Who do you think are the GOATS?
threeofsix
Posts: 579 ✭✭✭✭
I’ve heard many discussions on the Greatest Of All Time. I love to hear them because it makes me think about my own selections.
And I love that it is subjective.
So I’m asking you to tell me - Who are your sports GOAT’s? (No justifications. Please please please no disparaging remarks about anyone else’s choices… I’m just interested in your opinion.)
And (optional) if you were going to collect only one of their cards, what would it be?
Like I said, no discussion… just your opinions…
Women’s Soccer: Mia Hamm
Card: 1994 Upper Deck World Cup #268
Men’s Basketball: Michael Jordan
Card: 1986 Fleer #57
Men’s Soccer: Pele
Card: Any early 1950s card
The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Or the one.
Live long, and prosper.
Live long, and prosper.
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Men's Hockey: Wayne Gretzky, no one else, like you said: no discussion
Card: 1979 OPC
NFL: Thomas Edward Patrick Brady Jr.
end of discussion.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Baseball, Willie Mays.
Football, Peyton Manning.
Hockey, Gordie Howe.
Basketball, Wilt Chamberlain.
Baseball
Babe Ruth - any of the signed cards from the Uncle Jimmy Collection
Some sports missing from the list so far:
Clay/Ali
Gary Gait (Todd, do you agree with me on this? I know it is debatable)
Don Bradman
Leigh Matthews
Serena Williams
Nadal vs. Federer?
Spitz vs Phelps?
Nicklaus vs. Tiger?
Lewis Hamilton
Jim Thorpe
Man O' War (horse)
Paavo Nurmi
Clay/Ali
Also: men's hockey? As opposed to? Kid's? Women's? Horse?
(Sorry, it just sounded a bit funny to me as no one else had provided such a clarification)
I read somewhere that Clay / Ali had over 100 amateur boxing matches before he turned 18. Could not have been good for his developing gray matter.
Kiss me twice.....let's party.
Sorry… I’m a non-sport guy so it’s taking me a while to catch up…
I think I labeled correctly…
Live long, and prosper.
Sorry… I wanted everyone to say what they think… and feel free to say women’s basketball, or women’s boxing if they have an opinion… but if you leave the pronoun out… I’ll have a look at your thoughts either way!!!
Thanks for replying.
Live long, and prosper.
Babe Ruth-1916 Sporting News(or any 1921/22 Caramel card).
Michael Jordan- 1984 Star #101
Gordie Howe-1951 Parkhurst
You can listen to these guys here, or you can look at Scotty Bowman’s top 15 greatest Canadian hockey players ever. Yes, #99 should be 4 or 5.
For every sport and pro league that exists or will ever exist the answer is Bobby Orr
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
There was never an athlete in any of the four major team sport that statistically dominated their position per game like Bobby did.
Baseball - Babe Ruth
Football - Tom Brady, Jim Brown, Jerry Rice, Walter Payton. All 4 were off the charts.
Basketball - Bill Russell, 11 12 rings, 11 as a player and one as a coach of his own team
Hockey - Wayne
Dodgeball - The Average Joes
For baseball, I would say Teddy Ballgame was the greatest hitter, but Willie Mays was the best all-around player.
Football, I would have to go with Walter Payton as the best all-around player. Jerry Rice and Tom Brady had the most dominant stretches at their position.
Basketball is definitely Michael Jordan.
Hockey, Gretzky for scoring, Bobby Orr for defense, and The Dominator at goalie.
Baseball - Ruth
Football - Brady (hate saying this)
Hockey - Gretzky
Bowling - Ear Anthony (though it can go either way with Walter Ray Williams)
Tennis - Serena Williams & Djokavic
Golf - Jack Nicklaus
In boxing, GOAT is up for grabs, it's really a matter of each individuals opinion, a lot of people consider Sugar Ray Robinson to be the best pound for pound boxer that ever lived, Ali won 56 of 61 fights, Sugar Ray Robinson won 173 fights, heck, Rocky Marciano was never defeated, Joe Louis was heavyweight champion for 11 years, defended his title some 26 times. Jimmy Wilde won 93 straight fights to start his career, he was 93-0 before being handed a loss, Julio Cesar Chavez was 89-0 before he was beaten. In a career spanning 25 years, Willie Pep fought 241 fights and went 229-11. Look up Henry Armstrong, definitely a candidate for GOAT, heck Harry Greb won 262 fights. Throw Benny Leonard in there, an absolute boxing genius. While Ali was a brilliant boxer, he certainly wasn't the greatest the sport has ever seen.
Nicolino Locche had a record of 117-4, almost impossible to hit cleanly, they called him "the untouchable", phenomenal athlete. He could do things in the ring that would mesmerize you.
Here is my take on the most universally accepted G.O.A.Ts in their respective sports along with their key card to own based on broad recognition of the card…
Baseball = Babe Ruth (1916 M-101 Sporting news, consolation is 1933 Goudey batting pose)
Basketball = Michael Jordan (1986 Fleer #57, consolation is 1984 Star #101)
Football = Tom Brady (2000 Playoff Contenders Auto, consolation is 2000 Bowman Chrome)
Hockey = Wayne Gretzky (1979 OPC, consolation is 1979 Topps)
Golf = Jack Nicklaus (1971 Barratt & Co, consolation is 1981 Donruss)
For my money, I'll take Joe Louis as a close #2 behind Ali. Sugar Ray Robinson in at 3rd.
I do believe that poor old Bobby Orr is starting to rank right up there with he who shall not be named here in Sports Talk.
poor guy.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
[Checks to see if Edwin Moses had any cards.]
It’s ok. People laughed when they heard the world was round and not flat. They wouldn’t believe it unless they saw it.😉
Again, if people took time to do the research, they would see that per game, and by position, no one dominated their sport offensively the way Bobby Orr did. When discussing the four major team sports. The numbers tell the story. Not me. He had no equal. Every other position player, per game does have an equal in points per game. Orr doesn’t.
OP had specified "Men's" in his list, I followed suit, and yes there is a thing called Women's hockey
Women's Hockey: Hayley Wickenheiser - five time Olympic medal winner (4 gold) and a Hockey Hall of Fame inductee
@georgebailey2 Excellent!!!!! Thanks for your contribution!!!
Live long, and prosper.
I was befuddled the day I learned there was a thing called "ice hockey" as opposed to just "hockey". More the day I learned there was a thing called "snow skiing". Moving to Texas for college was very educational.
My apologies. I didn't mean to cause a stir.
Baseball - Mike Schmidt (I am originally from the Philly area, so this is an obviously biased choice - although, if his career had been shifted 10-15 years in either direction and he got the benefits from expansions and smaller ballparks, he may have been in the discussion.) Otherwise, it is tough call. I might go with Ted Williams due to the five years, three in the main part of his prime, he missed due to military service. Mays, Aaron and Ruth are right along there, as may have been Josh Gibson.
Hockey - Gretzky
Football - Brady
Basketball - Jordan
If we’re speaking strictly offensively, what about Wilt Chamberlain and his offensive dominance? I fully respect Bobby Orr, mind you, but Wilt Chamberlain was an offensive force like nothing basketball has ever seen before or since. There’s a lot of innacuracies about him, the greatest being that he didn’t play against anyone his size. Wilt was 7’1 and the average center was 6’10. In today’s game the average center is 6’11. It’s not his fault he had better physical gifts than the other players; isn’t that much of the argument in favor of Orr, anyway?
This is a really solid collection of his records, many as unbreakable as any records in sports. I would suggest any basketball fan would enjoy how it often they list who was ‘second best’ and how enormous the disparity is between he and the other great scorers. Often, he’s also second…🤔
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_career_achievements_by_Wilt_Chamberlain
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Its been said by some(including you) that championships are the measure of greatness, and only two championships seem to be a little low for someone that is said to be so dominant....for someone who(claims have been made) that he moved like lightning while his opponents moved in quicksand.
Either championships are the benchmark or they aren't. With only two, it seems Orr didn't dominate as much as you are making him out to have. Per the championship argument, one would think if he was so fast ahead of everyone else and so dominant that his teams would have won more than twice. Just saying.
I think everyone understands Orr was great, but not the God he is being made out to be.
Ingemar Stenmark, Men's Alpine
Kelly Slater, Surfing
Tony Hawk, Skateboarding
Shaun White, Snowboarding
Thorpe is not the GOAT for football, but he is likely the GOAT for all-around athlete when considering his excellent abilities in all sports, including Track and Field events, lacrosse, football, baseball, etc.
DD, I love the information, thank you.
Shouldn't Mayweather Junior be listed? I know he is hated but he is clearly one of the most technical and possible the greatest defensive boxer of all time.
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first off, a disclaimer, I am not a hockey expert or fan. I do find statistics interesting though.
just by perusing Orr's stats, it sure seems he is awfully similar to Koufax in baseball. he played 12 seasons, but was GREATLY hampered by injury. it looks like he had 6 or maybe 7 dominant seasons sandwiched between a couple of early seasons and 3 injury-plagued end-of-career seasons.
We all know what the greatest ability for an athlete is...
how much should we discount Orr's lack of availability? He was not durable and played a pretty brief career. wouldnt the fact that he only played 657 games in 12 years rank him lower on the all time list? he was retired by 30 but really done by 27. he had no old man decline years, so of course it makes his rate stats look better.
Change my mind...
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
@miwlvrn Thanks for the clarification!!!
Live long, and prosper.
I just knew where this thread was headed when I read the OP. I wish I could bet on stuff like this at DraftKings. Unfortunately, (1) I can’t and (2) being a little late to the party, all the easy jokes are gone. So can we just respect the OP’s request that there isn’t debate or discussion, just lists. Otherwise I’ll be forced to reiterate my belief Clemens did PEDs, and maybe he even got them from Bobby Orr, and then watch the whole inevitable meltdown.
@GreenSneakers - I agree 10000%.
Let's please respect the OP's request and leave the debate for other threads.
GOATs:
Football - Tom Brady
Baseball - Ted Williams
Fanboy - Goldenage
Soccer - Pele
Basketball - Jordan
Golf - Nicholas
Thanks @GreenSneakers and @AFLfan for the support!!!
I would love to see these lists continue…any sport, your opinion on who you think the GOATs are (without discussion!) and (optionally) what one card of theirs would you want to own if you could only have one….
I’d love to see your choices!
Live long, and prosper.
It's a bit complicated with Mayweather, he was one of the smartest boxers ever, brilliant defense, he was obviously never beaten, but the knock I've heard about him is that he waited until certain fighters were past their prime until he fought them, most notably Manny Pacquiao. I've gone back and forth with it, and personally I think that Mayweather Jr was one of the all-time greats, but not a GOAT candidate.
Pete Rose, Barry Sanders, Gretzky, Jordan, Conor McGregor but now Khabib as UFC can change in a minute.
Babe Ruth was given homer balls cuz the pitchers wanted the fame and wee bought off. heh.
I would loved to have seen Floyd Mayweather Jr go back in time and fight Battling Nelson or Ad Wolgast in their era and rules, two guys that would take you to the edge of the abyss, went 40 rounds with eachother in the most apocalyptic fight in the history of the sport, Mayweather would be scarred for life.
Wow! I’m a GOAT !
Fantastic !
😭
NASCAR - Richard Petty
Baseball: Ruth
Football: Brown
Hockey: Orr
Basketball: Jordan
Golf: Woods
Extreme Games: Tony Hawk
Soccer: Pele
Olympian: Phelps
Horse Racing: Secretariat
Wrestling: Hogan
Chess: Fischer
Boxing: Ali
Tennis: Federer/Graf
Baseball: Ruth
Football: QB: Brady, nonQB off: Sanders, def: LT
Hockey: Gretzky. Will someday be Conor Bedard
Basketball: MJ
Wrestling: Ric Flair
Chess: Magnus
Soccer: Pele
Golf: Tiger
Surf: Laird Hamilton
XGames: Tony Hawk
Olympian: Jesse Owens
Triathlon: Mark Allen
Swimmer: Phelps
Boxer: Ali
MMA: GSP
Tennis: who cares
Tennis: Novak Djokovic and Margaret Court
Golf: Nicklaus
Bowling: Walter Ray Williams
Boxing: Marciano
College football: Archie Griffin
Pro football: Brady/Payton
Baseball: Barry Bonds
Terry Bradshaw was AMAZING!!
Ignore list -Basebal21
Baseball - Babe Ruth
Football - Jim Brown (offense), Lawrence Taylor (defense)
Basketball - Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Hockey - Wayne Gretzky
Tennis - Jack Kramer
Golf - Jack Nicklaus
Boxing - Joe Louis
Agree with the cards already listed…
Curious about the rare, mysterious and beautiful 1951 Wheaties Premium Photos?
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/987963/1951-wheaties-premium-photos-set-registry#latest
Love a guy who knows his stuff.
Wilt is right there behind Orr in per game numbers by position, except MJ scored as many points as Wilt per game, but Jabbar was well below Wilt.
Not as much as Coffey (#2) was behind Orr in points per game.
If we look into other factors between Wilt/Jabbar and Orr/Coffey, then Bobby Orr’s #’s per game becomes stronger.
1 GOAT. Bobby Orr
2 GOAT. Wilt
3 GOAT. Secretariat