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Grade opinions on this 1909-s indian head cent

I need help with this one..

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    ashelandasheland Posts: 22,694 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Nice. VF35

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,936 ✭✭✭✭✭

    XF40

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    rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    My first impression was XF40 as well.... nice old IHC and good date/mint. Cheers, RickO

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    ldhairldhair Posts: 7,123 ✭✭✭✭✭

    40

    Larry

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    BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,484 ✭✭✭✭✭

    EF-40 sharpness, but I'm concerned about the color. There should be any bright coppery color on a piece that has seen this much circulation. I am concerned about dipping or cleaning and then artificial color to bring the brassy look down.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
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    Namvet69Namvet69 Posts: 8,673 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Nice 40 for sure.

    BST: endeavor1967, synchr, kliao, Outhaul, Donttellthewife, U1Chicago, ajaan, mCarney1173, SurfinHi, MWallace, Sandman70gt, mustanggt, Pittstate03, Lazybones, Walkerguy21D, coinandcurrency242 , thebigeng, Collectorcoins, JimTyler, USMarine6, Elkevvo, Coll3ctor, Yorkshireman, CUKevin, ranshdow, CoinHunter4, bennybravo, Centsearcher, braddick, Windycity, ZoidMeister, mirabela, JJM, RichURich, Bullsitter, jmski52, LukeMarshall

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    dsessomdsessom Posts: 2,212 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would guess VF35, but it's had an old cleaning (a VF or even XF copper coin will not have any shiny copper color) so I am not sure it would straight grade. If it were mine, I would submit it anyway just to find out. That's a nice IHC either way!

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    MFeldMFeld Posts: 12,053 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 11, 2023 1:26PM

    XF details, cleaned, as the color looks unnatural.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

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    Piano1Piano1 Posts: 233 ✭✭✭

    I'm going to go with XF 40 as well. I have to agree that the color appears just a touch off and there is a bit of a sheen to the surfaces. Regardless, a decent coin. In the "old days", the grading used to be knocked down a level to compensate for cleaning. SO, does that mean VF 35 if that "rule" still applies? I guess now they just call it "XF Details"??

    I remember a time when grades like F-15, VF-25 didn't exist, amongst others. "In my "day", it was just G, VG, F, VF, XF, and maybe AU. Gee...that REALLY dates me!!! Better get my chain and wheelchair out and my pacemaker lubed up. Sheldon's Penny Whimsy went 1-70 but I don't think there were as many numerical grades as there are these days. Probably a good thing though.

    Time for my Preparation X and Geritol for iron Poor Blood. 🤣

    Alan Piano 1

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    Piano1Piano1 Posts: 233 ✭✭✭

    OOOOPS...I meant CANE, not chain! Haven't used the chains for years....

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    coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 10,768 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm in the VF35 cleaned/detail camp.

    My Lincoln Registry
    My Collection of Old Holders

    Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
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    johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 27,512 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'll go with a 40 as well

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    SmudgeSmudge Posts: 9,254 ✭✭✭✭✭

    40, but I am not sure it will straight grade.

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    Coin FinderCoin Finder Posts: 6,953 ✭✭✭✭✭

    XF details questionable color...

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    @jmlanzaf said:
    XF40

    VF-35 I’d say. Check coins facts photograde. You get more ribbon in XF-40 than the op’s coin

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    OAKSTAROAKSTAR Posts: 5,806 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Nice to see some original mint luster still left on the coin! 👍🏻

    Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )

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    JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,818 ✭✭✭✭✭

    XF40BN

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,936 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Indianlincoln said:

    @jmlanzaf said:
    XF40

    VF-35 I’d say. Check coins facts photograde. You get more ribbon in XF-40 than the op’s coin

    And I'd say XF40 or XF40 details. I appreciate the call-out, especially given the number of people who said XF or XF details. While the ribbon looks 35, the feathers and Liberty are more in line with a 40. But we're splitting hairs.

    I would be more concerned about the possibility of a details grade than the 35 or 40. If the coin is really as yellow around the devices as it appears, it is cleaned.

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    MFeldMFeld Posts: 12,053 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @OAKSTAR said:
    Nice to see some original mint luster still left on the coin! 👍🏻

    I could be wrong but I don’t think we’re seeing “original luster”.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

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    mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Appears to me to have been cleaned at one time. Not original luster. I doubt will receive straight grade from PCGS.

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

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    braddickbraddick Posts: 23,115 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Slabbable and acceptable as VF35.

    peacockcoins

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    OldIndianNutKaseOldIndianNutKase Posts: 2,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think XF-40 if does not grade .91 Questionable color. I would dip it in acetone prior to submital…….you have little to lose.

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    2windy2fish2windy2fish Posts: 817 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld, agree…the color is off and the “luster/red “ peeking through are from a cleaning…

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    OAKSTAROAKSTAR Posts: 5,806 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld- Hmmm, from cleaning not luster. So that coin would not straight grade? Okay. Market acceptable?..

    Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,936 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @OAKSTAR said:
    @MFeld- Hmmm, from cleaning not luster. So that coin would not straight grade? Okay. Market acceptable?..

    Not if it is a bright as it appears in the photo.

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    0ronron0ronron Posts: 248 ✭✭✭

    Thank you all for your input and opinions!!
    I will go ahead and try to send it in with a couple of others to see what it gets. I will update with the results when I receive them.

    Thanks again,
    Ron

    Thank you, Heavenly Father, for first loving us.

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    OAKSTAROAKSTAR Posts: 5,806 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @0ronron said:
    Thank you all for your input and opinions!!
    I will go ahead and try to send it in with a couple of others to see what it gets. I will update with the results when I receive them.

    Thanks again,
    Ron

    Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )

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    AtcarrollAtcarroll Posts: 343 ✭✭✭

    A little late, but I think xf40 details. I don't like the color and I'm not sure enough about bronze retoning to take a chance on it.

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    lkeneficlkenefic Posts: 7,829 ✭✭✭✭✭

    My initial impression was VF35 based on the ribbon and lower curl on the obverse but the reverse looks more like an XF piece. I'm more concerned about the color... old wipe or very old cleaning?? Pleaselet us know what our hosts say with coin in hand...

    Collecting: Dansco 7070; Middle Date Large Cents (VF-AU); Box of 20;

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