eBay buyer buys coin, breaks it out of TPG holder and is now returning it!

What a tool bag!
eBay says once I receive the package, I have two days to issue a refund. I planned to video tape opening the package to prove the item was damaged/altered, but I’ll probably still be at FUN and miss the two day window. I’ll call eBay tomorrow and state my case.
Has anyone been in a similar situation and how did it go for you?

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Comments

  • CoinstartledCoinstartled Posts: 7,120 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Uphill battle, seller vs customer. Good luck and update us.

  • coinpalicecoinpalice Posts: 1,181 ✭✭✭✭

    the buyer sounds like a nut case

  • thevolcanogodthevolcanogod Posts: 270 ✭✭✭

    Buyer returns have gotten ridiculous.

    Direct result of eBay trying to beat Amazon with “free” returns on the seller’s dime.

    Thinking of going no returns on everything. I have a very generous, no questions asked return policy but it’s being abused heavily. People winning auctions with nuclear bids then returning 90% of the coins etc.

  • CoinstartledCoinstartled Posts: 7,120 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @thevolcanogod said:
    Buyer returns have gotten ridiculous.

    Direct result of eBay trying to beat Amazon with “free” returns on the seller’s dime.

    Thinking of going no returns on everything. I have a very generous, no questions asked return policy but it’s being abused heavily. People winning auctions with nuclear bids then returning 90% of the coins etc.

    Agree about the free returns. Margins just are not there on properly graded coins to offer Neiman Marcus type service.

  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭

    @thevolcanogod said:
    Buyer returns have gotten ridiculous.

    Direct result of eBay trying to beat Amazon with “free” returns on the seller’s dime.

    Thinking of going no returns on everything. I have a very generous, no questions asked return policy but it’s being abused heavily. People winning auctions with nuclear bids then returning 90% of the coins etc.

    Wish I could do no returns, but I just re-qualified for Top Rated Seller discounts.
    Also, forced returns still happen when buyers say their item was not as described. :'(

  • ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 10,950 ✭✭✭✭

    What possible reason does the buyer have to justify returning the coin after cracking it out?

  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭

    @Coinstartled said:
    At least post the buyer handle so we can add him to the "list".

    Can't do that until the transaction has completed and then only by PM.

  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭

    @Connecticoin said:
    What possible reason does the buyer have to justify returning the coin after cracking it out?

    Says the grade is way off and noticed a rim ding after removing it from the holder, lol

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 36,150 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Did he just return just the coin or did he also return the plastic slab with insert and label? He needs to return everything.

  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:
    Did he just return just the coin or did he also return the plastic slab with insert and label? He needs to return everything.

    Says that the item has shipped. We will see what I actually get back in the package. Positives (If you can call them that) ...there is no open case against my PayPal account or on eBay, just an open return.

  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭

    @JBK said:
    I would argue it is not the same item you shipped. Raw is not the same as slabbed. Not sure if this will matter to ebay.

    Here are the two options that seem most applicable once I received the return package.

    I have an option to: Report Buyer
    Then: Buyer misused returns
    Then: Returned a damaged or used item

    Or,

    I have an option to: Report Buyer
    Then: Buyer abused a buyer protection program
    Then: Misused the program to claim an item was not as described

  • ms70ms70 Posts: 10,758 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Isn't it enough that he admitted it?

  • AUandAGAUandAG Posts: 20,733 ✭✭✭✭✭

    and his ebay ID?????

    bob

    BST deals: Dozens of buys/sells. Will provide a list upon request.
    Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), [email protected]
  • ms70ms70 Posts: 10,758 ✭✭✭✭✭

    And add me to the PM list for his ID to add to blocked buyers.

  • notwilightnotwilight Posts: 12,881 ✭✭✭

    What is the approximate value of this coin (in the holder)?

    I have dealt with eBay on similar issues. The advice above of use "broke" or "destroyed" the PCGS holder is important. Add a statement that a coin in a PCGS holder is more valuable because the grade is certified and that the same coin without the holder could we worth up to 80% less (pick a number). Assume in all communications that you are speaking to a layman.

    If things go south a letter from a respected dealer may help. Frankly, a dealer who sells a lot on ebay may be more valuable than one who doesn't.

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 27,289 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The only scenario in which the buyer would have a case would be of the slab was so badly damaged to the point were you could not the grade of the coin inside.

    I got caught on that when I first became a dealer. The slab was so badly scratched that I could not see the coin inside properly. It was an 1807 Quarter. The slab said “VF-30” so I thought the coin had to be okay because I could see a lot of design detail on the piece through the scratches. The customer wanted a raw coin so I had a dealer friend crack it for me. As soon as the coin was out in the open, we both said “Yuk!” The coin was an EF that had been polished and given a layer of AT. The slab had been roughed up to hide that fact.

    The original fault was with the TPG for blowing the grade, but after the slab had been roughed up, there was no way to see that.

    I lost only $100 on the piece because I didn’t put up with any bull from the dealer who sold it to me. He knew what he was selling. I viewed that $100 as “tuition money.” I learned to never take the grade on the slab for granted when you can’t see the item properly.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible.
  • ErrorsOnCoinsErrorsOnCoins Posts: 9,265 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 6, 2019 10:01AM

    I had a buyer buy a coin from me and had it graded and it came back Cleaned. He wanted me to pay for the certification and refund the money on the coin. I did.

    I told my favorite (buying) client what I did and thought I was nuts. We just laughed.

    I did tell the original buyer whom I reimbursed that I could not do that again in the future. He could still return a coin, but I could not pay for his certification.

    Just trying to do the right thing.

  • MLBdaysMLBdays Posts: 421 ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 6, 2019 3:40PM

    What's remarkable to me is how unschooled Ebay is about their very own backyard business..... Ebay should know what a slab is and the many ramifications of rupturing the slab ..... PWCC ALONE sells millions in commissions of slabbed cards and you have an issue with ebay understanding the basics of COLLECTIBLES!! Hello MCFLY!!

  • amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 5,274 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I had something similar happen to me. The final word from ebay was it's just the cost of doing business. GRRRRRR! Unless it is a major issue...lottsa lost value, switched coin or the like. Just block him and move on.

    The one time I called ebay about a nefarious return they automatically ruled in the buyers favor and gave me my only transaction defect.

  • AUandAGAUandAG Posts: 20,733 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just dawned on me that the PO may have destroyed the packaging?

    bob :)

    BST deals: Dozens of buys/sells. Will provide a list upon request.
    Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), [email protected]
  • Wahoo554Wahoo554 Posts: 126 ✭✭✭

    Stories like this are why I’m reticent to ever sell any of my collection on eBay. I was just offered five listings without seller fees but I can’t stop thinking of all the things that can go wrong...

  • Wabbit2313Wabbit2313 Posts: 7,273 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @thevolcanogod said:
    Buyer returns have gotten ridiculous.

    Direct result of eBay trying to beat Amazon with “free” returns on the seller’s dime.

    Thinking of going no returns on everything. I have a very generous, no questions asked return policy but it’s being abused heavily. People winning auctions with nuclear bids then returning 90% of the coins etc.

    If you are getting 90% returns, YOU are doing something wrong. I call BS on this.

  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 15,655 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Wabbit2313 said:

    @thevolcanogod said:
    Buyer returns have gotten ridiculous.

    Direct result of eBay trying to beat Amazon with “free” returns on the seller’s dime.

    Thinking of going no returns on everything. I have a very generous, no questions asked return policy but it’s being abused heavily. People winning auctions with nuclear bids then returning 90% of the coins etc.

    If you are getting 90% returns, YOU are doing something wrong. I call BS on this.

    Not what he said. The arbitrary nuclear bidding buyer is returning 90% of their purchases across all sellers, and doing so with impunity. I don't doubt such buyers exist.

  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭

    @AUandAG said:
    Just dawned on me that the PO may have destroyed the packaging?

    bob :)

    Package arrived safely. He admitted to breaking the coin out of the holder then deciding to return.

  • topstuftopstuf Posts: 12,032 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Mark all listings: No returns if package is opened! :D

    Having placed the order and made payment, the package finally arrived and therein was the finest......

  • BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 29,134 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 6, 2019 12:54PM

    @AUandAG said:
    Just dawned on me that the PO may have destroyed the packaging?

    bob :)

    Deleted.

  • bsshog40bsshog40 Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭✭

    @Tookybandit said:

    @AUandAG said:
    Just dawned on me that the PO may have destroyed the packaging?

    bob :)

    Package arrived safely. He admitted to breaking the coin out of the holder then deciding to return.

    If Ebay stands behind the seller on this, then how safe is it anymore to send out slabbed coins?

  • Wabbit2313Wabbit2313 Posts: 7,273 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @messydesk said:

    @Wabbit2313 said:

    @thevolcanogod said:
    Buyer returns have gotten ridiculous.

    Direct result of eBay trying to beat Amazon with “free” returns on the seller’s dime.

    Thinking of going no returns on everything. I have a very generous, no questions asked return policy but it’s being abused heavily. People winning auctions with nuclear bids then returning 90% of the coins etc.

    If you are getting 90% returns, YOU are doing something wrong. I call BS on this.

    Not what he said. The arbitrary nuclear bidding buyer is returning 90% of their purchases across all sellers, and doing so with impunity. I don't doubt such buyers exist.

    I can read just fine. No way he has 90% returns. Nationwide return average in retail is 9%. I would love to see the sellers eBay page. Not buying it man!

  • Raybob15239Raybob15239 Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭

    I will not sell on eBay anymore. Haven't sold on eBay for about 8 years now. BST only for me.

    Successful B/S/T transactions: As Seller: PascoWA (June 2008); MsMorrisine (April 2009); ECHOES (July 2009) As Buyer: bfjohnson (July 2008); robkool (Dec 2010); itsnotjustme (Dec 2010) TwoSides2aCoin (Dec 2018) PrivateCoin Jan 2019
  • logger7logger7 Posts: 4,094 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm doing ok on ebay but am content to make tiny profits with all the expenses.

  • Cougar1978Cougar1978 Posts: 3,454 ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 6, 2019 1:48PM

    I would fight the return thru eBay.

    Looks like another type of nut case buyer. I could care less about his reasons. If item removed from orig Holder return privilege void PERIOD!

    If they rule in his favor this is factor in causing increased cost of doing business there. All one can do us factor risk into markup equation.

    Please share who so we can block.

    Buy / Sell - US / World - Coins & Currency
  • YQQYQQ Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭✭

    the outcome of this will depend a lot on the slab. I.E. who the TPG is.
    I think we all assumed the slab was one of the top and by Ebay approved TPGS.
    If it was a basement sbbers slab.. you might be out of luck.
    If it was one of the approved slabs, a letter or note from the TPG might set the record of Values or diminished values straight with Ebay and support a damage claim for you.

    Today is the first day of the rest of my life
  • GluggoGluggo Posts: 2,393 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Tookybandit said:
    What a tool bag!
    eBay says once I receive the package, I have two days to issue a refund. I planned to video tape opening the package to prove the item was damaged/altered, but I’ll probably still be at FUN and miss the two day window. I’ll call eBay tomorrow and state my case.
    Has anyone been in a similar situation and how did it go for you?

    Keep in mind many of the Ebay employees are young kids. When ever I have a problem with Ebay I get their first and last name. I document every question I ask them. Once I am dissatisfied I ask to speak to their boss. Your gathering information to be used in your favor.
    Sorry about what your going through. Looks like the buyer took possession when he decided to DESTROY the plastic slab.
    You do have proof of the slabbed coin right via good quality pictures?
    Make your case once you get all the information.

    In the mean time TELL US the BUYERS NAME so I can BAN the son of a [email protected] on my list.
    Show us the picture of the coin? Please!

  • BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 29,134 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @messydesk said:

    @Wabbit2313 said:

    @thevolcanogod said:
    Buyer returns have gotten ridiculous.

    Direct result of eBay trying to beat Amazon with “free” returns on the seller’s dime.

    Thinking of going no returns on everything. I have a very generous, no questions asked return policy but it’s being abused heavily. People winning auctions with nuclear bids then returning 90% of the coins etc.

    If you are getting 90% returns, YOU are doing something wrong. I call BS on this.

    Not what he said. The arbitrary nuclear bidding buyer is returning 90% of their purchases across all sellers, and doing so with impunity. I don't doubt such buyers exist.

    No idea how he would know that info. I also take it as 90% of the nuke bid wins on his listings get returned.

  • BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 29,134 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Cougar1978 said:
    I would fight the return thru eBay.

    Looks like another type of nut case buyer. I could care less about his reasons. If item removed from orig Holder return privilege void PERIOD!

    If they rule in his favor this is factor in causing increased cost of doing business there. All one can do us factor risk into markup equation.

    Please share who so we can block.

    There was a seller here who sold a desirable mint-sealed box of coins and expressly stated so in his listing. The buyer opened it, claimed a coin or 2 was damaged and eBay forced the seller to accept a return. One of many reasons why I rarely sell there.

  • @BAJJERFAN said:

    @Cougar1978 said:
    I would fight the return thru eBay.

    Looks like another type of nut case buyer. I could care less about his reasons. If item removed from orig Holder return privilege void PERIOD!

    If they rule in his favor this is factor in causing increased cost of doing business there. All one can do us factor risk into markup equation.

    Please share who so we can block.

    There was a seller here who sold a desirable mint-sealed box of coins and expressly stated so in his listing. The buyer opened it, claimed a coin or 2 was damaged and eBay forced the seller to accept a return. One of many reasons why I rarely sell there.

    terrible idea to sell unproved coins. they could have been all gem - replaced with fully circulated - and returned.

  • ms70ms70 Posts: 10,758 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Tookybandit said:

    @Coinstartled said:
    At least post the buyer handle so we can add him to the "list".

    Can't do that until the transaction has completed and then only by PM.

    Why?

  • CoinstartledCoinstartled Posts: 7,120 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ms70 said:

    @Tookybandit said:

    @Coinstartled said:
    At least post the buyer handle so we can add him to the "list".

    Can't do that until the transaction has completed and then only by PM.

    Why?

    I think Heather put the kibosh on that sort of stuff.

  • GluggoGluggo Posts: 2,393 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ms70 said:

    @Tookybandit said:

    @Coinstartled said:
    At least post the buyer handle so we can add him to the "list".

    Can't do that until the transaction has completed and then only by PM.

    Why?

    Yes I agree if he Claims he has a right to break a slab then put his name out. Of course if it’s not true? :*

  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭
    edited January 6, 2019 2:24PM

    @ms70 said:

    @Tookybandit said:

    @Coinstartled said:
    At least post the buyer handle so we can add him to the "list".

    Can't do that until the transaction has completed and then only by PM.

    Why?

    I figure it's in my best interest to wait until I go through the eBay process first. Since I qualify for Top Rated Seller again, it's probably not the smartest move to out buyer's user names publicly. PM seems like a better way to go ....no doubt there's probably eBay policies in place against sharing user names. If not, give them a couple days to add that rule, haha

  • GluggoGluggo Posts: 2,393 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 6, 2019 2:35PM

    @Tookybandit said:

    @ms70 said:

    @Tookybandit said:

    @Coinstartled said:
    At least post the buyer handle so we can add him to the "list".

    Can't do that until the transaction has completed and then only by PM.

    Why?

    I figure it's in my best interest to wait until I go through the eBay process first. Since I qualify for Top Rated Seller again, it's probably not the smartest move to out buyer's user names publicly. PM seems like a better way to go ....no doubt there's probably eBay policies in place against sharing user names. If not, give them a couple days to add that rule, haha

    I am glad your laughing.
    I don’t even care about this thread no more!

  • BustDMsBustDMs Posts: 432 ✭✭✭

    You should see if the person is selling items on eBay. If they are order or buy a bunch and return them.

    Isn’t turnabout fair play?

    Q: When does a collector become a numismatist?



    A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.



    A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,280 ✭✭✭

    I am glad your laughing.
    I don’t even care about this thread no more!

    That response seems rather mean spirited. Easier to laugh about a difficult situation vs. if I chose to spew my anger.

    If you don’t care just stop reading.

    This thread has already helped me a ton. I needed feedback so I’d make the best decision and if I’m lucky have a better chance at not losing money over this buyer.

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