@blitzdude said:
The metal of kings will continue NORTH and it has absolutely nothing to do with "longterm $$$ mismanagement". The gutter metal, expect the lost groundhog decades to continue. Opposite directions. Magin Dat! Hoard on! THKS!!!
Buyers continue to gradually swamp sellers. Mined supply is tight. Central Bank, SWF, and other institutional selling is drying up.
@derryb said:
Long term gold price will continue to be reflected by long term dollar mismanagement.
Gold is 10x the price of 47 years ago and the dollar is in better shape.
Unless you want a return to the G. William Miller days !!
47 years ago a gallon of gas was 59 cents and a McDonalds burger was 15 cents.
The dollar is only in better shape when compared to other currencies. What good does that serve me at the gas pump or at the grocery store?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
Long term gold price will continue to be reflected by long term dollar mismanagement.
Gold is 10x the price of 47 years ago and the dollar is in better shape.
Unless you want a return to the G. William Miller days !!
47 years ago a gallon of gas was 59 cents and a McDonalds burger was 15 cents.
The dollar is only in better shape when compared to other currencies. What good does that serve me at the gas pump or at the grocery store?
Perhaps the fact that you earn 20x more dollars in 2023 then you did in 1976? Well at least I hope you do. RGDS!
Inflation adjusted wages are lower than they were in 1976. Wage increases historically lag well behind price increases. I'm not in the socialist camp but imagine how bad it would be if it were not for organized labor fighting for wage increases.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
Long term gold price will continue to be reflected by long term dollar mismanagement.
Gold is 10x the price of 47 years ago and the dollar is in better shape.
Unless you want a return to the G. William Miller days !!
47 years ago a gallon of gas was 59 cents and a McDonalds burger was 15 cents.
The dollar is only in better shape when compared to other currencies. What good does that serve me at the gas pump or at the grocery store?
Perhaps the fact that you earn 20x more dollars in 2023 then you did in 1976? Well at least I hope you do. RGDS!
Inflation adjusted wages are lower than they were in 1976. Wage increases historically lag well behind price increases. I'm not in the socialist camp but imagine how bad it would be if it were not for organized labor fighting for wage increases.
I'm putting more $$$ in savings then I ever have. I just don't see it. I mean my lifestyle has certainly changed as I decided being a city chicken was no way to live. I probably spend less livin up here in gods country. Frugal by default I suppose you could say. Happy with the wages and the cost of living. I mean I wish the Au was a bit cheaper as the plan is still to accumulate more. Certainly, can't complain. RGDS!
@derryb said:
The dollar is only in better shape when compared to other currencies. What good does that serve me at the gas > >pump or at the grocery store?
If you want a reimposition of the gold standard, forget it. Central Banks need monetary flexibility, unless you want to re-do The Depression and have all economic adjustments take place on relatively inflexible prices and wages.
@derryb said:> @derryb said:
Inflation adjusted wages are lower than they were in 1976. Wage increases historically lag well behind price >increases. I'm not in the socialist camp but imagine how bad it would be if it were not for organized labor fighting >for wage increases.
No, they are not. Wages are higher, and TOTAL COMPENSATION (including 401K, healthcare, pensions, OPEBs, etc.) is substantially higher.
Most people mean that median manufacturing wages or blue-collar jobs have shown little or no growth, which is partly true, mostly because of free trade and the rebuilding of economies after WW II. It began in the late-1960's.
Organized labor = organized theft. They've destroyed more jobs than bad economic policies. 93% of private sector jobs are not unionzied; they seem to do OK.
@derryb said:
The dollar is only in better shape when compared to other currencies. What good does that serve me at the gas > >pump or at the grocery store?
If you want a reimposition of the gold standard, forget it. Central Banks need monetary flexibility, unless you want to re-do The Depression and have all economic adjustments take place on relatively inflexible prices and wages.
reimposition of the gold standard? LOL
I simply want dollar cheerleaders to realize the impotence of comparing dollars to much worse off currencies. The dollar is simply the winner of the ugly pig contest. The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing power. How's that working out for you?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing power. How's that working out for you?
Certainly better than my green boxes of gutter metal. RGDS!
All of my boxes were bought well below current spot. Buy low, sell high grasshopper.
However, I am still a buyer of other silver products when close to current spot.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing power. How's that working out for you?
Certainly better than my green boxes of gutter metal. RGDS!
All of my boxes were bought well below current spot. Buy low, sell high grasshopper.
As were mine......Now factor in inflation which you like to do every time you talk about dollars but for some reason neglect to mention when you speak of the gutter metal. You made a terribly poor Invesment. Every gutter stacker did. I mean we be talking lost decades. THKS!
@derryb said:
The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing power. How's that working out for you?
Certainly better than my green boxes of gutter metal. RGDS!
All of my boxes were bought well below current spot. Buy low, sell high grasshopper.
As were mine......Now factor in inflation which you like to do every time you talk about dollars but for some reason neglect to mention when you speak of the gutter metal. You made a terribly poor Invesment. Every gutter stacker did. I mean we be talking lost decades. THKS!
my green boxes have kept up with inflation. That's why I buy them - to protect the dollars I spent on them.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing power. How's that working out for you?
Certainly better than my green boxes of gutter metal. RGDS!
All of my boxes were bought well below current spot. Buy low, sell high grasshopper.
As were mine......Now factor in inflation which you like to do every time you talk about dollars but for some reason neglect to mention when you speak of the gutter metal. You made a terribly poor Invesment. Every gutter stacker did. I mean we be talking lost decades. THKS!
my green boxes have kept up with inflation. That's why I buy them - to protect the dollars I spent on them.
Well I suppose we can always agree to disagree. Look on the bright side, at least we didn't buy Pt or Pd. VERY overpriced gutter for sure. GD LCK! RGDS!
@derryb said:
I simply want dollar cheerleaders to realize the impotence of comparing dollars to much worse off currencies. The >dollar is simply the winner of the ugly pig contest. The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing >power. How's that working out for you?
Totally wrong. The strength of the dollar IS NOT measured in whether or not it can buy the same goods or has maintained purchasing power parity......it's whether or not it helps Americans achieve a rising standard of living, is used as the global reserve currency, facilitates financial transactions, etc.
Inflation hasn't been a problem for 40+ years. Are you saying you want NO ECONOMIC GROWTH if that is the price of 0% inflation ? Some inflation and currency depreciation is the NORM for economic growth.
And a global reserve financial currency MUST be printed in LARGER QUANTITIES than would be the case under PURE DOMESTIC CONSIDERATIONS as this is the definition of a global reserve financial currency. The U.S. MUST run a trade deficit -- a capital account surplus -- as the flip side of printing more money than domestic needs would demand.
I will take our monetary and economic fundamentals over any other country on Earth. You are free to tell us who is better.
@derryb said:
All of my boxes were bought well below current spot. Buy low, sell high grasshopper.
However, I am still a buyer of other silver products when close to current spot.
That's fine...just recognize and be honest that your return from PMs is much lower than traditional financial assets like stocks and bonds.
I will take our monetary and economic fundamentals over any other country on Earth. You are free to tell us who is better.
None are better, but that does not prevent inflation in both money supply and prices from turning us into "any other country on earth."
Heed the warning signs. . . or don't. LOL
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
I simply want dollar cheerleaders to realize the impotence of comparing dollars to much worse off currencies. The >dollar is simply the winner of the ugly pig contest. The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing >power. How's that working out for you?
Totally wrong. The strength of the dollar IS NOT measured in whether or not it can buy the same goods or has maintained purchasing power parity......it's whether or not it helps Americans achieve a rising standard of living, is used as the global reserve currency, facilitates financial transactions, etc.
Inflation hasn't been a problem for 40+ years. Are you saying you want NO ECONOMIC GROWTH if that is the price of 0% inflation ? Some inflation and currency depreciation is the NORM for economic growth.
And a global reserve financial currency MUST be printed in LARGER QUANTITIES than would be the case under PURE DOMESTIC CONSIDERATIONS as this is the definition of a global reserve financial currency. The U.S. MUST run a trade deficit -- a capital account surplus -- as the flip side of printing more money than domestic needs would demand.
I will take our monetary and economic fundamentals over any other country on Earth. You are free to tell us who is better.
In case you haven't noticed, the "standard of living" and "quality of life" are not generally going up at this time. Even with technological improvements, more spouses have to work than ever before, just to maintain the same standard of living.
The debt-based financial system that we have only works when there are new people willing to take on debt. If no new parties take on debt, then the existing debt of previous borrowers cannot be serviced in aggregate. Population growth can not go on indefinitely. Eventually population growth has to level off and maybe even decline, due to "Nature", scarcity of resources, overcrowding, war, etc. Interest rates that were abnormally low pre-Covid and during Covid is an indication that the non-Governmental demand for borrowing money has decreased.
As this continues to play out, there will be a move away from debt-based systems back to more of an asset-based system.
I remember HRH many years ago quoting Hugh Sconyers. Something like “I can’t predict what gold will do in the short run, but it’s going to infinity in the long run, because the dollar is going to zero.” I think he nailed it.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
@dcarr said:
In case you haven't noticed, the "standard of living" and "quality of life" are not generally going up at this time. Even >with technological improvements, more spouses have to work than ever before, just to maintain the same standard > of living.
It takes much less hours of work to buy a dishwasher.....a car....a refrigerator....or a color (HDTV) TV. You also have to adjust for the quantum improvement in consumer goods today vs. 40-60 years ago.
The debt-based financial system that we have only works when there are new people willing to take on debt. If no >new parties take on debt, then the existing debt of previous borrowers cannot be serviced in aggregate. Population >growth can not go on indefinitely. Eventually population growth has to level off and maybe even decline, due to >"Nature", scarcity of resources, overcrowding, war, etc. Interest rates that were abnormally low pre-Covid and >during Covid is an indication that the non-Governmental demand for borrowing money has decreased.
No, low rates were a function of the pandemic and are now normalized.
GDP Growth = Population Growth + Productivity Growth.....there is now talk that AI could boost productivity by 1-1.5% per year. Instead of growing 2% a year, we could be growing 3-4% a year.
As this continues to play out, there will be a move away from debt-based systems back to more of an asset-based > >system.
No, because you can't trade assets like you can debt. Just because we have lots of debt doesn't mean we're a "debt-based system." Stop worrying about "Minsky Moments" and focus on solid economic fundamentals.
@dcarr said:
In case you haven't noticed, the "standard of living" and "quality of life" are not generally going up at this time. Even >with technological improvements, more spouses have to work than ever before, just to maintain the same standard > of living.
It takes much less hours of work to buy a dishwasher.....a car....a refrigerator....or a color (HDTV) TV. You also have to adjust for the quantum improvement in consumer goods today vs. 40-60 years ago.
The debt-based financial system that we have only works when there are new people willing to take on debt. If no >new parties take on debt, then the existing debt of previous borrowers cannot be serviced in aggregate. Population >growth can not go on indefinitely. Eventually population growth has to level off and maybe even decline, due to >"Nature", scarcity of resources, overcrowding, war, etc. Interest rates that were abnormally low pre-Covid and >during Covid is an indication that the non-Governmental demand for borrowing money has decreased.
No, low rates were a function of the pandemic and are now normalized.
GDP Growth = Population Growth + Productivity Growth.....there is now talk that AI could boost productivity by 1-1.5% per year. Instead of growing 2% a year, we could be growing 3-4% a year.
As this continues to play out, there will be a move away from debt-based systems back to more of an asset-based > >system.
No, because you can't trade assets like you can debt. Just because we have lots of debt doesn't mean we're a "debt-based system." Stop worrying about "Minsky Moments" and focus on solid economic fundamentals.
.
Rates were historically low well before the pandemic, from about 2005 onward.
You can have all the fancy products you want. But that doesn't mean your QUALITY of life is any better. Ask a young family how they like it with both parents having to spend hours each day sitting in traffic commuting to jobs so as to make ends meet.
Eventually, robotics will make a difference. They will do the jobs that humans don't want. They can also relieve us from things that negatively impact quality of life such as commuting to work in traffic, crime, paperwork, household labor, etc. But they might also "relieve" us of some of our freedoms.
.
We are a debt-based monetary system. Dollars are borrowed into existence. The only reason that a dollar has any value is because somewhere somebody needs that dollar to pay off a debt. So in that sense, a dollar is backed by a promise of future labor. As time goes by, it takes less and less labor to earn a dollar. Thus, the decline in value of the dollar.
@dcarr said:
In case you haven't noticed, the "standard of living" and "quality of life" are not generally going up at this time. Even >with technological improvements, more spouses have to work than ever before, just to maintain the same standard > of living.
It takes much less hours of work to buy a dishwasher.....a car....a refrigerator....or a color (HDTV) TV. You also have to adjust for the quantum improvement in consumer goods today vs. 40-60 years ago.
The debt-based financial system that we have only works when there are new people willing to take on debt. If no >new parties take on debt, then the existing debt of previous borrowers cannot be serviced in aggregate. Population >growth can not go on indefinitely. Eventually population growth has to level off and maybe even decline, due to >"Nature", scarcity of resources, overcrowding, war, etc. Interest rates that were abnormally low pre-Covid and >during Covid is an indication that the non-Governmental demand for borrowing money has decreased.
No, low rates were a function of the pandemic and are now normalized.
GDP Growth = Population Growth + Productivity Growth.....there is now talk that AI could boost productivity by 1-1.5% per year. Instead of growing 2% a year, we could be growing 3-4% a year.
As this continues to play out, there will be a move away from debt-based systems back to more of an asset-based > >system.
No, because you can't trade assets like you can debt. Just because we have lots of debt doesn't mean we're a "debt-based system." Stop worrying about "Minsky Moments" and focus on solid economic fundamentals.
Time to throw the BS flag.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Talk is cheap...put your money where your posts are.
Come up with an investment strategy based on what you post here regarding debt and money and inflation and all the other headline nonsense. Show us how you can beat the S&P 500.
If what you say is true, you should be able to profit from it. Let's see it.
Just because we have lots of debt doesn't mean we're a "debt-based system."
"Gold is money. All else is credit." Bankers love issuing loans, especially when they can "poof" it into existence and collect interest on it. Even better when there's no reserve requirement.
Talk is cheap...put your money where your posts are.
Debt isn't money. It's a control mechanism.
you can't trade assets like you can debt
What a crock of BS!
Come up with an investment strategy based on what you post here regarding debt and money and inflation and all the other headline nonsense. Show us how you can beat the S&P 500.
If what you say is true, you should be able to profit from it. Let's see it.
When you are up to your eyeballs in debt, there is NO investment strategy. It's pretty simple.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
@jmski52 said:
When you are up to your eyeballs in debt, there is NO investment strategy. It's pretty simple.
So what you are saying is that stocks don't make money for people the last few decades, huh ? But gold, with a MISERABLE performance over virtually all time periods, does ?
Talk is cheap...put your money where your posts are.
Come up with an investment strategy based on what you post here regarding debt and money and inflation and all the other headline nonsense. Show us how you can beat the S&P 500.
If what you say is true, you should be able to profit from it. Let's see it.
This is not an investment forum. It is a discussion of precious metals. And yes, my precious metals do the job I pay them to do.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
This is not an investment forum. It is a discussion of precious metals. And yes, my precious metals do the job I pay >them to do.
Agreed...but when you make unsubstantiated claims and utter false statements regarding currencies or the status of the dollar and use it to plug PMs or gold, you should be called out on it.
If what you are saying is truthful and if you know what you are talking about, then you should have no probelm articulating how your posts can make money off of various "collapses."
I am bullish on gold as are you. But I base it on underlying fundamentals not pie-in-the-sky baloney about the end of the dollar, economies, or the banks. That's nonsense.
@derryb said:
This is not an investment forum. It is a discussion of precious metals. And yes, my precious metals do the job I pay >them to do.
Agreed...but when you make unsubstantiated claims and utter false statements regarding currencies or the status of the dollar and use it to plug PMs or gold, you should be called out on it.
If what you are saying is truthful and if you know what you are talking about, then you should have no probelm articulating how your posts can make money off of various "collapses."
I am bullish on gold as are you. But I base it on underlying fundamentals not pie-in-the-sky baloney about the end of the dollar, economies, or the banks. That's nonsense.
In case you haven't noticed, your gold price is heavily dependent on the state of the currency it is priced in. It's price is a reflection of faith in that currency. News concerning dollars is very relevant to PM price movements and a declining dollar increases PM price. Any threat to or supply/demand issues concerning the dollar are of great interest to the serious stacker.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Interesting discussion, if gold does goes to 5k or even 10k do you think there is any possibility that traditional buyers the average person would sell to , coin shops for example, refuse to buy it at that price?
I know there are stores around my area that will take gold for goods, but they are getting fewer and far between these day.
Welcome ! Move to Nebraska. We trade corn, beans, beef , jabs and barbs , and just about anything
@blitzdude said:
My Gold and my Dollars are doing just fine. Sleeping like a baby. BOOMIN! RGDS!
@derryb said:
In case you haven't noticed, your gold price is heavily dependent on the state of the currency it is priced in. It's price >is a reflection of faith in that currency. News concerning dollars is very relevant to PM price movements and a >declining dollar increases PM price. Any threat to or supply/demand issues concerning the dollar are of great >interest to the serious stacker.
Only in the short-term....longer-term, the dollar and gold can move any way they like.
@derryb said:
In case you haven't noticed, your gold price is heavily dependent on the state of the currency it is priced in. It's price >is a reflection of faith in that currency. News concerning dollars is very relevant to PM price movements and a >declining dollar increases PM price. Any threat to or supply/demand issues concerning the dollar are of great >interest to the serious stacker.
Only in the short-term....longer-term, the dollar and gold can move any way they like.
And in the long term they will move inversely in tandem just as they have been doing since gold was set free in 1972. If you think the dollar will fare better over time then you should sell me your gold.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
And in the long term they will move inversely in tandem just as they have been doing since gold was set free in > >1972. If you think the dollar will fare better over time then you should sell me your gold.
The dollar is up strongly against many currencies in the last 30 years but gold is 4x higher.
@derryb said:
And in the long term they will move inversely in tandem just as they have been doing since gold was set free in > >1972. If you think the dollar will fare better over time then you should sell me your gold.
The dollar is up strongly against many currencies in the last 30 years but gold is 4x higher.
Measure of dollar against other currencies is irrelevant to the American who spends dollars and never touches a euro or a yen. It currently tells us that the dollar is in shallow do-do while the other basket currencies are in deep do-do.
The meaningful measuring stick for the dollar to those who depend on them is "what it will buy now compared to what it would buy in the past?"
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
The meaningful measuring stick for the dollar to those who depend on them is "what it will buy now compared to > >what it would buy in the past?"
If real wages and incomes are rising, then some dollar depreciation is not a problem. Rapid or hyperinflation is different.
Nobody is hurt in 2023 America because a dollar doesn't buy what it did in 1976 or 1920.
@derryb said:
The meaningful measuring stick for the dollar to those who depend on them is "what it will buy now compared to > >what it would buy in the past?"
If real wages and incomes are rising, then some dollar depreciation is not a problem. Rapid or hyperinflation is different.
Nobody is hurt in 2023 America because a dollar doesn't buy what it did in 1976 or 1920.
Many retired people are on a fixed income and are hurt quite a lot.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
@derryb said:
The meaningful measuring stick for the dollar to those who depend on them is "what it will buy now compared to > >what it would buy in the past?"
If real wages and incomes are rising, then some dollar depreciation is not a problem. Rapid or hyperinflation is different.
Nobody is hurt in 2023 America because a dollar doesn't buy what it did in 1976 or 1920.
Many retired people are on a fixed income and are hurt quite a lot.
Then they should have saved more and spent less. Or gotten better education and better jobs. Or scared less and made better investments.
@derryb said:
The meaningful measuring stick for the dollar to those who depend on them is "what it will buy now compared to > >what it would buy in the past?"
If real wages and incomes are rising, then some dollar depreciation is not a problem. Rapid or hyperinflation is different.
Nobody is hurt in 2023 America because a dollar doesn't buy what it did in 1976 or 1920.
They are hurt when price increases have been what they have been in the past two years. Easy to confirm we are experiencing your "rapid" inflation. First it was food and medical, now it's insurance and other necessities.
Wages? they always lag inflation and do not often match it. Over time this becomes a cost of life.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
CEO of Barrick was on CNBC....I'll post the link later.
He noted that the dollar is at an ATH yet gold has been RISING. But he was wrong in calling gold a "safe asset that people go to" -- it's probably 4th or 5th on th list (U.S. Treasuries are #1).
Barrick still waiting for the turnaround -- the hedging and CAPX programs of the last 20 years wrecked the company.
@GoldFinger1969 said:
CEO of Barrick was on CNBC....I'll post the link later.
He noted that the dollar is at an ATH yet gold has been RISING. But he was wrong in calling gold a "safe asset that people go to" -- it's probably 4th or 5th on th list (U.S. Treasuries are #1).
Barrick still waiting for the turnaround -- the hedging and CAPX programs of the last 20 years wrecked the company.
Well, the way I read that.... perhaps the dollar IS at an ATH (all time high?).... if compared to other paper/fiat currencies. But purchasing power is another matter, when compared to the past and in regards to inflation that keeps occurring. Perhaps that is why gold has been rising even though the dollar is at an ATH? (though price of gold has been 'adjusting' this past week or so)
But I'm a very simple guy. Not nearly as well versed in the financial world as many of you are. My opinion is just that; my opinion. As a collectible old copper states: "Value Me As You Please".
Seems prudent to me to be diversified.... IMO gold seems to remain a good option for today, as in the past..... as well as stocks and various other assets. But I'll leave the Bitcoin for the more adventurous ones,.
@derryb said:
The meaningful measuring stick for the dollar to those who depend on them is "what it will buy now compared to > >what it would buy in the past?"
If real wages and incomes are rising, then some dollar depreciation is not a problem. Rapid or hyperinflation is different.
Nobody is hurt in 2023 America because a dollar doesn't buy what it did in 1976 or 1920.
Many retired people are on a fixed income and are hurt quite a lot.
Then they should have saved more and spent less. Or gotten better education and better jobs. Or scared less and made better investments.
@PerryHall said:
Many retired people are on a fixed income and are hurt quite a lot.
Not if their incomes have COLAs or other inflation adjustments.
Getting a 3.2% social security COLA raise in 2024. What was the inflation rate in 2023? LOL
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@derryb said:
Wages? they always lag inflation and do not often match it. Over time this becomes a cost of life.
Wages normally exceed inflation -- just look at the recent UAW contracts.
Wages DO NOT normally exceed inflation. . . unless you are an auto worker.
If wages exceeded inflation the middle class would be growing,.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@GoldFinger1969 said:
CEO of Barrick was on CNBC....I'll post the link later.
He noted that the dollar is at an ATH yet gold has been RISING.
This "All time High" is misleading. It does not indicate a dollar has stronger buying power at home. It only represents a dollar that is better off than the terrible foreign currencies it is being compared to. Dollar purchasing power at home is at all time lows. This is why gold has been rising.
These all time highs constantly being quoted by the quacks only work if an American buys his groceries in France.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Comments
Gold is 10x the price of 47 years ago and the dollar is in better shape.
Unless you want a return to the G. William Miller days !!
Buyers continue to gradually swamp sellers. Mined supply is tight. Central Bank, SWF, and other institutional selling is drying up.
We have some days ahead of gold up $150. Mark it.
47 years ago a gallon of gas was 59 cents and a McDonalds burger was 15 cents.
The dollar is only in better shape when compared to other currencies. What good does that serve me at the gas pump or at the grocery store?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Perhaps the fact that you earn 20x more dollars in 2023 then you did in 1976? Well at least I hope you do. RGDS!
Inflation adjusted wages are lower than they were in 1976. Wage increases historically lag well behind price increases. I'm not in the socialist camp but imagine how bad it would be if it were not for organized labor fighting for wage increases.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
I'm putting more $$$ in savings then I ever have. I just don't see it. I mean my lifestyle has certainly changed as I decided being a city chicken was no way to live. I probably spend less livin up here in gods country. Frugal by default I suppose you could say. Happy with the wages and the cost of living. I mean I wish the Au was a bit cheaper as the plan is still to accumulate more. Certainly, can't complain. RGDS!
If you want a reimposition of the gold standard, forget it. Central Banks need monetary flexibility, unless you want to re-do The Depression and have all economic adjustments take place on relatively inflexible prices and wages.
No, they are not. Wages are higher, and TOTAL COMPENSATION (including 401K, healthcare, pensions, OPEBs, etc.) is substantially higher.
Most people mean that median manufacturing wages or blue-collar jobs have shown little or no growth, which is partly true, mostly because of free trade and the rebuilding of economies after WW II. It began in the late-1960's.
Organized labor = organized theft. They've destroyed more jobs than bad economic policies. 93% of private sector jobs are not unionzied; they seem to do OK.
reimposition of the gold standard? LOL
I simply want dollar cheerleaders to realize the impotence of comparing dollars to much worse off currencies. The dollar is simply the winner of the ugly pig contest. The strength of the dollar to Americans is simply it's purchasing power. How's that working out for you?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Certainly better than my green boxes of gutter metal.
RGDS!
All of my boxes were bought well below current spot. Buy low, sell high grasshopper.
However, I am still a buyer of other silver products when close to current spot.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
As were mine......Now factor in inflation which you like to do every time you talk about dollars but for some reason neglect to mention when you speak of the gutter metal. You made a terribly poor Invesment. Every gutter stacker did. I mean we be talking lost decades. THKS!
my green boxes have kept up with inflation. That's why I buy them - to protect the dollars I spent on them.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Well I suppose we can always agree to disagree. Look on the bright side, at least we didn't buy Pt or Pd. VERY overpriced gutter for sure. GD LCK! RGDS!
Totally wrong. The strength of the dollar IS NOT measured in whether or not it can buy the same goods or has maintained purchasing power parity......it's whether or not it helps Americans achieve a rising standard of living, is used as the global reserve currency, facilitates financial transactions, etc.
Inflation hasn't been a problem for 40+ years. Are you saying you want NO ECONOMIC GROWTH if that is the price of 0% inflation ? Some inflation and currency depreciation is the NORM for economic growth.
And a global reserve financial currency MUST be printed in LARGER QUANTITIES than would be the case under PURE DOMESTIC CONSIDERATIONS as this is the definition of a global reserve financial currency. The U.S. MUST run a trade deficit -- a capital account surplus -- as the flip side of printing more money than domestic needs would demand.
I will take our monetary and economic fundamentals over any other country on Earth. You are free to tell us who is better.
That's fine...just recognize and be honest that your return from PMs is much lower than traditional financial assets like stocks and bonds.
But stocks and bonds -- which pay dividends and income -- have outpaced inflation.
None are better, but that does not prevent inflation in both money supply and prices from turning us into "any other country on earth."
Heed the warning signs. . . or don't. LOL
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
In case you haven't noticed, the "standard of living" and "quality of life" are not generally going up at this time. Even with technological improvements, more spouses have to work than ever before, just to maintain the same standard of living.
The debt-based financial system that we have only works when there are new people willing to take on debt. If no new parties take on debt, then the existing debt of previous borrowers cannot be serviced in aggregate. Population growth can not go on indefinitely. Eventually population growth has to level off and maybe even decline, due to "Nature", scarcity of resources, overcrowding, war, etc. Interest rates that were abnormally low pre-Covid and during Covid is an indication that the non-Governmental demand for borrowing money has decreased.
As this continues to play out, there will be a move away from debt-based systems back to more of an asset-based system.
I remember HRH many years ago quoting Hugh Sconyers. Something like “I can’t predict what gold will do in the short run, but it’s going to infinity in the long run, because the dollar is going to zero.” I think he nailed it.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
It takes much less hours of work to buy a dishwasher.....a car....a refrigerator....or a color (HDTV) TV. You also have to adjust for the quantum improvement in consumer goods today vs. 40-60 years ago.
No, low rates were a function of the pandemic and are now normalized.
GDP Growth = Population Growth + Productivity Growth.....there is now talk that AI could boost productivity by 1-1.5% per year. Instead of growing 2% a year, we could be growing 3-4% a year.
No, because you can't trade assets like you can debt. Just because we have lots of debt doesn't mean we're a "debt-based system." Stop worrying about "Minsky Moments" and focus on solid economic fundamentals.
.
Rates were historically low well before the pandemic, from about 2005 onward.
You can have all the fancy products you want. But that doesn't mean your QUALITY of life is any better. Ask a young family how they like it with both parents having to spend hours each day sitting in traffic commuting to jobs so as to make ends meet.
Eventually, robotics will make a difference. They will do the jobs that humans don't want. They can also relieve us from things that negatively impact quality of life such as commuting to work in traffic, crime, paperwork, household labor, etc. But they might also "relieve" us of some of our freedoms.
.
We are a debt-based monetary system. Dollars are borrowed into existence. The only reason that a dollar has any value is because somewhere somebody needs that dollar to pay off a debt. So in that sense, a dollar is backed by a promise of future labor. As time goes by, it takes less and less labor to earn a dollar. Thus, the decline in value of the dollar.
.
BARRON'S gold commentary in "Up & Down Wall Street" the lead section of the weekly.
The author notes:
The entire piece is worth reading. Mentions Indian buying of oil from OPEC, global conflicts, gold vs. Treasury yields, and other tidbits.
BTW, BARRON'S is must-reading for me each weekend and has been since the 1980's.
Time to throw the BS flag.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Talk is cheap...put your money where your posts are.
Come up with an investment strategy based on what you post here regarding debt and money and inflation and all the other headline nonsense. Show us how you can beat the S&P 500.
If what you say is true, you should be able to profit from it. Let's see it.
BS flag noted - 15 yard penalty and down over.
Just because we have lots of debt doesn't mean we're a "debt-based system."
"Gold is money. All else is credit." Bankers love issuing loans, especially when they can "poof" it into existence and collect interest on it. Even better when there's no reserve requirement.
Talk is cheap...put your money where your posts are.
Debt isn't money. It's a control mechanism.
you can't trade assets like you can debt
What a crock of BS!
Come up with an investment strategy based on what you post here regarding debt and money and inflation and all the other headline nonsense. Show us how you can beat the S&P 500.
If what you say is true, you should be able to profit from it. Let's see it.
When you are up to your eyeballs in debt, there is NO investment strategy. It's pretty simple.
I knew it would happen.
So what you are saying is that stocks don't make money for people the last few decades, huh ?
But gold, with a MISERABLE performance over virtually all time periods, does ?
Now I got it.
This is not an investment forum. It is a discussion of precious metals. And yes, my precious metals do the job I pay them to do.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Agreed...but when you make unsubstantiated claims and utter false statements regarding currencies or the status of the dollar and use it to plug PMs or gold, you should be called out on it.
If what you are saying is truthful and if you know what you are talking about, then you should have no probelm articulating how your posts can make money off of various "collapses."
I am bullish on gold as are you. But I base it on underlying fundamentals not pie-in-the-sky baloney about the end of the dollar, economies, or the banks. That's nonsense.
Some are only able to parrot what Bulgaria Hedge and the Gutter peddlers tell them. The rest of us choose to reside in reality. RGDS!
.
You do realize that YOU are a "gutter peddler", right ?
Caught in the act :
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/comment/13622737#Comment_13622737
So I guess this means that, as a "gutter peddler", you don't listen to yourself.
But you really should hear yourself sometimes
.
In case you haven't noticed, your gold price is heavily dependent on the state of the currency it is priced in. It's price is a reflection of faith in that currency. News concerning dollars is very relevant to PM price movements and a declining dollar increases PM price. Any threat to or supply/demand issues concerning the dollar are of great interest to the serious stacker.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Welcome ! Move to Nebraska. We trade corn, beans, beef , jabs and barbs , and just about anything
Go back to bed.
Only in the short-term....longer-term, the dollar and gold can move any way they like.
And in the long term they will move inversely in tandem just as they have been doing since gold was set free in 1972. If you think the dollar will fare better over time then you should sell me your gold.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
The dollar is up strongly against many currencies in the last 30 years but gold is 4x higher.
Measure of dollar against other currencies is irrelevant to the American who spends dollars and never touches a euro or a yen. It currently tells us that the dollar is in shallow do-do while the other basket currencies are in deep do-do.
The meaningful measuring stick for the dollar to those who depend on them is "what it will buy now compared to what it would buy in the past?"
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
If real wages and incomes are rising, then some dollar depreciation is not a problem. Rapid or hyperinflation is different.
Nobody is hurt in 2023 America because a dollar doesn't buy what it did in 1976 or 1920.
Many retired people are on a fixed income and are hurt quite a lot.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
.
Then they should have saved more and spent less. Or gotten better education and better jobs. Or scared less and made better investments.
Everyone retires eventually....plan for it.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
They are hurt when price increases have been what they have been in the past two years. Easy to confirm we are experiencing your "rapid" inflation. First it was food and medical, now it's insurance and other necessities.
Wages? they always lag inflation and do not often match it. Over time this becomes a cost of life.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Not if their incomes have COLAs or other inflation adjustments. Also, their income from financial investments can go up.
Prices were stable and falling during The Depression but those weren't great times for retirees, right ?
Wages normally exceed inflation -- just look at the recent UAW contracts.
CEO of Barrick was on CNBC....I'll post the link later.
He noted that the dollar is at an ATH yet gold has been RISING. But he was wrong in calling gold a "safe asset that people go to" -- it's probably 4th or 5th on th list (U.S. Treasuries are #1).
Barrick still waiting for the turnaround -- the hedging and CAPX programs of the last 20 years wrecked the company.
Well, the way I read that.... perhaps the dollar IS at an ATH (all time high?).... if compared to other paper/fiat currencies. But purchasing power is another matter, when compared to the past and in regards to inflation that keeps occurring. Perhaps that is why gold has been rising even though the dollar is at an ATH? (though price of gold has been 'adjusting' this past week or so)
But I'm a very simple guy. Not nearly as well versed in the financial world as many of you are. My opinion is just that; my opinion. As a collectible old copper states: "Value Me As You Please".
Seems prudent to me to be diversified.... IMO gold seems to remain a good option for today, as in the past..... as well as stocks and various other assets. But I'll leave the Bitcoin for the more adventurous ones,.
Fed quite dovish....gold up $43....might make another run at $2,150 in coming days. We'll see.
Getting a 3.2% social security COLA raise in 2024. What was the inflation rate in 2023? LOL
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Wages DO NOT normally exceed inflation. . . unless you are an auto worker.
If wages exceeded inflation the middle class would be growing,.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
This "All time High" is misleading. It does not indicate a dollar has stronger buying power at home. It only represents a dollar that is better off than the terrible foreign currencies it is being compared to. Dollar purchasing power at home is at all time lows. This is why gold has been rising.
These all time highs constantly being quoted by the quacks only work if an American buys his groceries in France.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
2.8% forecast for Q4 PCE. Inflation as measured by CPI a bit above or below that for all of 2023.