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What is consider a better grade?

Joe_360Joe_360 Posts: 1,482 ✭✭✭✭✭

Let's say a silver dollar piece, what is consider a better grade?

MS64 DMPL or MS65?

Thanks

Comments

  • pursuitoflibertypursuitofliberty Posts: 6,342 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yes, "better" here is kindof a misnomer. A DMPL is a much different look and texture than most non-PL's and DMPL's.

    Pictures!!??!!


    “We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”

    Todd - BHNC #242
  • lkeigwinlkeigwin Posts: 16,877 ✭✭✭✭✭

    What @BryceM said.

    DMPL is surely special. Sometimes its surfaces show flaws more readily.
    Lance.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    For me, it would depend on in hand appraisal. Certainly the DMPL would merit attention, and the one point difference in mid MS is very slight. Cheers, RickO

  • amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @lkeigwin said:
    What @BryceM said.

    DMPL is surely special. Sometimes its surfaces show flaws more readily.
    Lance.

    Yeah, they advertise their marks so well they usually look a grade or 2 lower than there non DMPL companions.

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 26,986 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BryceM said:
    Personally, I'd buy the coin that I liked better.

    This :)

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 44,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would take the one with the CAC sticker. ;)

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • Joe_360Joe_360 Posts: 1,482 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ricko said:
    For me, it would depend on in hand appraisal. Certainly the DMPL would merit attention, and the one point difference in mid MS is very slight. Cheers, RickO

    Hi Ricko, thanks, and understood, but are MS65 a standout because at that grade the coin is considered Gem?

    I have no pictures as I do not own any DMPL coins, so I have no side by side comparison

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Joe_360... Well, yes, 65 is good... however, to judge value, check the price steps between 64 and 65... on some coins, not much difference, on others (usually rarity enters into the picture here) it is a big jump. DMPL on older coins is scarce, so frequently a big factor. Cheers, RickO

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 44,822 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 18, 2022 6:49AM

    It depends on the date, mintmark, and series. In some cases, the DMPL coins are exceedingly rare while in other cases they are not quite as rare. In the former case, I'd take the MS64DMPL while in the latter case, I'd take the MS65.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • Joe_360Joe_360 Posts: 1,482 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Thank you all. Always, I learn from this fine group. Joe

  • Joe_360Joe_360 Posts: 1,482 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @lusterlover said:
    Not to confuse the issue, but for PCGS registry purposes, they consider the 64DMPL better than the 65....

    Thanks, I find that very interesting, hence why I asked the question...

    Wondering now, NGC MS64PL verses a PCGS MS65...

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 11,048 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 18, 2022 9:33AM

    @Joe_360 said:

    @lusterlover said:
    Not to confuse the issue, but for PCGS registry purposes, they consider the 64DMPL better than the 65....

    Thanks, I find that very interesting, hence why I asked the question...

    Wondering now, NGC MS64PL verses a PCGS MS65...

    You're trying to compare apples to oranges. It doesn't usually work with fruit or coins.

    Define "better". Do you mean more valuable, higher quality, superior eye-appeal? Other? Regardless of what you mean by it, as others have said, it depends upon the type and date of the coin, as well as individual preferences.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,018 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 18, 2022 12:05PM

    To me eye appeal is better than the "better grade." If I don't care for the look of the piece I pass, unless it's something I really want, and I know I won't see another one for a long time. The items that fall into that category for me most of the time are 19th century presidential campaign tokens. Here is an example.

    In 1856, former president Millard Filmore won the presidential nomination from the American or “Known Nothing” Party. The “Know Nothings” were extreme xenophobes who opposed granting civil rights to immigrants. For example, under their platform, an immigrant had to live in the United States for 21 years before they could become naturalized citizens.

    Filmore was not as radical as the party that nominated him, but to get to the White House, he had to accept their nomination. He was Whig, and the Whig Party was dead. The Republicans didn’t want him because he had supported the Fugitive Slave Law when he was president. The Democrats didn’t want him either because he “soft on slavery.” (He didn't like it.) Therefore he ran as the American Party Candidate. This was only Filmore related piece that had a strong American Party message. It’s very scarce, and finding one can take years. Therefore I bought this one.

    As for consider a better grade, this is a Proof 67. I won't pay PR-68 money so I would not consider a better grade.

    This is an AU-53. I would think about buying a better one if I could find it and the price was right.


    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • Joe_360Joe_360 Posts: 1,482 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld said:

    @Joe_360 said:

    @lusterlover said:
    Not to confuse the issue, but for PCGS registry purposes, they consider the 64DMPL better than the 65....

    Thanks, I find that very interesting, hence why I asked the question...

    Wondering now, NGC MS64PL verses a PCGS MS65...

    You're trying to compare apples to oranges. It doesn't usually work with fruit or coins.

    Define "better". Do you mean more valuable, higher quality, superior eye-appeal? Other? Regardless of what you mean by it, as others have said, it depends upon the type and date of the coin, as well as individual preferences.

    For me, it's not only the "specifics" of my question (define) but the interesting responses we get such as from @billjones

    "Better": By coin collecting standards (much like the grading system - which "can be" some what subjective) would be considered (in-general) the more desired, sawt after, or a bit harder to find

    Another question, which mint is known for more PL certifications?

    Thanks for the interesting replies. Joe

  • alefzeroalefzero Posts: 834 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 18, 2022 12:14PM

    @Joe_360 said:
    Let's say a silver dollar piece, what is consider a better grade?

    MS64 DMPL or MS65?

    Thanks

    Depends entirely on the date. I would take a 64DM over a 65 any day for a 1901 or an O/CC Morgan.

    But if you talk with some registry nuts, it would be all about the points.

  • sweetwillietsweetwilliet Posts: 2,304 ✭✭✭

    I hesitate to post this, because there are way too many exceptions, but often an MS65 and a MS64PL and a MS63DMPL of the same date are all worth about the same. So if you go by value, an MS64DMPL will usually be worth more than an MS65 of the same date.

    It is good to know this as a general benchmark, especially for commons, but don’t base a purchase on it. Always check auctions, price guides, etc… for value. Along with how nice the coin is, of course.

    For the better dates, especially in gem, the price guide can make huge jumps from 64 to 65.

    Listen. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.
    Will’sProoflikes
  • sweetwillietsweetwilliet Posts: 2,304 ✭✭✭

    My post above was about Morgans, as they are the coins graded dmpl and pl. there are a few other series now that get the pl designation, and growing.

    Listen. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.
    Will’sProoflikes
  • david3142david3142 Posts: 3,305 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 18, 2022 6:22PM

    I can only think of four Morgans where a 64DMPL is worth less than a 65 (80-O, 86-O, 89-CC, 96-O) and a few more where they are about the same (81-O, 93-CC, 93-O, 95-S, 97-O). For a few others there are no 64DMPLs in existence with which to compare.

    At sufficient levels of rarity, the demand for gems outweighs the premium for DMPL surfaces.

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