@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
What is the new style of 1910? I assume you are referring to the reverse. What are the similarities your reverse has that is shared with the new 1910 style?
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
I'm not saying that you're coin has an embossed VDB. Im saying that there is a reasonable possibility that it could be embossed. For some reason, you keep dismissing this as a possibility without providing any explanation. Are we just supposed to trust your opinion on something as significant as a new die pairing?
you said
"Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny."
Of course it's a diff composition. But why do you believe that one composition would be harder to emboss? Are there ductility differences? Hardness differences? Are you saying that 95% copper is harder to work than 75Cu25Ni and that's why it can't be crisp on your coin as it is on buffalo nickel fakes? Do you have any data?
Here's some data, (you know, the stuff you get when you do a little research to support your opinions)
70Cu30Ni = 80-120 HB
90Cu10Ni = 70 -120 HB
(The cupronickel coin alloy falls between these 2 compositions)
So your right, there is a difference. Cupronickel is much harder than bronze. That means it would be EASIER to emboss features into a cent to than it would be a buffalo nickel.
Now stop throwing out unsubstantiated opinions as facts. That seems to be to your specialty. You posted NOTHING to show that the VDB can't be embossed, yet you quickly dismiss it.
@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
What is the new style of 1910? I assume you are referring to the reverse. What are the similarities your reverse has that is shared with the new 1910 style?
My SVDB has a "new" reverse, a reverse that it, as an SVDB, is "not supposed to have."
The "old" reverse has shallow valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' The "new" reverse, the style used on some 1909 cents, 1910 cents and cents made thereafter, has deep valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' I just looked at my 1910-S. It has the "new" reverse, as it should. My 1911 pennies, same thing, "new" reverse.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
What is the new style of 1910? I assume you are referring to the reverse. What are the similarities your reverse has that is shared with the new 1910 style?
My SVDB has a "new" reverse, a reverse that it, as an SVDB, is "not supposed to have."
The "old" reverse has shallow valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' The "new" reverse, the style used on some 1909 cents, 1910 cents and cents made thereafter, has deep valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' I just looked at my 1910-S. It has the "new" reverse, as it should. My 1911 pennies, same thing, "new" reverse.
But it’s not the new style of 1910 since the deep valley “N” appears in ALL 1909’s EXCEPT the S-VDB. This includes the original old style no S VDB, and the later 1909 (no VDB) and 1909-S (no VDB).
@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
What is the new style of 1910? I assume you are referring to the reverse. What are the similarities your reverse has that is shared with the new 1910 style?
My SVDB has a "new" reverse, a reverse that it, as an SVDB, is "not supposed to have."
The "old" reverse has shallow valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' The "new" reverse, the style used on some 1909 cents, 1910 cents and cents made thereafter, has deep valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' I just looked at my 1910-S. It has the "new" reverse, as it should. My 1911 pennies, same thing, "new" reverse.
But it’s not the new style of 1910 since the deep valley “N” appears in ALL 1909’s EXCEPT the S-VDB. This includes the original old style no S VDB, and the later 1909 (no VDB) and 1909-S (no VDB).
I don't want to argue semantics.
My own 1909-S without V.D.B. has shallow valley 'N.' 1909-S without V.D.B. is known to exist with deep valley 'N', too. So, if 1909-S without V.D.B. exists with both types of reverses, why is it such a stretch that there could exist 1909-S with V.D.B. with the "new" reverse, the reverse of 1910?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@mr1874 said:
Thanks. I just ordered one. Promises to be a very useful tool in helping solve "The whispering V.D.B. mystery."
You say counterfeit but along with others don't have anything to offer about method of manufacture. I heard "added V.D.B." from one commenter. To that commenter I say, "Okay, if added, HOW added?"
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
What is the new style of 1910? I assume you are referring to the reverse. What are the similarities your reverse has that is shared with the new 1910 style?
My SVDB has a "new" reverse, a reverse that it, as an SVDB, is "not supposed to have."
The "old" reverse has shallow valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' The "new" reverse, the style used on some 1909 cents, 1910 cents and cents made thereafter, has deep valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' I just looked at my 1910-S. It has the "new" reverse, as it should. My 1911 pennies, same thing, "new" reverse.
But it’s not the new style of 1910 since the deep valley “N” appears in ALL 1909’s EXCEPT the S-VDB. This includes the original old style no S VDB, and the later 1909 (no VDB) and 1909-S (no VDB).
I don't want to argue semantics.
My own 1909-S without V.D.B. has shallow valley 'N.' 1909-S without V.D.B. is known to exist with deep valley 'N', too. So, if 1909-S without V.D.B. exists with both types of reverses, why is it such a stretch that there could exist 1909-S with V.D.B. with the "new" reverse, the reverse of 1910?
This is year 113 of the Lincoln Cent, 1909 being year 1.
The 1909-S VDB is arguably the most famous and well known of all the coins in the series. This coin has been studied and scrutinized since it first appeared.
If the variety you are arguing for existed it would have been brought out in the open long ago, and in much better condition than yours. Where are they? Do you actually think you have the only one? That a special reverse die was made for only one coin?
There is a much simpler explanation, but you seem to be the only one that refuses to accept it.
And now you've even gone so far as to label it the reverse of 1910, even when it is obvious the deep valley "N" appeared early in the minting of the 1909 Lincoln's. Did the "new" reverse of the 1910 also have the whispering VDB?
And now you've even gone so far as to label it the reverse of 1910, even when it is obvious the deep valley "N" appeared early in the minting of the 1909 Lincoln's. Did the "new" reverse of the 1910 also have the whispering VDB?
Charles Daughtrey used "reverse of 1910" well before me to characterize the pieces with "deep valley 'N'". Ever hear of him?
I hope my piece is not unique. I fear that other SVDB's that look exactly like mine might have been rejected by one or more grading services as authentic because it didn't look like it's "supposed to" to the individual doing the inspection at the TPG. Time will tell. For the time being I have no immediate plans to send my piece in for "reconsideration." When the time is right ,I might do exactly that but not now. My dealer will take the piece back in a heartbeat if I decide to bail. He would replace it for me with an SVDB of even higher grade and it would be no extra money to me. But until my research is done, the piece needs to stay in its current holder. Everyone except me and my co-owner brother is in a hurry to find out what the "reconsiderers" decide. If TPG decides "fake" on reconsideration are we going to get an explanation WHY they think it's fake? HOW was it made? Do you think we would get an answer to that question? If they decide it really is "real" do my brother and I get to choose something cool and fitting like "Discovery PCGS die #5" on the new label?
If it were your coin and somebody who doesn't even have the coin in hand comes up with assessment of "added V.D.B." after viewing the poor image of the V.D.B. would you shrug your shoulders and say, ''oh, okay. Want to buy it as a fake for a fraction of what I paid for it?"
My brother and I both are trained in the scientific method. There is a historical perspective that we are working on (How could our coin come to be?) in addition to basic research we are now only beginning to conduct. Hopefully, we will leave no stone unturned. This kind of thing used to be called "the old college try" back in the day. Something wrong with that in your considered opinion?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
My brother and I both are trained in the scientific method. There is a historical perspective that we are working on (How could our coin come to be?) in addition to basic research we are now only beginning to conduct. Hopefully, we will leave no stone unturned. This kind of thing used to be called "the old college try" back in the day. Something wrong with that in your considered opinion?
Based on the data you've presented (or lack there of), unsubstantiated conclusions, and using opinions as facts over the last few months, I would be very hesitant to trust the credibility of your research and scientific methods
It was suggested in a previous post that you review the existing literature for anything that could help. Have you done this?
Have you made arrangements for a Lincoln Cent expert to examine your coin?
Have you made an attempt to summarize the info you have and publish it so others can become involved in the discussion? Getting that info out there in a clear, concise format would be very useful
Have you made an attempt to find any mint records that would confirm, or even suggest the die usages and dispositions? Dud you check the Newman Numismatic Portal?
All of these were suggested weeks ago. Yet you continue to make questionable claims, with little or no data. How many weeks did we wait until you showed it to your dealer? Did you ever do this? What did he say?
If you keep insisting that you're doing research, please do some research. What is your plan? If you want to keep playing games, go ahead, but don't call it research. It is nothing of the sort
Time to join a number of other members and wash my hands of this nonsense. No need to waste any more time.
i strongly suggest you consider doing the research listed above. Maybe someday you'll figure it out.
My brother and I both are trained in the scientific method. There is a historical perspective that we are working on (How could our coin come to be?) in addition to basic research we are now only beginning to conduct. Hopefully, we will leave no stone unturned. This kind of thing used to be called "the old college try" back in the day. Something wrong with that in your considered opinion?
Based on the data you've presented (or lack there of), unsubstantiated conclusions, and using opinions as facts over the last few months, I would be very hesitant to trust the credibility of your research and scientific methods
It was suggested in a previous post that you review the existing literature for anything that could help. Have you done this?
Have you made arrangements for a Lincoln Cent expert to examine your coin?
Have you made an attempt to summarize the info you have and publish it so others can become involved in the discussion? Getting that info out there in a clear, concise format would be very useful
Have you made an attempt to find any mint records that would confirm, or even suggest the die usages and dispositions? Dud you check the Newman Numismatic Portal?
All of these were suggested weeks ago. Yet you continue to make questionable claims, with little or no data. How many weeks did we wait until you showed it to your dealer? Did you ever do this? What did he say?
If you keep insisting that you're doing research, please do some research. What is your plan? If you want to keep playing games, go ahead, but don't call it research. It is nothing of the sort
Time to join a number of other members and wash my hands of this nonsense. No need to waste any more time.
i strongly suggest you consider doing the research listed above. Maybe someday you'll figure it out.
What is authentication/grading about if not OPINION? The FACT is PCGS has certified my coin as authentic. What am I supposed to do, scratch my head and go, "Are you guys sure? The fellows on the forum pretty much have decided it's fake." No, my brother and I are going to get proactive and do some old-fashioned research to try and figure this out.
Haven't shown the coin to dealer yet. I don't live next door to him. He will have the coin in-hand within next 6 weeks or so for close inspection. How many times do I have to say it?
I know some Lincoln cent experts in Denver where I once lived. That's a long hike for me and I'm not even sure if they are available these days since my experience with them was decades ago.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
What is authentication/grading about if not OPINION? The FACT is PCGS has certified my coin as authentic. What am I supposed to do, scratch my head and go, "Are you guys sure? The fellows on the forum pretty much have decided it's fake." No, my brother and I are going to get proactive and do some old-fashioned research to try and figure this out.
Haven't shown the coin to dealer yet. I don't live next door to him. He will have the coin in-hand within next 6 weeks or so for close inspection. How many times do I have to say it?
I know some Lincoln cent experts in Denver where I once lived. That's a long hike for me and I'm not even sure if they are available these days since my experience with them was decades ago.
Well we tried to tell you guys he doesn't really want experts facts - he just wants his own fantasy opinions and the attention. This has been going on now for 3 months with this Fake S-VDB cent and if you noticed - He will produce Magnified and Clear photos of the obverse of this cent now that he says he has a microscope......... BUT when it comes to the reverse picture everybody has requested, then his photography skills are no good and we get a super blurry photo.
And I just noticed, His obverse picture with his so called Microscope has been deleted - like usual..................
Here ya go - this post used to have a High Magnification and clear photo of the Obverse of his coin - you now can see he edited the photo out of the post as soon as he was questioned about it.
@mr1874 said:
The highest setting of megapixels for my Elikliv® Digital Microscope is 3. I know that's not great but for under a $100 that's as good as it's going to get for the time being. I might do a photographic equipment upgrade with the goal to get higher resolution images at some later time. I like the small television-like screen on my Elikliv®. I'll be able to easily do tracings of 1909 date/'S' mintmark positions and, too,VDB's by using the screen for this in the pursuit of solving my SVDB mystery.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
This is an unedited close-up image of the date/mintmark area. Image is for analysis by Mr. Newman per his request. Camera angle is straight on (overhead above the coin in its slab) taken with my new Elikliv® 4.3 Inch Digital Microscope...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
What is authentication/grading about if not OPINION? The FACT is PCGS has certified my coin as authentic. What am I supposed to do, scratch my head and go, "Are you guys sure? The fellows on the forum pretty much have decided it's fake." No, my brother and I are going to get proactive and do some old-fashioned research to try and figure this out.
Haven't shown the coin to dealer yet. I don't live next door to him. He will have the coin in-hand within next 6 weeks or so for close inspection. How many times do I have to say it?
I know some Lincoln cent experts in Denver where I once lived. That's a long hike for me and I'm not even sure if they are available these days since my experience with them was decades ago.
And why would you NOT send it in to PCGS for a review to be sure? I even offered to set it up with my contacts there or worse come to worse purchase it from you and do it myself!
@mr1874 said:
(Gee, one can even see the die chip in the upper loop of the 'S.' Better picture of date and mintmark coming soon)
Don't need them - and really, didn't you always supply good examples of the obverse? Of course you did - EXCEPT you deleted all of you pictures - now why was that?. We've been asking for good examples of the reverse VDB pictures for 3 MONTHS but you make every excuse for NOT supplying them.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
9 This is an unedited close-up image of the date/mintmark area. Image is for analysis by Mr. Newman per his request. Camera angle is straight on (overhead above the coin in its slab) taken with my new Elikliv® 4.3 Inch Digital Microscope...0
That's a mighty fine picture of the Obverse ANDY - Now can you take one of the VDB on the Reverse??? Of course you can't..................
EDIT - Just a REVERSE PICTURE OF THE VDB PLEASE! I'll be damn, after 3 months of this crap , I AM YELLING!!!!!!!!!!! But of course you won't post any.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
You may not need them but Mr. Newman requested better image of date/mintmark so that's what I'm trying to do.
I've got some images of the whispering V.D.B. that I've taken with my Elikliv rig but not really happy with them. I'm not going again where I went before with the V.D.B. images. Maybe I can get acceptable (to me) image of the V.D.B. with the endoscope I recently ordered. I want that third dot (it's there as seen with 10x loupe if piece is rotated just right in light) to show up in the image. I'm finding that whispering V.D.B.'s are a b to image.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
I'm just a beginner in photography.ˈI have taken some pictures of my V.D.B. with my new digital microscope. I haven't been able to capture the third dot, the one after the 'B,' in an image but it can definitely be seen when I rotate the piece just right while inspecting with 10x loupe.
And these with my $30 microscope/camera.
Care to share the make/model of microscope/camera and where you purchased it? Those are great images.
This is an unedited close-up image of the date/mintmark area. Image is for analysis by Mr. Newman per his request. Camera angle is straight on (overhead above the coin in its slab) taken with my new Elikliv® 4.3 Inch Digital Microscope...
@mr1874 said:
I've got some images of the whispering V.D.B. that I've taken with my Elikliv rig but not really happy with them. I'm not going again where I went before with the V.D.B. images. Maybe I can get acceptable (to me) image of the V.D.B. with the endoscope I recently ordered. I want that third dot (it's there as seen with 10x loupe if piece is rotated just right in light) to show up in the image.
WHICH ONE do we believe???
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
@mr1874 said: And why would you NOT send it in to PCGS for a review to be sure?
Review involves removing the piece from holder, right?
If so, reholdered if it is OK, so what would the concern be?
If not reholdered, brother and I would want explanation beyond "we just made a mistake." Would that be forthcoming?
WHAT makes the coin fake? HOW was the coin made? These are the questions that demand answers. My brother and I didn't just fall off the turnip truck. THEIR scientific method of analysis needs to work for us not just them.
If reholdered as "authentic", brother and I have a discovery piece, right? Shouldn't a new label shout that out? That's not too much to ask, is it?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@Steven59 said:
"Whispering VDB" - Now I get it..............
You come up with the most darling memes. You have no parallel in this area but when is the learning going to start happening? Around here, sometimes I feel like the teacher who turns his back to the class to write something on the chalkboard and is met with a paper airplane from the kid at the back of the room. Kind of amusing first few times it happens but eventually gets tiresome for teacher and students who come to learn.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
My brother and I both are trained in the scientific method. There is a historical perspective that we are working on (How could our coin come to be?) in addition to basic research we are now only beginning to conduct. Hopefully, we will leave no stone unturned. This kind of thing used to be called "the old college try" back in the day. Something wrong with that in your considered opinion?
Based on the data you've presented (or lack there of), unsubstantiated conclusions, and using opinions as facts over the last few months, I would be very hesitant to trust the credibility of your research and scientific methods
It was suggested in a previous post that you review the existing literature for anything that could help. Have you done this?
Have you made arrangements for a Lincoln Cent expert to examine your coin?
Have you made an attempt to summarize the info you have and publish it so others can become involved in the discussion? Getting that info out there in a clear, concise format would be very useful
Have you made an attempt to find any mint records that would confirm, or even suggest the die usages and dispositions? Dud you check the Newman Numismatic Portal?
All of these were suggested weeks ago. Yet you continue to make questionable claims, with little or no data. How many weeks did we wait until you showed it to your dealer? Did you ever do this? What did he say?
If you keep insisting that you're doing research, please do some research. What is your plan? If you want to keep playing games, go ahead, but don't call it research. It is nothing of the sort
Time to join a number of other members and wash my hands of this nonsense. No need to waste any more time.
i strongly suggest you consider doing the research listed above. Maybe someday you'll figure it out.
He doesn't have the time to do all of that. He's too busy blathering here.
@mr1874 said:
Learning moment for my most ardent readers:
Which 1909-S obverse variety can one tell, with a high level of confidence without looking at the reverse, has a V.D.B. merely by obversing die erosion along the rim near the date and under the bust?
Is it:
(A) PCGS #2 ('S' high left, tilts to right a great deal)?
(B) PCGS #3 ('S' high right, tilts to right a moderate amount)?
(C) PCGS #4 ('S' low right, nearly vertical)?
(D) Harsche #5 ('S' low, far right)?
(E) none of the above?
for the archive
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@mr1874 said:
Learning moment for my most ardent readers:
Which 1909-S obverse variety can one tell, with a high level of confidence without looking at the reverse, has a V.D.B. merely by obversing die erosion along the rim near the date and under the bust?
Is it:
(A) PCGS #2 ('S' high left, tilts to right a great deal)?
(B) PCGS #3 ('S' high right, tilts to right a moderate amount)?
(C) PCGS #4 ('S' low right, nearly vertical)?
(D) Harsche #5 ('S' low, far right)?
(E) none of the above?
@mr1874 said:
Learning moment for my most ardent readers:
Which 1909-S obverse variety can one tell, with a high level of confidence without looking at the reverse, has a V.D.B. merely by obversing die erosion along the rim near the date and under the bust?
Is it:
(A) PCGS #2 ('S' high left, tilts to right a great deal)?
(B) PCGS #3 ('S' high right, tilts to right a moderate amount)?
(C) PCGS #4 ('S' low right, nearly vertical)?
(D) Harsche #5 ('S' low, far right)?
(E) none of the above?
for the archive
Why would anyone archive this ...
His most ardent readers archive everything he says.
@mr1874 said:
Learning moment for my most ardent readers:
Which 1909-S obverse variety can one tell, with a high level of confidence without looking at the reverse, has a V.D.B. merely by obversing die erosion along the rim near the date and under the bust?
Is it:
(A) PCGS #2 ('S' high left, tilts to right a great deal)?
(B) PCGS #3 ('S' high right, tilts to right a moderate amount)?
(C) PCGS #4 ('S' low right, nearly vertical)?
(D) Harsche #5 ('S' low, far right)?
(E) none of the above?
for the archive
Wow! Quoting yourself to save from your own edit. Why don't you just not edit it out?
If you have to delete all of your posts maybe you shouldn't be making them in the first place.
I'm not sure why @HeatherBoyd & @PCGS_Moderator let you keep making a mess of the forum and keep trolling your counterfeit coin on the forum. There is nothing constructive about this behavior or this thread.
Only reason I'm hanging around here now is to post better images of date/mintmark for Mr. Newman's analysis. The endoscope I recently ordered should be able to do the job. I'll try to be as precise as I can to get a "straight-on" shot so the unedited better picture will be as true as possible to "straight-on" allowing Mr. Newman to apply his "mintmark position grid" successfully.
Do you know if the die chip in the upper loop of the 'S' should be present on ALL known-to-be-genuine 1909-SVDB's? I got to thinking about this and realized I don't know the answer to this question. Do PCGS #1-#4 all have 'S' with die chip in upper loop?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Mr. Newman has posted close-up pictures of PCGS #4. The die chip can be clearly seen.
Here's Picker's SVDB, image of date and mintmark. Picker's piece appears to me to be an example of PCGS #3, 'S' high right, tilts to the right a moderate amount.:
Die chip is clearly seen on Picker's SVDB. Do PCGS #1 and PCGS #2 have the die chip in the upper loop of the 'S'?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@mr1874 said:
Learning moment for my most ardent readers:
Which 1909-S obverse variety can one tell, with a high level of confidence without looking at the reverse, has a V.D.B. merely by obversing die erosion along the rim near the date and under the bust?
Is it:
(A) PCGS #2 ('S' high left, tilts to right a great deal)?
(B) PCGS #3 ('S' high right, tilts to right a moderate amount)?
(C) PCGS #4 ('S' low right, nearly vertical)?
(D) Harsche #5 ('S' low, far right)?
(E) none of the above?
for the archive
Wow! Quoting yourself to save from your own edit. Why don't you just not edit it out?
If you have to delete all of your posts maybe you shouldn't be making them in the first place.
I'm not sure why @HeatherBoyd & @PCGS_Moderator let you keep making a mess of the forum and keep trolling your counterfeit coin on the forum. There is nothing constructive about this behavior or this thread.
C'mon vamz. I'm just trying to make learning fun. Have a lucky penny? There's some great ones to be seen in my lucky penny thread.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@Picker1954 said:
His most ardent readers archive everything he says.
.
that kinda reminds me of a scene from that howard stern movie.
when trying to assess how his listener count kept going up, they found that the more people despised him, they MORE they listened, even more than the ones that liked him!!!
Comments
How was the VDB added? Did you follow up on any of the Embossing posts?
You were told that embossing was used to add mint marks to buffalo nickels in the 80s and 90s. You were also told how to check the edges for confirmation. DiD you check for articles in coin World, Numismatic News, and The Numismatic from that time period. If you did you, you would understand it isnt hard to add features near the rim (like buffalo mintmarks) and weak raised features are characteristics of mediocre workmanship. Wow, lets see, you have an unknown die pairing with a weak VDB, the original design placed the VDB near the rim.
Why wouldn't you at least do some checking instead of continually saying 'nobody can tell me how it was added'
Please stop this nonsense and send it for reevaluation. PCGS made a mistake, nothing more
You added what I was too lazy to do. LOL
I would be ASTONISHED if V.D.B. added to my piece by embossing. The V.D.B. is crisp on my coin. Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny. I discussed this awhile back but probably wasn't read by and understood by but just a few.
You MENTION embossing. SHOW me a picture of an embossed V.D.B. on a bronze penny that doesn't look like mush. Three letters and three dots to emboss on a bronze penny. Good luck.
I'll be taking better pictures for Mr. Newman to analyze in a few days. The goal here is to definitively establish that the V.D.B., IF added, was added to a genuine 1909-S cent with obverse die #6 and new, style of 1910, reverse.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
What is the new style of 1910? I assume you are referring to the reverse. What are the similarities your reverse has that is shared with the new 1910 style?
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
I'm not saying that you're coin has an embossed VDB. Im saying that there is a reasonable possibility that it could be embossed. For some reason, you keep dismissing this as a possibility without providing any explanation. Are we just supposed to trust your opinion on something as significant as a new die pairing?
you said
"Buffalo Nickel is a totally different composition of metal than a bronze penny."
Of course it's a diff composition. But why do you believe that one composition would be harder to emboss? Are there ductility differences? Hardness differences? Are you saying that 95% copper is harder to work than 75Cu25Ni and that's why it can't be crisp on your coin as it is on buffalo nickel fakes? Do you have any data?
Here's some data, (you know, the stuff you get when you do a little research to support your opinions)
70Cu30Ni = 80-120 HB
90Cu10Ni = 70 -120 HB
(The cupronickel coin alloy falls between these 2 compositions)
Various bronze compositions = 5 - 35 HB
the following link has hardness values
https://columbiametals.com/products/copper-alloys
So your right, there is a difference. Cupronickel is much harder than bronze. That means it would be EASIER to emboss features into a cent to than it would be a buffalo nickel.
Now stop throwing out unsubstantiated opinions as facts. That seems to be to your specialty. You posted NOTHING to show that the VDB can't be embossed, yet you quickly dismiss it.
From the following link
"NGC regularly sees added mintmark 1909-S VDB cents as well as outright counterfeits and even the occasional added VDB example."
https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/5045/counterfeit-coins/
Good explanation of embossing with pics for other members who may be interested (scroll down through the link). Obviously, you have no interest in learning or research
https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/5120/counterfeit-morgan-dollar/
https://coinweek.com/counterfeits/counterfeit-mintmarks-watch-out-for-embossed-mintmarks/
My SVDB has a "new" reverse, a reverse that it, as an SVDB, is "not supposed to have."
The "old" reverse has shallow valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' The "new" reverse, the style used on some 1909 cents, 1910 cents and cents made thereafter, has deep valley 'N' in 'UNITED.' I just looked at my 1910-S. It has the "new" reverse, as it should. My 1911 pennies, same thing, "new" reverse.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
But it’s not the new style of 1910 since the deep valley “N” appears in ALL 1909’s EXCEPT the S-VDB. This includes the original old style no S VDB, and the later 1909 (no VDB) and 1909-S (no VDB).
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
E> @robec said:
I don't want to argue semantics.
My own 1909-S without V.D.B. has shallow valley 'N.' 1909-S without V.D.B. is known to exist with deep valley 'N', too. So, if 1909-S without V.D.B. exists with both types of reverses, why is it such a stretch that there could exist 1909-S with V.D.B. with the "new" reverse, the reverse of 1910?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
This is year 113 of the Lincoln Cent, 1909 being year 1.
The 1909-S VDB is arguably the most famous and well known of all the coins in the series. This coin has been studied and scrutinized since it first appeared.
If the variety you are arguing for existed it would have been brought out in the open long ago, and in much better condition than yours. Where are they? Do you actually think you have the only one? That a special reverse die was made for only one coin?
There is a much simpler explanation, but you seem to be the only one that refuses to accept it.
And now you've even gone so far as to label it the reverse of 1910, even when it is obvious the deep valley "N" appeared early in the minting of the 1909 Lincoln's. Did the "new" reverse of the 1910 also have the whispering VDB?
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
And now you've even gone so far as to label it the reverse of 1910, even when it is obvious the deep valley "N" appeared early in the minting of the 1909 Lincoln's. Did the "new" reverse of the 1910 also have the whispering VDB?
Charles Daughtrey used "reverse of 1910" well before me to characterize the pieces with "deep valley 'N'". Ever hear of him?
I hope my piece is not unique. I fear that other SVDB's that look exactly like mine might have been rejected by one or more grading services as authentic because it didn't look like it's "supposed to" to the individual doing the inspection at the TPG. Time will tell. For the time being I have no immediate plans to send my piece in for "reconsideration." When the time is right ,I might do exactly that but not now. My dealer will take the piece back in a heartbeat if I decide to bail. He would replace it for me with an SVDB of even higher grade and it would be no extra money to me. But until my research is done, the piece needs to stay in its current holder. Everyone except me and my co-owner brother is in a hurry to find out what the "reconsiderers" decide. If TPG decides "fake" on reconsideration are we going to get an explanation WHY they think it's fake? HOW was it made? Do you think we would get an answer to that question? If they decide it really is "real" do my brother and I get to choose something cool and fitting like "Discovery PCGS die #5" on the new label?
If it were your coin and somebody who doesn't even have the coin in hand comes up with assessment of "added V.D.B." after viewing the poor image of the V.D.B. would you shrug your shoulders and say, ''oh, okay. Want to buy it as a fake for a fraction of what I paid for it?"
My brother and I both are trained in the scientific method. There is a historical perspective that we are working on (How could our coin come to be?) in addition to basic research we are now only beginning to conduct. Hopefully, we will leave no stone unturned. This kind of thing used to be called "the old college try" back in the day. Something wrong with that in your considered opinion?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Based on the data you've presented (or lack there of), unsubstantiated conclusions, and using opinions as facts over the last few months, I would be very hesitant to trust the credibility of your research and scientific methods
It was suggested in a previous post that you review the existing literature for anything that could help. Have you done this?
Have you made arrangements for a Lincoln Cent expert to examine your coin?
Have you made an attempt to summarize the info you have and publish it so others can become involved in the discussion? Getting that info out there in a clear, concise format would be very useful
Have you made an attempt to find any mint records that would confirm, or even suggest the die usages and dispositions? Dud you check the Newman Numismatic Portal?
All of these were suggested weeks ago. Yet you continue to make questionable claims, with little or no data. How many weeks did we wait until you showed it to your dealer? Did you ever do this? What did he say?
If you keep insisting that you're doing research, please do some research. What is your plan? If you want to keep playing games, go ahead, but don't call it research. It is nothing of the sort
Time to join a number of other members and wash my hands of this nonsense. No need to waste any more time.
i strongly suggest you consider doing the research listed above. Maybe someday you'll figure it out.
What is authentication/grading about if not OPINION? The FACT is PCGS has certified my coin as authentic. What am I supposed to do, scratch my head and go, "Are you guys sure? The fellows on the forum pretty much have decided it's fake." No, my brother and I are going to get proactive and do some old-fashioned research to try and figure this out.
Haven't shown the coin to dealer yet. I don't live next door to him. He will have the coin in-hand within next 6 weeks or so for close inspection. How many times do I have to say it?
I know some Lincoln cent experts in Denver where I once lived. That's a long hike for me and I'm not even sure if they are available these days since my experience with them was decades ago.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
@{@Oldhoopster @Type2 @LanceNewmanOCC }
Well we tried to tell you guys he doesn't really want experts facts - he just wants his own fantasy opinions and the attention. This has been going on now for 3 months with this Fake S-VDB cent and if you noticed - He will produce Magnified and Clear photos of the obverse of this cent now that he says he has a microscope......... BUT when it comes to the reverse picture everybody has requested, then his photography skills are no good and we get a super blurry photo.
And I just noticed, His obverse picture with his so called Microscope has been deleted - like usual..................
Here ya go - this post used to have a High Magnification and clear photo of the Obverse of his coin - you now can see he edited the photo out of the post as soon as he was questioned about it.
mr1874 Posts: 5,206 ✭✭✭✭✭February 1, 2022 12:28PM edited February 1, 2022 12:34PM
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Gee, one can even see the die chip in the upper loop of the 'S.' Better picture of date and mintmark coming soon.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
And why would you NOT send it in to PCGS for a review to be sure? I even offered to set it up with my contacts there or worse come to worse purchase it from you and do it myself!
Don't need them - and really, didn't you always supply good examples of the obverse? Of course you did - EXCEPT you deleted all of you pictures - now why was that?. We've been asking for good examples of the reverse VDB pictures for 3 MONTHS but you make every excuse for NOT supplying them.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
That's a mighty fine picture of the Obverse ANDY - Now can you take one of the VDB on the Reverse??? Of course you can't..................
EDIT - Just a REVERSE PICTURE OF THE VDB PLEASE! I'll be damn, after 3 months of this crap , I AM YELLING!!!!!!!!!!! But of course you won't post any.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
You may not need them but Mr. Newman requested better image of date/mintmark so that's what I'm trying to do.
I've got some images of the whispering V.D.B. that I've taken with my Elikliv rig but not really happy with them. I'm not going again where I went before with the V.D.B. images. Maybe I can get acceptable (to me) image of the V.D.B. with the endoscope I recently ordered. I want that third dot (it's there as seen with 10x loupe if piece is rotated just right in light) to show up in the image. I'm finding that whispering V.D.B.'s are a b to image.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
mr1874 Posts: 5,206 ✭✭✭✭✭February 1, 2022 12:28PM edited February 1, 2022 12:34PM> @mr1874 said:
WHICH ONE do we believe???
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Me thinks the OP, everytime he posts VDB or Harsche, he gets 5¢ posted to his phone account......
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
And why would you NOT send it in to PCGS for a review to be sure?
Review involves removing the piece from holder, right?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
If so, reholdered if it is OK, so what would the concern be?
"Whispering VDB" - Now I get it..............
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
delete
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
If not reholdered, brother and I would want explanation beyond "we just made a mistake." Would that be forthcoming?
WHAT makes the coin fake? HOW was the coin made? These are the questions that demand answers. My brother and I didn't just fall off the turnip truck. THEIR scientific method of analysis needs to work for us not just them.
If reholdered as "authentic", brother and I have a discovery piece, right? Shouldn't a new label shout that out? That's not too much to ask, is it?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
You come up with the most darling memes. You have no parallel in this area but when is the learning going to start happening? Around here, sometimes I feel like the teacher who turns his back to the class to write something on the chalkboard and is met with a paper airplane from the kid at the back of the room. Kind of amusing first few times it happens but eventually gets tiresome for teacher and students who come to learn.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
He doesn't have the time to do all of that. He's too busy blathering here.
Another kid with a paper airplane...sigh...Off to the principal's office with both of ye!
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Where is the thread high jacking authority? We need to talk.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
delete
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
You pick who is who.
Hoard the keys.
@mr1974
You've spent more time deleting your posts in this thread than you did researching the coin.
You should have archived the posts when you had the chance if they are that important to you.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
delete
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
for the archive
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Why would anyone archive this
...
His most ardent readers archive everything he says.
Wow! Quoting yourself to save from your own edit. Why don't you just not edit it out?
If you have to delete all of your posts maybe you shouldn't be making them in the first place.
I'm not sure why @HeatherBoyd & @PCGS_Moderator let you keep making a mess of the forum and keep trolling your counterfeit coin on the forum. There is nothing constructive about this behavior or this thread.
Why would anyone archive this
...
I archived "this" for my own records.
Only reason I'm hanging around here now is to post better images of date/mintmark for Mr. Newman's analysis. The endoscope I recently ordered should be able to do the job. I'll try to be as precise as I can to get a "straight-on" shot so the unedited better picture will be as true as possible to "straight-on" allowing Mr. Newman to apply his "mintmark position grid" successfully.
Do you know if the die chip in the upper loop of the 'S' should be present on ALL known-to-be-genuine 1909-SVDB's? I got to thinking about this and realized I don't know the answer to this question. Do PCGS #1-#4 all have 'S' with die chip in upper loop?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
???
20+ of your posts on just the first page say "delete". What's to archive?
Mr. Newman has posted close-up pictures of PCGS #4. The die chip can be clearly seen.
Here's Picker's SVDB, image of date and mintmark. Picker's piece appears to me to be an example of PCGS #3, 'S' high right, tilts to the right a moderate amount.:
Die chip is clearly seen on Picker's SVDB. Do PCGS #1 and PCGS #2 have the die chip in the upper loop of the 'S'?
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
C'mon vamz. I'm just trying to make learning fun. Have a lucky penny? There's some great ones to be seen in my lucky penny thread.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
.
that kinda reminds me of a scene from that howard stern movie.
when trying to assess how his listener count kept going up, they found that the more people despised him, they MORE they listened, even more than the ones that liked him!!!
so many things in this wonky world are like that.