@DelawareDoons said:
I'm sure I could think of more, it's only been 5 minutes of looking at it and typing.
I didn't have to say you had to like it. So when they start slabbing coins, I guess you won't be buying any?
Not that there's anything wrong with that...
I mean, I only collect nice coins in old holders, so yeah, probably won't see me buying any, at least not for myself.
I'll probably crack some of my newer slabs and sub a couple though, why not. Definitely gonna have friends hassling me to do a few subs, so I'm sure I'll get an up close look to really break 'em down.
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
I’ve never understood why CAC uses that cartoonish logo. Cheapens the brand in my opinion. Looks like a middle schooler used an old school Microsoft paint to create it. Lose the cartoon character and CAC looks a lot more professional.
well, since none of that all above does include Canadian coins.....?????
I venture to say that it might be a done deal....or at least in negotiations.... as a business deal.
pre-deal hype...
i would be buying our hosts shares.....IF i could!!
do you guys just once thing that our hosts bosses sit by and watch???
it is all about the$$$$$$ on both sides.
All, or most posts were just about : what if....etc... can i ... my coins etc....put yourself into our host's shoes.....and THINK!!!!!
I guess it boils down to who has the longer "????arms????"
@DelawareDoons said:
I'll probably crack some of my newer slabs and sub a couple though, why not.
So you see a benefit in getting a coin into a CAC slab?
Ok.
Not really. I'd be mostly interested in what they call them, grade-wise, and how PCGS/NGC will treat 'em on crossover.
So you want to get them in a CAC holder just because. Ok.
I've gone from dealing almost full time, moving hundreds of coins a month to rarely getting to buy coins. So yeah, I'm gonna get my entertainment any other way I can.
@jwitten said:
I’ve never understood why CAC uses that cartoonish logo. Cheapens the brand in my opinion. Looks like a middle schooler used an old school Microsoft paint to create it. Lose the cartoon character and CAC looks a lot more professional.
This slander against beanie will not stand.
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
The CrACkout game will be in HIGH gear in about 2 months...alot of certs to be turned in for bounties and discarded plastic going into the recycle / trash bin....
@291fifth said:
The market is going to want the sticker on the front, not the back. When collectors see these in a dealer's case they are not going to want to have to ask if the coin has a sticker.
That’s why the word LEGACY is at the top on the front.
Here we go again.... This reminds me of the major controversy here when CAC launched years ago.... History repeating.... And all controversy is free press.... Smart move. Cheers, RickO
@DelawareDoons said:
It's amateur hour stuff to use somebody else's IP to create your mockups. You're telling me they couldn't use one of their own coins and own pics? Couldn't spend $50 to get something imaged by a third party with full disclosure on what it would be used for? Instead they just take a plate coin from a conditional rarity and use the TV's? You seriously don't see the issue here?
They could have done a lot of things different. If you're looking to find fault, no doubt you've found it.
Are you happy?
edited to add... The topic is the slab. Why would anyone be so obsessed with the coin?
Whats the UGLY green color? CAC stickers have that gorgeous dark green as their primary color unless you have them under a really bright light or tilt them right into the light. Go with that for the insert color.
100% agree. That color is not pleasant to look at. A deep, saturated emerald color would look great. Obviously couldn’t have that dark green where any lettering would be. Maybe copy PCGS somewhat again like they do with their “blue labels”.
Bland and borderline olive green is not helping one bit.
@Maywood said:
The new CAC slab reminds me of the NTC(Numistrust) slab.
That's the exact thought I had the second I saw that new holder. Really unappealing as well as brings back memories of an old 3rd world grading company.
Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.
After looking at all the images in the thread and considering some of the replies thus far, I have come to a conclusion:
--- It doesn't seem that anything depicted by CAC in their images is real, almost looks like they took an image of a proposed slab shell and then photo-shopped all the elements need to finish it, the coin/front insert/back insert. The entire thing seems to have been done hastily with little forethought.
@Maywood said:
The new CAC slab reminds me of the NTC(Numistrust) slab.
That's the exact thought I had the second I saw that new holder. Really unappealing as well as brings back memories of an old 3rd world grading company.
How much of that impression is created by the actual label versus the green background against which it was photographed? Get rid of that green background and the similarity diminishes.
@Maywood said:
After looking at all the images in the thread and considering some of the replies thus far, I have come to a conclusion:
--- It doesn't seem that anything depicted by CAC in their images is real, almost looks like they took an image of a proposed slab shell and then photo-shopped all the elements need to finish it, the coin/front insert/back insert. The entire thing seems to have been done hastily with little forethought.
I would presume that further adjustments will be made to the slab design. On both here and the other forum, many suggestions were received by CAC and it seems like most are in agreement that the bean should be on the obverse, among other things.
@jwitten said:
I’ve never understood why CAC uses that cartoonish logo. Cheapens the brand in my opinion. Looks like a middle schooler used an old school Microsoft paint to create it. Lose the cartoon character and CAC looks a lot more professional.
CAC took thousands of pictures of dealers at shows and auctions over the years and that's what the algorithm spit out.
It is a clear slab so not sure why so many are complaining about the color. That is the background color behind the slab. I guess they could have put blue back there or purple and then someone would complain about that.
To the Debbie Downers - let's see you come up with a slab design that is better, LOL................
I think overall this is a great success in design, look forward to having some coins in this slab. Hail, maybe I will put my whole collection in them, well at least the 85% with green beans...........
@spacehayduke said:
To the Debbie Downers - let's see you come up with a slab design that is better, LOL................
I think overall this is a great success in design, look forward to having some coins in this slab. Hail, maybe I will put my whole collection in them, well at least the 85% with green beans...........
I’m certain that anyone who has any issues with the holder is capable of coming up with a design that will meet with the approval of 100% of the members here.
😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@MFeld said: I’m certain that anyone who has any issues with the holder is capable of coming up with a design that will meet with the approval of 100% of the members here.
@jwitten said:
I’ve never understood why CAC uses that cartoonish logo. Cheapens the brand in my opinion. Looks like a middle schooler used an old school Microsoft paint to create it. Lose the cartoon character and CAC looks a lot more professional.
It reminds you of Microsoft for a reason. Essentially 2000s Retro clip-art. Has the same googly eyes and giant eyebrows as Microsoft "Clippy", but the a little bit of SpongeBob SquarePants girth.
I'm agnostic on whether the clip-art is a good idea. Much more interesting is how this affects people with large standardized collections and registries. Most top coins are pcgs&cac and people won't want mismatched services to holder, display, and box their collections. Thought experiment: try to come up with a reason someone would submit a pcgs&cac coin with the new service? (saying a higher price is circular, as it implies there's a reason someone prefers the new holder in the first place)
The best reason I can come up with is that someone wants to downcross a pcgs coin in order to get a cac certification at a lower grade. This is harder to do at pcgs as you will probably receive the original grade a second time.
Here is a mock-up that I came up with last night and posted on the CAC forum. I've made a few modifications based on feedback over there. The L at the end of the serial would indicate a Legacy coin, a graded coin that did not have a sticker or a raw coin would not have the L designation.
@jtlee321 said:
Here is a mock-up that I came up with last night and posted on the CAC forum. I've made a few modifications based on feedback over there. The L at the end of the serial would indicate a Legacy coin, a graded coin that did not have a sticker or a raw coin would not have the L designation.
I really hope they use something similar to that. The mock up you made is so much better than the other design it makes me actually like the holder.
@jtlee321 said:
Here is a mock-up that I came up with last night and posted on the CAC forum. I've made a few modifications based on feedback over there. The L at the end of the serial would indicate a Legacy coin, a graded coin that did not have a sticker or a raw coin would not have the L designation.
I only lurk over on the CAC forums so I'm glad you posted this here so I could say something really necessary for you to hear.
Fantastic job!!! That looks amazing, I really hope JA & team reach out to you to license your image or give you free grading for X number of coins or something. That is a perfect, perfect design.
@jtlee321 said:
Here is a mock-up that I came up with last night and posted on the CAC forum. I've made a few modifications based on feedback over there. The L at the end of the serial would indicate a Legacy coin, a graded coin that did not have a sticker or a raw coin would not have the L designation.
That's about 3 million times better. Can you mock it up with the barcode on the reverse?
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
@jtlee321 said:
Here is a mock-up that I came up with last night and posted on the CAC forum. I've made a few modifications based on feedback over there. The L at the end of the serial would indicate a Legacy coin, a graded coin that did not have a sticker or a raw coin would not have the L designation.
I really hope they use something similar to that. The mock up you made is so much better than the other design it makes me actually like the holder.
Much better! As someone with a number of (extremely rare) problem coins in his own collection, I especially like the treatment of “details” coins. Makes for a much better display when a collection is exhibited in a showcase or cabinet.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I too like Jets labels they look great against a black background. Imagine CACS Op pic against a black background and it pretty much looks the same. “Pretty much” meaning arms length with old eyes
It’s kind of like when Ford comes out with a new truck design and everybody thinks it looks ugly for the first couple of years and then all of a sudden it becomes the norm.
@ScarsdaleCoin said: Ummmm wasn’t JA the one who created the original tpg slab? LOL……..🎤
That was probably Alan Hager with Accugrade(now insert that LOL).
The @jtlee321 "improvements" are only a modification to the insert. Even with the "changes" it still evokes images of NumisTrust and that slab was quite flimsy, it could be twisted open quite easily.
The @jtlee321 "improvements" are only a modification to the insert. Even with the "changes" it still evokes images of NumisTrust and that slab was quite flimsy, it could be twisted open quite easily.
Er, from a pic, no one can possibly know how flimsy or strong the holder is so comparisons to an old holder from another company in that regard is meaningless at this point. Both NGC and PCGS slabs have become much stronger over time as they developed techniques to keep them from breaking open easily, there is little doubt that CAC will have the same or similar in terms of strength.....................
@Maywood said:
The @jtlee321 "improvements" are only a modification to the insert. Even with the "changes" it still evokes images of NumisTrust and that slab was quite flimsy, it could be twisted open quite easily.
@jtlee321 "improvements" are indeed for the insert, and they give the slab more eye appeal and aesthetics - great looking inserts and are a key part of the slab presentation. Have nothing to do with the NTC slabs and far better.
Comments
I didn't say you have to like it. So when they start slabbing coins, I guess you won't be buying any?
Not that there's anything wrong with that...
I mean, I only collect nice coins in old holders, so yeah, probably won't see me buying any, at least not for myself.
I'll probably crack some of my newer slabs and sub a couple though, why not. Definitely gonna have friends hassling me to do a few subs, so I'm sure I'll get an up close look to really break 'em down.
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
So you see a benefit in getting a coin into a CAC slab?
Ok.
Not really. I'd be mostly interested in what they call them, grade-wise, and how PCGS/NGC will treat 'em on crossover.
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
So you want to get them in a CAC holder just because. Ok.
I’ve never understood why CAC uses that cartoonish logo. Cheapens the brand in my opinion. Looks like a middle schooler used an old school Microsoft paint to create it. Lose the cartoon character and CAC looks a lot more professional.
So how much does it cost to waist more of my hard earned money?
well, since none of that all above does include Canadian coins.....?????
I venture to say that it might be a done deal....or at least in negotiations.... as a business deal.
pre-deal hype...
i would be buying our hosts shares.....IF i could!!
do you guys just once thing that our hosts bosses sit by and watch???
it is all about the$$$$$$ on both sides.
All, or most posts were just about : what if....etc... can i ... my coins etc....put yourself into our host's shoes.....and THINK!!!!!
I guess it boils down to who has the longer "????arms????"
As much as you want to waist. It's up to you.
So, if they're holdering the coin, then why NOT put the CAC sticker INSIDE the holder, maybe to the right of the grade ?
Just a suggestion.
Chris
Give it 10 years, then people will be paying MOON MONEY for Generation 1.0 CAC Holders.
There's a market for everything.
Chris
I've gone from dealing almost full time, moving hundreds of coins a month to rarely getting to buy coins. So yeah, I'm gonna get my entertainment any other way I can.
This slander against beanie will not stand.
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
The CrACkout game will be in HIGH gear in about 2 months...alot of certs to be turned in for bounties and discarded plastic going into the recycle / trash bin....
TC71
How so?
The word LEGACY on the front alerts people that it was a previously stickered coin.
That’s why the word LEGACY is at the top on the front.
Here we go again.... This reminds me of the major controversy here when CAC launched years ago.... History repeating.... And all controversy is free press.... Smart move. Cheers, RickO
Nobody will be forcing you to buy any!
100% agree. That color is not pleasant to look at. A deep, saturated emerald color would look great. Obviously couldn’t have that dark green where any lettering would be. Maybe copy PCGS somewhat again like they do with their “blue labels”.
Bland and borderline olive green is not helping one bit.
That's the exact thought I had the second I saw that new holder. Really unappealing as well as brings back memories of an old 3rd world grading company.
Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.
After looking at all the images in the thread and considering some of the replies thus far, I have come to a conclusion:
--- It doesn't seem that anything depicted by CAC in their images is real, almost looks like they took an image of a proposed slab shell and then photo-shopped all the elements need to finish it, the coin/front insert/back insert. The entire thing seems to have been done hastily with little forethought.
How much of that impression is created by the actual label versus the green background against which it was photographed? Get rid of that green background and the similarity diminishes.
I would presume that further adjustments will be made to the slab design. On both here and the other forum, many suggestions were received by CAC and it seems like most are in agreement that the bean should be on the obverse, among other things.
Type Collector of U.S. Pre-33 Gold https://instagram.com/deplorable_dan Successful transactions with- @drfish, @Cladiator, @johnny010, @Pedzola, @PerryHall, @2windy2fish, @Ike1964, @JohnThePainter, @rpmsrpms, @REALGATOR
CAC took thousands of pictures of dealers at shows and auctions over the years and that's what the algorithm spit out.
It is a clear slab so not sure why so many are complaining about the color. That is the background color behind the slab. I guess they could have put blue back there or purple and then someone would complain about that.
Successful BST with BustDMs , Pnies20, lkeigwin, pursuitofliberty, Bullsitter, felinfoel, SPalladino (CBH's - 35 Die Marriage's)
$5 Type Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/type-sets/half-eagle-type-set-circulation-strikes-1795-1929/album/344192
CBH Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/everyman-collections/everyman-half-dollars/everyman-capped-bust-half-dollars-1807-1839/album/345572
Lord, I hope this is a prototype. Ugly comes to mind, and let's please drop the cartoon character.
Dave
To the Debbie Downers - let's see you come up with a slab design that is better, LOL................
I think overall this is a great success in design, look forward to having some coins in this slab. Hail, maybe I will put my whole collection in them, well at least the 85% with green beans...........
Successful transactions with-Boosibri,lkeigwin,TomB,Broadstruck,coinsarefun,Type2,jom,ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief,Barndog,EXOJUNKIE,ldhair,fivecents,paesan,Crusty...
I like how the reverse is upside down in the holder.
I agree it was a blunder to use a "true view". Hopefully their pics will be a more accurate representation of how the coins look in hand.
I’m certain that anyone who has any issues with the holder is capable of coming up with a design that will meet with the approval of 100% of the members here.
😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Minimalist might be nice. Different, more emphasis on the coin
Mr_Spud
Looks nice.
Why can’t people just leave well enough alone.
@MFeld said: I’m certain that anyone who has any issues with the holder is capable of coming up with a design that will meet with the approval of 100% of the members here.
Either of the styles below would work fine.
It reminds you of Microsoft for a reason. Essentially 2000s Retro clip-art. Has the same googly eyes and giant eyebrows as Microsoft "Clippy", but the a little bit of SpongeBob SquarePants girth.
I'm agnostic on whether the clip-art is a good idea. Much more interesting is how this affects people with large standardized collections and registries. Most top coins are pcgs&cac and people won't want mismatched services to holder, display, and box their collections. Thought experiment: try to come up with a reason someone would submit a pcgs&cac coin with the new service? (saying a higher price is circular, as it implies there's a reason someone prefers the new holder in the first place)
The best reason I can come up with is that someone wants to downcross a pcgs coin in order to get a cac certification at a lower grade. This is harder to do at pcgs as you will probably receive the original grade a second time.
Here is a mock-up that I came up with last night and posted on the CAC forum. I've made a few modifications based on feedback over there. The L at the end of the serial would indicate a Legacy coin, a graded coin that did not have a sticker or a raw coin would not have the L designation.
I really hope they use something similar to that. The mock up you made is so much better than the other design it makes me actually like the holder.
Young Numismatist, Coin Photographer.
I only lurk over on the CAC forums so I'm glad you posted this here so I could say something really necessary for you to hear.
Fantastic job!!! That looks amazing, I really hope JA & team reach out to you to license your image or give you free grading for X number of coins or something. That is a perfect, perfect design.
That's about 3 million times better. Can you mock it up with the barcode on the reverse?
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
Because this is how thing progress and occasionally get better.
What if NGC and PCGS had just left well enough alone?
Absolutely agree, very nice work. Sign jtee321 up JA!
Successful transactions with-Boosibri,lkeigwin,TomB,Broadstruck,coinsarefun,Type2,jom,ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief,Barndog,EXOJUNKIE,ldhair,fivecents,paesan,Crusty...
The sticker should be just to the RH of the grade,,,,,,, centered in that area. Plenty of room.
It looks squeezed in above the grade.
Bar code on reverse. JMHO,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Much better! As someone with a number of (extremely rare) problem coins in his own collection, I especially like the treatment of “details” coins. Makes for a much better display when a collection is exhibited in a showcase or cabinet.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
i think both pcgs and ngc have already
Ummmm wasn’t JA the one who created the original tpg slab? LOL……..🎤
I too like Jets labels they look great against a black background. Imagine CACS Op pic against a black background and it pretty much looks the same. “Pretty much” meaning arms length with old eyes
It’s kind of like when Ford comes out with a new truck design and everybody thinks it looks ugly for the first couple of years and then all of a sudden it becomes the norm.
Delaware! Your wife makes one hell of a brownie
How long before China counterfeits these holders......
Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc
@ScarsdaleCoin said: Ummmm wasn’t JA the one who created the original tpg slab? LOL……..🎤
That was probably Alan Hager with Accugrade(now insert that LOL).
The @jtlee321 "improvements" are only a modification to the insert. Even with the "changes" it still evokes images of NumisTrust and that slab was quite flimsy, it could be twisted open quite easily.
Er, from a pic, no one can possibly know how flimsy or strong the holder is so comparisons to an old holder from another company in that regard is meaningless at this point. Both NGC and PCGS slabs have become much stronger over time as they developed techniques to keep them from breaking open easily, there is little doubt that CAC will have the same or similar in terms of strength.....................
Successful transactions with-Boosibri,lkeigwin,TomB,Broadstruck,coinsarefun,Type2,jom,ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief,Barndog,EXOJUNKIE,ldhair,fivecents,paesan,Crusty...
@jtlee321 "improvements" are indeed for the insert, and they give the slab more eye appeal and aesthetics - great looking inserts and are a key part of the slab presentation. Have nothing to do with the NTC slabs and far better.
Successful transactions with-Boosibri,lkeigwin,TomB,Broadstruck,coinsarefun,Type2,jom,ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief,Barndog,EXOJUNKIE,ldhair,fivecents,paesan,Crusty...
One more thought. Why is it necessary to state that a details coin is genuine, but not for a numerically graded coin?
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.