Auctions???
Southside7
Posts: 79 ✭✭✭
As a collector re-entering the hobby in earnest it "appears" to me that outside of the big auction houses auctions have lost their fun compared to, say, 20 years ago. I'm curious how others feel?
I had a ton of fun and excitement participating in Teletrade and Ebay when Ebay was a fun, inexpensive, person to person venue. The excitement of bidding and sniping and maybe, just maybe catching that good deal was a lot of fun in itself.
Do most no longer enjoy the fun of auctions? Or is it just that there are not many auctions to choose from?
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Ebay is still largely a person to person site. It is, however, too large for most people to risk an unreserved auction for common material. It is too easy for things to fall through the cracks.
I think there are more and better options now than 20 years ago. With higher bandwidths, we have high resolution photos and numerous auction sites: DLRC, GC, Stacks, heritage, Legends, to name a few. There also Facebook and Instagram auctions that are person to person.
Teletrade, back in the day, was literally a leap in the dark.
If you liked Teletrade, you should look into Great Collections. Ian was at Teletrade and has taken the best parts of the model to GC.
"Look up, old boy, and see what you get." -William Bonney.
I guess what I am really saying or wondering is if (using Ebay as an example) the volume of buy it now versus auctions is the result of buyer preference or seller preference? For a long while on Ebay there was no buy it now. I wonder if the now very lopsided balance towards buy it now ads versus auctions is because of seller greed or customer impatience?
Thoughts?
Seller greed and ignorance
Ignorance because widgets aren’t going to sell at 2x retail when 25% over isn’t selling either.
Plus there is a lot of pure trash on eBay. It’s not fun wading through the relisted garbage
Im a very small coin dealer in southern California. I do a live auction every Tuesday around 3:00pm pacific on Youtube. It is a great mix of collector at every level. Coming up on 4 years now. I put up about 30 blocks on average with a free Give away at auctions end. Not your typical coin auction, I insist that all in chat be respectful of each other and use auction etiquette but more importantly, have Fun. A hobby is to be enjoyed, a get away from the rat race, a safe haven. Come give us a try,
LINK: https://www.youtube.com/c/LemonHeadPenny
Be Well All, Travis Martin "Lemonhead Penny"Totally agree.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
It's both. There are a lot of commodity coins with defined prices. Why would I bother auctioning them? I mean, what's the point in trying to auction a 1998 proof set. By a similar token, if I'm looking for a 2021 silver eagle, why do I want to be competing in an auction?
Auctions only make sense for items that don't have clear values.
Ebay was, at one time, a great venue. It has long since been invaded by hucksters, thieves and idiots. I no longer use their site. Just not worth the time for me. Cheers, RickO
eBay is a good venue so is GC. I buy from them plus a wholesaler (bigger ticket purchases) at shows I set up at.
On eBay I have developed a list of fav sellers. One has to take responsibility and develop their own plan / strategy in numismatic investment.
The time and effort vs. the cost of living makes selling cheaper items via the auction route something of a moot point. If someone only needed three proof sets for their collection, it would simply be better for both them and the seller to have quick, retail-esque transaction rather than fretting over a few dollars more when anyone else might get involved.
Custom album maker and numismatic photographer.
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Thank You for the compliment! I'm sure other sellers here will too!
@amwldcoin... There was not a specific reference there.... but the statement holds true, in general, from what I have seen - not to mention the continuous stream of issues posted here. Yes, I am sure there are honorable sellers on ebay, however, for me, just not worth the trouble of screening through the rubbish. Cheers, RickO
There's plenty of great eBay sellers, and when you do end up on the bad side of a deal eBay's buyer protection will make you whole. I'm biased because I run an eBay page but I know there's lots of good sellers out there. Maybe I just know how to avoid the less than honest listings because I'm familiar with the platform, but I can honestly say in buying over 3k individual items on eBay I've only had two cases where the seller was dishonest and a borderline thief.
People only post complaints. Should I start 1000 threads for the LITERALLY 1000 ebay transactions that went through fine?
I've seen nothing but lost packages on this forum. By the same logic, that means the post office rarely delivers a package.
I have bought over tens of thousands of coins on Ebay. I have NEVER been ripped off.
I am also a seller on eBay with 100% feedback and so many repeat customers.
Most all the best and ethical sellers have a presence on eBay.
Yikes...interesting how often things can kind of go off the rails when egos get wounded! Somehow this turned into Ebay sellers defending and promoting themselves.
Of course there are reputable and not so reputable sellers on Ebay, just as there is in most any genre of retail. I believe most intelligent people realize this. I believe that any person that is willing to invest the time to do so can generate a list of the reputable sellers they care to associate with just as they would place effort into deciding which restaurant they like.
I was simply wondering about opinions on why there is "seemingly" substantially less interest in auctions than there used to be and opinions of if this change is more a result of seller or buyer influence?
Even the poster above ErrorsOnCoins has a "CTF Error Coins Ebay Auctions" link listed in their footnote. Yet of the 569 current Ebay listings there's not a single "Auction". Obviously this is a very knowledgeable individual with a lot of beautiful merchandise, professional representation and a lot of experience. There must be a tangible, intelligent reason for not holding auctions. I'm just wanting to learn!
In the spirit and context of the question asked there are some very insightful responses here, thank you!
I use to do 99 cent auctions all the time and will do more in the future.
I did them when I needed cash. I no longer "need" cash so BIN is the best option for me at this time.
I don't know if it's tangible or intelligent, but I don't run auctions for two reasons:
Considering the above, what's the point of listing an item as an auction?
Now this is GREAT information!
Thank you!
So far what I have gathered is that the comparative lack of auctions is a result of sellers wants, needs and subsequent actions, not consumers.
To MasonG; It is both tangible and intelligent! Tangible because it is your goods and your decision and intelligent because you gave thought to the reasons for your decision. Thank you for sharing!
To ErrorsOnCoins: Not to be nosy but I am curious, when you did 99 cent auctions did you find that often bidding would end up higher than you expected (not to be confused with what you wanted)? If so, was it rare or common?
Usually my 99 cent auctions go higher than my BIN price.
Which means, I should do all my lots at 99 cent auctions, right?
No. I am building inventory, a brand name and need high end (for my price range) eye appealing coins in my inventory to get where I want to go.
I always list on eBay with a zero start, and no reserve. I do very well. MASS eyeballs. On the other hand, I buy less and less there. I can’t see to find deals like I did 10+ years ago.
Great Collections is great as well. I’ve sold some widgets on GC a few times with decent results. Super service too.
Dave
It's amazing how some posters, who admit not having used ebay in years, keep indicating it's a scam or fraud heaven.
To quote: "In general, from what I have seen - not to mention the continuous stream of issues posted here."
It appears the poster has not personally had a negative experience in years, but relies on what is posted on the internet for his opinion. As the saying goes: "If it is posted on the internet, it must be true."
Personally, I've been buying and selling on ebay since 2000 and most of my less than favorable experiences have been with npb. Even the BST forum had their share of dead beats, but it's still a viable place to conduct business in.
As I mentioned above, auctions don't make sense for widgets - if it is widely available and has a commoditized price, why would you auction it?
Even if running an auction, don't ever start it at 99 cents, because:
1. If it is hard to find or thinly traded - one of the three collectors might be on vacation that week.
2. If it is common, most of the time people are bidding trying to get it for less than the commoditized BIN price.
People like auctions because they think it is a treasure hunting game where they might score. But, if there were really something you wanted, why would you want to wait and then have to outbid every other yahoo who wants one?
I don't know if this will be helpful or not.
1) It depends what you are looking for. I went on e-bay 20 years ago for 10 minutes, didn't see anything I was looking for, and never went back. Others find all sorts of material that interests them.
2) How important is seeing what you are buying in hand? Personally, I would not buy anything sight unseen unless I had a no questions asked five to seven day return privilege. Auction houses used to offer this option, but they haven't done this for many years. Don't know about Great Collections in this area; haven't bought or bid on anything of theirs. Many people are fine buying a coin from an image. I don't do that.
3) Price guide information on most actively traded coins is readily available. Use it.
4) Remember to factor in sales tax and shipping charges in your bid; if it's an expensive coin, if you don't do this, you'll be buried in it.
5) Auctions are much more expensive than they used to be. Factor in buyer's premiums into your bid. See item 4).
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
Many great constructive and intelligent opinions and personal preferences shared, thank you!
Also I am learning things I did not even ask about. I learned there are people that know what all other people like and why they like it. Man, what a great talent to have! I also learned that a person bidding in an auction is called a "yahoo".
I think Ebay should change "Bidder ____" to "Yahoo ____".
You don't have to bid on an auction to be a yahoo. Lots of yahoos out there.
What is one reason that anyone would prefer an auction other than to hope to get a bargain? You could want the market to price it for you, but then you are aiming to always pay the max.
I don’t buy coins on eBay because the prices are almost always high. I just checked the Heritage archives for 1921 peace dollars to have an example. In the last month the average sale price for a PCGS MS62 was $825, and for MS64 $1590.
On eBay right now the LOWEST price for a BIN NGC or PCGS MS62 is $950 + shipping and $1875 for a MS64.
With all the venues to buy, EBay is not appealing.
No one ever negotiates down. BIN should be higher than an auction.
If you add the fees for your Heritage auctions .... 10% seller fee and then the buyer will pay a 15% Buyers fee. It will even out. In addition, you can use a cc & have buyers or sellers protection on ebay.
That’s all in on the buyers end.
@jmlanzaf said:
"You don't have to bid on an auction to be a yahoo. Lots of yahoos out there." I do not believe anyone here said one has to bid in an auction to be a yahoo, did they? I was just acknowledging that you stated bidders in auctions are yahoos. So (from grade school) If all bidders are yahoos and some people are bidders then are all people yahoos? LOL!
"What is one reason that anyone would prefer an auction other than to hope to get a bargain?" I would never venture to claim to be an authority on what "anyone" would do or why they would do it. Instead I would ask them! Although I feel your presenting your comment as a question in rhetorical I will offer that personally a reason I may partake in an auction is because the item up for auction may be only current example available. Another reason could be that the item up for auction is nicer than the one or others available for outright sale. Another could be that the ones up for outright sale are (in my opinion of the merchandise versus my opinion of fair price) over priced, which in such a case I would bid to my limit. Another is maybe I have a better relationship or more trust with the auctioneer than I do the outright seller. Another could be that the auctioneer has better product representation and better customer service and satisfaction guarantees than the outright seller. Another could be that the auctioneer offers free shipping and insurance and the outright seller does not. Yet another is it can be fun and exciting. This is just a few that quickly come to mind but this is just me. Maybe you are absolutely right and I am wrong about myself and there's only one reason "anyone" would prefer an auction.
It "appears" to me that more often than not outright (attempted) selling is rooted more in sellers fishing and auctions are rooted more in sellers selling.
"No one ever negotiates down. BIN should be higher than an auction." "No one ever"...again, what a great gift to have!
A while back, as a test, I took about 20 items that typically sell for $10 to $20 and listed them as 99 cent opening bid auctions. Three or four of them got one bid, another had two or three bids and the rest closed without bids. I relisted those at fixed prices ($10 to $20) and in six months, all were sold.
Just sayin'.
That misses the point. Of course you bid in an auction because you want the item. My point was that if you want the item, would you not prefer a BIN to an auction a a means of acquisition? Unless, in my opinion, you're hoping it sells for less in the auction.
BIN do not exist in a vacuum
They exist along side true auction on eBay
Both live in the current reality of BIN pricing versus auction prices.
Yes, I do hope I can get it for less via auction because I find the BINs to be often over market
Some are, some aren't.
But that is my point...
There is a opportunity cost to the BIN. You don't have to wait for the purchase or risk losing it.