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Do You Think There's Something Going on With This $10.00 Indian?

LuxorLuxor Posts: 404 ✭✭✭✭✭

Very difficult to tell from an online pic, but would you say this one's been messed with?

Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.

Comments

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,427 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It looks suspiciously like putty, but I can’t say for sure. There is something wrong with the left obverse field, and I don’t think that it happened at the mint.

    “Puttying” is a coin doctor process where something like Bondo is used to fill in scratches on a coin. It is covered over something that has gold color. It looks okay for a while, but after time, the repair goop under the gold color comes to the surface.

    The coin is not necessarily ruined; the stuff can be removed. But it will often be over graded because that’s the idea. You fill scratches to up the grade.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,301 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I've seen US gold in older slabs that have been puttied to hide hairlines and minor scuffs where the putty has turned chalky and hazy. It's hard to tell from your pic but that may be the case with your coin. The putty can be easily removed with acetone.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Really difficult to tell conclusively... but the area in front of the face looks suspiciously dull, compared to the surface just above it that shows luster. I would pass. Cheers, RickO

  • LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    enlarged and sharpened, if it helps.

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -

  • WAYNEASWAYNEAS Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Will bow to the experts here.
    There is something going on with the coin.
    Can we get a reverse photo?
    Wayne

    Kennedys are my quest...

  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 19,642 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I agree that there seems to be something amiss with the lower left dead-looking zone. If I were looking for a $10 Indian type coin, I'd pass on this one. 1926 is sufficiently common where the right one will come along without much of a hunt.

  • coinpalicecoinpalice Posts: 2,435 ✭✭✭✭✭

    i own 6 graded 1926 indians all ms-63, none of them have that 2 tone color, coin was altered

  • pcgscacgoldpcgscacgold Posts: 2,616 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This is an interesting thread. I like gold and have always thought the big grading companies would grade puttying a coin as details or doctored/cleaned. This gives me something to watch for.

  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,034 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It’s ok with me. Been in that holder long enough to stay just the way it is

  • LuxorLuxor Posts: 404 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @WAYNEAS said:
    Will bow to the experts here.
    There is something going on with the coin.
    Can we get a reverse photo?
    Wayne

    Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 27,411 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Would that explain the pinkish color some what on the obverse? For lack of knowledge here

  • Mr_SpudMr_Spud Posts: 4,357 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I vaguely remember reading that putty can be detected under UV light. Is that true? If so, look at the coin under UV light maybe?

    Mr_Spud

  • TomBTomB Posts: 20,697 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I don't like the look of that.

    Thomas Bush Numismatics & Numismatic Photography

    In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson

    image
  • csdotcsdot Posts: 669 ✭✭✭✭

    The US Mint pumped out large mintages of $10s in both 1926 and 1932, and many of those coins survive today to be bought by collectors. Neither date is hard to find in high grades.

    If you are asking whether you should buy that specific coin, I would suggest you pass on that coin and keep looking. There will be plenty of opportunities to get a 1926 that doesn't have you wondering if there is something wrong with the coin you purchase.

  • WAYNEASWAYNEAS Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 25, 2021 11:11AM

    @Luxor said:

    @WAYNEAS said:
    Will bow to the experts here.
    There is something going on with the coin.
    Can we get a reverse photo?
    Wayne

    Thanks.
    Seems like the reverse has the same issues.
    I would not buy it.
    Wayne

    Kennedys are my quest...

  • CryptoCrypto Posts: 3,368 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I don’t know if that is putty or thumbed nose grease but it have been smoothed for sure

  • streeterstreeter Posts: 4,312 ✭✭✭✭✭

    From the photos, puttied; and if you expanded the photos many deep scratches are visible.
    If the goal was To go from BU original to a hopeful 63 or 64 grade on this coin ...seems to me like a waste of effort. And the cert # will always ID the submitter. Foolish business.

    Have a nice day
  • dcarrdcarr Posts: 7,936 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It has a hazy film, particularly on the higher points of the obverse. But I wouldn't necessarily attribute that to an intentional "putty" job. I think there is a good probability that it is old residue from a PVC flip and/or skin oil fingerprints.

    I don't see anything there (like major scratches or tooled smoothing) that the "putty" is attempting to hide. So I think it is a pretty nice coin and if it were mine I might consider a bath in acetone (or similar solvent) to remove the gunk.

    Without better pictures, grading from my point of view is a crapshoot. But if properly "conserved" and resubmitted, I could potentially see an MS64 grade.

  • lkeneficlkenefic Posts: 7,741 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yeah, something is definitely off. There's good luster on part of it, but the surfaces in front of Liberty face looks dead...

    Collecting: Dansco 7070; Middle Date Large Cents (VF-AU); Box of 20;

    Successful BST transactions with: SilverEagles92; Ahrensdad; Smitty; GregHansen; Lablade; Mercury10c; copperflopper; whatsup; KISHU1; scrapman1077, crispy, canadanz, smallchange, robkool, Mission16, ranshdow, ibzman350, Fallguy, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, jwitten, Walkerguy21D, dsessom.
  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,618 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @johnny9434 said:
    Would that explain the pinkish color some what on the obverse? For lack of knowledge here

    @Mr_Spud said:
    I vaguely remember reading that putty can be detected under UV light. Is that true? If so, look at the coin under UV light maybe?

    Yes and yes.

    But the OP does not have the coin in hand.

    Hard to be definitive.

  • ms70ms70 Posts: 13,946 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I am as far from being an expert on puttying as anyone could ever be and putty immediately came to mind the second I saw the pic.

    Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.

  • thefinnthefinn Posts: 2,653 ✭✭✭✭✭

    What does the label say?

    thefinn
  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,034 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You guys should be professional graders think what you could do actually seeing the coin.

  • Joey29Joey29 Posts: 458 ✭✭✭

    How come you are not showing what grade is on the label

  • LuxorLuxor Posts: 404 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I purposely didn't show the label and grade as it's a coin currently on the market.

    Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.

  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,956 ✭✭✭✭✭

    What a world. Coin doctors and thieves ruining our once great hobby. Get the putty knife out and make easy money. :s

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,034 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wasn’t hard to find. Now that you know it’s in a OGH you’ll be slobbering all over it.
    https://www.greatcollections.com/Coin/1053716/1926-Indian-Gold-Eagle-PCGS-MS-63-OGH

  • LuxorLuxor Posts: 404 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JimTyler I don't think it's correct to link to a coin actively on the market in this instance. Would you mind please deleting the link you posted?

    Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.

  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,034 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Luxor said:
    @JimTyler I don't think it's correct to link to a coin actively on the market in this instance. Would you mind please deleting the link you posted?

    I would respectfully say no but HELL NO.

  • cameonut2011cameonut2011 Posts: 10,060 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Zooming in on my phone it appears to have a cloudy and slightly discolored residue that very much looks like putty to me.

  • WinLoseWinWinLoseWin Posts: 1,471 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If it was putty, seems like it would look worse than it does in a holder that old. But I have not seen much puttied gold to make a good judgement.

    Guessing @dcarr 's post above may be a reasonable assessment.

    "To Be Esteemed Be Useful" - 1792 Birch Cent --- "I personally think we developed language because of our deep need to complain." - Lily Tomlin

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,301 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ianrussell Does GC review the coins that are in your auctions for coins that may have turned in their slab?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • cameonut2011cameonut2011 Posts: 10,060 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:
    Does GC review the coins that are in your auctions for coins that may have turned in their slab?

    I’m guessing that there probably isn’t a thorough review since most items don’t have detailed written descriptions, opting for high resolution images instead.

  • skier07skier07 Posts: 3,650 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:
    @ianrussell Does GC review the coins that are in your auctions for coins that may have turned in their slab?

    Does any auction house review relatively inexpensive common coins?

  • vulcanizevulcanize Posts: 1,339 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 26, 2021 2:43PM

    @JimTyler said:

    @Luxor said:
    @JimTyler I don't think it's correct to link to a coin actively on the market in this instance. Would you mind please deleting the link you posted?

    I would respectfully say no but HELL NO.

    Not trying to be a grammar Nazi here but English is really a funny language.

    You replied Hell no to a query of Would you mind please which truly meant that you agree to do it because don't mind acceding to the request. :p

  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,034 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 26, 2021 2:53PM

    @vulcanize said:

    @JimTyler said:

    @Luxor said:
    @JimTyler I don't think it's correct to link to a coin actively on the market in this instance. Would you mind please deleting the link you posted?

    I would respectfully say no but HELL NO.

    Not trying to be a grammar Nazi here but English is really a funny language.

    You replied Hell no to a query of Would you mind please which truly meant that you agree to do it because don't mind acceding to the request. :p

    You’re right. HELL YES. HELL NO I won’t remove it ( is that a double negative ? Did I just say I will remove it again ) People need to see everything about the coin in question. I like the coin and would buy it if I liked the price.

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,301 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ianrussell said:

    @PerryHall said:
    @ianrussell Does GC review the coins that are in your auctions for coins that may have turned in their slab?

    Yes, and we routinely reject coins that have turned, either from putty or other issues.

    We'll be reviewing this particular coin before it ships, and will take the appropriate action in consulting with the winning bidder. We stand behind everything we auction.

    Regards,

    • Ian

    It's customer service like this why your company is so successful. B)

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • pcgscacgoldpcgscacgold Posts: 2,616 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I will be interested to hear how this turns out. The coin seemed to still get to a pretty good price for a common 63 (though no premium for OGH). Chances are it straight grades again.

  • mark_dakmark_dak Posts: 1,085 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JimTyler said:

    @vulcanize said:

    @JimTyler said:

    @Luxor said:
    @JimTyler I don't think it's correct to link to a coin actively on the market in this instance. Would you mind please deleting the link you posted?

    I would respectfully say no but HELL NO.

    Not trying to be a grammar Nazi here but English is really a funny language.

    You replied Hell no to a query of Would you mind please which truly meant that you agree to do it because don't mind acceding to the request. :p

    You’re right. HELL YES. HELL NO I won’t remove it ( is that a double negative ? Did I just say I will remove it again ) People need to see everything about the coin in question. I like the coin and would buy it if I liked the price.

    Me too.. at a couple bucks over melt price. Common $10 Indian that obviously been messed with. No way is it worth what it went for.

    Mark

  • mark_dakmark_dak Posts: 1,085 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @pcgscacgold said:
    I will be interested to hear how this turns out. The coin seemed to still get to a pretty good price for a common 63 (though no premium for OGH). Chances are it straight grades again.

    Would you say "unknowingly" went for "a pretty good price for a common 63"?

    I'd say this is one of those instances where "Buy the coin, not the holder" should most definitely apply. Purchasing a coin because it resides in an OGH is insane!

    There should be no way this one straight grades again IMO.

    Mark

  • fathomfathom Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 28, 2021 1:29PM

    @vulcanize said:

    @JimTyler said:

    @Luxor said:
    @JimTyler I don't think it's correct to link to a coin actively on the market in this instance. Would you mind please deleting the link you posted?

    I would respectfully say no but HELL NO.

    Not trying to be a grammar Nazi here but English is really a funny language.

    You replied Hell no to a query of Would you mind please which truly meant that you agree to do it because don't mind acceding to the request. :p

    The usage of the specific fascist dictatorship mentioned is offensive to survivors and families of survivors of the regime.

  • vulcanizevulcanize Posts: 1,339 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @fathom said:
    The usage of the specific fascist dictatorship mentioned is offensive to survivors and families of survivors of the regime.

    Well, if you can prove that their main language was English, then you have a case.

    https://www.dictionary.com/e/pop-culture/grammar-nazi/

    :p

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,301 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @fathom said:

    @vulcanize said:

    @JimTyler said:

    @Luxor said:
    @JimTyler I don't think it's correct to link to a coin actively on the market in this instance. Would you mind please deleting the link you posted?

    I would respectfully say no but HELL NO.

    Not trying to be a grammar Nazi here but English is really a funny language.

    You replied Hell no to a query of Would you mind please which truly meant that you agree to do it because don't mind acceding to the request. :p

    The usage of the specific fascist dictatorship mentioned is offensive to survivors and families of survivors of the regime.

    Did you ever watch the Seinfeld episode with the "soup Nazi"?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • fathomfathom Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 28, 2021 9:15PM

    Deleted

  • BroadstruckBroadstruck Posts: 30,497 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Here's an example of putty that really turned hard...

    To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!
  • TreashuntTreashunt Posts: 6,747 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Time to claim the guarantee?

    Frank

    BHNC #203

  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 22,721 ✭✭✭✭✭

    its possible

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,034 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Broadstruck said:
    Here's an example of putty that really turned hard...

    That’s what I’m talkin about. This coin is OK.

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