Pure Technologies <> App Update 1.1 Improved Toning Analysis & Pricing

treybenedict

Hi everyone!

We are really excited to announce that Pure Technologies is launching our first iOS App on the app store on June 21st, for all iPhone sizes on iOS 16.0 or higher. The app is called: Collect Pure: Scan Rare Coins, and has taken 3 months of dedicated work from our engineering team who used to work at Apple, and Amazon & Heritage. It is free for everyone to download and comes with live support & documentation that can be accessed here. Our goal is to create pricing transparency for all collectors, dealers and auction houses so please share with your friends!

Let me introduce you to some of the features of this public preview version...

Scan PCGS, NGC, CAC & (soon) CACG Holders all at Once
Verifying Certs, Looking up prices & Onboarding Inventory has never been easier. Pure offers four different ways to onboard certified coins including matrix scan (multiple holders at once), single scan, manual entry (traditional cert lookup), and NFC tap for certified coins equipped with NFC. We created a custom barcode decoding algorithm to be able to decipher the services apart from each other with very high accuracy, so you don't have to specify the service when using matrix scan or single scan features. Furthermore, you can subtract scans with a review page on matrix scan to view coins individually or save them all at once to your inventory.

Pure Pricing Engine
The Pure Pricing Engine produces unique pricing points for each coin, separating grading services and providing real-time estimates on common dates and rarities alike. We utilize over 7 million Auction Sales from Top Numismatic Auction Houses in our machine learning and statistical models to be able to produce an accurate and actionable price for the collector/dealer. Understand trending values, view previous results, and toggle across different grades to view alternative sales. We only take into account Pure historical records in our models to produce unbiased and transparent results eliminating price guides, wholesale and retail pricing.

Tracking Real-Time Inventory/Collection Value
After Scanning in your coins via Scanning, Tapping, or Manual Entry, you can save them by clicking the download button at the top right of the page. This adds and tracks your inventory in one sweep to allow for ease of sorting and viewing. The inventory is searchable by date, comes automatically ordered by denomination, and can be segmented by service. You may delete coins from your inventory all at once using the trash can button, or by swiping left to individually delete. On the home page, a breakdown of inventory will be charted and viewable, as well as an aggregate real-time value that updates automatically with recent sales.

Obverse AI Toning Analysis Reports for PCGS Trueviews
Upon scanning a coin with a PCGS Trueview, click the rainbow emoji Icon in the top right corner to be able to generate an Obverse AI Toning analysis that both rates the toning on a letter scale (A+, A, A- ... F), and provides a color scale indicator for how toned the coin is. Please be patient as this is an experimental feature and may take ~1-2 minutes to generate given the high processing time of computer vision & machine learning. Updates coming soon: Adaptive pricing after running a toning analysis, Number score & Letter score, as well as segmented analysis for Obverse & Reverse Images.

The app comes embedded with live support and documentation to help you figure out all the nooks and crannies of usability, and you are more than welcome to message me directly for support or email me at treyb@berkeley.edu.

To download the app click here on your iPhone: https://apps.apple.com/app/collect-pure-scan-rare-coins/id6446706268 or search "Collect Pure: Scan Rare Coins" on the app store.

The app is currently available for Pre-Order and will officially launch and download to your phone on June 21st, 2023. You must have an account to use the app, the signup is at the beginning when onboarded.

Note: This is a public preview and has lots of iterations and updates to come. We appreciate your support highly by leaving a 5-star review on the app store as it helps us grow as a startup. All logos and trademarks of associated companies belong to their respective copyright holders.

Furthermore, I will be at the Long Beach show this week and am happy to help you get onboarded, take user feedback, and also implement new features that you would like to see. I'll have goodies for those that come say hi

keyman64

Sounds interesting. Which auction houses, besides Heritage that I see in the pic? Is Great Collections included? If they are not then it is a huge miss.

Pricing of toners will be very interesting and I am skeptical. Some great toners will sell near price guide, some 3-6 times price guide and others can go 20x price guide. There are so many variables and if you mess up on just one you might not even be in the ballpark. The rarity of toning based on the date and grade cannot be ignored. It seems to be a risky move where people might just call it another junk price guide.

Re: Obverse AI Toning Analysis...when will you be able to do a full coin analysis?

I do like where you are going though. Really neat work!

treybenedict

@keyman64 said:
Sounds interesting. Which auction houses, besides Heritage that I see in the pic? Is Great Collections included? If they are not then it is a huge miss.

Pricing of toners will be very interesting and I am skeptical. Some great toners will sell near the price guide, some 3-6 times the price guide and others can go 20x the price guide. There are so many variables and if you mess up on just one you might not even be in the ballpark. The rarity of toning based on the date and grade cannot be ignored. It seems to be a risky move where people might just call it another junk price guide.

Re: Obverse AI Toning Analysis...when will you be able to do a full coin analysis?

I do like where you are going though. Really neat work!

Sadly Ian has not agreed to open his sales data for public usage. I suspect if enough people make the push, we can get some groundwork laid there, but I have already spoken to him more than once about this issue.

Nearly every other house is included. You name it we got it!

Pricing toners is a longer in-depth process that will not be released in this initial version. I will likely be taking community calls and gathering a study that impacts both the Computer Vision aspect & subjectivity of grade/date. The goal is to provide facts and evidence to be able to make based claims. Many of the other PGs and sheets we see are merely wild guesses.

Long hill battle ahead but willing to put in the work for the community!

JW77

A lot of neat features in your app; much thought put into the development to make this a value add for the users. Wish you the best of luck and I look forward to giving it a go.

treybenedict

@JW77 said:
A lot of neat features in your app; much thought put into the development to make this a value add for the users. Wish you the best of luck and I look forward to giving it a go.

Thank you! Lots of hours have been put into this, I hope it serves as a beacon for the community to utilize for the betterment of collecting and trading.

keyman64

@treybenedict said:

@keyman64 said:
Sounds interesting. Which auction houses, besides Heritage that I see in the pic? Is Great Collections included? If they are not then it is a huge miss.

Pricing of toners will be very interesting and I am skeptical. Some great toners will sell near the price guide, some 3-6 times the price guide and others can go 20x the price guide. There are so many variables and if you mess up on just one you might not even be in the ballpark. The rarity of toning based on the date and grade cannot be ignored. It seems to be a risky move where people might just call it another junk price guide.

Re: Obverse AI Toning Analysis...when will you be able to do a full coin analysis?

I do like where you are going though. Really neat work!

Sadly Ian has not agreed to open his sales data for public usage. I suspect if enough people make the push, we can get some groundwork laid there, but I have already spoken to him more than once about this issue.

Nearly every other house is included. You name it we got it!

Pricing toners is a longer in-depth process that will not be released in this initial version. I will likely be taking community calls and gathering a study that impacts both the Computer Vision aspect & subjectivity of grade/date. The goal is to provide facts and evidence to be able to make based claims. Many of the other PGs and sheets we see are merely wild guesses.

Long hill battle ahead but willing to put in the work for the community!

Ian has not allowed PCGS to use auction results in Coin Facts so this is not a surprise. One of the most valuable things on this planet is data and I’m guessing Ian knows this. I imagine he wants people on his website, not just anywhere else that has mined the data. It’s unfortunate but I can’t blame him one bit.

treybenedict

@keyman64 said:

@treybenedict said:

@keyman64 said:
Sounds interesting. Which auction houses, besides Heritage that I see in the pic? Is Great Collections included? If they are not then it is a huge miss.

Pricing of toners will be very interesting and I am skeptical. Some great toners will sell near the price guide, some 3-6 times the price guide and others can go 20x the price guide. There are so many variables and if you mess up on just one you might not even be in the ballpark. The rarity of toning based on the date and grade cannot be ignored. It seems to be a risky move where people might just call it another junk price guide.

Re: Obverse AI Toning Analysis...when will you be able to do a full coin analysis?

I do like where you are going though. Really neat work!

Sadly Ian has not agreed to open his sales data for public usage. I suspect if enough people make the push, we can get some groundwork laid there, but I have already spoken to him more than once about this issue.

Nearly every other house is included. You name it we got it!

Pricing toners is a longer in-depth process that will not be released in this initial version. I will likely be taking community calls and gathering a study that impacts both the Computer Vision aspect & subjectivity of grade/date. The goal is to provide facts and evidence to be able to make based claims. Many of the other PGs and sheets we see are merely wild guesses.

Long hill battle ahead but willing to put in the work for the community!

Ian has not allowed PCGS to use auction results in Coin Facts so this is not a surprise. One of the most valuable things on this planet is data and I’m guessing Ian knows this. I imagine he wants people on his website, not just anywhere else that has mined the data. It’s unfortunate but I can’t blame him one bit.

Totally understand his perspective. Maybe one day!

Catbert

Other than the toning analysis, how is your app different than the PCGS app and coin facts? Not sure I see the value proposition.

treybenedict

@Catbert said:
Other than the toning analysis, how is your app different than the PCGS app and coin facts? Not sure I see the value proposition.

Glad you asked this question! Think of us as the Bloomberg terminal for coins. Our value prop is as follows:

• Pure can look up and scan multiple coins at once as long as they are certified PCGS, NGC & CAC, and soon CACG.
• Pure provides deeper data analytics through the use of machine learning models, as well as access to more auction records that typically only dealers can view. You also visualize price trends going up and down and predict future sales.
• Pure allows for tracking your collection and inventory more efficiently by gaining real-time updates on new sales and pricing information that comes in as well as having a comprehensive and searchable inventory list.

Our current state of the market is segmented between apps, you need a PCGS app, an NGC app, and a CAC lookup online. On top of that, the scanners are broken, and the values are misaligned and typically hidden after multiple link clicks. We cleaned this all up and made it one easy place for you to receive insights about your certified rare coins.

FlyingAl

I love the idea, and I really see the value of having one app for everything. If your prices are more accurate than other guides, then you've really got something.

What I appreciate most is that it really does seem like there's a collector behind this (and the app is therefore collector centered and what the collector wants). I really do wish you the best for this, and I look forward to the launch.

BStrauss3

Where is the revenue stream to support this? I see a nice app (Android when?) that takes time and money to code, support, and data access (more and more data is moving behind paywalls or by-the-drink charging - Reddit API anyone?)

treybenedict

@FlyingAl said:
I love the idea, and I really see the value of having one app for everything. If your prices are more accurate than other guides, then you've really got something.

What I appreciate most is that it really does seem like there's a collector behind this (and the app is therefore collector centered and what the collector wants). I really do wish you the best for this, and I look forward to the launch.

Thank you! Really appreciate this comment. Been a lot of long hours, but happy to finally have collectors like myself start using the app as well.

treybenedict

@BStrauss3 said:
Where is the revenue stream to support this? I see a nice app (Android when?) that takes time and money to code, support, and data access (more and more data is moving behind paywalls or by-the-drink charging - Reddit API anyone?)

We were recently backed by Y Combinator, more on their story here. Our team consists of four college students at Berkeley who put together something scrappy to prove product-market fit and usage! Our goal is to never pay-wall data, more on our roadmap in a later thread.

Sunshine Rare Coins

Looks very interesting. Can't wait to try it!

treybenedict

@UltraHighRelief said:
Looks very interesting. Can't wait to try it!

Thanks! Will you be in Long Beach? Would love to talk and help with the onboarding process.

Sunshine Rare Coins

@treybenedict said:

@UltraHighRelief said:
Looks very interesting. Can't wait to try it!

Thanks! Will you be in Long Beach? Would love to talk and help with the onboarding process.

I will be at ANA. Will you have an Android app and iPad app available soon?

treybenedict

@UltraHighRelief said:

@treybenedict said:

@UltraHighRelief said:
Looks very interesting. Can't wait to try it!

Thanks! Will you be in Long Beach? Would love to talk and help with the onboarding process.

I will be at ANA. Will you have an Android app and iPad app available soon?

I will see you at the ANA then iPad will be easier than Android. However, will have both within the next 2-3 months.
Sadly the iPad does not have an NFC reader though, so scanning/manual entry is only available.

Mr_Spud

Cool, I did the pre-download with the app so I’ll be notified when it’s available!

treybenedict

@Mr_Spud said:
Cool, I did the pre-download with the app so I’ll be notified when it’s available!

Awesome! Thanks for the support, curious to hear your feedback as well.

It should automatically download to your phone on the 21st around Noon PST.

spyglassdesign

Can one look up coins quickly like on Coinfacts without having to scan a coin?

jmlanzaf

@keyman64 said:

@treybenedict said:

@keyman64 said:
Sounds interesting. Which auction houses, besides Heritage that I see in the pic? Is Great Collections included? If they are not then it is a huge miss.

Pricing of toners will be very interesting and I am skeptical. Some great toners will sell near the price guide, some 3-6 times the price guide and others can go 20x the price guide. There are so many variables and if you mess up on just one you might not even be in the ballpark. The rarity of toning based on the date and grade cannot be ignored. It seems to be a risky move where people might just call it another junk price guide.

Re: Obverse AI Toning Analysis...when will you be able to do a full coin analysis?

I do like where you are going though. Really neat work!

Sadly Ian has not agreed to open his sales data for public usage. I suspect if enough people make the push, we can get some groundwork laid there, but I have already spoken to him more than once about this issue.

Nearly every other house is included. You name it we got it!

Pricing toners is a longer in-depth process that will not be released in this initial version. I will likely be taking community calls and gathering a study that impacts both the Computer Vision aspect & subjectivity of grade/date. The goal is to provide facts and evidence to be able to make based claims. Many of the other PGs and sheets we see are merely wild guesses.

Long hill battle ahead but willing to put in the work for the community!

Ian has not allowed PCGS to use auction results in Coin Facts so this is not a surprise. One of the most valuable things on this planet is data and I’m guessing Ian knows this. I imagine he wants people on his website, not just anywhere else that has mined the data. It’s unfortunate but I can’t blame him one bit.

But you can't call this a "miss" unless it is Ian's "miss".

treybenedict

@spyglassdesign said:
Can one look up coins quickly like on Coinfacts without having to scan a coin?

Coming in the next update after this release. Currently working on that now! To begin with, just certs & verifications for querying.

Paradisaea

Is coverage of the app limited to US coins or will it work with slabbed world and ancient coins, as well?
And is the app being restricted to the US public?

The reason I ask is an "App Not Available. This app is currently not available in your country or region" notice appears when following the app store link in the OP (app store is currently set with Australia as the country/region). Looks to be a great resource that I'd be keen to explore!

ricko

@treybenedict... This is a major project and very impressive. When fully developed/implemented, I believe it will be an incredible resource. Best of luck in your work, Cheers, RickO

gumby1234

What if the coin doesn't have an image from the TPG. Can you use a quality photo from your phone for the toning scan? Gotta wait for Android version myself.

treybenedict

@Paradisaea said:
Is coverage of the app limited to US coins or will it work with slabbed world and ancient coins, as well?
And is the app being restricted to the US public?

The reason I ask is an "App Not Available. This app is currently not available in your country or region" notice appears when following the app store link in the OP (app store is currently set with Australia as the country/region). Looks to be a great resource that I'd be keen to explore!

US & Canada to begin with. This is more of an issue with Privacy Policies for the other regions. I can get an Australian version up for you as well as EU. World coins will pull in auction data as well but we have to formalize that process first!

treybenedict

@ricko said:
@treybenedict... This is a major project and very impressive. When fully developed/implemented, I believe it will be an incredible resource. Best of luck in your work, Cheers, RickO

Thank you! These types of comments keep me going and curious to hear more feedback as more people use the app.

treybenedict

@gumby1234 said:
What if the coin doesn't have an image from the TPG. Can you use a quality photo from your phone for the toning scan? Gotta wait for Android version myself.

Self-supplied images coming in a later update. Working on image uniformity our end, but this will be released at a later time.

As for Android, will also be around 2-3 months and a native version will come to you guys as well!

johnny010

For pricing trends can certain TPGs be excluded. Some coins in certain TPGs at certain grades are worth less than the same grade at other TPGs.

treybenedict

@johnny010 said:
For pricing trends can certain TPGs be excluded. Some coins in certain TPGs at certain grades are worth less than the same grade at other TPGs.

Yes, you can segment to filter for just one TPG.

Filters come preset by “All”, NGC, PCGS, NGC & CAC, or PCGS & CAC.

Our model prices each segmentation differently.

dbldie55

Looks like an app to look into. Keep us posted as to when it is available for us android users.

treybenedict

@dbldie55 said:
Looks like an app to look into. Keep us posted as to when it is available for us android users.

Thanks! Surprised how many android users there are. This will be a priority for us in the near future.

treybenedict

Will anyone be at Long Beach?

PM me if so, we can meet up.

spyglassdesign

@treybenedict said:

@dbldie55 said:
Looks like an app to look into. Keep us posted as to when it is available for us android users.

Thanks! Surprised how many android users there are. This will be a priority for us in the near future.

I know it may not seem that way but there are actually more androids in hands than iphones overall. Not sure what the current stats are but it had been over half for a long time.

Edit: In the most recent quarter of 2023, Android remained the most popular operating system in the world, with a 71.63% market share, followed by its main competitor, iOS, with 27.71%.

jedm

I'm impressed that you're doing this and respect your goal of no paywall. I'll patiently wait for the Android version.

treybenedict

@spyglassdesign said:

@treybenedict said:

@dbldie55 said:
Looks like an app to look into. Keep us posted as to when it is available for us android users.

Thanks! Surprised how many android users there are. This will be a priority for us in the near future.

I know it may not seem that way but there are actually more androids in hands than iphones overall. Not sure what the current stats are but it had been over half for a long time.

Edit: In the most recent quarter of 2023, Android remained the most popular operating system in the world, with a 71.63% market share, followed by its main competitor, iOS, with 27.71%.

Understood! Thanks for these stats.

In our case, developing native means either choosing Kotlin, for Android, or Swift for apple. Both are long processes and atypical languages to learn. There’s also new(er) options to use react native however you don’t get the same feel. Furthermore to be able to use the NFC reader, apple only allows interaction using the swift controller pre-builds that they created. So we made the first choice for the App Store, then creating Android next.

I hope this provides more insight into our decision making!

treybenedict

@jedm said:
I'm impressed that you're doing this and respect your goal of no paywall. I'll patiently wait for the Android version.

Thanks! Apologies about being iOS only. I think we will try to spin up a web app for those who are on android first, then get a more formal app completed in the future.

Lots coming up this summer, hope you follow along on our journey!

jerseycat101

I believe there is a market for using AI to quantitatively measure the quality of toning; looking forward to trying this feature when the app is released on Android!

percyb

Quite the undertaking I say. Looking forward to using the app.

treybenedict

@jerseycat101 said:
I believe there is a market for using AI to quantitatively measure the quality of toning; looking forward to trying this feature when the app is released on Android!

Still experimental, but every trial helps us build out more features that can help the collector understand deeper insights into their collection

Thanks! I’ll be sure to notify the Android users when a web version becomes available as well as an app.

treybenedict

@percyb said:
Quite the undertaking I say. Looking forward to using the app.

Thanks! Looking forward to your feedback as well.

Will you be attending Long Beach or Summer FUN?

johnny010

Here’s some comparison obverse Vs reverse pricing
Same seller

yosclimber

But there is also a CAC factor at play in those prices.

silviosi

@ treybenedict said
Still experimental, but every trial helps us build out more features that can help the collector understand deeper insights into their collection

I think i have to send you some proof sets of same years to analyze. What cause to toning? I do not open and put in lab. But from the perspective of the soft will can help, hope.

johnny010

@yosclimber said:
But there is also a CAC factor at play in those prices.

No
Neither coin is CAC

TomB

@johnny010 said:

@yosclimber said:
But there is also a CAC factor at play in those prices.

No
Neither coin is CAC

Neither coin is CAC? The title of the first coin states "PCGS & CAC" just above the price.

johnny010

@TomB said:

@johnny010 said:

@yosclimber said:
But there is also a CAC factor at play in those prices.

No
Neither coin is CAC

Neither coin is CAC? The title of the first coin states "PCGS & CAC" just above the price.

1630Boston

My kind of project @treybenedict , best of luck with this
boston

yosclimber

OK, so it is apparently mislabelled as "PCGS & CAC" in the listing categories, but CAC is not in the main title (or on the slab).

Another factor at play here is that these are asking prices, not completed/sold prices.

robec

yosclimber

Good work.
So it apparently got re-holdered, but not re-stickered?