@mr1874 said:
Should put my PCGS F15 SVDB on ebay and see if they remove it.
Seeing how this thread is actually completed, and it doesn't matter if from here its gets derailed!
I wouldn't treat it any differently then any other like it I find on ebay, I would consider it for sure questionable!
I would post the image in a thread with NO LINK
And ask for opinions on the coin??
get a general consensus from the forum members, let the powers that be, do what they do!
My best guess to the outcome based on the past nearly 100 of these, I'd say the consensus would be mixed, and as far as the members here the coin would get sold to the highest bidder
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
@mr1874 said:
Coin wouldn't be sold to the highest bidder. Buy It Now for $$$$ is the way I would go with it on ebay. btw I didn't see your S VDB on the show ME your 1909-S VDB thread. Do you have one?
Why would you even list a questionable coin on ebay?
You are digging the hole you are in deeper with every post.
@mr1874 said:
[ btw I didn't see your S VDB on the show ME your 1909-S VDB thread. Do you have one?]
Let's not get too flippy with your replies - according to the actual real diagnostics of a S-VDB, you don't have one either. Quit the childish responses and come back with the facts when and if you ever submit your coin for authentication. So far you have hijacked/ruined two threads with your nonsense. Please just start your own thread on your amazing coin...........
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
@mr1874 said:
Coin wouldn't be sold to the highest bidder. Buy It Now for $$$$ is the way I would go with it on ebay. btw I didn't see your S VDB on the show ME your 1909-S VDB thread. Do you have one?
Why would you even list a questionable coin on ebay?
You are digging the hole you are in deeper with every post.
Okay, I take it that you meant me with your comment about not seeing my SVDB in a referenced thread, that's because your not paying attention to bigger than life detail!
I did post images of yes my SVDB
These are the images I posted!
Harsh lighting digital microscope images, but better details.
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
@mr1874
Also, here is the cut open slab that my 09SVDB came in, I used a dremel tool and I cut the front window out to remove the coin, I don't like actually "cracking" the slabs.
Please feel free to see if you can find something wrong with my coin!
Mint mark appears to be the correct font, and in one of the currently known 4 locations!
The "N" in united appears to be the Shallow cut (correct font) for a genuine 09SVDB!
The designers initials seems to be in order, the center cross bar of the "B" is correctly slanted, the period following the "D" is in proper position, and the period following the V is in correct alignment with the "V"!
Lincoln's facial features, nose, lips, cheek, hair, & so on seem to be correct!
But if you see something wrong with let me (us) know?
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
@mr1874 said:
I believe that my coin is an authentic San Francisco mint product, mrjuniorauthenticator.
Your very own statement is the same collective conclusion the other forum members came to!
Its likely a Genuine 09-S that's been altered to include fake designers initials!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
@mr1874 said:
Why did you crack itremove it from it's PCGS holder?
I have two three ring albums that my Lincoln cent collection is in I started working (building) on it in the early 80's so, all the coins up until current were RAW coins, I put off getting the childhood bucket list coins until last. So, once all the date ranges and mint mark positions in the album were full except ONE! the 09SVDB!
My album of many years was FULL with one vacancy, so I didn't want to take money from the household finances to purchase the 09SVDB, but I wanted that last slot FILLED after all those years. I collected pop cans, scrape copper, collected pocket change, sold some personal items, for a year to get extra money to buy this bucket list coin!!
So, I bought one, it turned out to be a counterfeit
Bla...bla....... That's one of a few coins that led me here, then I didn't think I'd ever be able to pull off another SVDB purchase, I was DONE! I left the forum for a good while, I was totally discouraged about the my entire collection (Lost interest). Then that vacant slot started bugging me again. I came back to the forum, spent near a year looking at ONLY SVDB's looking, learning, & watching, I poured over the ebay listings, I poured over the online authenticity markers, the counterfeit markers, I checked ebay's newly listed SVDB's several times a day, I started posted the images on the forum, and after nearly a year of that I was up to buying another one, which is the one I posted the images of.
The why I removed it from its slab?
The whole purpose, the motivation to get it was to fill that last vacancy in my album, and the slot only fits a 2" X 2" flip
Here is that counterfeit I bought and my finances at the time wasn't good either, so this one HURT!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
Here is an image of the rest of some slabs I cut open, I didn't buy them because they were graded, I did so because of the condition and the price I got on them, I needed the raw coins.
This past year I've started added proofs to my collection, hence the PR grading slabs!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
All Leach would have had to say to the SF mint superintendent who followed him would be, "Make a few S VDB's with a die you haven't yet used for S VDB's. Make sure these pieces have a faint V.D.B. Set the pieces free for future collectors to discover."
@mr1874 said:
Couldn't get your money back for the counterfeit? That won't be an issue for me at crunch time. I will get to keep my coin AND get money, more money than I spent for the coin. Doesn't get any better than that. Well, better than that would be PCGS confirming what I suspect which is my coin is a genuine 1909-S VDB that isn't supposed to exist. That would be sweet for me I gotta tell you.
I consider that Director of the Mint Frank Leach's mysterious abrupt departure from the Mint (as in Philadelphia Mint) in August,1909 could very well have led to some creativity in San Francisco with striking a few unusual S VDB 's that were ultimately released into the channels of commerce. Leach was much-loved in San Francisco having served as Superintendent of the mint there. Leach was recognized as a hero after the Great San Francisco Earthquake of April 18, 1906. Leach likely got the shaft in Philadelphia. Treasury made a scapegoat of him for the VDB debacle is what I think. All Leach would have had to say to the SF mint superintendent who followed him would be, "Make a few S VDB's with a die you haven't yet used for S VDB's. Make sure these pieces have a faint V.D.B. Set the pieces free for future collectors to discover."
@mr1874 said:
Couldn't get your money back for the counterfeit?
I consider that Director of the Mint Frank Leach's mysterious abrupt departure from the Mint (as in Philadelphia Mint) in August,1909 could very well have led to some creativity in San Francisco with striking a few unusual S VDB 's that were ultimately released into the channels of commerce. Leach was much-loved in San Francisco having served as Superintendent of the mint there. Leach was recognized as a hero after the Great San Francisco Earthquake of April 18, 1906. Leach likely got the shaft in Philadelphia. Treasury made a scapegoat of him for the VDB debacle is what I think. All Leach would have had to say to the SF mint superintendent who followed him would be, "Make a few S VDB's with a die you haven't yet used for S VDB's. Make sure these pieces have a faint V.D.B. Set the pieces free for future collectors to discover."
Plausible theory? I think so.
"You wrote Couldn't get your money back for the counterfeit?"
Well, the deal wasn't on ebay for the fake, but it was a long distance transaction. I contacted the seller about the coin, ol' he was sorry, and he felt bad, but he didn't know If I returned the the coin if I might switch it out for a fake, this was of great concern to him!
I took micro shots of the position of this nick, this mark, I then cut it in half and I sent it back to him, a good while went by and NOTHING! then after a few months I got a check in the mail for $200.00 and a note promising $200.00 more around the first of March (Yes, this past march) When I got the promise note I sent him an email basically forgiving him the debt of $200.00 That he got burned on the coin (he claimed to have bought it from an estate sell??) and I got burned and that I was willing to split the loss with him.
He replied, No! I feel really bad about the whole thing and I want to make this right, bla...bla....
So, the first of this past march STOOD, but I've not heard anything more from him.
At lest me forgiving the debt removes any anger I would have had about the bad dealing.
$500.00 out, $200.00 back, forgave $300.00
Then you wrote! "Make a few S VDB's with a die you haven't yet used for S VDB's. Make sure these pieces have a faint V.D.B. Set the pieces free for future collectors to discover."
Plausible theory? I think so.
We live in a world where anomalies do happen, a world where a common phrase is "Nothing Is Impossible"
But looking at the word "Plausible"
I take to mean reasonable or likely possible, vs anomaly,
So, in the case of your coin I would say, more of an anomaly rather than "Plausible" and I leave room for "Nothing Is Impossible"
The bottom line with your coin is your not trying to sell it!
You seem very happy with it!
You find its oddity fascinating!
And all the possibilities about how it came to be self rewarding!
And what it is and the fact that it seems to have passed a Professional Certification just adds to the mystery!
Its those very aspects that makes it YOUR treasure!
Its no longer about $$$ value, its about its unsolved mystical existence and that's what makes it a keeper.
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
It means you can edit your post and change what you wrote but it won't change in the quote.
"Make a few S VDB's with a die you haven't yet used for S VDB's. Make sure these pieces have a faint V.D.B. Set the pieces free for future collectors to discover."
And I'll bet Leach whispered the request in his ear and that why it was named the "Whispering VDB"
@mr1874 said: The bottom line with your coin is your not trying to sell it!
Really, I'm not trying to sell it but if I got a serious offer for it as it stands I would have to give said offer serious consideration. It's to be understood that I'm not an approval service, however. The one who would buy it owns it after depositing sufficient money in one of my Swiss bank accounts.
@burfle23 said:
WOW, what happened to this thread???
Removing my bookmark on this; only interested in the fakes and having them removed if possible...
That is the intended purpose of these threads!
I really do appreciate all the members that follow these!
I tried a couple of times to bring this thread back on point!
The task at hand was accomplished in that we got two counterfeit listings removed
Here again,
It was another group effort!
Thanks Everyone!
Happy New Year To All Of You!!!!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
Thanks for all of your hard work throughout the last year.
Sorry about the grief that you received.
On your next report, consider making an entire new post.
This one has run its course.
I will still follow your findings and give support where I can.
Wayne
Great work Mark in getting rid of the fakes trying to be sold as real S-VDB's. And about this guy and his miracle cent he keeps interjecting into other peoples threads - My Grandfather always used to say "If you quit feeding the stray cats they will go away" - so lets all just ignore his posts no matter how bizarre they get - obviously he thrives on attention just like a little kid. I'm out - catch you in your next "Questionable S-VDB" thread!
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
@Steven59 said:
Great work Mark in getting rid of the fakes trying to be sold as real S-VDB's. And about this guy and his miracle cent he keeps interjecting into other peoples threads - My Grandfather always used to say "If you quit feeding the stray cats they will go away" - so lets all just ignore his posts no matter how bizarre they get - obviously he thrives on attention just like a little kid. I'm out - catch you in your next "Questionable S-VDB" thread!
I found images of the "miracle cent" and have posted it in my Group for opinions ...
Thanks for all of your hard work throughout the last year.
Sorry about the grief that you received.
On your next report, consider making an entire new post.
This one has run its course.
I will still follow your findings and give support where I can.
Wayne
Thanks!
When I added the second coin to the thread there wasn't very many comments, and the first coin went so quick (thanks to everyone here in their group effort) so, I added the second one, THEN came the derailment
So, at this point in this thread and seeing how its mission is complete, I edited the title to reflect both listings have been removed, so if the remaining thread can maybe lead to a resolve with the other issues Then it can roll on where ever it goes!
Once any one of my 09SVDB gets much content then I will for sure start a new thread for a NEW coin addition!
Happy New Year Wayne!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
Not a counterfeit holder. I pulled the images of the slab. Sorry.
This thread is so far off the rail that its not really a problem for you to 'Re-post' them below!
Its a shame the post with the slab picture wasn't saved from an edit.
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
Comments
Seeing how this thread is actually completed, and it doesn't matter if from here its gets derailed!
I wouldn't treat it any differently then any other like it I find on ebay, I would consider it for sure questionable!
I would post the image in a thread with NO LINK
And ask for opinions on the coin??
get a general consensus from the forum members, let the powers that be, do what they do!
My best guess to the outcome based on the past nearly 100 of these, I'd say the consensus would be mixed, and as far as the members here the coin would get sold to the highest bidder
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
mr1874
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
mr1874
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
mr1874
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Why would you even list a questionable coin on ebay?
You are digging the hole you are in deeper with every post.
mr1874
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
So when the facts don't line up with your "as you said Active Imagination" you start calling people names.
Just 1 question..... how old are you?
mr1874
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Wow
The mods are on vacation for the week
Let's not get too flippy with your replies - according to the actual real diagnostics of a S-VDB, you don't have one either. Quit the childish responses and come back with the facts when and if you ever submit your coin for authentication. So far you have hijacked/ruined two threads with your nonsense. Please just start your own thread on your amazing coin...........
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Okay, I take it that you meant me with your comment about not seeing my SVDB in a referenced thread, that's because your not paying attention to bigger than life detail!
I did post images of yes my SVDB
These are the images I posted!
Harsh lighting digital microscope images, but better details.
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
@mr1874
Also, here is the cut open slab that my 09SVDB came in, I used a dremel tool and I cut the front window out to remove the coin, I don't like actually "cracking" the slabs.
Please feel free to see if you can find something wrong with my coin!
Mint mark appears to be the correct font, and in one of the currently known 4 locations!
The "N" in united appears to be the Shallow cut (correct font) for a genuine 09SVDB!
The designers initials seems to be in order, the center cross bar of the "B" is correctly slanted, the period following the "D" is in proper position, and the period following the V is in correct alignment with the "V"!
Lincoln's facial features, nose, lips, cheek, hair, & so on seem to be correct!
But if you see something wrong with let me (us) know?
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
Your very own statement is the same collective conclusion the other forum members came to!
Its likely a Genuine 09-S that's been altered to include fake designers initials!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
I have two three ring albums that my Lincoln cent collection is in I started working (building) on it in the early 80's so, all the coins up until current were RAW coins, I put off getting the childhood bucket list coins until last. So, once all the date ranges and mint mark positions in the album were full except ONE! the 09SVDB!
My album of many years was FULL with one vacancy, so I didn't want to take money from the household finances to purchase the 09SVDB, but I wanted that last slot FILLED after all those years. I collected pop cans, scrape copper, collected pocket change, sold some personal items, for a year to get extra money to buy this bucket list coin!!
So, I bought one, it turned out to be a counterfeit
Bla...bla....... That's one of a few coins that led me here, then I didn't think I'd ever be able to pull off another SVDB purchase, I was DONE! I left the forum for a good while, I was totally discouraged about the my entire collection (Lost interest). Then that vacant slot started bugging me again. I came back to the forum, spent near a year looking at ONLY SVDB's looking, learning, & watching, I poured over the ebay listings, I poured over the online authenticity markers, the counterfeit markers, I checked ebay's newly listed SVDB's several times a day, I started posted the images on the forum, and after nearly a year of that I was up to buying another one, which is the one I posted the images of.
The why I removed it from its slab?
The whole purpose, the motivation to get it was to fill that last vacancy in my album, and the slot only fits a 2" X 2" flip
Here is that counterfeit I bought and my finances at the time wasn't good either, so this one HURT!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
Here is an image of the rest of some slabs I cut open, I didn't buy them because they were graded, I did so because of the condition and the price I got on them, I needed the raw coins.
This past year I've started added proofs to my collection, hence the PR grading slabs!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Yeah right!
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Just a save from an edit.
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
"You wrote Couldn't get your money back for the counterfeit?"
Well, the deal wasn't on ebay for the fake, but it was a long distance transaction. I contacted the seller about the coin, ol' he was sorry, and he felt bad, but he didn't know If I returned the the coin if I might switch it out for a fake, this was of great concern to him!
I took micro shots of the position of this nick, this mark, I then cut it in half and I sent it back to him, a good while went by and NOTHING! then after a few months I got a check in the mail for $200.00 and a note promising $200.00 more around the first of March (Yes, this past march) When I got the promise note I sent him an email basically forgiving him the debt of $200.00 That he got burned on the coin (he claimed to have bought it from an estate sell??) and I got burned and that I was willing to split the loss with him.
He replied, No! I feel really bad about the whole thing and I want to make this right, bla...bla....
So, the first of this past march STOOD, but I've not heard anything more from him.
At lest me forgiving the debt removes any anger I would have had about the bad dealing.
$500.00 out, $200.00 back, forgave $300.00
Then you wrote!
"Make a few S VDB's with a die you haven't yet used for S VDB's. Make sure these pieces have a faint V.D.B. Set the pieces free for future collectors to discover."
Plausible theory? I think so.
We live in a world where anomalies do happen, a world where a common phrase is "Nothing Is Impossible"
But looking at the word "Plausible"
I take to mean reasonable or likely possible, vs anomaly,
So, in the case of your coin I would say, more of an anomaly rather than "Plausible" and I leave room for "Nothing Is Impossible"
and that's what makes it a keeper.
The bottom line with your coin is your not trying to sell it!
You seem very happy with it!
You find its oddity fascinating!
And all the possibilities about how it came to be self rewarding!
And what it is and the fact that it seems to have passed a Professional Certification just adds to the mystery!
Its those very aspects that makes it YOUR treasure!
Its no longer about $$$ value, its about its unsolved mystical existence
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
@mr1874 "What does that mean?"
It means you can edit your post and change what you wrote but it won't change in the quote.
"Make a few S VDB's with a die you haven't yet used for S VDB's. Make sure these pieces have a faint V.D.B. Set the pieces free for future collectors to discover."
And I'll bet Leach whispered the request in his ear and that why it was named the "Whispering VDB"
"Plausible theory? I think so."
I'm thinking an overactive imagination.
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Just another save from an edit.
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Wow! You would sell a coin that may be a problem without having it checked?
For a "serious offer" and "depositing sufficient money" and you admit that on a coin forum where a persons integrity is key?
Step away from your keyboard, you are not making yourself look good!
A famous Interior Designer!
https://www.greenbrier.com/About-Us/Dorothy-Draper-Co.aspx
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
WOW, what happened to this thread???
Removing my bookmark on this; only interested in the fakes and having them removed if possible...
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
That is the intended purpose of these threads!
I really do appreciate all the members that follow these!
I tried a couple of times to bring this thread back on point!
The task at hand was accomplished in that we got two counterfeit listings removed
Here again,
It was another group effort!
Thanks Everyone!
Happy New Year To All Of You!!!!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
If it is counterfeit it will be removed...
I have looked this thread over- have you posted an image of your example and I just missed it?
Thanks for all of your hard work throughout the last year.
Sorry about the grief that you received.
On your next report, consider making an entire new post.
This one has run its course.
I will still follow your findings and give support where I can.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
Don't tell me..............................she designed drapes?
Pete
Great work Mark in getting rid of the fakes trying to be sold as real S-VDB's. And about this guy and his miracle cent he keeps interjecting into other peoples threads - My Grandfather always used to say "If you quit feeding the stray cats they will go away" - so lets all just ignore his posts no matter how bizarre they get - obviously he thrives on attention just like a little kid. I'm out - catch you in your next "Questionable S-VDB" thread!
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
I found images of the "miracle cent" and have posted it in my Group for opinions
...
Thanks!
Then it can roll on where ever it goes!
When I added the second coin to the thread there wasn't very many comments, and the first coin went so quick (thanks to everyone here in their group effort) so, I added the second one, THEN came the derailment
So, at this point in this thread and seeing how its mission is complete, I edited the title to reflect both listings have been removed, so if the remaining thread can maybe lead to a resolve with the other issues
Once any one of my 09SVDB gets much content then I will for sure start a new thread for a NEW coin addition!
Happy New Year Wayne!
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
...
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
This thread is so far off the rail that its not really a problem for you to 'Re-post' them below!
Its a shame the post with the slab picture wasn't saved from an edit.
"I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
Thomas Jefferson!
mr1874
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein