Birch Evans Bayh Jr. (/baɪ/;[3] January 22, 1928 – March 14, 2019) was an American Democratic Party politician who served as U.S. Senator from Indiana from 1963 to 1981. He was first elected to office in 1954, when he won election to the Indiana House of Representatives; in 1958, he was elected Speaker, the youngest person to hold that office in the state's history. In 1962, he ran for the U.S. Senate, narrowly defeating incumbent Republican Homer E. Capehart. Shortly after entering the Senate, he became Chairman of the Subcommittee on Constitutional Amendments, and in that role authored two constitutional amendments: the twenty-fifth—which establishes procedures for an orderly transition of power in the case of the death, disability, or resignation of the President of the United States—and the twenty-sixth, which lowered the voting age to 18 throughout the United States. He is the only non–Founding Father to have authored two constitutional amendments. Bayh also led unsuccessful efforts to ratify the Equal Rights Amendment and eliminate the Electoral College.
There's also interesting information on his relationship with the Kennedys.
On June 19, 1964, Bayh, his wife, Senator Ted Kennedy and legislative aide Edward Moss were on a small plane that crashed near Springfield, Massachusetts.
I checked closely, and it is not an Accented Hair Kennedy - so I am not really interested Actually, an interesting coin with history that ties to the issue of the coin itself. I would keep it as is... Cheers, RickO
I read it. As long as the slab included the provenance, why would it matter if the token was removed?
The JFK half dollar doesn't say it comes taped to cardboard
But it did come that way, which is part of its history and presentation.
This is part of the history and presentation of the 1913 Liberty Head nickels as it used to hold them all. Unfortunately, not a single one is stored it in anymore
To me, the cardboard is more like this holder than the cocoabola wood.
It's okay for different people to value the cardboard differently.
How cool would it be to display that holder with one (or more) of the 1913 nickels in it?! But alas, I only got halfway there.😉
I do think it would be nice, but the current owners of the nickels apparently do not.
This holder did sell for over $10K. I don't think the cardboard would go for that much.
I know what that holder sold for. You do k > @ricko said:
I checked closely, and it is not an Accented Hair Kennedy - so I am not really interested Actually, an interesting coin with history that ties to the issue of the coin itself. I would keep it as is... Cheers, RickO
Only the proofs include Accented Hair examples.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Keeping the whole thing intact, with the letter and coin attached to the cardboard, is what gives the package value. Otherwise it’s just another 1964 half dollar with Scotch Tape toning. Don’t get obsessed with certification. That is not where the value of this item lies.
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
Thus far; new discoveries do occur. Undiscovered varieties and errors keep the hobby interesting.
That’s true, but are you advocating that people always use a disclaimer when discussing known issues and varieties? There are a number of coins which exist, despite a lack of official records. So in theory, there could be numerous others. But unless or until they’re discovered, I’m good without disclaimers.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
No disclaimer required. However, you make it sound as if it is a definitive fact that has been confirmed by a reliable source such as the issuing mint.
How about "Accented Hair variety has only been found in the proofs."
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
As a collector, I would not value this as much as I would have if the coin had been taped to the letter. Having it taped to cardboard leaves the door cracked slightly open that something happened to the original coin and this is a substitute.
Looking at the men's heads I see that the older generation was still wearing hats and the younger generations were not. Hats were standard for men up until a few years earlier. (I love the old mugshots where one of the angles always showed them with a hat on).
Nowadays, the younger generations would all be wearing baseball caps, unless it was really cold and anyone might wearing a winter hat.
I read it. As long as the slab included the provenance, why would it matter if the token was removed?
The JFK half dollar doesn't say it comes taped to cardboard
But it did come that way, which is part of its history and presentation.
This is part of the history and presentation of the 1913 Liberty Head nickels as it used to hold them all. Unfortunately, not a single one is stored it in anymore
To me, the cardboard is more like this holder than the cocoabola wood.
It's okay for different people to value the cardboard differently.
How cool would it be to display that holder with one (or more) of the 1913 nickels in it?! But alas, I only got halfway there.😉
I do think it would be nice, but the current owners of the nickels apparently do not.
This holder did sell for over $10K. I don't think the cardboard would go for that much.
I know what that holder sold for. You do k
But neither of us know for sure what the holder in the OP would sell for without the coin. That comparison was the jist of that post.
I speculated it wouldn't be worth much without the coin. Any thoughts?
@JBK said:
It is a 1964 JFK half that was sent by Senator Birch Bayh to a constituent.
What I want to know is who is Miller Carbon and why he was chosen to receive this
Miller Carbon was treasurer of the Indiana Young Democrats in 1863. Birch was the first term Democratic US Senator for Indiana so it makes sense that they would have a relationship.
The Terre Haute Tribune from Terre Haute, Indiana · Page 33
Publication: The Terre Haute Tribune
Location: Terre Haute, Indiana
Issue Date: Thursday, September 19, 1963
Page: Page 33
... America will be held in Terre Haute the weekend of Oct. 18-20, according to announcement made by Miller Carbon, treasurer of the Indiana Young Democrats ...
In 1957, he was a member of the Indiana State Teachers College Commerce Club. Here's a photo where Miller Carbon is in the last row, send from the right.
Commerce Club
As its primary purpose Commerce Club aimed at stimulating educational and professional growth in the field of commerce. This club also enables business education students to become better acquainted with other students and with professors in the field.
[...]
Row 6: Susie Kerr, Robert Hinshaw, Jessie Van Leer, Roy Walton, Damian Macey, Richard Schoeder, Albert Vogel, Dick Ballinger, Miller Carbon, Dick Ouweneel (1957 Sycamore, page 23)
Here's a better photo of Miller Carbon, also from Indiana State Teachers College.
Members of the Young Democrats Club.
Seated, from left to right, are Jane Curley, Normal Stohr, Margaret Owens, Gloria Howell, Shirely Brewer, Joan Pennington, Libby Skinner, Phyllis Bates, and Louise Clarke.
Standing, from left to right, are Jack R. Needham, Miller Carbon, Rudy Harrison, Robert Lucas, and Larry Oliver.
I'm guessing my posts are increasing the value of this
It also looks like Miller Carbon ran for Indiana Democratic State Representative in 1962. I haven't found any indication that he won.
The Terre Haute Star from Terre Haute, Indiana · Page 4
Publication: The Terre Haute Star
Location: Terre Haute, Indiana
Issue Date: Monday, May 7, 1962
Page: Page 4
VOTE FOR E. MILLER CARBON DEMOCRAT STATE REPRESENTATIVE Son of the late Albert J. Carbon, Sr. Life-long resident of Terre Haute, father of two children and resides at 87 Potomac. He is a member of St. Patrick Church. He is engaged in real estate business for J. B. Pfister Co. and a member of Terre Haute Board of Realtors. Other memberships include Vigo County Young Democrats, Terre Haute Noon Optimist Club, B. P. 0. E. No. 86 and K. of C. No. 541. Just one interest in mind YOURS VOTING MACHINE NO. 14C For a greater and prosperous Vigo County. A PAID POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENT.
@Zoins said:
Here's a better photo of Miller Carbon, also from Indiana State Teachers College.
Members of the Young Democrats Club.
Seated, from left to right, are Jane Curley, Normal Stohr, Margaret Owens, Gloria Howell, Shirely Brewer, Joan Pennington, Libby Skinner, Phyllis Bates, and Louise Clarke.
Standing, from left to right, are Jack R. Needham, Miller Carbon, Rudy Harrison, Robert Lucas, and Larry Oliver.
I'm guessing my posts are increasing the value of this
@Zoins said:
Here's a better photo of Miller Carbon, also from Indiana State Teachers College.
Members of the Young Democrats Club.
Seated, from left to right, are Jane Curley, Normal Stohr, Margaret Owens, Gloria Howell, Shirely Brewer, Joan Pennington, Libby Skinner, Phyllis Bates, and Louise Clarke.
Standing, from left to right, are Jack R. Needham, Miller Carbon, Rudy Harrison, Robert Lucas, and Larry Oliver.
I'm guessing my posts are increasing the value of this
Would I be nitpicking if I said “decreasing” instead of “increasing”? 😄
No you wouldn't as they are very different, opposite, outcomes.
Do you not think the history of Miller Carbon is valuable? Perhaps you believe the information indicates a less prominent person than one would otherwise guess?
It's certainly possible that the information causes a decrease, rather than an increase, in interest and value as you suggest.
@Zoins said:
Here's a better photo of Miller Carbon, also from Indiana State Teachers College.
Members of the Young Democrats Club.
Seated, from left to right, are Jane Curley, Normal Stohr, Margaret Owens, Gloria Howell, Shirely Brewer, Joan Pennington, Libby Skinner, Phyllis Bates, and Louise Clarke.
Standing, from left to right, are Jack R. Needham, Miller Carbon, Rudy Harrison, Robert Lucas, and Larry Oliver.
I'm guessing my posts are increasing the value of this
Would I be nitpicking if I said “decreasing” instead of “increasing”? 😄
No you wouldn't as they are very different, opposite, outcomes.
Do you not think the history of Carbon Miller is valuable? Perhaps you believe the information indicates a less prominent person than one would otherwise guess?
I was joking. But to answer your question, the identity of the person isn’t a big deal to me, either way, though it certainly might be for others.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
One thing I have learned is that you never know what little detail might appeal to someone. In any case, I assumed it was an anonymous constituent, so any additional identification is a plus.
Thx @Zoins for the detective work. I will have to print some of it off to keep with the coin and letter. I guess my Presentation JFK Coin file just went from a plastic sleeve to a small folder.
The letter and coin sat out on Ebay for months with a BIN price of $30. I finally pulled the trigger by offering $25 and my offer was automatically accepted, which you don't see too often (how much lower could I have gone, I wonder). Another $5 or so for shipping and here we are.
So, I'm happy to have it for the historical numismatic connection.
Comments
Here's some info on Birch Bayh from Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birch_Bayh
There's also interesting information on his relationship with the Kennedys.
I checked closely, and it is not an Accented Hair Kennedy - so I am not really interested
Actually, an interesting coin with history that ties to the issue of the coin itself. I would keep it as is... Cheers, RickO
I know what that holder sold for. You do k > @ricko said:
Only the proofs include Accented Hair examples.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Thus far; new discoveries do occur. Undiscovered varieties and errors keep the hobby interesting.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
Keeping the whole thing intact, with the letter and coin attached to the cardboard, is what gives the package value. Otherwise it’s just another 1964 half dollar with Scotch Tape toning. Don’t get obsessed with certification. That is not where the value of this item lies.
You need to understand the coin itself is NOT the rarity here.
That’s true, but are you advocating that people always use a disclaimer when discussing known issues and varieties? There are a number of coins which exist, despite a lack of official records. So in theory, there could be numerous others. But unless or until they’re discovered, I’m good without disclaimers.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
No disclaimer required. However, you make it sound as if it is a definitive fact that has been confirmed by a reliable source such as the issuing mint.
How about "Accented Hair variety has only been found in the proofs."
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
As a collector, I would not value this as much as I would have if the coin had been taped to the letter. Having it taped to cardboard leaves the door cracked slightly open that something happened to the original coin and this is a substitute.
Notice all the people staring at their phones.. I mean newspapers. And who is that lady standing between @Ricko & @Keets on the corner
What are these "newspapers" you speak of?
Oh the ironies in that photo....
Looking at the men's heads I see that the older generation was still wearing hats and the younger generations were not. Hats were standard for men up until a few years earlier. (I love the old mugshots where one of the angles always showed them with a hat on).
Nowadays, the younger generations would all be wearing baseball caps, unless it was really cold and anyone might wearing a winter hat.
But neither of us know for sure what the holder in the OP would sell for without the coin. That comparison was the jist of that post.
I speculated it wouldn't be worth much without the coin. Any thoughts?
It may be useful to put some numbers against this to get a feel for the magnitude of difference.
What would people pay for this on the cardboard vs. in a slab?
Miller Carbon was treasurer of the Indiana Young Democrats in 1863. Birch was the first term Democratic US Senator for Indiana so it makes sense that they would have a relationship.
https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/90515172/
In 1957, he was a member of the Indiana State Teachers College Commerce Club. Here's a photo where Miller Carbon is in the last row, send from the right.
https://www.indstate.edu/business/history/yearbooks/1950
Here's a better photo of Miller Carbon, also from Indiana State Teachers College.
I'm guessing my posts are increasing the value of this
http://visions.indstate.edu:8888/cdm/ref/collection/isuarchive/id/50794
It also looks like Miller Carbon ran for Indiana Democratic State Representative in 1962. I haven't found any indication that he won.
https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/10338305/
His full name is Ernest Miller Carbon (1936-1989):
https://ancestors.familysearch.org/en/LDH3-6YB/ernest-miller-carbon-1936-1989
Would I be nitpicking if I said “decreasing” instead of “increasing”? 😄
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
No you wouldn't as they are very different, opposite, outcomes.
Do you not think the history of Miller Carbon is valuable? Perhaps you believe the information indicates a less prominent person than one would otherwise guess?
It's certainly possible that the information causes a decrease, rather than an increase, in interest and value as you suggest.
I was joking. But to answer your question, the identity of the person isn’t a big deal to me, either way, though it certainly might be for others.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
One thing I have learned is that you never know what little detail might appeal to someone. In any case, I assumed it was an anonymous constituent, so any additional identification is a plus.
Thx @Zoins for the detective work. I will have to print some of it off to keep with the coin and letter. I guess my Presentation JFK Coin file just went from a plastic sleeve to a small folder.
The letter and coin sat out on Ebay for months with a BIN price of $30. I finally pulled the trigger by offering $25 and my offer was automatically accepted, which you don't see too often (how much lower could I have gone, I wonder). Another $5 or so for shipping and here we are.
So, I'm happy to have it for the historical numismatic connection.
On eBay for "months"!?!? What took you so long?
And who is that lady standing between @Ricko & @Keets on the corner
that's Maya Angelou having a bad hair day. we struck up a conversation with her, she'd snuck back to the US in cognito just for the release date.
Well that explains a lot...