New Top 100 Modern Set coming
Goldminers
Posts: 3,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
I just read the new article from Jaime Hernandez about a revised top 100 Modern set and am very excited to see it. I felt this set needed to be revised from the beginning to exclude nearly impossible items, way too many 1964 SMS and 2007 frosted freedom coins, and of course now update it for some new ones like the 2020-W $50 1,945 low mintage gold eagle privy, for example.
Please express my thanks to PCGS and Jaime for revising this set and I hope to see the new version very soon.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset/195526
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Comments
I believe Jaime’s (a superstar at PCGS) article written last year, but printed for the January magazine is not 100% clear.
The 3 illegal to own coins will be removed as I was promised they would be nearly 10 years ago. And, I believe you thanked me Goldminers back then for my efforts in that regard. But, the new edition didn’t come out for that nearly 10 year period so they were never removed (yet) as previously promised. Now, that will happen.
The super rare No S Ike and dime moderns will not be removed - I support what PCGS plans to do with those 2 mega-rarities as does John, who owns the No S Dime and worked through me to get to a position he fully supports as well.
The new set will begin in 1965 so goodbye to the 1964 dated coins. They were never “modern”to begin with by most folks definition. I still personally love the coins and have no plan to sell my $150k I have tied up in those rare coins.
Great new coins like the 2020-W $50 Gold Privy will, of course, be very highly ranked in the new set as it deserves to be.
Overall, it should be super exciting to be a Top 100 PCGS Modern collector later this year!
As always, just my 2 cents.
Wondercoin
Since you have collected many of the very finest coins possible for the top set since the day it started (and assisted in that regard) and were awarded a Hall of Fame award for it, it certainly makes sense for you, and a few select others to be involved again in establishing some criteria for the revised set.
I am looking forward to seeing what other changes will be made.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset/195526
I just started this set based on this thread- it sounds fun.
Sadly, I only had two coins in my collection that fit within this set!
peacockcoins
Mitch,
All the changes you noted above sound perfect. I'm glad to see the Ike and Roosie still included in the set. I'm guessing PCGS may include a sub set that does not require the Ike and Roosie?
Looking forward to when these changes happen.
Quick question.
How and why was the order these coins were listed came about?
It appears arbitrary.
peacockcoins
Hey Pat- I was one of the (4) “creators” of the Top 100 PCGS Modern set when DH invited me (as the only “outside” Modern coin expert at the time) to assist himself, Ron Guth and Jaime Hernandez (from the “inside” of PCGS) with the creation of the set. If you ask me a specific question, I can try to answer you back as specifically as possible.
Wondercoin
Thanks, Mitch!
1- How was the order of the coins listed within the Registry initiated?
2- Why is the 1996 American Silver Eagle (the 100th coin within the Registry) required and not 1986 instead?
3- I know it has probably been addressed in detail, but why is the 1964 Peace dollar needed as it would be
impossible to obtain this coin legally?
It is a terrific example of modern-era coins within a Registry and certainly would be a fun and challenging pastime
to even complete 50% of it.
Thanks for coming up with the idea for this set.
peacockcoins
3 is easiest to answer. After the 5th 1913 Liberty Nickel was found through PCGS offering a reward, if memory serves me right, DH wanted to offer a similar reward for anyone to simply come forward and show PCGS a 1964-D $1. Since he strongly believed (even knew?) these existed, I believe he concluded it would be the most valuable modern coin if anyone was ever allowed to keep one. So, it became #1 coin in set without much debate, as after all, DH was the Sheriff in town at that time and absolutely wanted the coin in the registry set as #1. I personally felt from the beginning the coin had no place in the registry set, especially being (likely) illegal to own. I finally convinced DH to remove the coin from the set and posted the confirmation in my notes to my registry set…
‘’About This Set: A couple years ago, I had an idea for a neat registry set for PCGS; a top 100 modern coin collection. I presented my idea to Jaime Hernandez who is the Price Guide editor at PCGS and a modern coin expert. He told me he had also been thinking about such a set and the two of us got to work on developing a proposed listing for what 100 modern coins should be included in the collection. We spent probably a few hundred hours working together on researching and formulating the (100) set coins and once we finally reached an agreement on all (100) coins, we presented our work to the top "Coinfacts" editors and contributors (David Hall and Ron Guth). David and Ron spent another six+ months fine tuning our work and only about a handful or so of our (100) proposed coins never made it to the inaugural (100) coins you see here. Later this year, I plan on writing some articles on my website, www.wondercoins.com, concerning the (100) top modern coins. There are so many great modern coins dated 1964-date that this set could have easily been the top (150) modern coins and the additional (50) coins would have been highly collectible and prized pieces. Who knows, maybe one day there will be such a set as the specialized area of modern coin collecting expands and the post-1963 era marches on. Just a quick personal comment on three of the coins in the "top 5". First, with respect to the 1964-D Peace Dollar, since it is (likely) illegal to own I would not have included it in the registry set, but would have created an "honorable mentions" listing outside of the required coins for the set. The same is true for the 1974 Aluminum Cent which is also quite possibly illegal to own. And, with respect to the dozen 22kt Sacagawea Dollars that have allegedly logged about 1.8 million miles in space already, it is without question these coins are government property and not possible to be privately owned by coin collections like me and you. As such, I respectfully believe coins ## 1,3,5 should not have been included in this registry set. Good luck everyone in building this wonderful registry set!
Do you have a coin that could help my set and that is solid for the grade? Please let me know.
UPDATE (1/29/13) -I had a chance to meet with David Hall today and discuss this Registry Set. He essentially agreed that coin ##1,3 & 5 deserve "honorable mention", but should not be included in this registry set. At the ANA show this Summer (or shortly thereafter), it is expected that (3) new coins will enter this registry set and those (3) coins will be deleted.’’
Wondercoin
So, while the ranking of the coins in the “first edition” was not “perfect” in my eyes, it was “close enough”. A few coins got left out of the edition 1 set including a couple coins purely by accident, but, overall, it was a fairly good representation of what were truly the Top 100 Modern coins at that time (more than a decade ago).
Wondercoin
2 - Very fair question Pat. I think it came down to value. The 1996 at that time was the more valuable Mint State Silver Eagle. But, it could have easily been the 1986 in that 100th slot.
Wondercoin
Wonderful answers and it just occurred to me that the set is ranked in order of importance and rarity!
In other words, the #1 coin is more challenging to locate than the #10 coin, and on and on, with the 100th coin being
the most "common."
It makes sense and gives the Registry even more credibility.
On a side note:
It would be a pleasure to see a photo of your no "S" Ike dollar.
peacockcoins
Here is this monster rarity and an amazing history:
PR66CAM PCGS grade
Slightly edited text below about the coin's history by Jaime Hernandez of PCGS:
The 1976 (Type 2) Proof Bicentennial Eisenhower Dollar coin without an "S" mint mark is probably the rarest non-error modern coin in existence. Incomprehensively, all other known 1976 Bicentennial Proof Eisenhower dollars bear an "S" mint mark as they were all produced at the San Francisco Mint.
On October 18, 1973 the U.S. Mint held a design contest offering a $5,000 reward for each design chosen for the new 1976 Bicentennial quarter, half dollar and one dollar coins. On March 6, 1974 the winners were announced and Dennis R. Williams' Liberty Bell and moon Bicentennial design was chosen for the Eisenhower dollar reverse.
On August 12, 1974 the three winning designers of the Bicentennial coins were allowed to strike trial proof coins at the Philadelphia Mint, well before the Bicentennial coins went out to the public. Since these trial pieces were struck at the Philadelphia Mint, they did not contain the "S" mint mark! These trial strikes without "S" mint marks were then sent to Bal Harbour, Florida to be displayed at the ANA Convention. Mary Brooks, Mint Director at the time, indicated that the coins displayed without the "S" mint marks were destroyed and replaced with coins bearing the "S" mint mark once they arrived at the U.S. Mint.
Additionally, two separate early sets were presented to President Gerald Ford, but these sets each had an "S" mint mark. Another set was also struck as a "specimen set" and presented to the White House on November 13, 1974 by Mary Brooks. The three designers of the bicentennial coins were then presented with proof examples in special display holders, and these coins also bore the "S" mint mark.
This is only half of the story as the original reverse design was then changed sometime in the middle of 1975. Williams confirmed that he received a call from Philadelphia Mint Chief Engraver Frank Gasparro asking if it would be OK to change the reverse design lettering to improve the striking quality and to facilitate minting procedures at the Mint. Thereafter, the U.S. Mint began producing Type 2 Eisenhower Dollars (Type 2 coins display thinner lettering on the reverse of the coin).
There is no mention as to whether Proof Bicentennial Dollars with a Type 2 reverse design were ever produced at the Philadelphia Mint. The only confirmations indicate Type 1 proofs were made without mint marks for presentation and promotional purposes, but there is no mention as to why the Type 2 No S Ike were produced. However, since Frank Gasparro was consulting Williams on the modifications for the new Bicentennial Type 2 Dollar redesign, it is very possible Gasparro struck a trial piece or trial pieces at Philadelphia to determine if the new Type 2 design would work.
Today, we do know there is only one 1976 Bicentennial Type 2 Proof Dollar known to exist. This colossal coin was found in 1977 in a Woodward and Lathrup Department store in the Washington District area. Incidentally, since Mary Brooks was involved in producing several promotional sets and presentation sets, she could have easily ordered a set of the Type 2 example and presented it to someone in Washington. Perhaps this coin was presented to a member of Congress or someone in Washington as a presentation piece and the recipient then spent it, having no idea that this coin was different from all others that were going to be produced.
It is evident that the Type 1 No S Ikes were produced for presentation pieces and according to Brooks, they were destroyed. For the Type 2 Bicentennial Proof Eisenhower Dollar there is no mention of why it was produced, but what we do know is that this miraculous coin does exist. Today, we have the honor of having such an exceptional and unique example as a testament to represent the 200th Anniversary of this country and American numismatics.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset/195526
The March/April PCGS Market report magazine article by Jaime Hernandez has a listing of the new 100 coins, but I am not sure this is the final version?
I do not see a new Registry Set for the "updated" version. I think maybe the old version should be retained or archived for past documentation?
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset/195526
Thanks to one and all for sharing this very informative article on the origin and updates to this historic set.
It is always great to hear from the horse's mouth (@wondercoin) the answers to the 5 W's.
I read the PCGS Market report on this set and actually bookmarked it for future reference.
I will have to see what coins that I have that will fit this set.
Please update this post as more information becomes available as to when the "new set" is up and running.
Again, thanks to all for sharing.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
The new set has been posted on the PCGS site as the Top 100 Modern Coins 10th Anniversary set.
The original Top 100 set that Wondercoin owns and that has been the top set for 10 years, including the Hall of Fame designation, remains as is and still includes the unique 1976 Ike no S dollar.
A few various special labels and certificate versions like First Day of Issue are still being added so they can be accepted on some of the coin lines, but all of the actual 100 coins are listed as they were in the magazine.
I believe some of the listing order is questionable.
The 2004-D Wisconsin quarters with the high and low extra leaf are listed at #18 and #19 with more than 3,000 graded each, and the (2007) Washington dollar with missing letters is #36 with over 10,000 graded.
The very rare 1970-S Lincoln DDO large date cent has only 107 ever graded and it is listed at #58 and should easily be in the top 20.
However, this unusual numerical listing order seems to be compensated for in set impact because the set composition weighting does show the rare Lincoln DDO as 4, and the other more common coins above as 1.
Overall, it is a well thought out revision and should attract some interest in some of the more obscure modern coins and varieties. I just wish the 1964 SMS coins were more affordable
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset/195526
Thank you @Goldminers for the update.
The last auction that I saw for a ‘64 SMS Kennedy was just under a 100k.
I have not followed the action results since. This coin is way out of my league.
I feel that there will be some changes made to the new set in regards to positioning and additions to and removals from.
I did notice that the ‘96 MS ASE was removed from the #100 slot.
I do not go for label rarities but that is just me.
Again thanks for updating me with this post.
Sorry for any bad punctuation and grammar as I am fighting Vertigo as I type this.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
The new set does have changes compared to the old set and they are already posted in the registry, including removing the 96 MS ASE that is in the old set that you mention.
I do not believe the new Top 100 Modern coin 10th Anniversary set will have any coin changes from what is active in the registry at this point.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset/195526
Hi guys.
Justin Atkins, top brass at PCGS in charge of the Top 100 Moderns project, gave me express permission to post the following…
The new updated “Premier” Top 100 Moderns set will be released in Quarter 2.
I have much to discuss, but wanted to get this announcement out as soon as possible.
Wondercoin
I see that the SMS dime was not included in the set. I also thought moderns started in 1965. Why have any of the SMS coins in the set. If they are to be included why not all 5. I have to assume this is just an error on PCGS's part. Why would you exclude only the dime?
I like the idea of a separate "Premier" set that includes the really high-end and extremely scarce coins.
I also believe there should be an "Everyman" version. Coins like the unique Ike, the five 1964 SMS, the 1969-S DD Lincoln cent, the 2000 Sacagawea quarter mule, or any coin with a graded population of less than 100 should be excluded from an "Everyman" set.
By only including coins that have more than 100 graded coins in existence, it would allow more modern collectors to have a shot at finding and collecting them, so there would be more interest in the set.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset/195526