If a whale is defined as the coins they can afford that the 99.97% of the rest of us can only dream of, I'd say you are a large animal! Just playing with you. I'm enjoying the view!
Seated Half Society member #38 "Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
By any chance did you see the March of 2000 sale of a PCGS PR61 example by Superior Galleries? I need to look more extensively for images but with the distinct difference in grades it is likely a different coin.
@MrEureka is this the one you mentioned seeing in hand?
It’s interesting that a handful were being reported in the 70-80s but almost no auction records in the last 20 years. I don’t think this is the case for the huge majority of major rarities! Either there are several very old specialist Morgan collections or maybe some of those reported were found not to be the real deal?
@FlyingAl said:
By any chance did you see the March of 2000 sale of a PCGS PR61 example by Superior Galleries? I need to look more extensively for images but with the distinct difference in grades it is likely a different coin.
That would be great to see images from that auction- I’m really curious as to how many individual pieces I can find! And I believe you’re correct- the 64’s get mixed up and reholdered and crossed and what not so they get counted multiple times but a PR61 should in theory be a different coin.
@FlyingAl said:
By any chance did you see the March of 2000 sale of a PCGS PR61 example by Superior Galleries? I need to look more extensively for images but with the distinct difference in grades it is likely a different coin.
That would be great to see images from that auction- I’m really curious as to how many individual pieces I can find! And I believe you’re correct- the 64’s get mixed up and reholdered and crossed and what not so they get counted multiple times but a PR61 should in theory be a different coin.
I agree. My search for images came up short, nearly everything related to Superior was lost when they transitioned to Stack's Bowers. I'm going to look in a few other places but I'm not particularly hopeful.
I can confirm my coin was in the Richmond Sale in 2005 from David Lawrence and was subsequently owned by Barry Chappell who had an amazing set of proof Morgans.
It’s interesting that a handful were being reported in the 70-80s but almost no auction records in the last 20 years. I don’t think this is the case for the huge majority of major rarities! Either there are several very old specialist Morgan collections or maybe some of those reported were found not to be the real deal?
It’s definitely a mystery I’m enjoying- as mentioned above I was directed to Wayne Miller’s textbook which I ordered- maybe that will help shed some light. So far mine is the only one I have ever seen or ever seen an image of. Definitely the most rare Philadelphia minted (non-branch mint) proof Morgan.
What an amazing and fantastic treo!! Had this combination of coins ever been assembled by anyone? I suspect this is quite a historic demonstration of the start of the fabled Morgan Dollar, which as a series has been arguably the largest collector market in value for any American coin series. Great Job Face!
@GoBust said:
What an amazing and fantastic treo!! Had this combination of coins ever been assembled by anyone? I suspect this is quite a historic demonstration of the start of the fabled Morgan Dollar, which as a series has been arguably the largest collector market in value for any American coin series. Great Job Face!
Thank you- it’s a fun project, and I’m pretty sure no one has ever built a custom set like this!
Looking at Miller's descriptions, this might be the #4 specimen he lists, "The finest known 1878 Round Breast proof, and the only one which could be considered a gem, was sold directly by Harlen White in the late 1970's to a prominent New England collector for $16,000. It is a deep-mirror cameo proof with virtually no hairlines." Pity the DLRC info online doesn't include a provenance for this Important Piece. Maybe they have other info in their offline archives.
The #3 specimen is pictured in his book was sold the HRH for $20K in 1980 but is not a match. The other 2 are lower grade, one AU and one badly hairlined.
@messydesk said:
Looking at Miller's descriptions, this might be the #4 specimen he lists, "The finest known 1878 Round Breast proof, and the only one which could be considered a gem, was sold directly by Harlen White in the late 1970's to a prominent New England collector for $16,000. It is a deep-mirror cameo proof with virtually no hairlines." Pity the DLRC info online doesn't include a provenance for this Important Piece. Maybe they have other info in their offline archives.
The #3 specimen is pictured in his book was sold the HRH for $20K in 1980 but is not a match. The other 2 are lower grade, one AU and one badly hairlined.
Thank you very much! So a population of 12 seems a stretch, more like 4-6 with some damaged or mishandled.
FWIW: Copy images of Lot 1680, '78 rev '79 PF, from the DLRC 2004 auction catalog of the Richmond Collection part II. Very nice comments by John Feigenbaum about the specimen's previous owner. Published in Greysheet December, 2019.
@shortnock said:
FWIW: Copy images of Lot 1680, '78 rev '79 PF, from the DLRC 2004 auction catalog of the Richmond Collection part II. Very nice comments by John Feigenbaum about the specimen's previous owner. Published in Greysheet December, 2019.
Thank you for posting- I had not seen the auction description for this coin, only the images online.
@shortnock said:
FWIW: Copy images of Lot 1680, '78 rev '79 PF, from the DLRC 2004 auction catalog of the Richmond Collection part II. Very nice comments by John Feigenbaum about the specimen's previous owner. Published in Greysheet December, 2019.
Thank you for posting- I had not seen the auction description for this coin, only the images online.
How does this coin compare to the other proofs from your regular issue set? I'm trying to establish a basis for if this coin was a pattern rather than a proof made at the end of the year.
Better question yet: since you have both this coin and the regular issue 1878 Rev 1878 coin, would you be willing to undergo a reed count of both coins? Not sure if this is possible in the NGC holders, but you may be able to count all visible reeds and see if there is a difference.
How does this coin compare to the other proofs from your regular issue set? I'm trying to establish a basis for if this coin was a pattern rather than a proof made at the end of the year.
It really looks just like the other early proof Morgans in the series to my eye. The only difference I mentioned before is that the cameo contrast is more bright shiny silver than white.
PCGS and NGC have both chosen to call it a regular issue, so I guess it remains so unless a smoking gun document from the mint emerges saying “hey check out this sample strike for next year’s reverse- submitted for your approval” kind of thing.
@FlyingAl said:
Better question yet: since you have both this coin and the regular issue 1878 Rev 1878 coin, would you be willing to undergo a reed count of both coins? Not sure if this is possible in the NGC holders, but you may be able to count all visible reeds and see if there is a difference.
I don’t think an accurate count is possible with those chunky white NGC prongs.
@shortnock said:
FWIW: Copy images of Lot 1680, '78 rev '79 PF, from the DLRC 2004 auction catalog of the Richmond Collection part II. Very nice comments by John Feigenbaum about the specimen's previous owner. Published in Greysheet December, 2019.
Thank you for posting- I had not seen the auction description for this coin, only the images online.
How does this coin compare to the other proofs from your regular issue set? I'm trying to establish a basis for if this coin was a pattern rather than a proof made at the end of the year.
Definitely a proof made later in the year. The exact same reverse die was also used to strike proofs in 1879 and 1880.
@FlyingAl said:
Better question yet: since you have both this coin and the regular issue 1878 Rev 1878 coin, would you be willing to undergo a reed count of both coins? Not sure if this is possible in the NGC holders, but you may be able to count all visible reeds and see if there is a difference.
I don’t think an accurate count is possible with those chunky white NGC prongs.
You can get close. There are 150 denticles on either side. If you count the reeds over 15 denticles and multiple by 10, you should get a decent number. It might not be accurate enough to differentiate 189 and 191 reed collars, though.
The Nov 2004 DL sale has an ngc cert number on the pcgs auction page. When I enter that ngc cert number and 64 for grade at the ngc cert verification it returns that the cert & grade can not be found. This would indicate that this cert does not account for the current ngc graded 64 in the ngc pop. Could still be the same coin but not those numbers unless I did something wrong.
The ngc cert was 1716032-031
NGC cert page https://www.ngccoin.com/certlookup/
PCGS page with cert number listed. https://www.pcgs.com/auctionprices/item/1878-7tf-1-reverse-1879-cam/87313/-5373681654156440817
Found this by Michael Fuljenz. The reference is Proof Morgan Dollars 1992.
There is a difference in the noted Mintage Approx 25 and the mintage in the text of (50). Looking around the 50 is from VAM and the 25 is his (MF) estimate.
The part that states (Unsurprising with a mintage of only 50 of which 15 were spent) might be from VAM (didn't check) but found a similar statement in a QDBowers book stating mintage 50 only 34 sold and balance placed into circulation.
A later Bowers book quotes Breen as 300 struck and most melted. The reference indicates it is from Breen book and page 161, 162 but I didn't check it in the Breen book.
So a choice of three stories.
One can note the quoted populations at NGC and PCGS from June 1991 and compare to today.
@lilolme said:
A couple more pieces that may or may not help.
Thank you very much- it seems 4-6 is a much more accurate representation of survivors. The whole “64” category is still a little blurry. I think that’s a more reasonable estimate and helps explain why only one has appeared at auction in the last 20 years.
Looking at the pcgs registry sets I only found one set, Driftwood, that has the 1878 Rev 79 Proof (Hansen set does not have one). Did not check ngc sets.
Here is the set. It went 100% back in 2011 (do not know what proof coin that was last) and appears that it has not changed since then.
This is the cert lookup info on the one in this set.
https://www.pcgs.com/cert/09956617
.
.
This retired set noted as David Hall customer was also 100% and had one and also a Proof 64.
Could not determine when set was retired as the link to info is inactive. So could be same Proof 64 as above or different.
@lilolme said:
This retired set noted as David Hall customer was also 100% and had one and also a Proof 64.
Could not determine when set was retired as the link to info is inactive. So could be same Proof 64 as above or different.
So with my new/old “The Morgan and Peace Dollar Textbook” by Wayne Miller and the above posts I can come up with a rudimentary roster of 4 known examples of the 1878 7TF Reverse of ‘79 Proof Morgan Dollar examined in person by Wayne Miller plus an additional 2 described by Breen. So the true population seems to be 4-6.
1) The finest known, and the only one which could be considered a gem, sold directly by Harlen White in the late 1970’s to a prominent New England collector for $16,000. It is a deep mirror cameo proof with virtually no hairlines. I believe this coin was subsequently in the Richmond Collection, sold by David Lawrence for $155,250 in 2004, subsequently owned by Barry Chappell, and now the present coin in my collection.
2) Also previously owned by Harlen White. Appeared in the Robert L. Hughes auction, early 1980- realized $15,000 in the auction and was immediately resold to David Hall for $20,000. It was described as a Choice Proof 63. This piece is deeply mirrored with some cameo contrast and obvious hairlines in both obverse and reverse. Very likely to be the PR64 coin that appeared in the retired registry set names “David Hall Customer.” Photo below:
3) NERCG auction April 1980. Listed as PR63, exhibited deep mirror fields but was badly hairlined. Realized $16,000. Acquired by the consignor in the mid-1970’s from a NERCG investment fund. This piece is probably the Hughes/NERCG specimen mentioned by Breen. Hughes bought the coin in the mid-1970’s from Harlen White.
4) An AU piece in the 1980 ANA auction conducted by Steve Ivy. This coin was toned a light yellow gold, with no significant impairments, but it did show obvious wear. Realized under $1000.
Breen mentioned two additional coins:
One from the Lester Merkin sale of 1970
Another in the Herstal collection
These may represent two additional examples extant or could represent two of the four listed above.
The current registry set named “Driftwood Collection” has a PR64- could this be coin #2 or #3 above? I emailed Driftwood but have not heard back.
Superior Galleries sold a PCGS PR61 in March 2000 for $11,500 could this be coin #4 above?
Unless anyone else has info to share or Driftwood replies I’m going to back out of this rabbit hole and call it 4-6 specimens known!
Highest graded coin at either service.
The first proof Morgan Dollars struck by the U.S. Mint.
Estimated 300-500 struck
PCGS pop 191
NGC pop 135
Mint records indicate a total of 300 proof Morgan dollars were delivered in three separate deliveries between March 12 and March 18, 1878. These coins almost certainly exhibited the 8TF design. A further delivery of 200 proof examples was delivered on March 26, which may, or may not, have been 8TF coins. Some experts believe only 300 examples of the 8TF proofs were struck, based on the frequency of appearance of this issue today, but the Guide Book opts for the more generous 500 piece mintage figure. There is no official mintage total for the 1878 proof Morgan dollar broken down by subtype.
1878 7TF Reverse of ‘78
NGC PR67 Cameo
The Second Reverse
Highest graded coin at either service.
Estimated 250 struck
PCGS pop 97
NGC pop 93
@Catbert said:
Wonderful collection. Will you be trying to cross the NGC specimens? If so, is there strategy you intend to try?
I’ve been meaning to get around to that, and wanted to try to cross the 3 NGC coins in this little set, but I got impatient and wanted to finish what I started. I feel they have the best shot if I arrange some type of walk through with the entire proof set- it’s about 36 coins in total. You would think they would like to have them encapsulated in their holders- right? Then PCGS changed ownership, then the leadership changed, then the submission timeline got prolonged, and I’m not sure where they are in terms of crossovers- I feel like some times over the years they have been more accepting than others, maybe not- could just be my perspective. Anyway it’s a big undertaking and it’s really just about the coins anyway so if I see the right time I may pull the trigger and if not that’s okay as well. At the end of the day the coins are the coins and they aren’t going anywhere anytime soon.
@Catbert said:
Wonderful collection. Will you be trying to cross the NGC specimens? If so, is there strategy you intend to try?
I’ve been meaning to get around to that, and wanted to try to cross the 3 NGC coins in this little set, but I got impatient and wanted to finish what I started. I feel they have the best shot if I arrange some type of walk through with the entire proof set- it’s about 36 coins in total. You would think they would like to have them encapsulated in their holders- right? ...
Let them know you might be interested in having them exhibit at least the 1878 set at a show for you.
@Catbert said:
Wonderful collection. Will you be trying to cross the NGC specimens? If so, is there strategy you intend to try?
I’ve been meaning to get around to that, and wanted to try to cross the 3 NGC coins in this little set, but I got impatient and wanted to finish what I started. I feel they have the best shot if I arrange some type of walk through with the entire proof set- it’s about 36 coins in total. You would think they would like to have them encapsulated in their holders- right? ...
Let them know you might be interested in having them exhibit at least the 1878 set at a show for you.
Some time when you are playing with the collection take a look at the designer's initial on both sides of each coin and see if you spot anything unusual.
TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
@CaptHenway said:
A great old thread! Congratulations on the newps!
Some time when you are playing with the collection take a look at the designer's initial on both sides of each coin and see if you spot anything unusual.
Comments
So glad you share and post here. We little fish enjoy watching whales at play!
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
Haha- no whale here- just a regular coin junkie obsessed with the hobby. I do my own research, my own bidding and buying, and maintain my own sets.
If a whale is defined as the coins they can afford that the 99.97% of the rest of us can only dream of, I'd say you are a large animal! Just playing with you. I'm enjoying the view!
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
By any chance did you see the March of 2000 sale of a PCGS PR61 example by Superior Galleries? I need to look more extensively for images but with the distinct difference in grades it is likely a different coin.
Coin Photographer.
@MrEureka is this the one you mentioned seeing in hand?
It’s interesting that a handful were being reported in the 70-80s but almost no auction records in the last 20 years. I don’t think this is the case for the huge majority of major rarities! Either there are several very old specialist Morgan collections or maybe some of those reported were found not to be the real deal?
That would be great to see images from that auction- I’m really curious as to how many individual pieces I can find! And I believe you’re correct- the 64’s get mixed up and reholdered and crossed and what not so they get counted multiple times but a PR61 should in theory be a different coin.
I agree. My search for images came up short, nearly everything related to Superior was lost when they transitioned to Stack's Bowers. I'm going to look in a few other places but I'm not particularly hopeful.
Coin Photographer.
Seems like this issue has been discussed before- way back in 2013:
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/897077/is-the-proof-1878-rev-79-morgan-1-a-transitional-pattern
I can confirm my coin was in the Richmond Sale in 2005 from David Lawrence and was subsequently owned by Barry Chappell who had an amazing set of proof Morgans.
It’s definitely a mystery I’m enjoying- as mentioned above I was directed to Wayne Miller’s textbook which I ordered- maybe that will help shed some light. So far mine is the only one I have ever seen or ever seen an image of. Definitely the most rare Philadelphia minted (non-branch mint) proof Morgan.
Awesome! Thanks for sharing!
What an amazing and fantastic treo!! Had this combination of coins ever been assembled by anyone? I suspect this is quite a historic demonstration of the start of the fabled Morgan Dollar, which as a series has been arguably the largest collector market in value for any American coin series. Great Job Face!
After you mentioned it I had to check out the lump on the D- some fresh pics:
Thank you- it’s a fun project, and I’m pretty sure no one has ever built a custom set like this!
Looking at Miller's descriptions, this might be the #4 specimen he lists, "The finest known 1878 Round Breast proof, and the only one which could be considered a gem, was sold directly by Harlen White in the late 1970's to a prominent New England collector for $16,000. It is a deep-mirror cameo proof with virtually no hairlines." Pity the DLRC info online doesn't include a provenance for this Important Piece. Maybe they have other info in their offline archives.
The #3 specimen is pictured in his book was sold the HRH for $20K in 1980 but is not a match. The other 2 are lower grade, one AU and one badly hairlined.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Thank you very much! So a population of 12 seems a stretch, more like 4-6 with some damaged or mishandled.
FWIW: Copy images of Lot 1680, '78 rev '79 PF, from the DLRC 2004 auction catalog of the Richmond Collection part II. Very nice comments by John Feigenbaum about the specimen's previous owner. Published in Greysheet December, 2019.
Thank you for posting- I had not seen the auction description for this coin, only the images online.
How does this coin compare to the other proofs from your regular issue set? I'm trying to establish a basis for if this coin was a pattern rather than a proof made at the end of the year.
Coin Photographer.
Better question yet: since you have both this coin and the regular issue 1878 Rev 1878 coin, would you be willing to undergo a reed count of both coins? Not sure if this is possible in the NGC holders, but you may be able to count all visible reeds and see if there is a difference.
Coin Photographer.
It really looks just like the other early proof Morgans in the series to my eye. The only difference I mentioned before is that the cameo contrast is more bright shiny silver than white.
PCGS and NGC have both chosen to call it a regular issue, so I guess it remains so unless a smoking gun document from the mint emerges saying “hey check out this sample strike for next year’s reverse- submitted for your approval” kind of thing.
I don’t think an accurate count is possible with those chunky white NGC prongs.
Definitely a proof made later in the year. The exact same reverse die was also used to strike proofs in 1879 and 1880.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
You can get close. There are 150 denticles on either side. If you count the reeds over 15 denticles and multiple by 10, you should get a decent number. It might not be accurate enough to differentiate 189 and 191 reed collars, though.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
A couple more pieces that may or may not help.
The Nov 2004 DL sale has an ngc cert number on the pcgs auction page. When I enter that ngc cert number and 64 for grade at the ngc cert verification it returns that the cert & grade can not be found. This would indicate that this cert does not account for the current ngc graded 64 in the ngc pop. Could still be the same coin but not those numbers unless I did something wrong.
The ngc cert was 1716032-031
NGC cert page https://www.ngccoin.com/certlookup/
PCGS page with cert number listed.
https://www.pcgs.com/auctionprices/item/1878-7tf-1-reverse-1879-cam/87313/-5373681654156440817
Found this by Michael Fuljenz. The reference is Proof Morgan Dollars 1992.
There is a difference in the noted Mintage Approx 25 and the mintage in the text of (50). Looking around the 50 is from VAM and the 25 is his (MF) estimate.
The part that states (Unsurprising with a mintage of only 50 of which 15 were spent) might be from VAM (didn't check) but found a similar statement in a QDBowers book stating mintage 50 only 34 sold and balance placed into circulation.
A later Bowers book quotes Breen as 300 struck and most melted. The reference indicates it is from Breen book and page 161, 162 but I didn't check it in the Breen book.
So a choice of three stories.
One can note the quoted populations at NGC and PCGS from June 1991 and compare to today.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=wwmUMvhy-lY - Pink Me And Bobby McGee
.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=D0FPxuQv2ns - Ruby Starr (from 'Go Jim Dandy') Maybe I'm Amazed
RLJ 1958 - 2023
Thank you very much- it seems 4-6 is a much more accurate representation of survivors. The whole “64” category is still a little blurry. I think that’s a more reasonable estimate and helps explain why only one has appeared at auction in the last 20 years.
Looking at the pcgs registry sets I only found one set, Driftwood, that has the 1878 Rev 79 Proof (Hansen set does not have one). Did not check ngc sets.
Here is the set. It went 100% back in 2011 (do not know what proof coin that was last) and appears that it has not changed since then.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/dollars/morgan-dollars-major-sets/morgan-dollars-major-varieties-proof-1878-1921/publishedset/11706
The link for the one in this set a Proof 64.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/mycoinfacts/1878-7tf-reverse-1879/83772/11706
This is the cert lookup info on the one in this set.
https://www.pcgs.com/cert/09956617
.
.
This retired set noted as David Hall customer was also 100% and had one and also a Proof 64.
Could not determine when set was retired as the link to info is inactive. So could be same Proof 64 as above or different.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/dollars/morgan-dollars-major-sets/morgan-dollars-major-varieties-proof-1878-1921/alltimeset/2134
The coin link in the set does not have a cert number.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/mycoinfacts/1878-7tf-reverse-1879/316304/2134
https://youtube.com/watch?v=wwmUMvhy-lY - Pink Me And Bobby McGee
.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=D0FPxuQv2ns - Ruby Starr (from 'Go Jim Dandy') Maybe I'm Amazed
RLJ 1958 - 2023
I don’t know Driftwood, but that is a spectacular set. I emailed them requesting photos and provenance.
This may be the coin pictured in the Wayne Miller book. The text says it was bought by Hall and placed with a customer.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
So with my new/old “The Morgan and Peace Dollar Textbook” by Wayne Miller and the above posts I can come up with a rudimentary roster of 4 known examples of the 1878 7TF Reverse of ‘79 Proof Morgan Dollar examined in person by Wayne Miller plus an additional 2 described by Breen. So the true population seems to be 4-6.
1) The finest known, and the only one which could be considered a gem, sold directly by Harlen White in the late 1970’s to a prominent New England collector for $16,000. It is a deep mirror cameo proof with virtually no hairlines. I believe this coin was subsequently in the Richmond Collection, sold by David Lawrence for $155,250 in 2004, subsequently owned by Barry Chappell, and now the present coin in my collection.
2) Also previously owned by Harlen White. Appeared in the Robert L. Hughes auction, early 1980- realized $15,000 in the auction and was immediately resold to David Hall for $20,000. It was described as a Choice Proof 63. This piece is deeply mirrored with some cameo contrast and obvious hairlines in both obverse and reverse. Very likely to be the PR64 coin that appeared in the retired registry set names “David Hall Customer.” Photo below:
3) NERCG auction April 1980. Listed as PR63, exhibited deep mirror fields but was badly hairlined. Realized $16,000. Acquired by the consignor in the mid-1970’s from a NERCG investment fund. This piece is probably the Hughes/NERCG specimen mentioned by Breen. Hughes bought the coin in the mid-1970’s from Harlen White.
4) An AU piece in the 1980 ANA auction conducted by Steve Ivy. This coin was toned a light yellow gold, with no significant impairments, but it did show obvious wear. Realized under $1000.
Breen mentioned two additional coins:
One from the Lester Merkin sale of 1970
Another in the Herstal collection
These may represent two additional examples extant or could represent two of the four listed above.
The current registry set named “Driftwood Collection” has a PR64- could this be coin #2 or #3 above? I emailed Driftwood but have not heard back.
Superior Galleries sold a PCGS PR61 in March 2000 for $11,500 could this be coin #4 above?
Unless anyone else has info to share or Driftwood replies I’m going to back out of this rabbit hole and call it 4-6 specimens known!
Final two additions for now….
1878 8TF
NGC PR67+ Cameo
The First Reverse
Highest graded coin at either service.
The first proof Morgan Dollars struck by the U.S. Mint.
Estimated 300-500 struck
PCGS pop 191
NGC pop 135
Mint records indicate a total of 300 proof Morgan dollars were delivered in three separate deliveries between March 12 and March 18, 1878. These coins almost certainly exhibited the 8TF design. A further delivery of 200 proof examples was delivered on March 26, which may, or may not, have been 8TF coins. Some experts believe only 300 examples of the 8TF proofs were struck, based on the frequency of appearance of this issue today, but the Guide Book opts for the more generous 500 piece mintage figure. There is no official mintage total for the 1878 proof Morgan dollar broken down by subtype.
1878 7TF Reverse of ‘78
NGC PR67 Cameo
The Second Reverse
Highest graded coin at either service.
Estimated 250 struck
PCGS pop 97
NGC pop 93
.
Gorgeous!
Of course, compared with the others in your set, those are "gimmes."
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
1878 Proof Morgan Dollar Type Set
———————————————————
Coin #1
J-1550a Pattern PCGS PR65 Cameo CAC
“The first model” for the Morgan Dollar in the words of George T. Morgan. Second finest known.
———————————————————
Coin #2
1878 8TF
NGC PR67+ Cameo
The First Reverse
The first proof Morgan Dollars struck by the U.S. Mint.
Highest graded coin at either service.
———————————————————
Coin #3
1878 7TF Reverse of ‘78
NGC PR67 Cameo
The Second Reverse
Highest graded coin at either service.
———————————————————
Coin #4
1878-S VAM-58 PCGS SP65 CAC
7TF Reverse of ‘78
The Second Reverse
Unique survivor- the only known surviving specimen striking of the 1878-S VAM-58.
———————————————————
Coin #5
1878 7TF Reverse of ‘79
NGC PR64+ Cameo CAC
The Third Reverse
Highest graded coin at either service.
Wonderful collection. Will you be trying to cross the NGC specimens? If so, is there strategy you intend to try?
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
I’ve been meaning to get around to that, and wanted to try to cross the 3 NGC coins in this little set, but I got impatient and wanted to finish what I started. I feel they have the best shot if I arrange some type of walk through with the entire proof set- it’s about 36 coins in total. You would think they would like to have them encapsulated in their holders- right? Then PCGS changed ownership, then the leadership changed, then the submission timeline got prolonged, and I’m not sure where they are in terms of crossovers- I feel like some times over the years they have been more accepting than others, maybe not- could just be my perspective. Anyway it’s a big undertaking and it’s really just about the coins anyway so if I see the right time I may pull the trigger and if not that’s okay as well. At the end of the day the coins are the coins and they aren’t going anywhere anytime soon.
Let them know you might be interested in having them exhibit at least the 1878 set at a show for you.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
That’s a good idea- thank you!
Happy to add two patterns to my 1878 proof Morgan type set!
Amazing thread and coins! Congrats on a spectacular set!
I'm really looking forward to following your progress. Best of Luck!
Cool set. Just curious ....... why did you add another J-1550a?
Haha good question- a bit of a hoarder perhaps? Right place right time right price! Got it for half the cost of the other one.
They both look like high end coins for the assigned grades.
Spectacular! Looking forward to following this.
Great efforts and results.
Question, are you planning to have them all in the same TPG for continuity/ display purposes?
Yes I would love to have them all in the same TPG ultimately.
Wow those are LOVELY!
This would make for a great study and book... @Rexford does impressive coin studies...
A great old thread! Congratulations on the newps!
Some time when you are playing with the collection take a look at the designer's initial on both sides of each coin and see if you spot anything unusual.
TD
Thanks- will do!