuses" will wake up from their dirty dreams and have an "AHA" moment and realize that all this time they have been fooled/taken in by dirt.
I am oversimplifying and for the toning "lover" out there, I will be more precise: toning is the deposition whether slowly or rapidly (sometimes referred to as AT) of a foreign substance(dirt, trash, chemical, metal, oxide, etc. etc.) upon a coin surface. I guess you could coat a coin with GOLD and call it toning, right? Or does it depend upon the gold being deposited on the coin over a long period of time and the "gold vapor" being mixed in the air so it would deposit on the coin and make it look pretty?
As is quoted so often here: "BWHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!"
Give it a break and a rest. EVERYONE with any sense knows that toning is nothing more than dirt or dust or a foreign material that is simply coating the coin. It may be "pretty" or it may make the coin BUTT UGLY, but it's still just dirt.
That's a FACT.
So - why are "pretty" toned coins worth sooooooo much more? Cause the dirt is pretty???
0
Comments
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
Good observation, GP, to which we reply: RUST RULES!
The Ludlow Brilliant Collection (1938-64)
"Diamond is a polymorph of the element carbon. Graphite is another polymorph. The two share the same chemistry, carbon, but have very different structures and properties. "
{I'll trade you some graphite for a diamond}
The value is in the naturally occurring rarity and beauty of the object in question.
-cr
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
If you wish to think of toning as dirt, consider diamonds as coal and other precious stones as rocks. They, too are pretty and people will pay for pretty, regardless of what you or I call it.
MARIA
I feel pretty,
Oh, so pretty,
I feel pretty and witty and bright!
And I pity
Any girl who isn't me tonight.
I feel charming,
Oh, so charming
It's alarming how charming I feel!
And so pretty
That I hardly can believe I'm real.
See the pretty girl in that mirror there:
Who can that attractive girl be?
Such a pretty face,
Such a pretty dress,
Such a pretty smile,
Such a pretty me!
I feel stunning
And entrancing,
Feel like running and dancing for joy,
For I'm loved
By a pretty wonderful boy!
GIRLS
Have you met my good friend Maria,
The craziest girl on the block?
You'll know her the minute you see her,
She's the one who is in an advanced state of shock.
She thinks she's in love.
She thinks she's in Spain.
She isn't in love,
She's merely insane.
It must be the heat
Or some rare disease,
Or too much to eat
Or maybe it's fleas.
Keep away from her,
Send for Chino!
This is not the
Maria we know!
Modest and pure,
Polite and refined,
Well-bred and mature
And out of her mind!
MARIA
I feel pretty,
Oh, so pretty
That the city should give me its key.
A committee
Should be organized to honor me.
GIRLS
La la la la . . .
MARIA
I feel dizzy,
I feel sunny,
I feel fizzy and funny and fine,
And so pretty,
Miss America can just resign!
GIRLS
La la la la . . .
MARIA
See the pretty girl in that mirror there:
GIRLS
What mirror where?
MARIA
Who can that attractive girl be?
GIRLS
Which? What? Where? Whom?
MARIA
Such a pretty face,
Such a pretty dress,
Such a pretty smile,
Such a pretty me!
GIRLS
Such a pretty me!
ALL
I feel stunning
And entrancing,
Feel like running and dancing for joy,
For I'm loved
By a pretty wonderful boy!
Music by Leonard Bernstein, lyrics by Stephen Sondheim.
© 1956, 1957 Amberson Holdings LLC and Stephen Sondheim. Copyright renewed.
Leonard Bernstein Music Publishing Company LLC, Publisher.
http://www.westsidestory.com/site/level2/lyrics/pretty.html
The Ludlow Brilliant Collection (1938-64)
RUST, by definition, is corrosion. Rust happens when the coin and elements in the atmosphere combine, i.e., an "eating away" of the coin. RUST has NOTHING todo with toning.
Nice try though.
CoinPeople.com || CoinWiki.com || NumisLinks.com
The Ludlow Brilliant Collection (1938-64)
<< <i> RUST, by definition, is corrosion. >>
Toning = Tarnish = Corrosion. Toning can be very pretty corrosion though.
CoinPeople.com || CoinWiki.com || NumisLinks.com
<< <i>Rust happens when the coin and elements in the atmosphere combine, i.e., an "eating away" of the coin. RUST has NOTHING todo with toning. >>
I would agree but some forms of toning is actually a oxide growth which also consumes as well as growing upwards. Oxide growth happens when 02 reacts with some other substance's such as the silver of a coin......
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
toning
The term for the color seen on many coins. There are infinite shades, hues, and pattern variations seen, the result of how, where, and how long a coin is stored. Every coin begins to tone as it leaves the die, as all United States coins contain reactive metals in varying degrees.
corrosion
Damage that results when reactive chemicals act upon metal. When toning ceases to be a "protective" coating and instead begins to damage a coin, corrosion is the cause. Usually confined to copper, nickel and silver regular issues, although patterns in aluminum, white metal, tin, etc., also are subject to this harmful process.
What were those noises....you know...late?
My Auctions
<< <i>Every coin begins to tone as it leaves the die >>
I agree and this was a point I tried to make with Iwog, the coin begins to react with O2 in the atmosphere and even substances that are present on the dies that struck them, then whatever is found on a roll or mint bag.
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
<< <i>Is this a "guess the real user name" thread? Put me down for $10 on its4real
I don't know if I'd go $10.00, but I would go lets say 3 cents
just like yo smelly feet
Greg
http://imagehost.auctionwatch.com/bin/imageserver.x/00000000/snakesq/7166.64.2829545.1.jpg
http://imagehost.auctionwatch.com/bin/imageserver.x/00000000/snakesq/7166.64.2829545.2.jpg
Photos courtesy of Adrian Crane, Anaconda Rare Coins.
Barney
THAT SILVER EAGLE IS GORGEOUS
Link 1
Link 2
evp
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
<< <i>I know what all of you are saying. I just HATE it when my coins get dirty and start to rot. Especially like this one:
Greg >>
Hey you know what, I have some silver cleaner that will fix that little problem right up for you.
"The silver is mine and the gold is mine,' declares the LORD GOD Almighty."
<< <i>Hey Placid, Toning is a protective coating on coins? Ya, and Sulphuric Acid protects human skin! >>
I didn't write that. The expert on coins at pcgs did.
If you don't agree talk to the author.
"By the way...the "Lingo" section is very comprehensive and very good. The section was written by coin expert extraordinaire (and PCGS founder), John Dannreuther. I believe JD is one of the great coin minds of our time".
Who am I to disagree?
toning is caused by mold & mildew. any goof-whack knows that. that's why i clean all my coins with lysol - cleans & deodorizes!
K S
toning
The term for the color seen on many coins. There are infinite shades, hues, and pattern variations seen, the result of how, where, and how long a coin is stored. Every coin begins to tone as it leaves the die, as all United States coins contain reactive metals in varying degrees.
corrosion
Damage that results when reactive chemicals act upon metal. When toning ceases to be a "protective" coating and instead begins to damage a coin, corrosion is the cause. Usually confined to copper, nickel and silver regular issues, although patterns in aluminum, white metal, tin, etc., also are subject to this harmful process.
The PCGS definition of toning admits that toning is a form of corrosion. The "reactive metal" part of the definition implies that the metal is being "eaten away". Any reactions between the metal in the coin and the atmosphere or anyother substance (acid, oxygen, chemicals, etc.) is indeed rust or corrosion. But, if you read on in the definition of corrosion, it is readily admitted that too much toning "causes corrosion". This is a misstatement. If all toning is corrosion, then toning doesn't "cause" corrosion - it already IS corrosion.
As Dorkkarl implies in his post - most toning can easily be cleaned off with a nice short dip. Although I'll admit first of all I don't KNOW for sure, due to not having tried, but I don't think ANY corrosion can be "dipped off". If it could, then the metal detector folks would all be rich and we would have wonderful examples of early colonials everywhere. LM, if you read this, let us know how successful you have been removing corrosion with dipping.
Even the slightest amount of "corrosion" can get a coin rejected by PCGS.
So, now, having written all of that - I have succeeded in confusing myself. If toning can easily be cleaned off and corrosion can't - then is the PCGS definition wrong? (
Someone help me out here.....
My Auctions
....... bob**rgte**
I hate it when you see my post before I can edit the spelling.
Always looking for nice type coins
my local dealer
K S
I'm building a collection of corroded Franklin Halfs. Anyone that comes across coins similar to the one photographed below can send them to me. They can't be helped by a dip (too corroded) so you might as well send them to me and face value.
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
"Corrosion" or "rust" is a reaction that continues past the surface level molecules and continues to react with the metal consuming the metal to form more salt. Unless halted, this process will totally consume the metal turning it completely into a metallic salt.
Dirt is a surface deposit not caused by a chemical reaction, just foreign matter deposited on the surface. Of course this "dirt" could then react with the surface mlecules to cause "toning" or "corrosion"
Just what I remember from my chemistry courses and considerable experience with gun finishes.
Wayne
Wayne
www.waynedriskillminiatures.com