New Anti-Counterfeit Edge?
Onastone
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July 20'th marks the release of the new Type-2 Proof ASE. The mint states: "Enhanced security features include an anti-counterfeit reeded edge variation" Does anyone know what that means? Will there be odd spacing of the reeds, or perhaps some secret laser marks?
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The reed variation is the missing reed just under the 1 in the date that can be seen the the third photo.
https://catalog.usmint.gov/american-eagle-2021-one-ounce-silver-proof-coin-21EAN.html?cgid=2021-product-schedule
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I'm not an expert on such things, but how hard would it be to counterfeit a coin with a missing reed?
I will get one of these (enrolled, I can avoid the rush).... It will be interesting to examine in hand. Cheers, RickO
It’s probably the missing reed in combination with exact positioning and maybe a few other things. At least that’s what I suspect. They definitely won’t use it in isolation. Still, it doesn’t help the end consumer all that much if they don’t have a simple way to verify authenticity.
Whatever works.
To me it is just another marketing gimmick.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
Will it now be an error if the missing reed is not in in the correct spot (rotated dies)?
Thanks @Kliao I see it now, how interesting. I agree with @MWallace, if you're actually
making a coin like this, would this last reed detail be the step that stops you from counterfeiting?
obviously it won't stop counterfeits, nothing will BUT as those of us that have spent a lot of time studying them, raw and slabbed, the more that gets thrown at them the more mistakes they will make and they make a lot which will make slowing them down a bit easier.
i say throw 100 security features at them and watch em fumble. they couldn't even spell simple words properly, not make non-existent dates/mm combos, mixed up coin type obv/rev combos, bad fonts and the list goes on.
the challenge is getting the information to the legit consumers that have little to no desire to learn such things and just want to buy this stuff and there are a lot.
for the rest of us that attempt to educate others and thwart the forgeries, we can take this knowledge forward and give the dishonest folks one heck of a run for their money.
it is a bid disappointing how many folks i contact on just ebay that have supposedly no idea of this site let alone have an account for it but i'm pressing.
I think there are always going to be the individual buyers who will impulse buy a small number without knowing anything about the coins and how many are counterfeit. The security measures are probably most helpful in avoiding large bulk numbers from getting into the normal supplychain.
Yeah that will deter them. lol
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I remember a TPG coin holder that was "Puffed" up on the obverse side that actually showed the rim (whoever sold it advertised it as a "3 surface" slab.) It was on a ASE and the darn things would not stack properly so I sold it, I think they also came with a plastic stand that would show the coin upright, kinda like a plate holder. Anybody remember ??
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Opened the 2021 ASE Uncirculated Coin minted at West Point (W) with the anti-counterfeit reeded edge variation and was left wondering as to how a missing reed can make a difference.
I mean if somthing was stamped in between that empty space it is understandable, but it is not, which means no great shakes and nothing major that a fine needle file cannot accomplish for the counterfeiters.
Or am I really missing something here
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/quarters/PCGS-2020-quarter-quest/album/247091
How can I use ASE as gears in my lego machines, if they come with missing teeth?!?
Maybe that "notch" is a secret key to unlock a lost treasure that only Nicholas Cage knows of. Or not! Peace Roy
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I believe I read there are other anti-counterfeiting measures that were also added but not revealed. I think a lot of these technologies are coming from the UK and Canada.
What good is an anti-counterfeiting measure that no one knows about?
I didn’t know that there was a big problem of people counterfeiting these. One more reason to enjoy reading here.
I think the US Mint and the Secret Service would know.
I've heard of hidden anti-counterfeiting measures on paper money but never on coins.
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"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
An interesting thread on the same topic from the Q&A forum...
Any attempt at more security and proof of being genuine is better that no attempt at all.
Pete
They should encode the date and mint mark into the number and position of missing reeds.
Wouldn't removing a reed affect the weight? Ever so slightly?
Unless I am mistaken, the mass of a coin is dictated by the planchet.
During striking, "when the dies come together, the planchet metal flows into the shape of the design. A collar placed around the planchet prevents the metal from expanding too much. It also forms the edge design, whether smooth, reeded, or lettered."
Source, Step #5
No. The missing reeds are are in the collar, not removed after striking. The weight is determined by the planchet. Under striking pressure, the metal flows/deforms to fill whatever gaps are in the die and coll.
And that means that the more reeds that are suppressed, the better the strike on the coin!
Did the unreeded 2016 ASE have better strikes?
Send me a few dozen, and some with reeds for comparisono, and I'll let you know...
The problem with undisclosed anticounterfeiting measures is:
Who do you send the suspicious ones to and would they even care to look.
Of course should they ever get a large batch in customs that’s a different story. But how many times has that happened?
Seems to me a Missing reed would be the easiest for counterfeiters to copy
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Question: do the new buffs have a missing reed?