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PCGS Rarities holder for Rarities - Morelan, Hansen, etc.

ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited December 4, 2021 6:09AM in U.S. Coin Forum

What do you think of using the Rarities holder for rarities?

Bruce is selling his early dollars soon and DL regularly sells his dupes.

Would you prefer to see and buy these coins in Rarities holders?

Here's the Newman-Eliasberg 1913 Liberty Nickel in one:

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Comments

  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 19,927 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:
    What do you think of using the Rarities holder for rarities?

    Not that I have anything behind that velvet rope, but the holder does nothing for me.

  • JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,846 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think it's ok ... but ...
    Business is business ... it's all about making money.

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 7:35AM

    @philographer said:
    I like old pedigrees. I like knowing where a coin was 100 years ago. I don’t have much of an interest in where a coin was 10 years ago.

    I agree old history is certainly interesting. It's great to know the Eliasberg coin was also owned by Abe Kosoff and was Newman's personal collection specimen.

    However, I also like more recent history since those owners are here and can talk about those coins. This one was also owned by Dwight @Dwight_M and Bruce @tradedollarnut.

    I always thought the larger insert could be used to hold more names on the provenance / pedigree. Imagine if this said:

    Newman-Kosoff-Eliasberg-Parino-Manley-Morelan-Forsythe

  • DCWDCW Posts: 7,258 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @GoldenEgg said:
    I would much rather have a holder that enhances the coin, not detracts from it. A coin of that size is lost in a holder that large.

    This is a well stated, good point.

    I prefer a piece to be in a standard holder, with a standard label, and the provenance beneath the grade on that label.

    Just looks more professional in my opinion.

    Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
    "Coin collecting for outcasts..."

  • cardinalcardinal Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Sonorandesertrat said:
    Those holders are marketing tools. Will they be relevant in 20 or 30 years? Someone who is seriously looking for a 1913 Liberty nickel does not need the coin to be in a holder like that.

    Aside from the label, I have seen that same holder used for everyday oversize holders. (I have one of those in the collection, and it's not worth more $1k.)

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 8:03AM

    @MrEureka said:
    I won’t mix PCGS and NGC holders in the same set because the collection doesn’t present as well that way. I don’t even like to mix rattlers and the newer slabs, for the same reason. So I certainly don’t want any giant slabs.

    Agreed on the mixing and matching, however, Bruce's early dollar set doesn't have that many coins so I was thinking they could all be Rarities holders.

  • MrEurekaMrEureka Posts: 24,240 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:

    @MrEureka said:
    I won’t mix PCGS and NGC holders in the same set because the collection doesn’t present as well that way. I don’t even like to mix rattlers and the newer slabs, for the same reason. So I certainly don’t want any giant slabs.

    Agreed on the mixing and matching, however, Bruce's early dollar set doesn't have that many coins so I was thinking they could all be Rarities holders.

    Yes, but the potential buyers already have collections of their own, or will one day.

    Andy Lustig

    Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.

    Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
  • MidLifeCrisisMidLifeCrisis Posts: 10,540 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I prefer coins in the holders in which they were originally slabbed, whenever I can get them. Old holders are more important to me than special or fancy holders. For that and other reasons already stated, no thanks.

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 8:42AM

    Opinions seem to be fairly consistent on this. I wonder how many coins have been slabbed using this holder?

    Are there sample slabs for these?

  • RarityRarity Posts: 1,422 ✭✭✭✭

    Very nice holder with unique tag but I like the older style inner ring better. I am afraid that the 3 prongs will break overtime.

  • cameonut2011cameonut2011 Posts: 10,159 ✭✭✭✭✭

    With the exception of rare, historically significant collections I think pedigree labels are all marketing and ego. I’d prefer a regular holder.

  • topstuftopstuf Posts: 14,803 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BryceM said:
    These oversized holders look silly to me. What's more important, the frame or what's inside? There's a reason they didn't do this:

    image

    Lisa's been FRAMED !!! :p

  • MrEurekaMrEureka Posts: 24,240 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Catbert said:
    Let’s be honest. Adding recent provenance is a vanity project.

    Yes, but with some exceptions. For example, Pogue.

    Andy Lustig

    Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.

    Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 8:56AM

    @MrEureka said:

    @Catbert said:
    Let’s be honest. Adding recent provenance is a vanity project.

    Yes, but with some exceptions. For example, Pogue.

    That's an interesting thought. I have a couple of Pogue coins. I wonder if PCGS would reslab them into Rarity holders with a Pogue insert.

  • coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 11,246 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Utter foolishness, I'll never understand the fascination some people have with a name that they associate fame to. I suppose its because kids were brought up by the TV instead of parents so they idolize and prioritize all the wrong things. I couldn't care less and would bid less for these coins (as I do/will for Hanson coins) because I have to factor in getting the coin reholdered to get rid of that name. No disrespect to Bruce but his name means squat to me and while I cannot afford one anyway the last coin I would want is one with his or any name on the label. And if that wasn't enough that holder is ugly to me.

    My Lincoln Registry
    My Collection of Old Holders

    Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
  • CoinJunkieCoinJunkie Posts: 8,772 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 9:22AM

    I like it, more real estate for stickers...

    ;)

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 10:22AM

    It would not add any attraction for me..... I really do not care about the pedigree/provenance....For me, it is the coin and the attributes it brings....Leave the decorations out....The only place I really like decorations is on my Christmas Tree.... ;):D Cheers, RickO

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 10:58AM

    Here's the prior slab. Do people like this one better?

    I think the gold foil insert is very classy and I'm sorry it's gone now.

    Of note, there's no provenance on this one.

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 10:59AM

    Of course, a regular size slab is even a bit big for a nickel.

    I've always wondered if it would be nice to have a holder for half dollars / quarters and smaller.

    This Max Mehl paster has a more nickel-sized holder.

  • topstuftopstuf Posts: 14,803 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Different size slabs make a problem for those who store in boxes.

  • keyman64keyman64 Posts: 15,499 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think the best way to reference provenance would be for the details to come up when you search the cert. That way, if there is history of a dozen or so, no one gets left out and the history is more complete...rather than just picking and choosing a couple. Incomplete data is rarely ideal. I like the, smaller, standard sized holders myself.

    "If it's not fun, it's not worth it." - KeyMan64
    Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners. :smile:
  • cameonut2011cameonut2011 Posts: 10,159 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:
    Here's the prior slab. Do people like this one better?

    I think the gold foil insert is very classy and I'm sorry it's gone now.

    Of note, there's no provenance on this one.

    We don’t really need the “finest known line,” but yes it is much better.

  • amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well! That's 1 coin that finest known is not likely to change!

    @cameonut2011 said:

    @Zoins said:
    Here's the prior slab. Do people like this one better?

    I think the gold foil insert is very classy and I'm sorry it's gone now.

    Of note, there's no provenance on this one.

    We don’t really need the “finest known line,” but yes it is much better.

  • koynekwestkoynekwest Posts: 10,048 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If anything I think the slabs should be smaller, more like the old ANACS slabs. Or even round.

  • cameonut2011cameonut2011 Posts: 10,159 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @amwldcoin said:
    Well! That's 1 coin that finest known is not likely to change!

    And anyone mulling over purchasing it already knows that too. It is pretentious IMHO.

  • cameonut2011cameonut2011 Posts: 10,159 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:

    The serial number appears to have changed from the gold foil label. Apparently Forsyth submitted it as a regrade. I guess he was hoping for a plus. Here’s to hoping it stickers again (that’s what really matters right?)... :D

  • keetskeets Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭

    so this thread seems to have developed into one asking two questions, over-sized holders and provenance.

    I think the holder used should fit the coin that's inside of it. putting a Nickel in a holder that's better suited for a 60mm medal just looks silly. as for Provenance, even though it isn't important to me I think they have been deemed Historically important and should be maintained on an insert with the coin. if a TPG sees it proper to add a Provenance to a coin insert it should be kept and then the current owner's name added, as displayed by Cardinal.

  • stockdude_stockdude_ Posts: 462 ✭✭✭

    Large holder doesnt work for me. I like the gold label slab

  • stockdude_stockdude_ Posts: 462 ✭✭✭

    "Apparently Forsyth submitted it as a regrade. " Maybe so but on a 1913 Liberty Nickel whether its labeled 64,65,66 is not going to change the value one iota

  • MrEurekaMrEureka Posts: 24,240 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @amwldcoin said:
    Well! That's 1 coin that finest known is not likely to change!

    @cameonut2011 said:

    @Zoins said:
    Here's the prior slab. Do people like this one better?

    I think the gold foil insert is very classy and I'm sorry it's gone now.

    Of note, there's no provenance on this one.

    We don’t really need the “finest known line,” but yes it is much better.

    Until they try to crack it out of the monster slab and...,uh oh.

    Andy Lustig

    Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.

    Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
  • LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,376 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not a fan of that holder - the coin looks lost, almost like an afterthought.......

    "My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko, Big Moose.
  • dbldie55dbldie55 Posts: 7,731 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I liked the presentation of the Forsythe collection at the ANA last year. As long as the owner likes the holders. Heck, I drove 20 hours to see them.

    Collector and Researcher of Liberty Head Nickels. ANA LM-6053
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 7:38PM

    @cardinal said:
    Augustin Dupre made it, and Benjamin Franklin owed it!

    Great provenance on that one :):+1:

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 13,400 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @stockdude_ said:
    "Apparently Forsyth submitted it as a regrade. " Maybe so but on a 1913 Liberty Nickel whether its labeled 64,65,66 is not going to change the value one iota

    That’s incorrect. As rare as the coin is, grade still matters when it comes to “value”.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • koynekwestkoynekwest Posts: 10,048 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2020 10:03PM

    I like that octagonal slab. A round slab could be labelled like that.

  • SDSportsFanSDSportsFan Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @cameonut2011 said:

    @Zoins said:

    The serial number appears to have changed from the gold foil label. Apparently Forsyth submitted it as a regrade. I guess he was hoping for a plus. Here’s to hoping it stickers again (that’s what really matters right?)... :D

    Of note, the cert # on the original holder is only seven digits; and PCGS' current database does not support that older format. The owner undoubtedly wanted the cert # updated to the current eight-digit format.

    Steve

  • keetskeets Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 4, 2020 3:42AM

    A round slab could be labelled like that.

    that's the second time in the thread that you've advocated for a round slab. that will never happen, ever. a round slab would be awkward and a storage nightmare. I know this because for a brief period I was enamored with KoinTains and other styles of round storage.

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 4, 2020 4:04AM

    @SDSportsFan said:

    @cameonut2011 said:

    @Zoins said:

    The serial number appears to have changed from the gold foil label. Apparently Forsyth submitted it as a regrade. I guess he was hoping for a plus. Here’s to hoping it stickers again (that’s what really matters right?)... :D

    Of note, the cert # on the original holder is only seven digits; and PCGS' current database does not support that older format. The owner undoubtedly wanted the cert # updated to the current eight-digit format.

    Steve

    I can't imagine the PCGS database doesn't support 7 digits. I've searched for these fine and the PCGS cert verification website says 7 digit certification numbers work.

    PCGS Cert Verification App: Before you buy any PCGS graded coin, quickly verify its authenticity and quality by scanning or entering the coin's 7 or 8 digit certification number.

    https://www.pcgs.com/cert

    Can you provide some info on this?

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 4, 2020 4:21AM

    @keets said:
    A round slab could be labelled like that.

    that's the second time in the thread that you've advocated for a round slab. that will never happen, ever. a round slab would be awkward and a storage nightmare. I know this because for a brief period I was enamored with KoinTains and other styles of round storage.

    I think KoinTains can be hard to store because they are not rigid.

    I've tended to like Air-Tites and I haven't had any problems with storage. I've been able to store Air-Tite round capsules fine with both Air-Tite boxes and Guardhouse boxes.

    The Air-Tite boxes use cards so it can hold different sizes and even bars. The cards also come in different colors for easy identification.

    https://www.littletoncoin.com/shop/ProductDisplay?storeId=10001&productId=58845

    The Guardhouse boxes don't require anything other than the capsules but then require the capsules to be the same size. I use these for 39mm and 38mm pieces and the boxes feel nice and sturdy, though it's a bit tight to remove from a full box. For smaller coins, gaskets can be used inside the Air-Tite if needed.

    https://www.wizardcoinsupply.com/storage-boxes-capsules/

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