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So how was the Philly show?
FunwithMPL
Posts: 333 ✭✭✭
We had our local coin club show here in Lancaster, PA held by the Red Rose CC and it had a nice turn out.
So I stayed home but would like to know how the Philly show went?
So I stayed home but would like to know how the Philly show went?
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I got my picket up my lots beforehand downstairs, and after the "mad rush" in...walked about for about 2 hours. Many dealers were either not there yet, or not set up yet..or not coming.
There was a lot more { open floor space ) than last year.
I didnt see Roberto Duran there. He was supposed to come.
<< <i>I didnt see Roberto Duran there. He was supposed to come. >>
Really?
Not great public attendance at that large a show.
A few dealers could not be found and were not manning their tables. They certainly lost potential customers. Where the h&ll were they?????
Prices on generic US was a little agressive, and I was surprised at quotes on some foreign - full retail +++++.
I wont be back. Stick to local smaller shows.
<< <i>A few dealers could not be found and were not manning their tables. They certainly lost potential customers. Where the h&ll were they????? >>
I'm guessing at lunch, in the can or at the auction.
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<< <i>A few dealers could not be found and were not manning their tables. They certainly lost potential customers. Where the h&ll were they????? >>
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God forbid dealers have an errand or two to run. They don't build flush toilets at each booth and if they did I'm certain that wouldn't be something you'd want to watch.
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
<< <i>I went on Friday - A few dealers could not be found and were not manning their tables. They certainly lost potential customers. Where the h&ll were they????? >>
We were at our table for the entire show. We also did quite well, incl. on Saturday. We will be back!
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
PCGS Registries
Box of 20
SeaEagleCoins: 11/14/54-4/5/12. Miss you Larry!
1652 Pine Tree Shilling
1793 Wreath Large Cent
1793 Liberty Cap Large Cent
1799 Draped Bust Large Cent
1877 Indian Head Cent
and a few others
Back when I lived in the New York metro area in the mid 1970s I went to a couple of Philadelphia shows. They were show while shows in New York City and New Jersey were hopping. Phily had a rep back then for not being a good coin show town. Is it possible that that trend continues to this day?
<< <i><< A few dealers could not be found and were not manning their tables. They certainly lost potential customers. Where the h&ll were they????? >> >>
Most likely they were at the auction.
Yes the bourse floor was not full or even very active looking on Friday - which is my preference but not usually the case. I did not have to wait long at any table to see what I wanted to see. The Philly convention center is not the best or easiest place to get to or get away from. The traffic was slow for most of the Schukill expressway. Then I had to find my way out of Philly. While this is the closest major show for me- I think I still Prefer Baltimore the best-Atmosphere and all that-Just seems better. I did not attend the auction.
I went on Friday and I bought 47 or 48 coins. One dealer had a lot of BU Washington quarters for just over silver (silver buyers were paying 28x on Friday)- He had a whole case full of Washingtons mostly BU dating from 1941-1964. I bought 16 dates and mms that I did not yet have for $7.50 each. I still need about 27 more of the silver ones (mostly in the 1930's mm catagory).
He had a few nice full band Merc dimes (3 to be exact in the $5 case) and I bought all of those. 1941, 1942,1944. Also got a MS 1956 type B Washington quarter from the same dealer for $10.
I did not yet have this date and could not find a cherry pick anywhere. I figured $10 for a 1956 BU type B was cheap-and yes the dealer knew it was a type B and marked it "type B rev".
Also got a few MS war nickels for $5 ea from this same dealer.
I bought more MS Washington's from another dealer.
From Lou Pearlman (one of my favorite dealers to buy from) I got a vg 1821 bust dime for $42 and an xf-AU 1857 dime for $47.
From Harry Laibstein- a 1850-o seated dollar and 1869 seated dollar, both in PCGS slabs
Total 47 coins-There is one more that I had to think about over the weekend I am going to buy that also if it is still available on Monday.
I got there about 11:30 am and left at 5:30 Pm and was searching coins out that I need the full time. Parking was $10 with a coupon that I printed from the internet. I really liked this show. I only went to buy - I did not sell anything.
Bob
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<< <i>
<< <i>A few dealers could not be found and were not manning their tables. They certainly lost potential customers. Where the h&ll were they????? >>
>>
God forbid dealers have an errand or two to run. They don't build flush toilets at each booth and if they did I'm certain that wouldn't be something you'd want to watch. >>
Ah fishcakes! Thats my pet peeve too. You go to these shows and many tables are not manned. It doesnt take two hours to go to the bathroom. At least most of the time it doesnt.
<< <i> Ah fishcakes! Thats my pet peeve too. You go to these shows and many tables are not manned. It doesnt take two hours to go to the bathroom. At least most of the time it doesnt >>
I see you haven't experienced the food served at some shows
Didn't go myself, but I was told by a few friends that things were very very slow. it gets mighty boring sitting there at a table with nothing to do. Actually I'm a little surprised that the Philly shows haven't gotten better, maybe the idea of too many shows too close together has a lot to do with it.
Philly is not not great place for a coin show.
By the way the RKY the PLAY here in Lancaster was GREAT.
<< <i>I got some good ones:
1652 Pine Tree Shilling
1793 Wreath Large Cent
1793 Liberty Cap Large Cent
1799 Draped Bust Large Cent
1877 Indian Head Cent
and a few others >>
hope ya got them at good prices
Good buys better than the club auction, eh?
Nevertheless Philly Whitman 3 years in a row has been the best show for me for both buying and selling.
HH
1947-P & D; 1948-D; 1949-P & S; 1950-D & S; and 1952-S.
Any help locating any of these OBW rolls would be gratefully appreciated!
The show is slowly deteriorating to a regional/east coast show (but of course, I suggested that concept!) . I would like it to continue but having it in August OR September is illogical following the ANA or right before or after Long Beach. Now it is right before the ANA Pittsburgh as well. Of course, the ANA is now out to compete as well. We will see the outcome of all this positioning.
I believe Whitman is overreaching in this area and while the Baltimore show in spring and fall will never be damaged. this overreaching may soon nibble away at the success of the November Baltimore show,
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<< <i>I didnt see Roberto Duran there. He was supposed to come. >>
Really? >>
I was in Vegas last month and walked by a memorabilia store while in a mall. There was a table for Roberto Duran to be signing autographs. He wasn't there either. Empty. However, Ernie Shavers was there. Go figure.
I have now learned that Roberto Duran is not where he is supposed to be often as of late. I'm guessing Ebay is at fault.
MJ
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
But I too wondered about quite a few dealers who were either manning booths with not much displayed for sale, or who were not there at all.
Oh well...I actually ended up dealing with about 4 or 5 of my regular dealer cronies...who seemed to be doing pretty good.
designset
Treasury Seals Type Set
The weather was pretty pissy...and cold...on Thursday. I was caught in several downpours coming down the turnpike...could have been a factor.
Way too close after ANA, and prior to fall Baltimore. No time for dealers to replenish stocks - it's going to take away from fall Baltimore eventually, as people don't want to travel to see the same things. I agree with those that said Philadelphia is not the best venue, epecially at this time of year.
Attendance up at this show...show me the numbers, definitely don't believe that one.
The Lancaster show was OUTSTANDING, as it always is every year.
<< <i>I walked in and walked out. Dead show. No PCGS. Whats that about? >>
It costs PCGS money to attend a show and if attending will not be profitable for them then they will not go. If you're willing to sponsor PCGS I'm sure they'd be happy to make the trip just for you.
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I didnt see Roberto Duran there. He was supposed to come. >>
Really? >>
I was in Vegas last month and walked by a memorabilia store while in a mall. There was a table for Roberto Duran to be signing autographs. He wasn't there either. .
MJ >>
Get Duran to sign his name and "no mas".
<< <i>Text << I walked in and walked out. Dead show. No PCGS. Whats that about? >> It costs PCGS money to attend a show and if attending will not be profitable for them then they will not go. " >>
The confusing thing was that I saw PCGS Currency there. Is PCGS Currency still part of PCGS?
I was surprised that PCGS did not have a booth just to accept submissions (no grading service)
The placement around the ANA doesn't help - one month after the 9-day marathon is too soon for everyone to reload.
Unfortunately, organizers compete, so in some ways a lot of this is unavoidable. If all the organizers got together and agreed on an annual schedule, you might be running into trade collusion problems (read, legal issues).
<< <i>bronze6827 If you were at the LANCASTER show how did you like the exhibits on display? >>
The MPL display was very well done and informative for those unfamilliar, yours I presume.
<< <i>It sucked. I walked through the whole bourse in about 3 hours. >>
How many hours did you want it to take?
<< <i>I walked in and walked out. Dead show. No PCGS. Whats that about? >>
I'd be pretty happy if I went to a coin show, and it turned into a Dead show.
A good Coin show must allow attendees an experience that is hassle-free, offers some level of entertainment, and is affordable within their means. DUH...PHIL WAS DULL, AND NOT AFFORDABLE..... a small collector wanting to drive to the show on Sat from 100 miles away would spend $100 bucks between gas, parking, and tolls.... might get a small interested collector to do that....but certainly not going to get a casual collector..... there are 1 Million coin collectors who only spend a few hundred dolllars a year picking up little coins....
Any way...That is why places like Las Vegas and Orlando end up being ideal settings not because of all the excitement each city has to offer (although that can play a part in a decision). They work out because they are built to host and service guests. DUH
First and foremost, a good host city will be one that people will want to attend a conference in. Next, the city should be relatively easy and inexpensive to get to. In today’s climate this typically means that attendees should be able to fly easily in and out of a city, as well as travel within the city once they get there. Although a location may be real desirable for some attendees, if they do not have the means to pay for the trip, or afford to get around once they are there, that part of your audience will not be able to attend. DUH...PARKING AT PHIL IS $4 TO $6 PER 15 MINUTES......and I think Whitman and crew are currently the best promotors out there....but guys you dropped the ball.....not even the address of the show on your website???? what kind of marketing is that???? secret agent marketing
Also make sure that the city has enough rooms, restaurants, and other businesses to meet the needs of your attendees. It would be a shame for your event to be under-attended because a segment of the audience could only find rooms 10 miles or more away from the event center. DUH...TRY BOOKING A CHEAP ROOM IN PHIL a average hotel....AVERAGE...not deluxe hotel is $75 to $200 bucks....
This not only hurts the event in the current year, but those attendees that couldn’t make it have a bad taste in their mouth, and those that did make it may wonder why others don’t think the show is important enough to attend. I wont even go into the timing of the show..... other dealers have covered this to death...
The big plus for Phil is the terminal market....great go buy a nice lunch, I summer in the Hamptons...I get all the nice lunches I want without driving to Phil for a cheese steak... and the other good plus is fact that the drive to Phil is not that far.... but its not a spot for coin collectors.... think that after a banging ANA in Chicago this year...Phil next year will be a let down look out ANA.... did anyone look that Chicago is one of the top convention cities some even say its #1...Phil is around #15 and only that high this past year since they added more convention space.... speaking about space
Coin shows dont need a lot of space.... 100k sq ft is a big show in the coin convention world..... guess what....to a convention center 500k to 1M is a big show....this means coin shows really dont count....dont count....convention centers could care less....Coin People dont book lots of rooms....... so you have the problem of needing more space than hotels would have in their ballrooms space maybe 10,000 ft and not being able to make a dent in a convention center like Phil which is 2.3 M feet with 1M feet rentable.....
Here is the answer.... probably a combo show of Coins with some other similiar interesting collectable items that have a good synergy.... Coins,
with sports memorabilla, stamps, collectibles, even jewerly for the ladies...... the cross over of more people could only help bring some new energy to the shows..... even if some of these people are tire kickers and bothering dealers with "stupid" questions, the hobby might pick up some new faces...etc....
my two cents
<< <i>A lot has been said that Phil was a "BAD" show.... my take yup and here is why... Its a rant.... but I had a few minutes...so here I go...and if you dont like what I have to say....too bad
A good Coin show must allow attendees an experience that is hassle-free, offers some level of entertainment, and is affordable within their means. DUH...PHIL WAS DULL, AND NOT AFFORDABLE..... a small collector wanting to drive to the show on Sat from 100 miles away would spend $100 bucks between gas, parking, and tolls.... might get a small interested collector to do that....but certainly not going to get a casual collector..... there are 1 Million coin collectors who only spend a few hundred dolllars a year picking up little coins....
Any way...That is why places like Las Vegas and Orlando end up being ideal settings not because of all the excitement each city has to offer (although that can play a part in a decision). They work out because they are built to host and service guests. DUH
First and foremost, a good host city will be one that people will want to attend a conference in. Next, the city should be relatively easy and inexpensive to get to. In today’s climate this typically means that attendees should be able to fly easily in and out of a city, as well as travel within the city once they get there. Although a location may be real desirable for some attendees, if they do not have the means to pay for the trip, or afford to get around once they are there, that part of your audience will not be able to attend. DUH...PARKING AT PHIL IS $4 TO $6 PER 15 MINUTES......and I think Whitman and crew are currently the best promotors out there....but guys you dropped the ball.....not even the address of the show on your website???? what kind of marketing is that???? secret agent marketing
Also make sure that the city has enough rooms, restaurants, and other businesses to meet the needs of your attendees. It would be a shame for your event to be under-attended because a segment of the audience could only find rooms 10 miles or more away from the event center. DUH...TRY BOOKING A CHEAP ROOM IN PHIL a average hotel....AVERAGE...not deluxe hotel is $75 to $200 bucks....
This not only hurts the event in the current year, but those attendees that couldn’t make it have a bad taste in their mouth, and those that did make it may wonder why others don’t think the show is important enough to attend. I wont even go into the timing of the show..... other dealers have covered this to death...
The big plus for Phil is the terminal market....great go buy a nice lunch, I summer in the Hamptons...I get all the nice lunches I want without driving to Phil for a cheese steak... and the other good plus is fact that the drive to Phil is not that far.... but its not a spot for coin collectors.... think that after a banging ANA in Chicago this year...Phil next year will be a let down look out ANA.... did anyone look that Chicago is one of the top convention cities some even say its #1...Phil is around #15 and only that high this past year since they added more convention space.... speaking about space
Coin shows dont need a lot of space.... 100k sq ft is a big show in the coin convention world..... guess what....to a convention center 500k to 1M is a big show....this means coin shows really dont count....dont count....convention centers could care less....Coin People dont book lots of rooms....... so you have the problem of needing more space than hotels would have in their ballrooms space maybe 10,000 ft and not being able to make a dent in a convention center like Phil which is 2.3 M feet with 1M feet rentable.....
Here is the answer.... probably a combo show of Coins with some other similiar interesting collectable items that have a good synergy.... Coins,
with sports memorabilla, stamps, collectibles, even jewerly for the ladies...... the cross over of more people could only help bring some new energy to the shows..... even if some of these people are tire kickers and bothering dealers with "stupid" questions, the hobby might pick up some new faces...etc....
my two cents >>
Jon...As you know I respect your observations and you are as qualified as anyone can be who can speak about coordinating coin shows. In contradiction, I believe Philadelphia is a good coin city and has a lot of potential to become host to a successful convention. Here is my rebuttal:
Coin show host cities need to be entertaining places. Philadelphia isn't Las Vegas but it isn't a place I would call completely dull. It's more exciting than Baltimore and light years better than Rosemont. It's also light years more exciting than Stamford, CT. What's the slogan for Stamford? Now I remember: "we're only 45 minutes by train away from NYC".
Parking in Philly cost me about $20/ day. Parking in Rosemont was about the same (if you didn't park at McDonalds). It costs me an average of $34/ day to park in Baltimore. As for the cost of gas, it costs the same to drive 100 miles to Philadelphia as it does 100 miles to Baltimore. I simply don't buy that argument.
Hotel rooms weren't cheap but they weren't any more expensive than a room in Baltimore and they're a hell of a lot cheaper than a typical room in Boston.
Philadelphia International is connected to downtown Philadelphia by train the same way BWI connects Baltimore by light rail. PHL delays more than BWI does but they both have similar convenient and affordable public transit options to get from the airport to the city center.
I agree with the hotel room dilemma. Coin people come in two forms: the ones who book hotel rooms like normal people do (myself, Ian Russell and a few others) and those who exclusively use Priceline or other third party opague sites. Booking via the convention room block is a good way to help your convention out. More rooms booked, the bigger the block means the more negotiable and lower future rates will be.
The combined interests show idea sounds good on paper but it's been tried before and it isn't all that helpful. Remember those PPI/ Bruggerman Mandalay Bay Las Vegas shows from a few years back and how they tried to tie that into a car and gun show? Recall doing that didn't work out as well has people had hoped. If anything the other interests were a distraction to the coin show portion of the show.
I will concede that attendance wasn't great at this last show and the bourse lacked that "buzz" but I still believe Philadelphia is a good host choice for a numismatic convention and has excellent upside potential. The last ANA convention in Philadelphia set an attendance record that still stands and if it worked that time there's a likely chance it'll work again next year.
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
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<< <i>It sucked. I walked through the whole bourse in about 3 hours. >>
How many hours did you want it to take? >>
I was hoping to kill 4-6 hours on the bourse. Maybe what I was looking for was too specific. I did manage to pick up about $55 worth of coin tubes from Wizard, and that pretty much saved the day. Of course, I had to buy some kind of coin, so I picked up three Mercs from Angel Dees. Not much else caught my eye that I was looking for, though.
It is a difficult thing, to predict a year in advance, what the mood of the market is gonna be down the road. Right now I'd say a big show every 6-8 weeks feels about right.
<< <i>I think the main problem with this show was timing, right after the ANA and LB.
It is a difficult thing, to predict a year in advance, what the mood of the market is gonna be down the road. Right now I'd say a big show every 6-8 weeks feels about right. >>
I agree with this.
All that stuff about parking and hotel costs is irrelevant IMO, as it is not appreciably different than in any major city.
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<< <i>It sucked. I walked through the whole bourse in about 3 hours. >>
How many hours did you want it to take? >>
I was hoping to kill 4-6 hours on the bourse. >>
I wish I would have had your spare time as there's a good amount of dealers I never had a chance to see
<< <i>Good question... since Charmy was not there we have a dearth of information... no pictures, no coin gossip, no wine information... sheeessshhh, what are we to do???
Even though I hear the Philly show was slow, sounds like there were some really good buys on the floor. But for me, slow shows just mean there's more time to go shop for coins (that's probably why some dealers were not manning their table) as well as more time for good wine!
A little OT, but this is what I was doing instead of the Philly show - I spent the last 5 days in Cabo celebrating my 20th anniversary with my wonderful hubby, and although I couldn't find any coin shops there, I actually had some very decent Mexican wine (along with some wonderful margaritas and pina coladas!).
Our beautiful resort!
Dining with my hubby
The famous Arch which divides the Sea of Cortez and the Pacific Ocean and is the most southern tip of Baja California
Having our last lunch at the resort just before we headed to the airport
I hope to see everyone at the Pittsburgh ANA and look forward to visiting that fun town for the first time, and will be sure to take lots of photos for my report....
The Penny Lady®
This is certainly a moderate walk from the convention center and not appropriate for dealers.
Is there a private drop off/pickup area for the dealers and exhibitors that is off the street?
Indeed the parking much closer to the convention center gets very expensive as Jon brings up. But cheaper parking can be found if you go more than five blocks away.
Also if you go on the Internet you can print out a prepaid parking ticket at many of the parking lots/garages if you do it the day before or so. There was one at 11th and Race which is only block or two away. Parking there was $8 on Saturday and I believe $13 during the week.
Whitman could be more helpful in this regard and give collectors more useful information as this will help the foot traffic.
Last but not least is moving the show to early May to mid May. I believe this would help tremendously. Doing the show next year so close to the ANAis very problematical unless it was a weekend show only.
Has Whitman thought of making Philly a 3 day weekend only show? It might work?
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<< <i>bronze6827 If you were at the LANCASTER show how did you like the exhibits on display? >>
The MPL display was very well done and informative for those unfamilliar, yours I presume. >>
Yes it was my exhibit bronze6827 glad you liked it.
Carl