Well we often hear about coins being in Strong Hands...
Broadstruck
Posts: 30,497 ✭✭✭✭✭
Once off the market in the collection of such a collector they may not reenter the market for decades.
Yet no one ever speaks about the coins that fall into Weak Hands.
Collectors that never keep a coin for more than a month. I'm sure everyone has a friend like this or at least knows a few collectors who collect in such a manner. Every new purchase is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Then as the 3 week point approaches the need to scratch the itch to sell and find another sets in. Although I don't understand this collecting approach I find it quite entertaining. Coins aren't bought to flip for profit yet instead usually a decent hit is taken reduced daily nearing fire sale levels just to get them out the door rapidly.
Just pondering if collectors like this wouldn't just be better off renting coins on a month to month basis...
Oops make that a weekly basis?
Comments
I have this all the time on a local scale, and much smaller $ value scale. I get customers who buy stuff , then a few weeks to a year , sell it all, and do something else. Some of the nicer coins I don't mind buying back at all. the dreck. I hate to see come back .
There have been several times where I made money off the same coin three times in less than a month
Sometimes its not weak hands but rather part of the learning process. I routinely buy coins on the internet as most of us do.
As a result this also allows us to sell on the internet. With such ease of conducting business, short term holding or "flipping" is bound to happen often.
Sometimes I'll stretch and other times low ball bid on internet offerings. I learn a lot obtaining and studying my results. The endpoint is:
1. Keepers
2. Flip for a quick profit
3. Flip to cut losses
In all cases knowledge is gained which is a good thing.
People move on, some times strong hands are really just a weak exit strategy.
I found that most of the coins I bought before I focused didn’t hold my attention long and I sold.
11.5$ Southern Dollars, The little “Big Easy” set
I guess my alternate ID would be Ironhands then.... My coins never leave....
If I buy a coin, it stays. Those who buy and sell coins often have their own 'collections'... but usually - it seems - even those collections will move at the right price. Cheers, RickO
So @RickO, you sound like a coin and pm black hole. I know one of those, me.
@Smudge.... An apt analogy indeed....Never thought of it that way before, but I agree. Cheers, RickO
Sometimes I think strong hands are folks that have enough money to not bother with the selling process to get the new purchase buzz, they just buy more and don’t worry about if they make out or not at the end. Money to burn so to speak. That quick flip can mean freeing up capitol to enjoy the buying, sell trade activity that can be so fun for folks who don’t have a huge powder keg and still enjoy hobby participation.
That and some people get attached and some don’t, to each their own.
I rarely sell coins. I look for material that is high end even if overpriced. These coins are usually found at dealers who specialize in what you collect. If I buy at auction I always search auction archives just to make sure it is 'fresh' and not reappearing every other auction (there are a few of these). Several of my 'keepers' were lucky purchases made at 4 to 5 times price guide; Its only a guide right ?
I think a significant part of a dealers income is from what I call "churn", basically the collector not keeping a coin long enough to realize a profit. It seems like the personality that makes one collect coins gets "bored" with a coin and seeks that "honeymoon" time with a new coin over and over.
My concept of strong hands is someone not in financial situation forcing them unload coins.
Many are selling out due to forced early retirement, downsizing, and the lackluster market.
While I am inventory neutral my goal is make what I can off my investmet in the buy it right / sell at retail process.
My advice is stick what you can afford and enjoy collecting.
I had a friend in the 1970s who used to flip his coins constantly. The thing of was he was a sharp trader and usually ended up making money although a couple of his mistakes were doozies. He once made the mistake of sending a coin to the Secret Service to see if it was genuine. It was, but the process took a very long time. This was before there was much of any third party grading.
I think that this behavior is very evident in the hobby and even on these boards. Some collectors are compulsive and have no broader organizing principle for their collection other than the endorphin release from buying something new.
Latin American Collection
Coins were made to circulated daily. Weeks or months are no big deal.
This, just a different type of circulation.
@Broadstruck I think your idea of coin rentals for some people may be the way to go. I think most people, not just collectors don't really know what they want and are usually swayed by the next big thing or as @Boosibri said "the endorphin release from buying something new". They don't spend enough time dwelling on what they really want and just start buying what's "trending" instead of what they like.
Donato
Donato's Complete US Type Set ---- Donato's Dansco 7070 Modified Type Set ---- Donato's Basic U.S. Coin Design Set
Successful transactions: Shrub68 (Jim), MWallace (Mike)
I have "variable" hands. Some stay and others go.
Sometimes on a whim and sometimes on a hint of future elements that I believe will be detrimental to the "value."
Not an investor but sorta. I don't want to board the Titanic.
That "rush" theory applies. In more things than coins.
"NEW" is fun.
Like a good friend of mine said about cards. “ We don’t own these cards, we’re just holding them for awhile.”
We don’t own these coins. Someday all of them will be back in circulation.
Another thought about flippers. The thrill is in the hunt. Once obtained it’s not as exciting and the hunt begins again.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
I can remember back in the day when a rather odd guy would visit the local coin shop. He would buy a coin like an Unc 3 Cent Silver and then put it loose in his pocket. A week or two later he would return to the shop and sell it back to them at a fairly good loss.
I always wondered who was following me around.
I'm weak, I admit it. There I said it. Do I get a badge or something nice??
bob
Oh, and should I say that the thrill is in the hunt not the holding.
bob
Yes I buy and sell coins. But if it's a keeper I keep it and if it's a flipper I sell it. I can't keep every thing it's just not possible for me.
Hoard the keys.
It doesn't matter how strong your hands are, you buy at auction, then turn around to sell, you lose money...period. Holding quality coins generally only pays off when the coins are held long term.
I've made some pretty quick flips on coins I had planned on keeping. Not for a loss though.
I remember a few years ago buying some coins at a local auction and selling them at Long Beach an hour later for a nice 20% gain.
the hobby is different for everyone. If you get more enjoyment buying and selling---then so long as you can afford it, enjoy. It's like people always say buy what u like. One can also say sell what you want.
I always read "strong hands" as "really rich collector unlikely to sell", but it always seemed like a bit of a misnomer given how these collections come up at auction with some regularity.
That said, I think the OP has a good point, and have noticed a few hands weaker than others.
I hold my better stuff. I like it when premium-quality items are in weak hands, as it gives me another opportunity to own them.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
I've been looking for specific coins for over 20 yrs. I've owned many of my coins for over 20 years.
Strong hands suck!
My 1866 Philly Mint Set
I can't stand people who rush to finish registry sets then sell them within weeks. yeah, thrill of the hunt i guess. usually they are selling the wrong coins at the wrong times.
we had a big collector who had completed a MS63-MS67 Morgan Set in 3-4 years (years ago you could buy nice coins). He showed it to his dad. Dad said, whats so great, they all look alike? We were on a plane to pick up the collection in 48 hours.
It probably should be noted that when there is talk of "Strong Hands", it's usually in relation to a coin type or grade that many people desire, and won't see again until this one is sold.
Being "Strong Hands" for dateless Buffalo nickels probably doesn't generate much of a second look.
<--Strong hands for MS-63 3-Cent nickels. I know you're all jealous....
To add to another poster, I do have a few customers who have bought something, and get tired of it, but because they are so financially sound, don't need to sell it, and just keep it along with the new purchases anyway
Somewhat guilty.....besides the coins I used to buy specifically to flip, I've also had some where the profit motive took over my better sense. I've owned two raw 23S walkers that were lock 58 coins that I sold for big profits within in hour of purchase. Meanwhile my registry set has a rather mundane hazy weakly struck PC AU55 in it
Big numbers get me all the time..... I don't care how strong your hands are. I had a 1921-S walker in a MS64+ holder sold it for $32K Why not I'll find some thing else to love or hold or look at for that kind of money I think I picked it up for $14K.
Hoard the keys.
>
+1
POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
Impulsivity shows its face in many forms. I like the fluidity of bullion.
My hands are hardly strong 'cause I don't flip for profit
.............Coins aren't bought to flip for profit yet instead usually a decent hit is taken reduced daily nearing fire sale levels just to get them out the door rapidly.
I love fire sales...
Hoard the keys.
I'm a numbers guy too.
Everything is for sale at the right price. If @ricko is a collector who could be compared to black hole, I would be the supernova.
I find the concept of "strong hands" childish and snobbish. It implies that those that hold are "strong" (a positive trait) and those that don't are "weak" (a negative trait). I GUARANTEE every person on this site would sell every coin they own for the right price, even Ricko. After all, it is just "STUFF". Intelligent people would know when it is the right time to sell any and all to be able to move onto something better, or better position themselves, unless they are 1) Terminally Vain (I have something you can't have) or 2) Uninformed without an exit strategy. Even the rich person that does not need to sell, does not stay a rich person, or did not become a rich person, with a buy and never sell strategy.
Mr Stronghands: "None of my coins are for sale, ever.
Agitator: "I am paying $500 each cash for any circulated Wheat cent, and I have $1 Billion to spend"
Mr. Stronghands: "Here is a bag of 5,000"
If anyone would like to come to my house with a big enough bag of money, I will sell everything, including the house and my clothes, and proudly wear a WEAK HANDS hat.
I'm not buying , selling, or trading. I'm flopping. It is similar to flipping; except it goes from side to side.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
I'm going to disagree, to an extent.
The "Strong Hands" concept is more than a money thing. It's a COLLECTION thing.
(As noted above by me, it implies a coin of greater than average rarity and prestige. Strong Hands for common date Morgans, or mid-grade type just isn't a real concept).
So, if a collector is in it for the coins, or the collection, buying one of these great rarities may be a prestige and legacy purchase. The fact that they COULD sell it for a profit, but won't, is in my mind where the "Strong Hands" concept comes from. Throw multiples of the purchase price at these collectors, and you'll probably get a smile, and polite "No". (In most cases, they don't NEED the money).
Yes, these "Strong Hands" collectors and collections are probably in the minority. But they tend to NOT sell, and their collections only come on the market when their heirs decide it's time to cash out....when the original collector is gone, or when the collector realizes it's time to move on.
@TommyType I could not have said it better myself. I agree 100%.
Donato
Donato's Complete US Type Set ---- Donato's Dansco 7070 Modified Type Set ---- Donato's Basic U.S. Coin Design Set
Successful transactions: Shrub68 (Jim), MWallace (Mike)
I've got weak hands and I don't care:)
The nicer the coin the tighter the grip.
Winter is Coming....
On a more serious note, I think the strong hands term applies to holding expensive rarities, not the typical stuff collected among us.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"